Peru - Stephany Flores, 21, murdered in Lima hotel room, 30 May 2010 #19

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I can only imagine now exactly what Beth & Dave Holloway have went thru for the past 5 years with this , When big things have happened in the NH case we all hear about those, but can you only imagine all the other things they have went thru that never made it to press....I bet they are literally sick with all the developments going on in Peru this week, The one bright spot is I don't think with SF Father being as high profile a person as he is in his own home country that JVS will be able to get away with a bunch of crap there....I say ship him to Louigancho NOW.....Then we will really hear him complain about barbaric conditions and his civil rights...
 
Any room here for the Victim Stephany Flores' rights which have been repeatedly been violated by this murdering ? :furious::furious:

Maximo Altez Navarro.......is full of doggie doo doo, horse manure and even the rat doo doo from JVDS's pet.


AIMO

:nono: El Rato is not JVDS's pet, he just stopped by b/c he needed to go potty... please see video evidence below. :innocent:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ieAmdixoJ4w"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ieAmdixoJ4w[/ame]
 
This may also answer the question if Mr. Garcia was the one calling Joran on the day the receptionist transferred the call to his room and ultimately ended up discovering the body of Stephany upon entering.
http://www.radaronline.com/exclusiv...murdered-woman-joran-van-der-sloots-room-read

I transferred the call to this room," Adeli recounted to police investigators in her native Spanish.

"Since nobody answered, I told the woman he must be resting because his key was not at the front desk -- and I hang off the phone."

Perhaps it was AVDS calling Joran?
 
http://www.rnw.nl/english/article/joran’s-rights-“repeatedly-violated”

snipped:

The Peruvian lawyer representing Joran van der Sloot says his client’s rights have repeatedly been violated and may take the case to the Inter-American Court of Human Rights. The lawyer, Máximo Altez Navarro, made the allegations in an exclusive interview with Radio Netherlands Worldwide.

Just as I predicted...he's going to try to make this an international human rights issue. Interesting that his lawyer is now using the media in the Netherlands to get the message out. Are they expecting the Netherlands to intervene on behalf of Joran and put some pressure on Peru? :banghead:
 
I believe Joran's confession was on the 6th right? Does anyone know what day he was back in Lima and being held at the jail there?

Sounds to me like these two different lawyers may have been with him on two different days. And considering that someone gave him good advice about confessing to minimize his sentence, and to make it appear as though it was an "impulse" reaction, then perhaps they thought they were doing him a favor bringing in a private attorney to explain the law to him rather than an overworked public defender who left because he didn't want to talk.

And of course if that is the case, Joran will use their generosity against them.

MOO

He returned to Lima on Saturday, June 5, after a 17 hour drive from the Chilean border. I think the first lawyer was present during his interrogation on June 5...but he said he was too tired and didn't want to talk.

Then I think the second lawyer was present when his interrogation resumed on Sun., June 6, which is when he gave his confession......thus the confusion re: two lawyers!

MOO as I understand it.
 
I don't see this looking very well for Joran either way... His life is in danger in there, and I think it would be in worse danger on the streets... He can't even be transported without being mobbed and tomatoes thrown at him...I can't imagine WHY he would want out..... Surely Peru will not grant him freedom before his trial...He has already proven that he is a flight risk..!!!
 
My son had his own place when he was 19 and I could not set rules and boundaries for him even if I helped him should he be short of cash. Rules were, you borrow from me, you pay me back.

My son also rebelled (age 17 & 18) and left and came back and had to follow the rules. Either do as I say, or don't let the door hit you in the "buns" on the way out.

I would hope that every parent teaches their children rules and responsibility, however, even though I was taught the basic rules of life, I did what I wanted when I turned 18 and was on my own. At some point, when I realized what I was doing wasn't working, I did better.

ETA: For me personally, I don't care if Joran gambled with his father, or was given money, etc. If Joran was of legal age to do so, then so be it! Of course, this is not something I would like to see for my son, as gambling can be addictive and this would be a great concern of mine. I wouldn't want my son to drink every night as a young adult, but he did and how could I stop him?


