Peru - Stephany Flores, 21, murdered in Lima hotel room, 30 May 2010 #14

[FLNY]

FLNY ~ Thanks for info. And I really like your quote by Elvis...so true!


I'd be too scared to go if I were his Mom.

Thanks, Danie!

Yesterday I posted another article which stated that his mother wasn't going to Peru. Guess we'll just have to wait and see what happens. Just like everything else about this case!!!

 

[nums24]

Is Joran van der Sloot a Serial Killer? Ex-FBI Profiler Paul Lindsay Responds

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-20007748-504083.html

snipped:

Lindsay believes that if reports of van der Sloot's confession are accurate, van der Sloot created the story of the e-mail and the confrontation to justify his actions. Many sociopaths get their social cues by watching television and mimicking what they see others do.

According to Lindsay, van der Sloot might not need a reason to kill, but may recognize that others need to believe there was a reason.

 

[FLNY]

Here is a link to the alleged new attorney's website:

http://www.cesarnakazaki.com/

Sounds like a good guy....but he's got to be nuts!! IMO

 

[Adalena935]

BBM - When did he confess? I clicked on the link and could not get the article to load.

thanks
lovelabs

I was tempted to ask which murder and which confession.

News has said he confessed several times (Natalee Holloway case), but most recently since Peruvian authorities have him imprisoned on Stephany Flores Ramirez murder. The link loads for me and I'm sorry you can't access it. You could use the header I posted and google it. Or use something like Dave Holloway Aruba as key words. I don't know what to do for you since you can't access the link I posted. Sorry I can't help more

He said he'd show them where Natalee's body is, IF they take him back to Aruba instead of leaving him in the Peruvian prison. To me that's a confession; same thing.

 

[nums24]

I thought he was eating what the guards are eating instead of what prisoners are...maybe it has changed?
I am hoping they will tell him, "ok you tell where NH is, let us physically get her, if she is not in sea. And then we will take you to Aruba"...But NOT really take him.

IIRC he was eating the same foods as the guards in Lima, before the transfer to Castro Castro.

 

[Adalena935]

Yep nums, no reason to believe JVS if he tells us there's sand at the beach. He's an empty shell just mimicks others and does what he percieves society expects; the better to murder young women in secret with the false facade he presents.

Who Joran really is, is who he is in the dark when nobody's watching. All the rest of the time he's acting.

 

[abbra]

I'm not to sure Tacopina can take Jorans case because the Justice System is totally different that the Justice System here in the U.S. My husband who works for the Supreme Court and I were chatting about this last evening and I asked him about a U.S. Attorney being assigned to the case. I am waiting for him to call on his lunch hour so I can ask him....ok here is the scoop~!
Tocopina may be able to practice International Law if he has a license to practice this, which would give him the right to take Jorans Case to defend him.
Plus Peru has its own rules and regulations that might or might not let Tocopina practice, but might let him be an advisor on the case. I guess it all depends on Peruvian Law. Tocopina would have to have knowledge of Peruvian Law, probably even to be an advisor.
I guess we will just have to see what happens or perhaps we can get one of the attorneys here to give us more information about how the laws in Peru work.
One things for certain Peru's laws are a heck of a lot different that the U.S's.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

Well, here's my guess, and that is all that it is, as to why an attorney would not want to represent Joran:
1. He lies.
2. He's already confessed to killing Stephany, who was killed in his hotel room.
3. There is, from what LE has stated, a mountain of forensic evidence pointing to his guilt, including evidence collected from his shoes and clothes.
4. He fled the scene, a demonstration of guilt.
5. He stole Stephany's car, money, etc.
6. He is wanted for extortion of the family of another victim, Natalee Holloway.
7. In the extortion case, there is FBI footage of Joran negotiating for money in exchange for telling where a missing person's body is located.
8. He has on several occasions on tape admitted to being present when Natalee died and either disposing of her body or knowing where his father disposed of it.
9. There is videotape of the entrance and exit to Joran's hotel room, which (we are led to believe) shows no one else going in or out during the time Stephany was missing.
10. He has given contradictory accounts to the officials in Chile and Peru about Stephany's murder.
11. With his father dead, the family may not have sufficient assets to mount legal defenses in one country, let alone three, assuming Aruba ever indicts him in Natalee's case.
12. He is a foreigner charged with murdering a Peruvian national, and one from a prominent family. This will not be the kind of "defense" that got Joran off the hook in Aruba. The prosecution will go after him with everything they have--which is apparently a lot.
13. The client is spoiled, immature and narcissistic and quite possibly has killed two young women by age 22. Even to most defense attorneys it would be evident that Joran probably belongs in jail as a matter of public safety.

