PA - Shane Montgomery, 21, Philadelphia, 27 Nov 2014 #5

[Jillybean78]

Sadly, I think this was a suicide. Based on where the keys were found, I believe Shane jumped from that ledge and his keys either fell out of his pocket when he entered the water or he threw them in first. I just can't make accidentally falling in the river at that location make sense in my head.

Unless his cousin knows someone else who committed suicide recently, I think his tweet is very telling. That's a very common phrase people say about suicide, so I would assume that is what he meant as well.

Thinking of the Montgomery family as they honor Shane's memory this evening.

What was his last tweet? Sorry, I missed this somewhere..TIA

 

[NJJohn]

I am still having a real problem, like I think "takeittothebank" is also having. I can not get past why Shane was there in the first place, and I think that is why I lean toward foul play or suicide. With foul play or suicide it gives me a reason, kinda, why he was by that river, on that ledge or wherever that night. If he set out deliberately to meet someone to buy something, smoke, hookup, etc, that gives him a reason for being there. And then maybe, something went horribly wrong. Foulplay?????

If it was suicide, well then that is his reason enough to go down to the river. I'm sorry kevin, I know it must add more hurt to hear suggestions of suicide. It can really be haunting for family and friends. "Why didn't we see it?" "Why did he not tell someone?" And so on. People do a wonderful job of hiding feelings of suicide. No one really knows what is going on in another's life regardless how close you may be. Does anyone know how his grades were? He was entering his final semester for graduation. He was at the end of the current semester, so if he was failing one or two subjects there is a chance he may not graduate in May. There could be a whole host of things, or, nothing in particular, just good ole clinical depression. Kevin, I know how much you hurt. And I mean no disrespect, but maybe you are just a little too close to Shane and the situation to see it 100% clearly.
With suicide or foul play, in my mind, that gives him a legit reason to be back there. I wouldn't care how bad I had to pee, or how much I wanted to smoke that joint, even if it was the best stuff in the county, you would not have gotten me to walk way back by that river on such a freezing, icy, slippery, rainy cold cold night. Especially if I am only wearing jeans and a hoodie.

Suicide is always a tough pill to swallow. Probably because it seems the most preventable. Again, if only we knew. I mentioned that very old, dear friends of mine lost their daughter to suicide 2 years after their son was killed. The parents always tell everyone that she committed suicide because she could not deal with the loss of her brother. Truth of the matter is, this young woman battled most of her young, short life with depression and other issues. Oh yes, she worked, had friends and a boyfriend. It wasn't outwardly obvious what was going on. I knew because I knew the family so well. I knew her since she was 5 yrs old. She was an absolutely gorgeous young gal. And although the parents were always very open regarding her issues, in the case of her suicide, they will only say she did it because of her brother being killed. They will never, ever just admit that it was suicide brought on by clinical depression that so many suffer from. It tough, and oh, so sad.

It's not too hard to come up with an accidental reason to be in the river. Perhaps he went to the river to pee/smoke and was twirling his keys on the lanyard and they flew off his finger and into the river. This happened to me all the time when I had keys on a lanyard or string in college (especially when drinking), except not into a river thankfully. If they were floating because of the ID or something and he saw them, perhaps he instinctively jumped in to get them or tried to wade out to get them and slipped or succumbed to hypothermia. If he was inebriated and not thinking straight and maybe even had done the same thing in the summer when the cold temperature wasn't as dangerous, it doesn't seem implausible.

Anyway, obviously, I have no evidence or reason to believe this specifically is what actually happened, but my point is that it's certainly not impossible to conceive of a host of accidental reasons for him to be in the river that are no less plausible than suicide or foul play since there isn't really anything to support either of those theories, either. Sadly, I don't think we're ever going to know exactly what happened.

 

[CementPond]

So it's Thursday. The day of Shane's viewing. So sad. I took a few days off the thread to try and see things perhaps differently. Tried playing the various scenarios over and over in my head to see if I could come to, and be happy with, one scenario versus another. But I couldn't.

