Patsy Ramsey

[otg]

This is very important. PR claims to have picked the RN pages up off the staircase. Paper is extremely absorbant, and her fingerprints and her TouchDNA would be left on those pages - if she had picked the pages up as she claimed. Given that it is large notepad paper and not some small card stock, one would not be to pick the pages up by only holding the edges. And there are NO fingerprints, and NO TouchDNA, so whoever wrote the RN wore gloves, and whoever placed it on the stairs wore gloves. If PR wrote the RN and placed the pages on the stairs, she was wearing gloves. Whoever wiped down the flashlight and batteries was wearing gloves. Were any animal (beaver or wolf or other) found anywhere other than with JBR?

When this occurred, there was no such thing as "touch DNA." DNA testing was only done on areas that were known (or at least suspected) to have bodily fluids (blood, saliva, etc.). When the tDNA testing was developed, the DA at the time (Mary Lacy) had some selected items submitted for testing. I don't think the RN was one of those things tested. Neither do I think testing it would prove anything conclusive that couldn't be explained away -- considering it was written on a pad that the Ramseys admitted belonged to Patsy and that John Ramsey handed over to investigators. Anyone in the house (or who had even been there) could have handled the pad or any of the pages in it.

 

[BoldBear]

There were smudge pints all over the pages. They only got a couple of good prints. Have a look at Overkill. It shows one of the pages with print smudges from fingerprint dust all over it. Fingerprints don't always transfer. If someone washes their hands and doesn't have a lot of sweat, oil or dust on their fingers, it's hard to get good prints. John just had a shower and Patsy had just been messing with spots on JB's jumpsuit--her hands had just been washed. You'd think that Patsy would have been touching her face during all this panic where there was makeup.

Give all of that, I believe that one of the two went out of their way not to touch the papers. It is odd that there aren't more good fingerprints on the paper because John and Patsy could have simply said, "Of course, I handled the ransom note. My finger prints should be on them."

The lack of good fingerprints on an object doesn't mean it hasn't been handled. The item may have smudged fingerprints all over it. Forensic investigators need good prints.

 

[BBB167893]

The idea that someone copied Patsy's writing is in the Fake News category. I'll be charitable and label it as counterfactual.

That IS generous. I just don't see any way that someone could do it so perfectly. Not just the writing itself, but the WAY she wrote.

I'd bet the house on Patsy writing the Ransom Note, her postmortem behaviour at attempting to mask her writing and deny prior examples tells you everything you need to know.

Now that is a quote I'd like permission to use elsewhere!

Patsy also said she never visited the Wine-Cellar Christmas Day yet her fibers are embedded into the knotting on the ligature, is this another IDI staging?

I recently encountered an IDI who thinks that.

 

[icedtea4me]

*snip*Patsy also said she never visited the Wine-Cellar Christmas Day yet her fibers are embedded into the knotting on the ligature, is this another IDI staging?

If she was in the wine cellar on or after 00:00:01 26 Dec 96, then she's telling the truth.

 

[BBB167893]

If she was in the wine cellar on or after 00:00:01 26 Dec 96, then she's telling the truth.

I think she said at one point that she never wore those clothes in the basement or while painting. Still, good catch. I'm a good one for using the "exact words" ploy myself!

 

[UKGuy]

If she was in the wine cellar on or after 00:00:01 26 Dec 96, then she's telling the truth.

icedtea4me,
Sure, whatever, but the point is her fibers should not be embedded into the ligature knotting, maybe the intruder's, but not Patsy's, and there has never been any explanation as to why, despite Patsy claiming responsibility for opening the partially opened gifts.

Looks like the case is either PDI or BDI and she is sheilding BR, by saying she opened the gifts, Kolar says it was BR, she says she dressed JonBenet in BR's long johns, but failed to notice the size-12's, funny that, but says she gave JonBenet the size-12's she purchased for her niece.

If JonBenet was placed directly, sleeping, to bed by Patsy then who dressed her hair with those hair-ties?


The hair-ties are alike the pineapple snack something administered to JonBenet by someone else.

.


.

 

[UKGuy]

That IS generous. I just don't see any way that someone could do it so perfectly. Not just the writing itself, but the WAY she wrote.



Now that is a quote I'd like permission to use elsewhere!



I recently encountered an IDI who thinks that.

Use away, gratis, copyright is revoked, LOL. The case is definitely PDI or BDI with JR helping out here and there, whilst he covered his rear end by hiring legal representation and with statements like Its an inside job.

.

 

[Tssiemer]

How tall was JBR?


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[Ambitioned]

4'7 according to several sources.

BR towered over her.

