Peru - Stephany Flores, 21, murdered in Lima hotel room, 30 May 2010 #19

[Kamille]

Witness statement from hotel worker that found Stephany's body:

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusiv...murdered-woman-joran-van-der-sloots-room-read

Thanks suzihawk!! Well that answers a couple of questions. He did check in on May 14th which means the stories of him returned to the desk and paying for a couple more days to get himself caught up may be true. And he likely paid another receptionist because this one had left by then. We'll have to wait for her testimony I guess. I wonder if there's tape of that too that hasn't been released. Or was he doing it when he went back to the desk to ask someone to let him in the room? We haven't seen tape of that, only a still shot.

And unless this receptionist also works for the FBI, she assigned him a random room when he showed up on the 14th. The room wasn't set up for him, with special camera, prior to his arrival.

MOO

 

[Kamille]

To add to the camera muddle, iirc, a couple of days ago it was part of the FBI setting Joran up story. The story was that the hotel did not have cameras before Joran went to Peru, the cameras were put in just for Joran's FBI sting. The cameras were then removed AFTER Joran left the hotel. There was some discussion, can't remember which thread. I do remember that it was stated (don't know if speculation or news article) that IF the cameras were removed, it was by the crime scene forensic people, so that they could gather all info. Just have to go back a thread or two and scroll through, it was lengthy conversation.

Well considering what JC said last night on NG that there are video surveillance cameras everywhere in Peru, including the beauty shops, and that the hotel's website advertised 24 hr video security, I'd say the cameras have always been there.

MOO

 

[21merc7]

Well considering what JC said last night on NG that there are video surveillance cameras everywhere in Peru, including the beauty shops, and that the hotel's website advertised 24 hr video security, I'd say the cameras have always been there.

MOO

I know, couldn't agree more. Must be nice for Joran being paranoid and all important. (He really needs some meds for that.)

 

[doobiedoo52]

Thanks suzihawk!! Well that answers a couple of questions. He did check in on May 14th which means the stories of him returned to the desk and paying for a couple more days to get himself caught up may be true. And he likely paid another receptionist because this one had left by then. We'll have to wait for her testimony I guess. I wonder if there's tape of that too that hasn't been released. Or was he doing it when he went back to the desk to ask someone to let him in the room? We haven't seen tape of that, only a still shot.

And unless this receptionist also works for the FBI, she assigned him a random room when he showed up on the 14th. The room wasn't set up for him, with special camera, prior to his arrival.
MOO

Not to mention that obviously Mr Garcia did not have it all arranged and paid for either.

 

[Patty G]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xPYCD9oZTeM[/ame]

 

[Linda7NJ]

<<<<<<snipped for purpose>>>>>>>>>>

VAN DEN HEUVEL: Well, I (INAUDIBLE) contact with Anita Van Der Sloot a few days or a week ago, and I asked her if she wanted to go and to -- I ask her if she want to give an interview. And I told her maybe it`s OK to give one big interview to a newspaper and for television. So she did for a few reasons. She wants to tell her side of the story and she wants to explain why she thinks Joran is completely sick in his head.

But I was there on Tuesday on Aruba for the interview. And then I asked her, Is it possible to have contact with Joran? And she had Joran several times on the phone. So I ask her, Is it a possibility that I can visit him in Peru? And she said, I cannot guarantee you that, but I can put your name on the visitors list of the Castro Castro prison, so you can try it. So she did. And I flew -- on Saturday, I flew to Peru, and on Sunday I went to the prison. And I went in and my name was on the list.

CASAREZ: So where did you talk to him? Did you get to go into the cell and talk to him or did they take you to another area?

VAN DEN HEUVEL: Yes, it was in his cell. It was also the first time I met him, of course. Of course, I saw him on television directly after the arrest, and at that time he looked very confused, which is not strange, of course. But when I met him, he was amazingly relaxed and it seemed that he accepted the whole situation. He looked relaxed. He laughed sometimes and he was detached. And I spoke 20 minutes with him, and he told me something about the prison -- about the situation in the prison.

CASAREZ: Did he tell you that he killed Stephany Flores?

