PA PA - Ray Gricar, 59, former district attorney, Bellefonte, 15 Apr 2005 - #17

[DeDee]

How is the letter related?

I don't know how or if the letter's related.
The letter was about the charges the victims wrote against the priests accounting for 4 long decades of continued abuse.
Maybe RG was involved in obtaining the criminal charges for them.

Who is JKA?

 

[DeDee]

How is the letter related?

I don't know how or if the letter's related.
The letter was about the charges the victims wrote

I don't know how or if the letter's related.
The letter was about the charges the victims wrote against the priests accounting for 4 long decades of continued abuse.
Maybe RG was involved in obtaining the criminal charges for them.

Who is JKA?

nm
J. Karen Arnold - co worker (was preparing for a trip at time of disappearance)

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Ten years ago today Sara Ganim wrote the story, published in the Harrisburg Patriot News and the State College Centre Daily Times, on the investigation into child molestation charges against Jerry Sandusky. Those were the only two general media sources covering it.

It was not discussed on Websleuths until November off 2011 and the first mention of it was on the Ray Gricar thread of the day (though there is now a whole section on it).

One of my regrets, in posting and blogging about the Gricar case is that I did not follow up on information I had been given about RFG declining to prosecute the case in 1998. I had been given the information on 4/1/11 that the case had gone to the DA's Office in 1998 and RFG had declined to prosecute. I couldn't confirm it, and didn't think it would amount to too much. As it was April 1st, I thought it might have been a joke. Mea culpa.

 

[Ozoner]

Ten years ago today Sara Ganim wrote the story, published in the Harrisburg Patriot News and the State College Centre Daily Times, on the investigation into child molestation charges against Jerry Sandusky. Those were the only two general media sources covering it.

It was not discussed on Websleuths until November off 2011 and the first mention of it was on the Ray Gricar thread of the day (though there is now a whole section on it).

One of my regrets, in posting and blogging about the Gricar case is that I did not follow up on information I had been given about RFG declining to prosecute the case in 1998. I had been given the information on 4/1/11 that the case had gone to the DA's Office in 1998 and RFG had declined to prosecute. I couldn't confirm it, and didn't think it would amount to too much. As it was April 1st, I thought it might have been a joke. Mea culpa.

In 1998, there likely wasn't much evidence, so Ray probably made the correct decision. Even when charges were filed, it was a fairly run-of-the mill molestation case. The media only ran with it because Paterno and and a couple of the college administrators knew about the accusations but failed to act.

Ray had prosecuted far more important cases, including murder cases. (Even though he was only convicted of the murder of Dawn Marie Birnbaum, I firmly believe that James Cruz, Jr., is a serial killer.)

There is no chance that the Sandusky case had anything to do with Ray's disappearance; that idea is silly. If Ray's disappearance was the result of foul play, and if it was connected to his job in any way, I would look at people he had prosecuted successfully who were back on the streets or people he was in the process of prosecuting (if there were any of the latter, considering that he was retiring).

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Respectfully snipped.

In 1998, there likely wasn't much evidence, so Ray probably made the correct decision. Even when charges were filed, it was a fairly run-of-the mill molestation case. The media only ran with it because Paterno and and a couple of the college administrators knew about the accusations but failed to act.

RFG had a second victim in 1998, that the PA AG did not have in 2001. They had a weaker case on the Victim 6 case in 2011 than RFG did in 1998. The AG still got a felony conviction on it. There was also no effort to turn the case over to the AG's Office for lack of resources, which could have been legitimately done.

I am generally not critical of RFG functions as DA, but in this case, I am. However, in saying this, I am critical of a number of Pennsylvania DA's/ADA's as well for the same reason. This might have been the first time turning a blind eye became public, but it would not be the last. (I have known some of these people personally, and am quite saddened by it.)

All that said, prosecutors have discretion in prosecuting. I do not believe RFG did anything illegal or in violation of the canon of legal ethics in declining to prosecute Sandusky in 1998. I disagree with his decision, but I do not find it illegal or unethical.

There is no chance that the Sandusky case had anything to do with Ray's disappearance; that idea is silly. If Ray's disappearance was the result of foul play, and if it was connected to his job in any way, I would look at people he had prosecuted successfully who were back on the streets or people he was in the process of prosecuting (if there were any of the latter, considering that he was retiring).

I agree that this was unlikely a motive for murder; there is no reason to kill a prosecutor who won't prosecute you.

It could be part of a reason to leave voluntarily. There is no shortage of motives for voluntarily leaving. One of them could be that he didn't want to spend his retirement answering questions about why he did or didn't do something decades ago, both in the press and before grand juries. Sandusky could be an example, but there could be dozens of those cases over a long career. There are possibly a half dozen other reasons as well.

 

[Ozoner]

It could be part of a reason to leave voluntarily. There is no shortage of motives for voluntarily leaving. One of them could be that he didn't want to spend his retirement answering questions about why he did or didn't do something decades ago, both in the press and before grand juries. Sandusky could be an example, but there could be dozens of those cases over a long career. There are possibly a half dozen other reasons as well.