Before coming back to check this thread I figured I'd check the news sites online to see if anything further had been said about the autopsy. While I didn't see anything new on that, one thing was definitely clear in the comments, almost NO ONE believes the "accident" theory either. And there's not many buying the suicide one. I was beginning to think that the handful of us here were alone in our thoughts. But I see we are not.

I just can't get beyond some things. They keep nagging at me. Telling me something is off. Is wrong. Of course maybe some of these things could be put to rest had the family been more forthcoming with what they DO know, as well as LE. I just don't know.

Anyway, these are just SOME of the things nagging at me still that won't allow me to move on:

1. The fact that Shane seemed to have become invisible once he got separated from the original people he came with. Well, everyone but the supposed relative and the bouncer. Although we did hear that, once he did get separated, he had met up and been talking to some neighborhood friends. Really? Well what did they have to say about his demeaner? How long did he stay and chat with them before ALSO getting separated from them as well?

2. We never really heard HOW or at what point/what was going on/etc. DID they become separated (from the cousin and original friends he came with AND from the neighborhood group of friends he supposedly was talking to later......so, he was separated twice from two separate groups of friends?)?

3. That "found" card of his on the floor and Kildares lying about having it. Why the lies? And the fact that they just handed it over to some guy (Kevin). Even if he was a family friend he IS NOT LE and there was currently an active missing person investigation going on. LE should have been notified of the card.

4. The way he was "escorted" out and the time this supposedly took place.

5. The fact that one person saw him walk on direction, another person saw him walk in the opposite direction and I believe the video had him come from yet another.

6. The time span between him being "led" out of the bar and then stumbling across the bridge. What was he doing all this time? Where was he? SOMEONE had to of seen him. It's roughly 2am and hundreds of people are being let out of multiple bars.

7. The fact that EVERYONE in the beginning said he was NOT drunk. Which I never believed but wondered why EVERYONE, even family, was so adamant about putting that out there. Yes, I understand no one was "supposedly" with him in that last 45-1 hr but, come on, really, how much more wasted could he have gotten in that time since the last time they HAD seen him?

8. We were never given an explanation of the "apology" story that went along with that false sighting story. Why not? Are we the only ones who found that odd? I find that hard to believe.

9. What were the plans for the end of the night? Were they all to meet up again? If so, where? If not, why not? Who was going where and with whom when the bars closed? What were the plans (I know with me and my friends we usually head to a 24 hour diner for breakfast before heading home for the night...what did they plan on doing?)? I have to believe some sort of plans were in place otherwise I find it hard to believe that his cousin and friends just left at the end of the night with no traces of Shane anywhere. I could not, and would not, just go home knowing my friend was missing and not with me or other friends. Unless of course I knew he had other plans. Then I would just assume he carried out those plans as planned. If he did have a habit of just getting up and walking away/leaving when drunk, which I find hard to believe but if he did, is there any record to show that anyone tried calling him after hours to see where he was? Even if the phone was dead or turned off, wouldn't records still show that yes, the cousin or friend or whomever tried calling to see where he had gone? And if they didn't try calling him, why not? Again that would mean to me that he had plans and they knew of them so there was no need to call. JMO

10. Why the hell was he in that lot in the first place?

11. Why were the keys found where they were?

12. Why was the body found where it was...so far from the keys.....and in water/an area previously searched......in just waist high, good visibility water? And yes, the GSURU said they HAD previously searched that area.

That's just some points.

As for the autopsy, I'd like to know if any of his bones were broken? I believe if he was going to/did commit suicide, then he would have done it from higher ground, as I said from the beginning. So, I would think he would have jumped from either the Green Lane Bridge or the train track bridge. But had he done so into such shallow water, I would think some bones would have been broken.

I know some think he could have jumped from the wall in the lot and that's when his keys fell out. IMO, I seriously doubt he would have 1. tried committing suicide from THAT wall, 2. broken any bones from THAT jump (not that he has, we don't know yet, but just saying) or 3. would have been so incapacitated that he could not get himself back out. I also don't believe the currents were so strong that he succumbed to it, was carried along downstream to the pub where he ultimately lost his life and went under (which also means if he jumped from the Green Lane Bridge I don't think he would have been carried down that far either). If you remember, we were also told in the beginning that the river had been more shallow than usual. And it did not rain or snow no where near enough in the 5 weeks he was missing that it would have raised the water levels. So I am assuming the levels were pretty much the same on the night he went missing and the day he was found.