Joran was 17 when Natalee disappeared. He was sneaking out, gambling, and drinking then. Apparently, that is legal in Aruba but I don't consider 17 an adult. I too, have had trouble with my teenage son, but I would not have ever given him an apartment of his own. I watched mine like a hawk. He still got in trouble but he paid the consequesnces. If he worked and supported himself, then what he did would be his business. It really doesn't bother me that Anita takes up for her son. I expect her too. I believe that Paulus and Joran kept her in the dark and only told her things that they wanted her to know. I believe that is why she accepted their story about Natalee. If she looks really hard she will discover some truths that I am sure she isn't ready to deal with. She has enough on her plate right now. I believe that parents can do everything right and have a child turn out bad. I believe that parents can do it all wrong and still have a kid turn out right. As parents we do the best we can do. So I don't blame Anita for the way Joran turned out (I believe she could have done some things differently but who couldn't). I do blame her for the way she treated the Holloways/Twitty's. She showed absolutley no compassion. It was all about the Van der sloot's. I believe she may have passed that attitude to Joran.
 
This may also answer the question if Mr. Garcia was the one calling Joran on the day the receptionist transferred the call to his room and ultimately ended up discovering the body of Stephany upon entering.
http://www.radaronline.com/exclusiv...murdered-woman-joran-van-der-sloots-room-read

I transferred the call to this room," Adeli recounted to police investigators in her native Spanish.

"Since nobody answered, I told the woman he must be resting because his key was not at the front desk -- and I hang off the phone."

Perhaps it was AVDS calling Joran?

I believe Elton Garcia asked someone at the casino (IIRC, it was a woman: the owner or manager of the poker room) to call the hotel looking for Joran.
 
I was actually understanding where AVS was coming from until her comments about how she wanted to hold Natalee's parents 5 years ago, when she got the news....I knew that was a lie just from watching her on TV 5 years ago... She may feel that way now.. But, she didn't then...
Then came the comment about how he could have been an actor...That did it for me...!!!

I sure hope she does alot better job with the other children she has...


I remember feeling compassion for her 5 years ago until I watched her give an interview. I believe it was after his release. I can't remember what she said but I remember telling my husband that Dave ought to take Joran somewhere and keep him for a few months with no word to the family and I bet she would be singing a different tune.
 
I have no problem with AVDS letting her adult child live in a house on the property or in an apartment away from the property. I am 100% for it!

Patty, if I misunderstood your point or confused your post with somebody else's (wouldn't be the first time), I sincerely apologize.

In any event, mine was no great bone of contention. I just know a lot of families where high-school-age teens are allowed to live in guest houses. (Wouldn't have happened in my family. I didn't have my own room, nor was I ever allowed to stay home alone over night until I was in college.)
 
BBM: Common here as well. Very. Also, not uncommon here for parents' setting up/paying expenses, etc for separate apartment for their under 21 year old. Also, during summer months when one would expect student to return home after the college/university year has ended>instead, separate apartment is not uncommon (with most of the bill footed by parents).


I must be from the poor section of the Country because I don't know anyone that pays for their child to live in an apartment. I don't know but one person that has a guest house. But I do know some underage drinkers.
 
I have a question: Does anyone know anything about Joran's two siblings? Val & Sebastian?
 
Just as I predicted...he's going to try to make this an international human rights issue. Interesting that his lawyer is now using the media in the Netherlands to get the message out. Are they expecting the Netherlands to intervene on behalf of Joran and put some pressure on Peru? :banghead:

My question - who's paying Mr Navarro?
 
I have a question: Does anyone know anything about Joran's two siblings? Val & Sebastian?