VAN DEN HEUVEL: No, he didn`t tell that. He didn`t deny it, but he said, I don`t want to say anything about that case. I talked to my lawyer, and he advised me to say -- to say nothing about the case. So he told me something about the situation in prison, but he didn`t want to talk about the case.

Of course, I asked him, Did you murder Stephany Flores? He said, I cannot say anything about it, that that`s the advice of my lawyer.

CASAREZ: Did he talk about that he was tricked, that he -- that they forced him to talk when he didn`t want to?

VAN DEN HEUVEL: Yes. He -- - that`s what he said. He said that the police in Chile and Peru put mental pressure on him to sign the reports. And he said they put a bucket full of water near him and they threatened him to put his head under the water if he didn`t want to declare.

CASAREZ: Say that again? What did he say?

VAN DEN HEUVEL: He said there was a bucket full of water near his -- near him and he said that they threatened him that they`d put his head under water if he didn`t want to declare anything.

JOHN VAN DEN HEUVEL, REPORTER, DE TELEGRAAF, EXCLUSIVE JAILHOUSE INTERVIEW WITH JORAN VAN DER SLOOT (via phone): No, he didn`t say anything about the case as already told. He said, I don`t say anything about it because that`s the case with my lawyer.

The only thing I think what he wants is to be convicted not for murder but for manslaughter. And I talked also to the lawyer for Joran. And he explained murder in Peru can give you 35 years behind prison. And manslaughter maybe only nine years.

Everything Joran says and wants to do is to be convicted for manslaughter.

CASAREZ: So did it sound like to you that he`d been studying the penal code here in Peru? The looking at the laws?

VAN DEN HEUVEL: Yes. I -- believe that. He -- he looks -- he looked very relaxed and calm, and I think he was upset in the first days after the arrest, but now he -- that`s amazing if you know -- this guy`s young, he`s only 22 years old. He had a crazy life the last five years.

I think when you`re in his position you`d be there in that hell -- you had to -- the thought that you maybe have to be there 35 years or more, I think everybody would be in panic. But this guy is very calm and relaxed and it`s really unbelievable.



more
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1006/23/ng.01.html

Ya gotta hand it to psychopaths, they adapt REALLY well to life behind bars.

 

[3doglady]

My take on AVS statement: "Maybe he missed a chance to become an actor," his mother said.

Joran probably would have made a good actor. Actors play roles of characters, and speaks words they probably would never say as themselves in normal day life.

I don't have a problem with AVS getting an apartment for her son. It probably was less stressful for in her daily life to get him out of the house so she had peace to raise her younger children and go to work.

My son would sneak out of the house, in the middle of the night also and I had no clue.

The problem I have with AVS is she took the easy way out. Every mother has stress when dealing with a teenage child. That doesn't mean it's ok to give them their own apartment with no rules or boundaries. Having younger children is no excuse, they watch their siblings get away with everything and think they can do the same. If children aren't taught to follow the rules and take responsibility for their actions how can we expect them to grow into responsible adults? I have two sons and both rebelled at the age of 17. I told them that if they lived in my house, they followed my rules. My youngest thought he could threaten me with leaving and I would give him free rein. He left for two weeks witch was extremely difficult for me even though I knew he was staying with a friend. He came back, cried, apologized and went back to being a respectful person. Doing the right thing by your child is not always easy, but I did it because I loved him. He learned it's a hard world to be in by yourself when you are 17. How did AVS not know JVS was gambling when her husband was gambling with him and setting up a line of credit for him? How is it a teacher doesn't understand the importance of teaching children that we all have rules and are responsible for our own actions? I understand that kids sneak out and do things without parental knowledge, but the answer is not to throw up your hands and say oh well let's just give him his own place and let him do whatever he wants. JMO

 

[Nova]

Not directly, but I did see the movie missing.
I do understand your concerns but that is not applicable to this case and Missing is a Movie that talks and brings forth a part of Chile political past.
It does not apply in this case at all.
Vina Del Mar is a resort beach town that has a casino , is located about 20 minutes away from Valparaiso. Valparaiso is mayor port with ships arriving and leaving daily.
Could he had been trying to get to Valparaiso so he could leave South America by ship?

