Peru - Stephany Flores, 21, murdered in Lima hotel room, 30 May 2010 #12

[star444]

He simply walked into a pharmacy and bought a box of blonde hair dye off the shelf. He thought he would be blonde, just like Scott Peterson thought. He didn't realize that his hair was too dark and for him to be a blonde in one step, it would require a double process. Ta Daaaa Tiger Piss Orange!

LOL... Now that's funny... I don't care who ya' are. :floorlaugh:

 

[Kat]

http://gothamist.com/2010/06/12/joran_van_der_sloot_charged_with_mu.php

Earlier posters were trying to decifer the tattoo that Joran had written on his chest. Many thought it was his name.


According to this article ....

"van der Sloot's chest tattoo is reportedly the Thai words for "No worries."

Do we have anyone here that is familiar with the written Thai language? I hope so because I looked for the Thai word for "no worries" and couldn't find one quickly but found that the word is closely related to another word used that differs in nuance from the word meaning now worries.

I hope someone here can have a look and make sure that tattoo has been properly interpreted. Not meaning that the writer of the article is incorrect, it's probably correct but given the first two words of that phrase is closely related to another and the subtle nuances in the difference in language, I'm just curious. JMHO.

 

[RR0004]

Absolutely!

IMO though this person theories might seem a bit more believable if they weren't peddling the mention of book throughout. That is where I feel it's simply someone trying to promote a book.

Conspiracy theories are great and definitely thought provoking. It allows a person to think outside the box and open your mind to other possibilities.

But for me plain and simple the book mention really turns me in a whole other direction as far as validity. Of course, not knowing what the theories are...can in a way seem unfair and biased.

So with that in mind...I will not say yeah or nay. But I for one will not jump so far deep in the pond when the preponderance of evidence in this case seems to be overwhelming on the surface that is. I am sure there is much we don't know and will probably never know.

I agree.

PS Isn't it against TOS to say (in so many words) "I know something you don't know...and I can't tell you!" ???

 

[KR2tonenow]

• 
  
  US journalist granted parole in Peru after 15 years in jail
  Lori Berenson, sentenced to life for helping MRTA rebels, is freed but cannot leave Peru until 2015

Likely, JVDS will be in similiar circumstances, but note Ms. Berenson was released last week. She survived the prison there as well.

 

[RR0004]

http://www.rr.com/news/topic/article...ells_All/full/


A Van der Sloot conviction may seem like a slam-dunk, but there are still potential caveats. The Dutch consulate in Lima says Van der Sloot's confession was coerced, and his mother Anita, who spoke with him briefly by telephone, told a Dutch radio station that his interrogation has been "barbaric." In 2009, Peru was singled out by the Bureau of Democracy, Human Rights and Labor for human rights abuses involving "abuse of detainees and inmates by police and prison security forces" and "harsh prison conditions."

Why pick Peru to committ murder?

I knew sooner or later the "human rights" issue would pop up.

 

[JBean]

I agree.

PS Isn't it against TOS to say (in so many words) "I know something you don't know...and I can't tell you!" ???

yes it is

 

[Nana46]

Thanks everyone for all the posts...I learn so much and spend more time with you than my family it seems,lol
I won't ramble on about this anymore I hope...unless you have lost a child there is no way on God's earth to explain to anyone how you feel....I cannot fathom the strength it took for BH to even manage to get on a plane and go to Aruba....well I can because at that point her child was missing...but, for the life of me I cannot understand what possible motive anyone could find if she listed her time of arrival differently....for months on end I am sure that I may not have combed my hair or even dressed at all....to state with any degree of accuracy anything I might have said during my grief would be impossible on my part.....she is a mother who unlike me has not been able to bury her child....that grief I cannot even fathom let alone imagine that she still might be out there somewhere......my prayers are with her and her family and especially to the Flores family now.

 

[Columbo]

I agree.

PS Isn't it against TOS to say (in so many words) "I know something you don't know...and I can't tell you!" ???

Isn't it also against TOS to say derogatory or accusatory things about people who aren't accused of the crime or directly involved with the crime(i.e. Beth Holloway)? Just wondering...

 

[Woe.be.gone]

http://gothamist.com/2010/06/12/joran_van_der_sloot_charged_with_mu.php

Earlier posters were trying to decifer the tattoo that Joran had written on his chest. Many thought it was his name.


According to this article ....

"van der Sloot's chest tattoo is reportedly the Thai words for "No worries."

That would be 'Mai Pen Rai'.

 

[RR0004]

This sounds very much like the theory that Martha Stout presents in her book "The Sociopath Next Door". The first 9/10ths of the book is an excellent read. I have issue with the last 10th because she comes to the conclusion that Sociopathy (what ever word you choose to use for it APD..etc) is genetic and IIRC she supports finding a way to test for that disorder in order to track a newborn through childhood and adulthood---in other words create a label for that newborn and by tracking them prevent crime by institutializing them before they can commit a crime.

Like I said the first 9/10ths are well written and supported by studies (however, some of those studies are open to other interpretations). I'm going to check out the author someone else here suggested R. Hare and see what he offers.