Suicide is a possibility. I think if he did do it he jumped from the train track bridge and pretty much lost his life right there under it pretty much where he was found. But does anyone really know exactly what spot he was located? Just wondering with trying to figure out if the bridge does come over that part of the water. But again, there is the issue with the keys......hmmm

Anyway, just can't get passed that stuff. And Kevin, I really dislike how you've come here on "our turf", so to speak, to tell us to just accept it as an accident and move on/get off certain things/etc. We are NOT over on the family site saying these things. We are here on a forum they most likely don't even know about. We already know these things, these thoughts, these ideas, these theories are not welcomed on their page so we keep them here. Respectfully so. So please, do not tell us on THIS page, like you do on theirs, to just leave it be and move on or to be quiet about certain things. I believe that is the MODS jobs and believe me, if we were in any violation they would not have a problem telling us so.

As a close friend of the family, as you claim you are, I would think that you would want the police and family to explore ALL avenues too, and to not just be cut off and told nope, this is what happened accept it and move on. End of story. Why have you, from the start, come on here saying it was an accident......that was that.......and that we should leave it be (are you or the family worried about his or their reputation if it were a suicide or he was drunk and/or high and this is why the "accident theory is being pushed?)? You don't know any more than we do. Just some of us have learned, and sadly through personal experience, that we cannot and will not just "accept" what is told to us. Had some of us here just accepted what was told to us......then some of us would have never had gotten to the bottom of our own family murder mysteries, missing person mysteries, etc. Not everything is so cut and dry as it seems. LE isn't always right. Nor are family. Things aren't always black and white. When something seems off, people WILL take notice and WILL start to ask questions. This is what we've done. That is human nature.

Yes, of course we could be wrong and for some God awful crazy reason, EVERYTHING and ANYTHING just went terribly wrong for poor Shane that night. I mean, so much bad luck just one thing after another. Yeah, some may believe it. But some of us just can't. Sorry if you can't understand that. You've come to accept the accident theory and are ok with it. That's fine. And I understand it. Now please accept that some of us just can't. Not without more info, as I said in the beginning of this already too long message. Maybe, if more of the missing pieces had been filled in for us, we too could accept and move on. But for now, I just know that I can't. And I know that I'm not the only one. His story and his death remains a constant on my timeline every day on FB (as most of my family are in Philly). No one believes he died of an "accident" of his own accord. Not one.

Anyway, JMO. Sorry this was so incredibly long.

 

[Gone Girl]

Thank you, CementPond, for putting into eloquent language all of the thoughts that have been consuming me. I have hesitated to post because it has felt very hostile ever since Shane's body was found. Something is different on this thread from all of the other threads I have followed. Hopefully, people expressed their concerns to mods as I have. Although, the tone never improved. I just felt the need to post in support of what you wrote. I hope we can all pursue justice for Shane and keep sleuthing to find the truth.

 

[i_m_fletch]

Thank you Cement Pond and Gone Girl. I, too, have not contributed posts to this thread after sensing hostility when people would theorize. I thought that this site was designed to share opinions or theorize. I hope those who were close to Shane realize that no disrespect is intended ever. We truly care about the missing which is why we are here. That concern we have as websleuthers should not be met with hostility. Hopefully the tone on this thread will improve.

 

[Oak]

Thank you CementPond and Gone Girl. I really have thought the same things. Before I commented for the first time the other day I had been lurking on here since just a few days after Shane's disappearance and I'm shy so I didn't comment for a long time, but the reason I checked this thread incessantly was because I was in awe of how this forum is full of amazing people who respect each other and truly only care about helping. As time went on and others joined the tone was changed to people being told they are wrong and to back off and now it's time to stop and I actually started feeling badly after coming here rather than positive. I kept coming though because I wanted to try to figure this out too and the two of you, plus many others here, are just wonderful.