I hope Joran gets a very good attorney, who knows the law and works very hard to demonstrate that he is innocent and/or that the evidence isn't sufficient to prove guilt--because then, once he is convicted, there will be no grounds for appeal. As an American, I believe everyone deserves a fair trial with quality representation. But I also hope that the guilty, especially vicious predators, are convicted, sent to prison, and stay there until they are too old to re-offend. Based on what I know about the Holloway case, I believe Joran murdered Natalee. Based on what I know about Stephany's case, I believe Joran murdered her. If the evidence shows that Joran killed Stephany, he needs to be taken off the street to he can't kill again. The best route to that is a fair trial.

 

[WmHersey]

The judge will have to make a series of measures, including reconstruction of the crime and the confrontation of the Dutchman with the taxi drivers that led him to Tacna, where he fled to Chile. It transpired that Van der Sloot said that they knew that he fled because he has committed a crime, but these have denied it.

I am assuming from this that JVDS threw the cab drivers under the bus.

http://translate.google.com/transla...obrino-toledo-violacion&sourceid=ie8-activity

Of course he did. Revenge for them telling the media where he crossed the border. Anyone in the path of a sociopath is harmed in some way. They throw everyone under the bus just for the joy of having the control to do it.

 

[CathyinTexas]

Just curious as to how a deck of cards would just be hanging around in the TV room/lounge. Not sure I'm believing some of this unless these two are hanging around the guard's lounge area. From everything that's been said and written about these prisons, I just can't imagine these two sitting around joking, playing cards and watching television in some special section with a lounge and excercise room. :waitasec:

unless the guards received mula for the "amenities"

 

[pittsburghgirl]

Here's a passage from and a link to an interesting article about whether Joran is a serial killer. The person being interview is Paul Lindsay, "an ex-FBI homicide" agent who worked on several serial killer investigations. Lindsay thinks we would know if there were other victims linked to JVDS, but sees "evidence of sociopathy";

Van der Sloot's reported confession to the murder of Stephany Flores, or at least the part where he tried to explain his actions, also provides evidence of sociopathy, according to Lindsay. Van der Sloot reportedly told police he lashed out at Stephany after she used his laptop to find out information about him, and learned of his connection to the Natalee Holloway disappearance.

"Why would he care if she knew about his connection to the [Holloway] case?" Lindsay asks, pointing out that it would be very hard to find someone who didn't know the connection.

Lindsay believes that if reports of van der Sloot's confession are accurate, van der Sloot created the story of the e-mail and the confrontation to justify his actions. Many sociopaths get their social cues by watching television and mimicking what they see others do.

According to Lindsay, van der Sloot might not need a reason to kill, but may recognize that others need to believe there was a reason.

One reason that Joran's actions and explanations seem so random and inexplicable is that "he might not need a reason to kill," which pretty much makes him unlike most of us. However, he recognizes that "others need to believe there was a reason" for killing and so he constructs these motives that seem "off" or that don't make sense. His stories don't make sense because 1) they didn't happen; and 2) he's a sociopath who can kill for no reason; and 3) when he sees the need to give a reason or motive, it will only be an approximation of what a normal person would see as a motive.
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-20007748-504083.html

 

[CathyinTexas]

It appears that the lawyer for JVDS might be Cesar Nakazaki and that the first court appearance for JVDS would be this Friday:

http://translate.google.com/transla...loot-declararia-viernes&sourceid=ie8-activity

http://www.microsofttranslator.com/...495292/joran-van-der-sloot-declararia-viernes

snipped:

Carlos Morales Córdova, ex-judge anticorruption, is the holder entrusted to realize the investigations and to solve the guilt of the foreigner and of possible third in the murder of the young woman, happened the dawn of May 30. “At the latest, on Friday there will be realized the first diligence of the judge, who will be the capture of instructive declaration to Joran”, expressed a related source of the Judicial Power.Carlos Morales Córdova, ex juez anticorrupción, es el titular encargado de realizar las investigaciones y de resolver la culpabilidad del extranjero y de posibles terceros en el asesinato de la joven, ocurrido la madrugada del 30 de mayo. “A más tardar, el viernes se realizará la primera diligencia del juez, que será la toma de declaración instructiva a Joran”, expresó una fuente allegada del Poder Judicial.