I do understand they are doing well and are 'good' goal oriented young fellows, unlike their older brother. Other than that, I think pinpointing where they are could be dangerous for them since Joran has garnered alot of hate. IMHO they have no place in discussions. (Not being snotty or anything; just, they don't deserve to be dragged through the mud)
 
He returned to Lima on Saturday, June 5, after a 17 hour drive from the Chilean border. I think the first lawyer was present during his interrogation on June 5...but he said he was too tired and didn't want to talk.

Then I think the second lawyer was present when his interrogation resumed on Sun., June 6, which is when he gave his confession......thus the confusion re: two lawyers!

MOO as I understand it.
I don't think his confession came until Wednesday evening, June 9.

The next morning he was transferred from the police crime investigator headquarters (DININCRI) to the public prosecuter's headquarters. "Sheathed in a bulletproof vest, the young Dutchman was driven less than a mile across central Lima during rush hour in a police caravan escorted by motorcycle officers."
 
From the money Anita made on her interview. (100,000). It's wrong to pay for a news item, but she probably held out for pay.

bbm

Interesting. How do you know that?
 
Epafras and Joran



http://www.rnw.nl/english/article/dutch-media-attacks-peru-could-harm-prisoners

Dutch criticism of Peru’s treatment of Joran van der Sloot, the suspect in the Lima hotel murder case, could impact on other Dutch prisoners in the country. The warning comes from Epafras, an organisation that provides support for Dutch prisoners abroad.

The Peruvian authorities’ treatment of Dutch murder suspect Joran van der Sloot has come in for much criticism in the Netherlands. Every detail of the case has been widely reported, and Van der Sloot’s statements published in the press, with little respect for his right to privacy. The parading of suspects in front of TV cameras is anathema to the Netherlands, where suspects’ privacy is strictly maintained. Their full names and photos are always withheld in the media unless (like Joran van der Sloot, in fact) their identity is already widely known to the public.

But Epafras is warning that the Dutch should be cautious about publicly criticising the Peruvian justice system. Spokesman and pastor Martien Agterberg says it could have negative consequences for other Dutch prisoners in the region. He says he knows of situations in which prisoners have had their entitlement to visits and other rights curtailed as a result of Dutch criticism.

“I think the Netherlands would be wise not to seek too much publicity. As far as I know, that’s what’s happening too. You should certainly respond to a number of matters, but through quiet diplomacy not through the media. I’ve seen it myself in Ecuador, where Dutch prisoners were being tortured in jail. The Dutch embassy, which had picked up signals about it, managed to arrange internally for a number of Dutch people to be transferred to somewhat safer prisons.”

Fair trial
Another organisation that represents the interests of Dutch prisoners abroad has also voiced concern. PrisonLaw is a Dutch foundation that provides legal information to Dutch prisoners overseas and campaigns against human rights abuses. Spokeswoman and lawyer Rachel Imamkhan has little faith in the independence of the Peruvian justice system.

“If I look at Dutch prisoners in Peru, my experience is that a fair trial is hard to come by in the country. Peru is a signatory to all sorts of international treaties and also has its obligations, but little comes of it in practice. Peru is now in the international spotlight, so they’ll do everything they can to give him a fair trial."

Ms Imamkhan says she has confidence in Joran van der Sloot’s Peruvian lawyer, Máximo Altez. Mr Altez has denied reports that he had pulled out of the case in response to threats against his family.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I wonder if Joran's complaining could have the same effect. There are many Dutch prisoners in the Peru system but mainly for drug trafficking. One of those is a young lady named Wendy who, when she was pregnant and out of a job, did some drug smuggling to save money for her and her baby. She's in Peru prison for 15 years. Her mother is raising her baby. It's a sad situation when she's got 15 years, and lawyers talk that Joran could get 3 to 5 years only for murder. He has also had a 5 year history of very adverse behaviour which started months before Natalee arrived on the Island. They still want to lay the blame on others with their interviews.
 
From the money Anita made on her interview. (100,000). It's wrong to pay for a news item, but she probably held out for pay.

john van den Heuvel, who interviewed both Anita and Joran, told Jean C. on last night's NG show that he didn't pay for either interview.
 
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