 

[CementPond]

Thank you GG, IAM and Oak. Unfortunately, I don't think it's gonna matter what we think. We can have a thousand questions that we feel need to be answered. But for some reason, the family seems happy with the outcome (well, NOT happy their son has passed, obviously, but you know what I mean) and don't seem to be interested in pursuing other avenues or asking what, in my opinion, are obvious questions that need to be asked. And because of this I'm gonna have to assume they may know more than we do.

Maybe there was a suicide memo, a text, a call? Maybe he said this to someone present that last night? Who the heck knows. But had he been my son, and knowing what little WE here on this forum DO know, this case would be far from over. They'd have to walk me through every last second of his last hours of life. They'd have to explain to me why it all made sense to them (LE and ME) that all these unfortunate circumstances came to be for my son and that he ended up where he did because of them. And it would have to make sense!! They'd have to hit me over the head with the reason why the keys could possibly he in one location and his body in another. Why no one thought it strange that he was missing at the end of the night.

I'd be damned, and would care less, if my own or my son's reputation was slightly tarnished for partaking in what many teens and young adults these days seem to partake in, drinking and smoking pot. Who cares? What would it matter to me if my son was missing? All that would matter would be finding him. The boy drank and smoked pot, for goodness sakes. Not like he was some junkie who constantly did wrong and was always putting his life on the line and maybe you'd come to expect this outcome from his carelessness.

No. Shane seemed like a normal, happy young boy with his whole life ahead of him. Which is why I do not suspect suicide. And, because of the multitude of questions that do exist, and because of the things that just don't make sense or add up, is why I cannot simply accept an accident of his own doing either. I need more explanations. I need to be walked through it. Need to be made to understand how such an accident can even be possible. But so far no one has been able to provide that and I don't think they 1. can or 2. even care to help us understand. And maybe we don't deserve, or have to know. He wasn't ours, so to speak. But in a way, I feel like he was. After all, so many people have held out hope, donated money, went out looking, attended the fundraisers, gave advice, opinions, theories, prayers, hopes, and whatever else the family needed and asked for. Is it too much for us to ask in return, for a little more understanding? For a little more info to be given to us? IS there even more to know? If so, what is it? If not, why not and why are they ok with there being nothing more to the story? Because, as it stands now, you can see MANY of us have MANY questions. Why don't they? And if they do know more but don't exactly want to say why, the least they can do is tell us something like, "We know THAT (theory) isn't possible because of some inside info we have but would rather not share with the public. Just know, however, that because of this info, that is the reason why we know that (theory) isn't possible." Something like that! Anything!

IF the family is worried about their or his reputation, I can tell you this, their behavior is in no way helping things. If anything, have seen it turn sympathetic people into questioning ones who wanna know why and how the family can be so willing to accept this outcome without wondering about the obvious things everyone has constantly been pointing out. Of course when I see or hear people pondering these things about the family, I try to come to their defense and offer, "Well, maybe they simply know more than we do." But many people have a hard time with that. And I understand why. JMO

Anyway, so sad to think the family will soon be saying their last goodbyes to their son (which angers me even more if someone else did have a hand in his death, even if only in neglect). I never want to be in their position. Would never want to know that pain first hand. I truly feel for them and will be thinking of them today and tomorrow. Just as I have been every day since he went missing.

 

[ChuckMaureen]

SBM, BBM

So it's Thursday. The day of Shane's viewing. So sad. I took a few days off the thread to try and see things perhaps differently. Tried playing the various scenarios over and over in my head to see if I could come to, and be happy with, one scenario versus another. But I couldn't.

Before coming back to check this thread I figured I'd check the news sites online to see if anything further had been said about the autopsy. While I didn't see anything new on that, one thing was definitely clear in the comments, almost NO ONE believes the "accident" theory either. And there's not many buying the suicide one. I was beginning to think that the handful of us here were alone in our thoughts. But I see we are not.