All the above is just my vague recollection of the ending of her book and my most humble opinion.

I'm posting this for those that are interested in the possible APD diagnosis for JVDS.

Yes, if I remember correctly there was something about viewing the images of the brain while shown pics (?)...but I've read a lot about sociopathy so I could be remembering wrong.
Great book, BTW!

 

[georger]

I think God (and us) already knows what else, unfortunately.

He was taught that whatever bad thing he's done or might happen to him... (remember him proclaiming, "something bad has happened")... whatever it was would be 'handled' so he had no need to worry.

Suzi, this guy is a "schmo" - he doesnt have a cogent thought in his head. He's been playing routlette with a loaded gun at his head for
years. If somebody sees that as heroic, sorry for them. He's a Fool.

Im actually wondering if his family had given up on him a long time
ago and acted only out of self preservation trying to get him out of
trouble then sending him away hoping he would stay away? The mother
hasnt been in any big rush to run to his side personally; she took time
to attend an arts festival while he is rotting (going to hell in a handbag)
in Peru. That strikes me ambivalent.

He has an attorney but what can any attorney actually hope to do,
under these circumstances?

I think Steph's father's statement says it pretty well; he seems to have
summarised things pretty well in his grief.

We are all affraid Joran may squirm free somehow but that
probably is not going to happen, realistically speaking . And this ocean
may be too large for any attorney to deal with -

 

[JBean]

suzihawk and others,

I really don't mean to be coy, and I would be much more detailed about things, but I am bound by contractural obligations to save most of this stuff for the book. I also have to careful about anything I say regarding Beth and her family/friends, because I don't want to violate forum rules.

That being said, the powerful interests that covered up Natalee's death revolve around the drug trade in Aruba (and elsewhere, including Peru) and government officials who profit financially from it. I really don't know why Joran was targeted initially; it may just have been a case of being in the wrong place at the wrong time. I still can't completely figure out why Beth focused so exclusively on him from the outset (and believe me, there is evidence to indicate there was no logical reason to do so). I believe, at some point, due to Joran's seeming lack of sympathy for her, and his ever changing stories, that it became personal for Beth.

I can only speculate about exactly what happened in Peru, but that speculation will naturally be influenced by the research I've conducted on the Holloway case. I can't help but strongly believe the two cases are connected, even without the incredible five year anniversary date "coincidence," and the sudden news about the "extortion" plot, breaking nationally on the exact day Joran was apprehended. I've tried to post a plausible scenario, but I fully realize that most of you will find it preposterous.

As for the coffee video, I respectfully question the dire interpretations about Joran appearing confounded in the hallway, weakly knocking on a door that isn't fully closed, etc. There is no question that it looks very weird, but I can't see as how it is an indication of guilt. And, of course, getting the hotel employee to open the door just makes no sense to me, if there is a dead body behind that door, unless you want it to be discovered, which obviously wasn't the case, since Joran didn't point it out.

Joran appears to lack the capacity to make sound judgments, and his morality clearly is impaired where money is involved. There are far too many young people now who share these unfortunate traits. If I were to mimic Kelly, and play armchair analyst, I'd say that Joran has some mild form of autism, which is reflected in the impassive look he often projects and the apparent lack of empathy he shows towards others. Of course, I could easily be wrong- this is just a guess to explain his habitual lying and failure to understand the seriousness of a situation.

I won't be on the forum again until tomorrow, but I thank those of you who are at least according my outlandish notions some respect.

As RR0004 so eloquently put it, if you cannot post it, don't bother alluding to it.
We are a forum open to different points of view but as Columbo has mentioned we don;t allow derogatory remarks about victims and in this case I mean Beth.So,it is time to leave Beth out of the mix and let's all get back to Stephany Ramirez Flores.

if you have information regarding this case that you would like to link for discussion that is fine. Your opinions are welcome as long as you can support them.

 

[Roze]

I don't have a book about the Holloway case to sell- at least yet. I only brought it up because I thought it would be of interest to those posting on a message board about the case. Obviously, the murder in Peru negatively impacted the potential for the book to ever be published, and if it is, much more will need to be researched and written.

I have used the poster name "unreals" for years on various forums. Yes, I thought it was a clever way to get the title of my novel out there, and perhaps people might stumble upon it and be interested. I usually didn't indicate that it was a title, however, unless the forum allowed you to leave a link (and only a few do that).

I actually posted a handful of times here on the Jon Benet Ramsey forum, some months ago. FYI, in that case I postulate no conspiracy, except one to shield a wealthy family from being investigated properly.

The references I made to the immigration document and the testimony of the students were only in response to requests that I stop being so vague about what was in the book. I never intended to do that, preferring simply to analyze the evidence in the Peru case on this thread. I think there is a lot of room for doubt there, without even mentioning the Holloway case.

It won't require that much research -- that's the beauty of fiction.