Snipped and BBM.

I respectfully disagree. The Sandusky case would not have been on Gricar's mind in 2005. It wasn't a particularly important case, it was seven years in the past, and Ray could not have known that it would be resurrected in 2011 and that the media would run with it the way that they did.

I doubt Ray walked away—I would rate that option a distant third behind suicide and foul play—but if he did, it had nothing to do with Jerry Sandusky.

 

[minazoe]

Lewisburg is not exactly a hooker hangout. I'm sure someone in the area would have sex for money, however. There are several houses that have windows facing the parking lot, not to mention a busy street.

Hookers come to you now a days..you don't have to prowl the streets, just the internet. mOO

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Snipped and BBM.

I respectfully disagree. The Sandusky case would not have been on Gricar's mind in 2005. It wasn't a particularly important case, it was seven years in the past, and Ray could not have known that it would be resurrected in 2011 and that the media would run with it the way that they did.

I doubt Ray walked away—I would rate that option a distant third behind suicide and foul play—but if he did, it had nothing to do with Jerry Sandusky.

If, and that is a big if, RFG walked away, at least part of that reason could be that he didn't want to be "the former DA," in quotes. He didn't want, under this scenario, to be bombarded with questions about things he did 20 years before. Those old cases come back to haunt prosecutors; the Bill Cosby case is the prime example. In the investigation of the Catholic Church in PA, the investigators had been talking to people that had not been prosecutors for 25 years about what their decision making process was 10-15 before they stopped being prosecutors.

Could that be the sole reason. I will agree with you and express doubt that it would. Could it be a contributing reason for leaving. I could easily understand why it would be.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Hookers come to you now a days..you don't have to prowl the streets, just the internet. mOO

Why would he have to drive 50 miles to visit one?

They apparently have them in State College: 3 men charged for patronizing prostitutes in State College, police say

 

[SeekingJana]

Why would he have to drive 50 miles to visit one?

They apparently have them in State College: 3 men charged for patronizing prostitutes in State College, police say

I appreciate your wry sense of humor.
Hookers - the world's oldest profession. ( not carpentry, which my sweet friend once thought because of Joseph, Jesus's earthly father).

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I appreciate your wry sense of humor.
Hookers - the world's oldest profession. ( not carpentry, which my sweet friend once thought because of Joseph, Jesus's earthly father).

A friend of mine was a mortician. He showed me his class ring, which a depiction of a mummified body on it. He said, "This is to show that this profession is old as death." I say, "Yes, but not as old as prostitution."

A bit of levity on a serious thread.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

This is not the podcast I had mentioned. There are a lot of errors in this, but I want people to see what is out there:

 

[Kell1]

I remember hearing the theories on Rays case, when I attended the Sheriffs academy at Penn State, some of the investigators were our instructors, I believe there were originally 3 theories that they were putting forth.

-Suicide
-He was murdered
-He left to start a new life somewhere possibly in Europe or something

Later theorists put something out there about his disappearance possibly having something to do with Sandusky etc.. but theres no evidence of that anywhere that i know of

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Those are the three basic theories. I have yet to see a tie to the Sandusky case, except as an example of a case RFG would not want to be badgered about.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

The podcast The Final Argument just dropped. https://open.spotify.com/show/08fpe2aBLGREIhv5YO1SVi

Rebecca Knight will be discussing the disappearance, which she thinks is foul play, and the investigation.

She has a copy of the case file, and will be releasing relevant parts of it as it goes along.

This could very well be the dawn of a new day in the Gricar investigation.

 

[Ozoner]

The podcast The Final Argument just dropped. https://open.spotify.com/show/08fpe2aBLGREIhv5YO1SVi

Rebecca Knight will be discussing the disappearance, which she thinks is foul play, and the investigation.

She has a copy of the case file, and will be releasing relevant parts of it as it goes along.

This could very well be the dawn of a new day in the Gricar investigation.

That link isn't working for me. Do I need to be on a mobile deivce?

 

[Kell1]

Those are the three basic theories. I have yet to see a tie to the Sandusky case, except as an example of a case RFG would not want to be badgered about.

Thats all ive ever heard, for awhile the prevailing theory was that he was murdered I believe. The Sandusky theory as I said was unfounded, i read it somewhere online, where it was suggested, that perhaps , Gricar may have had child *advertiser censored* on his computer, or was involved with Sandusky, hence why he never prosecuted Sandusky on his initial charges etc...

It sounded like BS claim to me

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Try this link. Final Argument: The Disappearance of Ray Gricar, District Attorney

 

[Ozoner]

Try this link. Final Argument: The Disappearance of Ray Gricar, District Attorney

That one worked.

"Hoffa disappeared under similar circumstances." Really? Maybe she knows some things that we don't. The circumstances that have been shared with the public seem pretty dissimilar.

 

[minazoe]

I am going to listen to this TODAY...very excited, thanx j.j.