Is still not known who the new lawyer of the Dutch is, nevertheless, it came out that he would be César Nakazaki. “I can neither confirm nor deny if this request was done to me”, answered the attorney to Perú.21. It is presumed that Joseph Tacopina, who advised Joran for the accusation of having killed Natalee Holloway, will come to Peru to defend the European again.

Does anyone know if Joe Tacopino is fluent in Spanish, and if he is even licensed or allowed to try cases in Peru?

 

[nums24]

Well, here's my guess, and that is all that it is, as to why an attorney would not want to represent Joran:
1. He lies.
2. He's already confessed to killing Stephany, who was killed in his hotel room.
3. There is, from what LE has stated, a mountain of forensic evidence pointing to his guilt, including evidence collected from his shoes and clothes.
4. He fled the scene, a demonstration of guilt.
5. He stole Stephany's car, money, etc.
6. He is wanted for extortion of the family of another victim, Natalee Holloway.
7. In the extortion case, there is FBI footage of Joran negotiating for money in exchange for telling where a missing person's body is located.
8. He has on several occasions on tape admitted to being present when Natalee died and either disposing of her body or knowing where his father disposed of it.
9. There is videotape of the entrance and exit to Joran's hotel room, which (we are led to believe) shows no one else going in or out during the time Stephany was missing.
10. He has given contradictory accounts to the officials in Chile and Peru about Stephany's murder.
11. With his father dead, the family may not have sufficient assets to mount legal defenses in one country, let alone three, assuming Aruba ever indicts him in Natalee's case.
12. He is a foreigner charged with murdering a Peruvian national, and one from a prominent family. This will not be the kind of "defense" that got Joran off the hook in Aruba. The prosecution will go after him with everything they have--which is apparently a lot.
13. The client is spoiled, immature and narcissistic and quite possibly has killed two young women by age 22. Even to most defense attorneys it would be evident that Joran probably belongs in jail as a matter of public safety.

I hope Joran gets a very good attorney, who knows the law and works very hard to demonstrate that he is innocent and/or that the evidence isn't sufficient to prove guilt--because then, once he is convicted, there will be no grounds for appeal. As an American, I believe everyone deserves a fair trial with quality representation. But I also hope that the guilty, especially vicious predators, are convicted, sent to prison, and stay there until they are too old to re-offend. Based on what I know about the Holloway case, I believe Joran murdered Natalee. Based on what I know about Stephany's case, I believe Joran murdered her. If the evidence shows that Joran killed Stephany, he needs to be taken off the street to he can't kill again. The best route to that is a fair trial.

Thank you for this excellent post! I do hope that Nakazaki is his new attorney.

 

[Kamille]

Van der Sloot's reported confession to the murder of Stephany Flores, or at least the part where he tried to explain his actions, also provides evidence of sociopathy, according to Lindsay. Van der Sloot reportedly told police he lashed out at Stephany after she used his laptop to find out information about him, and learned of his connection to the Natalee Holloway disappearance.

"Why would he care if she knew about his connection to the [Holloway] case?" Lindsay asks, pointing out that it would be very hard to find someone who didn't know the connection.

BBM- He might care that she knew or found out about his connection to NH if she used the information to back out of a decision to help him out financially.

All of his statements regarding the computer can be corroborated or disregarded with a simple check of the laptop. I wonder why it's taking them so long to get a warrant to do so. :waitasec:

 

[Danie]

IIRC he was eating the same foods as the guards in Lima, before the transfer to Castro Castro.

oh i bet that is right, i didn't see toilet paper in that cell when camera showed, did you all?