 

[georger]

http://www.rr.com/news/topic/article...ells_All/full/


A Van der Sloot conviction may seem like a slam-dunk, but there are still potential caveats. The Dutch consulate in Lima says Van der Sloot's confession was coerced, and his mother Anita, who spoke with him briefly by telephone, told a Dutch radio station that his interrogation has been "barbaric." In 2009, Peru was singled out by the Bureau of Democracy, Human Rights and Labor for human rights abuses involving "abuse of detainees and inmates by police and prison security forces" and "harsh prison conditions."

Why pick Peru to committ murder?

proving his confession was coerced, before Peruvian Judges no less,
is a very steep climb! Keep in mind 99% of the world is behind the
Peruvians and the Holloways ... in everything. Joran is history.

 

[georger]

Skipping a lot of posts I haven't read to voice my aggravation with all the misinformation we get. I was so happy to have my curiosity satisfied by a caller to Nancy Grace a couple of evenings ago .. She asked what Joran was wearing when he left the hotel room to get the coffee. The correspondent's reply was "The white shirt." Wasn't that Jean C who responded?

Anyway, now that we have seen the video of him leaving for coffee, he is wearing the striped shirt. I mean "a" striped shirt. Is it the same striped shirt he was wearing when he finally departed the hotel?

The time that he "left" and was playing knock-knock with the door, did he leave then to go for coffee? He really did go to a store and get two cups of coffee at 8 a.m., didn't he? Why do I get so confused?

If Joran worked as hard at a real job as he has at lying, he wouldn't be where he is today.

BTW, is he still eating the same meals as the guards, or has he hit the real menu for prison life in Peru yet? Will LE wait until he is sentenced before feeding him slop?

Much of what passes on Grace's program is assumption and speculation,
and prejudice. (No wonder her ratings are rock bottom)

 

[FLNY]

Here we go again....this article states that the cab drivers received $1,500 for taking VDS to Chile. Yesterday, an amount of $600 was stated. But, I believe 1,500 sole equals 600 US, so that is probably the cause, once again, of the mis-statement. IMO

The report also denies that Joran's mother is coming to Peru.

http://elcomercio.pe/noticia/493874...van-der-sloot-no-tienen-como-pagar-su-defensa

 

[Patty G]

:wave:

Any hints on where I can find a link to the other men being charged along with Joran. I recorded Jean's segment regarding the others, but I would like to read more details. Thanks.

 

[WmHersey]

To those of you who have responded respectfully to my admittedly unpopular theorizing, I express my appreciation. To those who think my thoughts are unworthy of discussion, no one is forcing you to discuss them.

In Peru, nothing has been "made public." All the "evidence" against Joran, outside of the video snippets, which prove nothing other than that he entered the room with a girl who is purportedly the one who was later found dead in the same room, did the strange thing with the coffee and the hotel employee, and then later left the hotel, have consisted of ever changing leaks and pronouncements from Peruvian authorities. In my view, the authorities in Peru have little more credibility than Joran does.

We have heard nothing from Joran, and only sporadic comments from a few attorneys- I'm not even sure who his lawyer is at this point. Certainly any good defense attorney would have been questioning the wildly varying accounts of the crime scene, and be confident of raising reasonable doubt in the minds of the jury, on that basis alone. Of course, that would happen under our system, but I'm not certain what role a defense attorney plays in the Peruvian courts; Joran's fate will be decided by three hooded judges.

I'd just like to gently suggest that we all keep an open mind about this until the real facts stop changing. All any of us should be interested in is truth and justice.

For some of us two and two equals four is very simple. In this case there is much much more that makes us believe he is quilty. Circumstance upon circumstance not the least of which his dash for the border. Joran has proved himself less than credible on more than one occasion. I have no reason to doubt the Peruian authorities and I have plenty to doubt Joran.

You seem to enjoy the attention from making what you admit are outlandish statements. Please don't be offended that I have put you on ignore. I do hope others will follow my lead.

 

[georger]

I knew sooner or later the "human rights" issue would pop up.

Are you saying Amnesty International is going to come to Joran's defense!?

I think not. The al Quaida may!

 

[Woe.be.gone]

Do we have anyone here that is familiar with the written Thai language? I hope so because I looked for the Thai word for "no worries" and couldn't find one quickly but found that the word is closely related to another word used that differs in nuance from the word meaning now worries.

I hope someone here can have a look and make sure that tattoo has been properly interpreted. Not meaning that the writer of the article is incorrect, it's probably correct but given the first two words of that phrase is closely related to another and the subtle nuances in the difference in language, I'm just curious. JMHO.

Mai Pen Rai Means Never Mind is a book written by Carol Hollinger in 1965. She was an American housewife who wrote about her love affair with "the irrepressible people of Thailand".

Never mind and no worries mean the same thing in Thai. It also is used to acknowledge an "excuse me" type situation.

Let's pretend the air conditioning man has come to fix your air conditioner for you. He doesn't have the right parts and you are sort of put out - he might say "mai pen rai, I'll be back tomorrow." No worries. You would be thinking, easy for you to say! It is sort of a don't sweat it type of mentality - life will take care of itself.