For what it's worth, I read Bobarino's original post as a simple reminder where Americans might have heard certain Chilean place names. I didn't think it was a criticism of Chilean LE, nor did it imply that JVDS would have been treated unfairly there.

I'm generalizing, of course, but I think most Americans who remember the terrible events of the early 1970s do so with a sense of shame over our own government's involvement in overthrowing the democratically elected leader of Chile. We don't assume that period is representative of Chile today.

 

[Patty G]

The problem I have with AVS is she took the easy way out. Every mother has stress when dealing with a teenage child. That doesn't mean it's ok to give them their own apartment with no rules or boundaries. Having younger children is no excuse, they watch their siblings get away with everything and think they can do the same. If children aren't taught to follow the rules and take responsibility for their actions how can we expect them to grow into responsible adults? I have two sons and both rebelled at the age of 17. I told them that if they lived in my house, they followed my rules. My youngest thought he could threaten me with leaving and I would give him free rein. He left for two weeks witch was extremely difficult for me even though I knew he was staying with a friend. He came back, cried, apologized and went back to being a respectful person. Doing the right thing by your child is not always easy, but I did it because I loved him. He learned it's a hard world to be in by yourself when you are 17. How did AVS not know JVS was gambling when her husband was gambling with him and setting up a line of credit for him? How is it a teacher doesn't understand the importance of teaching children that we all have rules and are responsible for our own actions? I understand that kids sneak out and do things without parental knowledge, but the answer is not to throw up your hands and say oh well let's just give him his own place and let him do whatever he wants. JMO

My son had his own place when he was 19 and I could not set rules and boundaries for him even if I helped him should he be short of cash. Rules were, you borrow from me, you pay me back.

My son also rebelled (age 17 & 18) and left and came back and had to follow the rules. Either do as I say, or don't let the door hit you in the "buns" on the way out.

I would hope that every parent teaches their children rules and responsibility, however, even though I was taught the basic rules of life, I did what I wanted when I turned 18 and was on my own. At some point, when I realized what I was doing wasn't working, I did better.

ETA: For me personally, I don't care if Joran gambled with his father, or was given money, etc. If Joran was of legal age to do so, then so be it! Of course, this is not something I would like to see for my son, as gambling can be addictive and this would be a great concern of mine. I wouldn't want my son to drink every night as a young adult, but he did and how could I stop him?

 

[froginTtown]

I was actually understanding where AVS was coming from until her comments about how she wanted to hold Natalee's parents 5 years ago, when she got the news....I knew that was a lie just from watching her on TV 5 years ago... She may feel that way now.. But, she didn't then...
Then came the comment about how he could have been an actor...That did it for me...!!!

I sure hope she does alot better job with the other children she has...

 

[Sanny]

To add to the camera muddle, iirc, a couple of days ago it was part of the FBI setting Joran up story. The story was that the hotel did not have cameras before Joran went to Peru, the cameras were put in just for Joran's FBI sting. The cameras were then removed AFTER Joran left the hotel. There was some discussion, can't remember which thread. I do remember that it was stated (don't know if speculation or news article) that IF the cameras were removed, it was by the crime scene forensic people, so that they could gather all info. Just have to go back a thread or two and scroll through, it was lengthy conversation.

Well if this was truly a 'sting' operation with cameras set up to catch JVDS then by golly, the FBI failed miserably.......Why didn't they set up an itty bitty camera inside Room 309?

 

[Nova]

Van Der Sloot Files Complaint Against Police

"I have been denied my right to a proper defense, by imposing an attorney that seems to be the girlfriend of a cop on duty who works in this police department," the complaint states.

"I have been imposed an unofficial translator whom has confused me, with the intention of pressuring me to incriminate myself in the homicide investigation," the complaint states.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/06/23/peru.murder.case/?hpt=T1

There's an old trial-lawyer saying that goes something like, "If the facts aren't on your side, argue the law." I think that's all that's going on here.

 

[froginTtown]

There's an old trial-lawyer saying that goes something like, "If the facts aren't on your side, argue the law." I think that's all that's going on here.

yeah, and Joran is the aggrevating factor, cuz he sure is aggrevating the crap out of me....:banghead:

 

[Nova]

My take on AVS statement: "Maybe he missed a chance to become an actor," his mother said.