 

[Adalena935]

The man who spoke with Greta last evening (I think it was an ex-lawyer) said it's not solitary, it's isolation and it's isolation in name only. There are too many prisoners v. guards, so the thugs run the prison and make their own rules. They have dif sections, but they come & go as they please. It is not like USA prisons. Hence, the other prisoner playing cards with Joran, visiting with Joran, going into Joran's area, etal. They're just in a section where non-Peruvians are. my words but that's what he told GVS last night on her show because she asked him about all of those things.

He said if he can get money he can have lots of niceties delivered from the outside such as food which is not available without money. So a deck of cards? Yes I can see them having that easily enough. I think there's abt 1500 inmates to a small number of guards. I can see where cards wouldn't be high priority. all my opinion.

 

[FLNY]

Well, here's my guess, and that is all that it is, as to why an attorney would not want to represent Joran:
1. He lies.
2. He's already confessed to killing Stephany, who was killed in his hotel room.
3. There is, from what LE has stated, a mountain of forensic evidence pointing to his guilt, including evidence collected from his shoes and clothes.
4. He fled the scene, a demonstration of guilt.
5. He stole Stephany's car, money, etc.
6. He is wanted for extortion of the family of another victim, Natalee Holloway.
7. In the extortion case, there is FBI footage of Joran negotiating for money in exchange for telling where a missing person's body is located.
8. He has on several occasions on tape admitted to being present when Natalee died and either disposing of her body or knowing where his father disposed of it.
9. There is videotape of the entrance and exit to Joran's hotel room, which (we are led to believe) shows no one else going in or out during the time Stephany was missing.
10. He has given contradictory accounts to the officials in Chile and Peru about Stephany's murder.
11. With his father dead, the family may not have sufficient assets to mount legal defenses in one country, let alone three, assuming Aruba ever indicts him in Natalee's case.
12. He is a foreigner charged with murdering a Peruvian national, and one from a prominent family. This will not be the kind of "defense" that got Joran off the hook in Aruba. The prosecution will go after him with everything they have--which is apparently a lot.
13. The client is spoiled, immature and narcissistic and quite possibly has killed two young women by age 22. Even to most defense attorneys it would be evident that Joran probably belongs in jail as a matter of public safety.

I hope Joran gets a very good attorney, who knows the law and works very hard to demonstrate that he is innocent and/or that the evidence isn't sufficient to prove guilt--because then, once he is convicted, there will be no grounds for appeal. As an American, I believe everyone deserves a fair trial with quality representation. But I also hope that the guilty, especially vicious predators, are convicted, sent to prison, and stay there until they are too old to re-offend. Based on what I know about the Holloway case, I believe Joran murdered Natalee. Based on what I know about Stephany's case, I believe Joran murdered her. If the evidence shows that Joran killed Stephany, he needs to be taken off the street to he can't kill again. The best route to that is a fair trial.

There is also a personal reason:
14. Threats to himself and his family, as experienced by the previous lawyer.


MOO

 

[Adalena935]

BBM- He might care that she knew or found out about his connection to NH if she used the information to back out of a decision to help him out financially.

All of his statements regarding the computer can be corroborated or disregarded with a simple check of the laptop. I wonder why it's taking them so long to get a warrant to do so. :waitasec:

Do they bother with warrants?

 

[Woe.be.gone]

For a guy who says he doesnt know why it happened and doesnt know
some things that happened, he sure talks a lot and has a lot of "useless"
details ... the Peruvians LE (as well as all LE people) deal with this kind of thing all the time and know he's lying all the way ....

Joran says what triggered it all was an email "Im going to kill you you
Mongoloid". Mongoloid? Why that word? Does the word Mongoloid relate
to something specific in the Holloway case if this email was about the
Holloway case? Why would someone call Joran a Mongoloid? Or is
Mongoloid Joran's word he chose, planting the idea for the Peruvians
he has some mental deficiency (is therefore not repsonsible)?

Why would the word Mongoloid set Joran off - or why would he chose
the word if the word is his choice?

Someone should check his chromosomes.

 

[nums24]

It looks like the same attorney Mr. Altez will stay on:

http://translate.google.com/transla.../altez-tetap-bela-joran&sourceid=ie8-activity