I just can't get beyond some things. They keep nagging at me. Telling me something is off. Is wrong. Of course maybe some of these things could be put to rest had the family been more forthcoming with what they DO know, as well as LE. I just don't know.

Anyway, these are just SOME of the things nagging at me still that won't allow me to move on:

///snipped///

I know some think he could have jumped from the wall in the lot and that's when his keys fell out. IMO, I seriously doubt he would have 1. tried committing suicide from THAT wall, 2. broken any bones from THAT jump (not that he has, we don't know yet, but just saying) or 3. would have been so incapacitated that he could not get himself back out. I also don't believe the currents were so strong that he succumbed to it, was carried along downstream to the pub where he ultimately lost his life and went under (which also means if he jumped from the Green Lane Bridge I don't think he would have been carried down that far either). If you remember, we were also told in the beginning that the river had been more shallow than usual. And it did not rain or snow no where near enough in the 5 weeks he was missing that it would have raised the water levels. So I am assuming the levels were pretty much the same on the night he went missing and the day he was found.

///snipped///

The river has literally had its ups and downs from when the day Shane went missing to the day Shane was recovered. It is not unreasonable to assume Shane may have been moved along in the river during one or more of the peak gage height and flow rate periods depicted in the graphs:

 

[takeittothebank]

CP said it all and echoed my concerns, there are so many things that are questionable and dont make sense.

Apparently there isnt much of a current at the bottom of the river. So I really feel like where the keys were found is where they hit the water. So either when Shane somehow got into the water, he somehow while alive ended up 10 ft from the wall and the keys fell out from his pocket/hand then........or he drowned closer to the wall or closer to shore and his body floated out to this area and the keys hit the river there [seems unlikely his body would travel in that direction though, and then end up back in shallower water when he was eventually found?????].......or they were thrown in by him or someone else. The keys situation bugs me as does the credit card situation.

 

[takeittothebank]

Jonesy I remember you said before a source told you weeks before Shane was found that cameras were being checked from Venice island to see if they could see Shane in the water.......do you know where this camera or cameras are at? I wanted to know if we could rule out potential spots that he jumped in from and also spots on land that it could be confirmed he never got to.

CP, to answer one of your questions, it does appear the track bridge that you mentioned as a possible suicide spot is near where he was found...., unless Im looking at things wrong. Im looking at Google earth,. He was found behind the brewery I believe.

 

[ChuckMaureen]

Is it possible Kildare's may have had Shane's card in their possession from earlier that evening, from his first purchase and they 'lost' it to the floor, either accidentally or purposefully? I can fathom no reason for Kildare's (as a business) to do such a thing, but perhaps an individual?

 

[ChuckMaureen]

Jonesy I remember you said before a source told you weeks before Shane was found that cameras were being checked from Venice island to see if they could see Shane in the water.......do you know where this camera or cameras are at? I wanted to know if we could rule out potential spots that he jumped in from.

CP, to answer one of your questions, it does appear the track bridge that you mentioned as a possible suicide spot is near where he was found...., unless Im looking at things wrong. Im looking at Google earth,. He was found behind the brewery I believe.

'yellow question mark' is the location:

 

[takeittothebank]

ChuckMaureen, you may have said this already but I want to be sure, where do you believe the actual drowning [not necessarily point of entry] happened? Near where he was found or closer to the lot?

 

[circe221]

In reading some of the recent posts, I remembered something from my youth.
I was with a group of kids drinking on the banks of the Delaware River (NJ side).
We were not of legal drinking age, but had some wine coolers and "Purple Passion" - this was in the late 80's - and were just hanging out goofing around.
It was summertime, so ice, snow, temperature was not an issue. I am guessing we were anywhere from 17-19 years old. Either in high school or just out of high school.
Someone had the idea to walk across the Tacony Palmyra Bridge (those in the Philadelphia are may know this bridge).
It is not a long or wide bridge, nor is it particularly high, and has to open when higher boats come down the river.
Anyway, as we were walking across the bridge, one of the boys, who was known to smoke pot and hash and drop acid from time to time, started acting strange, pretending to lean over the railing, jumping on the railing, trying to straddle the railing, dangling his feet down, etc. All of a sudden, he ran ahead. At one point, I remember I heard him yelling. He made it to the other side and hid off to the side of the bridge. We were frantic thinking he fell, not knowing what had happened or where he was. Finally he ran out laughing. But on the way back, I remember being at the highest point of the bridge suddenly thinking, why are we doing this??? This is crazy!!! This is stupid!!!