Joran probably would have made a good actor. Actors play roles of characters, and speaks words they probably would never say as themselves in normal day life.

I don't have a problem with AVS getting an apartment for her son. It probably was less stressful for in her daily life to get him out of the house so she had peace to raise her younger children and go to work.

My son would sneak out of the house, in the middle of the night also and I had no clue.

(Emphasis added.) Basically OT, but as a theater person myself (albeit a writer), I have to challenge this common misconception of the the acting craft.

Good actors--like good writers or good artists of any stripe--are skilled at truth telling, not lying. True, they may do so in the superficial guise of a character, but even then, the goal is to find the truth of that character, not just spew random lies in the hopes something will stick.

JVDS tells lies to create confusion; artists create fictions that reveal greater truths about human nature. Or as Aristotle put it: "poetry" (what we would call fiction) is more important than "history" (what we would call reporting) because poetry reveals universal truth.

 

[3doglady]

My son had his own place when he was 19 and I could not set rules and boundaries for him even if I helped him should he be short of cash. Rules were, you borrow from me, you pay me back.

My son also rebelled (age 17 & 18) and left and came back and had to follow the rules. Either do as I say, or don't let the door hit you in the "buns" on the way out.

I would hope that every parent teaches their children rules and responsibility, however, even though I was taught the basic rules of life, I did what I wanted when I turned 18 and was on my own. At some point, when I realized what I was doing wasn't working, I did better.

ETA: For me personally, I don't care if Joran gambled with his father, or was given money, etc. If Joran was of legal age to do so, then so be it! Of course, this is not something I would like to see for my son, as gambling can be addictive and this would be a great concern of mine. I wouldn't want my son to drink every night as a young adult, but he did and how could I stop him?

Just wanted to say I meant no disrespect to you, Patty G. Just voicing my opinion. I'm glad things worked out for you and your son. My point about the gambling was, Joran was not of legal age. He was 17 the night Natalee went missing and Paulus was gambling with him that night. It was reported that his father gambled with him often and gave him a line of credit before Joran was of legal age.

PS: My son that was such a pain in the neck, is in law school. Go figure! lol

 

[Patty G]

Just wanted to say I meant no disrespect to you, Patty G. Just voicing my opinion. I'm glad things worked out for you and your son. My point about the gambling was, Joran was not of legal age. He was 17 the night Natalee went missing and Paulus was gambling with him that night. It was reported that his father gambled with him often and gave him a line of credit before Joran was of legal age.

PS: My son that was such a pain in the neck, is in law school. Go figure! lol

My son, now 42, turned out to be a wonderful man. He tells me "you know, you may have thought I wasn't listening to you, but I was".

 

[Kamille]

yeah, and Joran is the aggrevating factor, cuz he sure is aggrevating the crap out of me....:banghead:[/QUOT

:rolling:

 

[jtsetj]

Godspeed sweet girls.
I wouldnt be surprised if Stephany's family will do what they can to get Yoran to tell the whereabouts of Natalie's remains. They are good people and wont let their loss cloud their judgement in seeking justice.

 

[Nova]

yeah, and Joran is the aggrevating factor, cuz he sure is aggrevating the crap out of me....:banghead:

I understand. But while I don't think JVDS is a moron, I doubt he has suddenly become an expert on Peruvian law.

Despite the hysteria on Nancy Grace's show, I don't think the latest motions are anything but JVDS' lawyers doing what lawyers do. Of course, JVDS is cooperating, but what else can he do? (I know: he could man up and tell the truth, but let's don't hold our breaths.)

As for his confession, until the details are confirmed by forensic experts, I see no reason to believe a word of it. I don't think there's a chance in hell it will be thrown out, but even if it were, I wouldn't be much bothered.

 

[Nova]

My son, now 42, turned out to be a wonderful man. He tells me "you know, you may have thought I wasn't listening to you, but I was".

Patty, I take nothing away from your excellent parenting advice above.

But in fairness to AVDS, I have to say that among people I know with properties large enough to include separate guest houses, it seems pretty common to let kids in their late teens live in the out-building (or what is called a "casita" (or "little house") where I live).