 

[icedtea4me]

4'7 according to several sources.*snip*

Wrong. She was 47" (3'11"), not 4'7" (55").

http://www.acandyrose.com/12271996jonbenet04.gif

 

[SandyQLS]

There were smudge pints all over the pages. They only got a couple of good prints. Have a look at Overkill. It shows one of the pages with print smudges from fingerprint dust all over it. Fingerprints don't always transfer. If someone washes their hands and doesn't have a lot of sweat, oil or dust on their fingers, it's hard to get good prints. John just had a shower and Patsy had just been messing with spots on JB's jumpsuit--her hands had just been washed. You'd think that Patsy would have been touching her face during all this panic where there was makeup.

Give all of that, I believe that one of the two went out of their way not to touch the papers. It is odd that there aren't more good fingerprints on the paper because John and Patsy could have simply said, "Of course, I handled the ransom note. My finger prints should be on them."

The lack of good fingerprints on an object doesn't mean it hasn't been handled. The item may have smudged fingerprints all over it. Forensic investigators need good prints.

Thank you. I did not understand that they had found a variety of smudged, unidentifiable prints on the RN. Your post helps.

 

[SandyQLS]

4'7 according to several sources.

BR towered over her.

Attached Thumbnails

Thank you for posting that photo. Does anyone else think that the jumper on JBR is about 2-3 sizes too large for her? Not to mention that hat being oversized. There are so many items in this saga that are Oversized that it makes me wonder if PR had difficulty with her perceptions of reality, that her reality is distorted.

Oversized:
-the plaid outfit on JBR above
-bowl used for the pineapple
-serving spoon in bowl instead of a teaspoon or soup spoon
-iced tea glass instead of cup (which JR refers to as a glass in his interview but when PR looks at the same photo she calls it a cup, twice, when clearly it is a tall glass. ref: picture 414)
-size 12 Bloomies
-BR's oversized longjohn bottoms on JBR
-the life-sized Twinn doll
-the artifical Christmas trees are oversized (and too numerous in the house)
-the house itself is oversized

Has anyone else noticed other instances of this oversizing or undersizing?

(I keep thinking of Alice in Wonderland/Through the Looking Glass or perhaps the song White Rabbit/Go Ask Alice because of these distorted sizes.)

 

[k-mac]

Thank you for posting that photo. Does anyone else think that the jumper on JBR is about 2-3 sizes too large for her? Not to mention that hat being oversized. There are so many items in this saga that are Oversized that it makes me wonder if PR had difficulty with her perceptions of reality, that her reality is distorted.

Oversized:
-the plaid outfit on JBR above
-bowl used for the pineapple
-serving spoon in bowl instead of a teaspoon or soup spoon
-iced tea glass instead of cup (which JR refers to as a glass in his interview but when PR looks at the same photo she calls it a cup, twice, when clearly it is a tall glass. ref: picture 414)
-size 12 Bloomies
-BR's oversized longjohn bottoms on JBR
-the life-sized Twinn doll
-the artifical Christmas trees are oversized (and too numerous in the house)
-the house itself is oversized

Has anyone else noticed other instances of this oversizing or undersizing?

(I keep thinking of Alice in Wonderland/Through the Looking Glass or perhaps the song White Rabbit/Go Ask Alice because of these distorted sizes.)

I dont see the plaid outfit as oversized?
to me its a rare occasion of PR dressing her appropriately for a sweet innocent little girl.

the house is hideous.
zero cohesion .
can't even write it off for the times. 1996 wasn't that long ago! :facepalm:

 

[Userid]

^ Agree, I'm no expert of course, but I don't see it as over-sized at all.

 

[Annapurna]

Thank you for posting that photo. Does anyone else think that the jumper on JBR is about 2-3 sizes too large for her? Not to mention that hat being oversized. There are so many items in this saga that are Oversized that it makes me wonder if PR had difficulty with her perceptions of reality, that her reality is distorted.

Oversized:
-the plaid outfit on JBR above
-bowl used for the pineapple
-serving spoon in bowl instead of a teaspoon or soup spoon
-iced tea glass instead of cup (which JR refers to as a glass in his interview but when PR looks at the same photo she calls it a cup, twice, when clearly it is a tall glass. ref: picture 414)
-size 12 Bloomies
-BR's oversized longjohn bottoms on JBR
-the life-sized Twinn doll
-the artifical Christmas trees are oversized (and too numerous in the house)
-the house itself is oversized

Has anyone else noticed other instances of this oversizing or undersizing?

(I keep thinking of Alice in Wonderland/Through the Looking Glass or perhaps the song White Rabbit/Go Ask Alice because of these distorted sizes.)

It was fashionable in the 90's to wear oversized clothes. I don't see it as too large, but it is not the same style as we see now.

ETA: the My Twinn doll was not life sized iirc, just about the size of an American girl doll. JBR did have a life sized Barbie doll (I don't think that was for Christmas, I think she had it earlier)

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[singularity]

Has anyone else noticed other instances of this oversizing or undersizing?