But...
The reason this memory struck me was because the one boy, the one who had a history of dropping acid and was acting strangely, could very well have fallen off the bridge.
There was a period where we couldn't see him.
I imagine that if he had fallen in, there would have been a lot of questions - Was it an accident? Did he jump on purpose? Was there anyone else on the other side of the bridge we couldn't see? Did someone push him? Unlike Shane's case there were witnesses, but there were short periods of time when he was alone, or when he was with one other person. I imagine that we all would have had a different story, a different perspective on what had happened, what our own role was in the whole thing.

I relate this to Shane because as many questions as we might have that may never be answered, sometimes things just happen.
Terrible things that have no logical explanation.
Shane may have simply fallen into the water.
If the boy I remember had fallen from the Tacony Palmyra Bridge, it would most likely would have been because he was drunk and high and not thinking clearly.
Not because anyone pushed him or he chose to end his life. Just because it was a perfect storm of circumstances that came together tragically.
I think that in our search for answers, we might be overlooking the most likely explanation.

 

[takeittothebank]

In thinking of Shane's case, I remembered something from my youth.
I was with a group of kids drinking on the banks of the Delaware River (NJ side).
We were not of legal drinking age, but had some wine coolers and "Purple Passion" - this was in the late 80's - and were just hanging out goofing around.
It was summertime, so ice, snow, temperature was not an issue. I am guessing we were anywhere from 17-19 years old. Either in high school or just out of high school.
Someone had the idea to walk across the Tacony Palmyra Bridge (those in the Philadelphia are may know this bridge).
It is not a long or wide bridge, nor is it particularly high, and has to open when higher boats come down the river.
Anyway, as we were walking across the bridge, one of the boys, who was known to smoke pot and hash and drop acid from time to time, started acting strange, pretending to lean over the railing, jumping on the railing, trying to straddle the railing, dangling his feet down, etc. All of a sudden, he ran ahead. At one point, I remember I heard him yelling. He made it to the other side and hid off to the side of the bridge. We were frantic thinking he fell, not knowing what had happened or where he was. Finally he ran out laughing. But on the way back, I remember being at the highest point of the bridge suddenly thinking, why are we doing this??? This is crazy!!! This is stupid!!!


But...
The reason this memory struck me was because the one boy, the one who had a history of dropping acid and was acting strangely, could very well have fallen off the bridge.
There was a period where we couldn't see him.
I imagine that if he had fallen in, there would have been a lot of questions - Was it an accident? Did he jump on purpose? Was there anyone else on the other side of the bridge we couldn't see? Did someone push him? Unlike Shane's case there were witnesses, but there were short periods of time when he was alone, or when he was with one other person. I imagine that we all would have had a different story, a different perspective on what had happened, what our own role was in the whole thing.

I relate this to Shane because as many questions as we might have that may never be answered, sometimes things just happen.
Terrible things that have no logical explanation.
Shane may have simply fallen into the water.
If the boy I remember had fallen from the Tacony Palmyra Bridge, it would most likely would have been because he was drunk and high and not thinking clearly.
Not because anyone pushed him or he chose to end his life. Just because it was a perfect storm of circumstances that came together tragically.
I think that in our search for answers, we might be overlooking the most likely explanation.

Thanks for posting this story. It's interesting to me b/c I said before that I could see something like this happening if Shane had been there with friends. An accident that stemmed from goofing around/hanging out with friends. In Shane's case, we do not know if he interacted with anyone in the lot.

 

[AllGood]

Thank you GG, IAM and Oak. Unfortunately, I don't think it's gonna matter what we think. We can have a thousand questions that we feel need to be answered. But for some reason, the family seems happy with the outcome (well, NOT happy their son has passed, obviously, but you know what I mean) and don't seem to be interested in pursuing other avenues or asking what, in my opinion, are obvious questions that need to be asked. And because of this I'm gonna have to assume they may know more than we do.

Maybe there was a suicide memo, a text, a call? Maybe he said this to someone present that last night? Who the heck knows. But had he been my son, and knowing what little WE here on this forum DO know, this case would be far from over. They'd have to walk me through every last second of his last hours of life. They'd have to explain to me why it all made sense to them (LE and ME) that all these unfortunate circumstances came to be for my son and that he ended up where he did because of them. And it would have to make sense!! They'd have to hit me over the head with the reason why the keys could possibly he in one location and his body in another. Why no one thought it strange that he was missing at the end of the night.

I'd be damned, and would care less, if my own or my son's reputation was slightly tarnished for partaking in what many teens and young adults these days seem to partake in, drinking and smoking pot. Who cares? What would it matter to me if my son was missing? All that would matter would be finding him. The boy drank and smoked pot, for goodness sakes. Not like he was some junkie who constantly did wrong and was always putting his life on the line and maybe you'd come to expect this outcome from his carelessness.

No. Shane seemed like a normal, happy young boy with his whole life ahead of him. Which is why I do not suspect suicide. And, because of the multitude of questions that do exist, and because of the things that just don't make sense or add up, is why I cannot simply accept an accident of his own doing either. I need more explanations. I need to be walked through it. Need to be made to understand how such an accident can even be possible. But so far no one has been able to provide that and I don't think they 1. can or 2. even care to help us understand. And maybe we don't deserve, or have to know. He wasn't ours, so to speak. But in a way, I feel like he was. After all, so many people have held out hope, donated money, went out looking, attended the fundraisers, gave advice, opinions, theories, prayers, hopes, and whatever else the family needed and asked for. Is it too much for us to ask in return, for a little more understanding? For a little more info to be given to us? IS there even more to know? If so, what is it? If not, why not and why are they ok with there being nothing more to the story? Because, as it stands now, you can see MANY of us have MANY questions. Why don't they? And if they do know more but don't exactly want to say why, the least they can do is tell us something like, "We know THAT (theory) isn't possible because of some inside info we have but would rather not share with the public. Just know, however, that because of this info, that is the reason why we know that (theory) isn't possible." Something like that! Anything!

IF the family is worried about their or his reputation, I can tell you this, their behavior is in no way helping things. If anything, have seen it turn sympathetic people into questioning ones who wanna know why and how the family can be so willing to accept this outcome without wondering about the obvious things everyone has constantly been pointing out. Of course when I see or hear people pondering these things about the family, I try to come to their defense and offer, "Well, maybe they simply know more than we do." But many people have a hard time with that. And I understand why. JMO

Anyway, so sad to think the family will soon be saying their last goodbyes to their son (which angers me even more if someone else did have a hand in his death, even if only in neglect). I never want to be in their position. Would never want to know that pain first hand. I truly feel for them and will be thinking of them today and tomorrow. Just as I have been every day since he went missing.

Thank you CP, for this post (and the one before this). I have thought many of the things you posted...You have a wonderful way of expressing your thoughts.

I have been reading WS for quite some time (different thread), but never felt compelled to join the group until this happened. When I saw all the concerned people with so many theories, who had questions just as I do, I decided to join. What an amazing, giving group of people.

My son is 21..he and Shane spent a lot of time together during Freshman year at WCU, they were friends and had great times together. They lived on the same floor of the dorm, a couple rooms away from each other. I heard so many "Shane and I" stories that year from my son.....

Thank you to members of this board who have lost someone and continue to honor them by coming to this forum and offering support, encouragement and theories to others. You are inspiring.

Any parent (including me) would not want their child "judged" by their recreational activities. I have not ever gotten the feeling on WS that anyone was judging Shane.
I hope everyone on this forum continues to post here, as well as on other forums. This group is awesome.