She wore oversized cowboy boots sometimes.

(I keep thinking of Alice in Wonderland/Through the Looking Glass or perhaps the song White Rabbit/Go Ask Alice because of these distorted sizes.)

I have a feeling that Patsy liked that song. She could relate to it.

 

[DeDee]

Thank you. I did not understand that they had found a variety of smudged, unidentifiable prints on the RN. Your post helps.

Perhaps the author of the RN wore gloves. Another benefit of donning gloves is they might assist in camouflaging one's handwriting. Why did the author insist upon the RN remaining clean of prints when it was written and deposited on the steps of the white spiral iron staircase. There was a real kidnapping. JBR was taken from her room and, against her will, left in the he!! hole wine cellar where the mold grows.

I guess JR had covered his underwear and gotten dressed since he first looked at the RN while it's on the floor by the spiral staircase. JR spread the multiple pages of the RN across the floor. Fernie walks up to the side door. Pretends to read it while it's upside down in his position. There was also a large green wreath covering the glass on that side door. I reiterate my analysis. Fernie could not read the RN from outside of the home. He was one of the very first to arrive and only one to park in the alley.

Realizing it's Patsy's thread, I simply must post this stupidity about John, the other liar du jour. It's an interview with Smit:

Lou Smit: "Yes. So I would like to show you a series of prints. If you will do that, Mr. Ramsey...what do you see?"

John Ramsey: "I see 'Hi,' looks like 'Hi-something' you see in a square block with, I can't tell if it's raised or lettering...I don't know if that's sand or is that mildewy stuff that was in the basement. Looks like there is some - some of the Christmas tree...."

Lou Smit: "Needles?"

John Ramsey: "...Needles, yeah, that were laying in there. It almost looks like the wall to me rather than the floor. Is it on the floor?"

This is the image they were discussing. Does it look like a wine cellar wall?

http://www.acandyrose.com/crimescene-basement.htm
Lou Smit's Presentation
Crime Scene Photo
Footprint HiTech prints in Basement

 

[singularity]

Perhaps the author of the RN wore gloves. Another benefit of donning gloves is they might assist in camouflaging one's handwriting. Why did the author insist upon the RN remaining clean of prints when it was written and deposited on the steps of the white spiral iron staircase.

I still say that should've been a "gotcha!" moment that simply slipped by LE. When they were discussing the details of the timeline when the ransom note is discovered and they're running up and down stairs and John becomes a semi-nude contortionist to read it, the simple fact of no fingerprints should've been hammered home once it got to the part where this note is levitating from room to room, floor to floor.

Fernie could not read the RN from outside of the home.

I'd love to know if he was ever called out on this odd scenario he describes that only makes sense in a world where Rod Serling comes out from behind a curtain, cigarette in hand... telling you where the next stop is.

if not, another huge missed opportunity.

This is the image they were discussing. Does it look like a wine cellar wall?

In that exchange, he's almost as good as Patsy at playing dumb. Almost...

Its almost as bad as the exchange where he's being asked some tough questions and he brings up how a kleenex box is out of place. No it isn't. Even if it was...how would he know? Mr. Big CEO Man doesn't give a rat's rump about the placement of kleenex boxes.

 

[MzOpinion8d]

Thank you for posting that photo. Does anyone else think that the jumper on JBR is about 2-3 sizes too large for her? Not to mention that hat being oversized. There are so many items in this saga that are Oversized that it makes me wonder if PR had difficulty with her perceptions of reality, that her reality is distorted.

Oversized:
-the plaid outfit on JBR above
-bowl used for the pineapple
-serving spoon in bowl instead of a teaspoon or soup spoon
-iced tea glass instead of cup (which JR refers to as a glass in his interview but when PR looks at the same photo she calls it a cup, twice, when clearly it is a tall glass. ref: picture 414)
-size 12 Bloomies
-BR's oversized longjohn bottoms on JBR
-the life-sized Twinn doll
-the artifical Christmas trees are oversized (and too numerous in the house)
-the house itself is oversized

Has anyone else noticed other instances of this oversizing or undersizing?

(I keep thinking of Alice in Wonderland/Through the Looking Glass or perhaps the song White Rabbit/Go Ask Alice because of these distorted sizes.)

I agree that the jumper looks slightly oversized. I would buy dresses slightly too large for my daughters so they could wear them longer, but that was no concern to Patsy I'm sure - she could buy clothes whenever she wanted.

However, I think Patsy's reality was distorted in every way. She lived in a fantasy world, surrounded by people who catered to her version of reality.

 

[ItzShea]

Wow. Could she have been trying to tell the investigators without ratting out her husband directly, what was going on in the home? And what actually happened that night?
How many of these odd ‘clues’were There?