 

[circe221]

Well, my main reason for posting it was to illustrate that had the kid I was with fallen from the Tacony bridge, it would have been an accident, but in the aftermath, I can see people concocting all of these different scenarios to explain what was quite simple - a kid who was under the influence was somewhere he shouldn't have been and lost his balance. No suicide, no foul play, no one lurking in the shadows, just a horrible accident...

And it really made me think how we do careless things when we are younger that in our later years we would never do.
Most of the time, these reckless moments have no consequences except maybe a hangover or wounded pride.
Sadly, though, some of these moments, which could be attributed to the "high" of being young and carefree as well as alcohol or drugs, do have tragic repercussions.

I think this is just one of those cases.

 

[TMAN2014]

Well, my main reason for posting it was to illustrate that had the kid I was with fallen from the Tacony bridge, it would have been an accident, but in the aftermath, I can see people concocting all of these different scenarios to explain what was quite simple - a kid who was under the influence was somewhere he shouldn't have been and lost his balance. No suicide, no foul play, no one lurking in the shadows, just a horrible accident...

And it really made me think how we do careless things when we are younger that in our later years we would never do.
Most of the time, these reckless moments have no consequences except maybe a hangover or wounded pride.
Sadly, though, some of these moments, which could be attributed to the "high" of being young and carefree as well as alcohol or drugs, do have tragic repercussions.

I think this is just one of those cases.

Well stated. I guess that is one of the reasons I took interest in this case. I have many similarities to Shane. I can think of countless nights where I did the stupidest of things (driving in snow, trusting strangers, walking dangerous areas), while out on the town. Somehow, it seemed like there was always an angel who looked over me. The bottom line is sometimes on a rare occasion a fluke accident happens. No one can explain it, and there need to be someone to blame. I tend to chalk this case up as one of those occasions.

I understand people want to be sure it was not foul play, and will hang on to that speculation. Some people will try to make a connection to the supposed "smiley faced murders." I don't see it. As far as I am concerned, if the family is set to move forward and put this behind them, that is good enough for me. I wish the family, friends, and neighbors the best.

It is very shocking and confusing to lose a 21 year old, and it just shows there is no order in the universe. I have never lost a family member in this manner, just a few friends, at very young ages, to some senseless tragedies.

I know this forum is here to constantly ask why, but sometimes people accept that we are not on this earth to know everything. There are mysteries in life, and we are not always entitled to all the answers. I accept that the family wants to move forward. Sometimes, if you never move forward, you can drive yourself crazy. That is not to say that I don't respect those with different opinions of this case. Everyone adds their piece and we get the true picture somewhere in between.

God Bless Shane!
An Irish Toast to you Lad!

 

[takeittothebank]

The bottom line is sometimes on a rare occasion a fluke accident happens. No one can explain it, and there need to be someone to blame. I tend to chalk this case up as one of those occasions.

snipped by me. You could very well be right but I also want to say this, there were so many "flukes" from that night leading up to Shane's death which is why I can understand anyone's skepticism.

 

[AlwaysOnTheCase]

I've been following Shane's case from the beginning but haven't posted before. First, I just want to say that my heart breaks for the family. I've also been following Paul's case so I'm trying to catch up, but was wondering if the toxicology tests specifically test for roofies? Sorry if I missed this in a previous post. Thanks!

Toxicology reports are standard in a case like this.
They test for all types of illicit and prescription drugs.
Including alcohol and metabolites (break down of other drugs)
The problem with roofies- they are a Benzodiazepine.
Several anti-depression drugs give a "false positive" result when combined.
So, if Shane was on -example: Ativan, Zoloft etc...it might give a positive reading.

The pathologist & forensic chemist will perform other advanced testing: Mass/Gas. They are more sophisticated and can determine the amount or quantity of the substance and also identify the specific drug.
They use, blood, urine and tissue samples.
They also test in the heart, liver, kidney etc...
They ask the family for a list of all prescribed medications.
They do not test for poisoning. Unless specified or a suspected poisoning is given.
These samples are kept for many years.
Example: let's say hypothetically speaking. Someone comes forward in 5 years and says they gave/slipped Shane =xyz... These samples can then be tested for that substance.
A standard test will take 4-6 weeks.