Peru - Stephany Flores, 21, murdered in Lima hotel room, 30 May 2010 #9

[21merc7]

Oh, absolutely! They were great for apprehending Joran and also not letting extradition take months and months! Just expelled him from their country! Wonder if Joran has ever been kicked out of any country?

I cannot wait for the press conference this morning.

Completely agree with the thoughts on apprehension and expulsion.

News conference? When and where? Do we have any links?

TIA.

 

[LaWanda]

So I'm trying to catch up and reading and reading. I normally stay on WS at work. I know ... shame shame ... lol But I can't read the forums at night due to kids, and a new chihuahua puppy. But I have a couple of comments:

1- I love Tim Miller. He is such a country guy. Did anyone notice on JVM that the way he pronounces Joran sounds like Urine? hehe <3
2- I am also digging that everyone's "BOMBSHELLS" and "BREAKING NEWS" is old news to us. We have such a GREAT member base. I feel like you guys are part of Dionne's "Friend's Networks" cos we get the scoop reading here before the TH's!

Thanks for filling us in. I can't get to any pressers or anything from work but I'm glad that WS isn't blocked from my web nanny. I would go insane (well, more insane than I am) if I couldn't read here!!

 

[Lexington]

Completely agree with the thoughts on apprehension and expulsion.

News conference? When and where? Do we have any links?

TIA.

I heard earlier that it will take place at 10:00. They didn't say whose time that would be. I am sure InSession will show it.

 

[LilJoePinto]

Not the exact time of death, but about a 10 or 15 minute window.

He didn't leave the room wearing clothes that he killed Natalee in. Using the surveillance footage, they know it was around 30 minutes that he entered the room with his old clothes, and then left the room for good in the new, with the bags.

Forensically it can't be done. There are just far too many variables. Other factors such as surveillence video, a witness hearing her screaming or talking at a certain time, etc. all play a part in estimating time of death, but FORENSICALLY (ie, examination of the body) it can't be done.

We don't know if she was alive or dead when he went out for coffee, and it doesn't matter what he was wearing at that time. It's not likely at all that he killed her and immediately went out for coffee nor is it likely that he went out for coffee and killed her immediately after returning with it. What is most likely is he killed her at some point after they arrived in the room and when he realized what he'd done he hung out in the room with her body trying to formulate a plan to not only get out of the country but to make it appear that he wasn't even responsible for her death at all. That's exactly what his first story was... he knew her but didn't kill her. This statement by him goes to his thinking that the coffee run was intended as an alibi which means she was dead when he made that coffee run.

Buying two cups of coffee as though one is intended for her also goes to the intent to make it appear that she was killed by some unknown person while he was out getting the coffee further strengthening his alibi. Unfortunately for him he didn't consider surveillence video.

It also isn't likely that he went out for coffee and killed her immediately when he got back with it. Doesn't matter if he was wearing the same clothes as when the two of them first entered the room since the police said they found traces of blood on his clothes... traces can be so small as to require an ultraviolet light to be seen at all. And contrary to the belief that there was blood all over the room, it appears that there wasn't. There's a crime scene photo on the cover of the National Enquirer that shows the upper portion of Stephany lying face down on the floor between the bed and the wall as has been described and the mattress on the bed askew as also had been described... you can't see a speck of blood anywhere. Heartbreaking photo... I kind of wish I hadn't looked at it.

It's possible that he could have killed her at some point between arriving in the room with her and going out for coffee or at some time when he came back with the coffee and leaving the hotel for good. However, it is much more likely that he killed her closer to the time of their arrival together considering the coffee run as an alibi and his statement to police that he knew her but didn't kill her.

We just aren't going to know the estimated time of death until the ME releases the autopsy report or the police says so. There has been all manner of conflicting reports on pretty much every single aspect of this case due to the ridiculous tabloid media and the Google translations which always seem to cause more confusion and misinformation than they're worth.

 

[Solomisskitty]

I heard earlier that it will take place at 10:00. They didn't say whose time that would be. I am sure InSession will show it.

HLN just reported charges may come at 10 am eastern time. Also, his attorney wants his confession thrown out.

 

[suzihawk]

karma-girl and suzihawk,

Thanks for your comments. I didn't expect much support for my views, and understand how much against the grain they are. Btw, no, I have never posted under another name here.

I have a personal stake in this case. I've been working on a book about the Holloway case, and it has obviously been severely impacted by this unforeseen event. I will just tell you that my research has shown conclusively that Beth Twitty has told more lies than even Joran has over the years. I have also had it verified, from those in Aruba to newspaper reporters who covered the story locally, that the students were coached by Beth and her entourage, not to provide information about what happened.

So, having a strong view that Joran was not the last person with Natalee, and that Beth and her people knew that, but still persisted in trying to railroad this 17 year old kid, I naturally was incredibly suspicious from the outset about the murder in Peru. Think about it- one of the world's youngest criminal masterminds, who removed all traces of Natalee Holloway, to such an extent that not a fingernail or thread of clothing has ever been found of her, devolves into a laughable, Darwin Award-like klutz five years later. Who would leave a dead body in a hotel room registered in his hame? And, as noted previously, the coincidences of the five year anniversary, extortion plot, and Kalpoe-Dr. Phil trial are all just way too unbelievable.

I have great confidence that Joran didn't willingly confess to anything. He is a habitual liar, and appears to have almost no principles where money is involved, but I don't think he's a murderer. I do agree that, even in a best case scenario, he will probably serve many excruciating years in the horrendous Pervian prison system. I just want to see justice.

Thanks, Unreals. Sounds like your book will be an interesting read.

And thanks for your take on the immense distaste and suspicion some have for Beth Holloway as I've never understood it, myself.

Could you reveal who or why you believe JVDS was not the last to be seen with Natalee?

It just seems too far-fetched that the entire Flores family was recruited in a set up to frame this guy. That they would be willing to allow their child, their own daughter, to die a brutal death just to prove a point?

And the hotel staff (as well as who knows who else) that would have to be in on it. That would require some major pay-offs. How would they know what hotel he would be checking into in advance? Much less making sure the cameras were right outside his door to capture this 'sting'?

I dunno... just hard for me to swallow.

I appreciate your personal viewpoints and would like to hear more. I find it most intriguing.

 

[Lexington]

Just now on InSession, as per Jean C., Joran's new attorney has asked the judge to suppress Joran's confession as he did not have representation at the time the confession was given. Also, that Stephany borrowed money from Joran that night and Stephany attacked Joran. The press conference is set for 10:00 a.m. It should be interesting.

 

[21merc7]

HLN just reported charges may come at 10 am eastern time. Also, his attorney wants his confession thrown out.

BBM:

Saw that one coming the day he confessed. Sigh.

Can those of you that can watch update us? I don't have cable at home, which does not matter, I am at work now, and don't have it here. Have to sneak in to read. Thank you all so much!!!

 

[impatientredhead]

Maybe there are some experts that can agree or disagree with me. I have read some true crime books and other fictional murder books, in most cases, sooner or later, they get sloppy and get caught. Forgive me if I'm not in the real world, I'm just trying to get inside his mind.

JVS has for years, has gotten away with literally murder and other crimes. With each crime he gets more cocky and feels he is untouchable. Coupled with the desparation of drugs money gambling, he got sloppy on this. He can't get the body out of the room, so he'll just take off. If and when he gets caught, someone else did it, well we have a video of you coming and going, no one else could have done it, she made me do it, (as if that's a good enough reason), the only reason he can come up with that she made him do it is the reference to NH, there's always an excuse in his twisted mind, but more importantly his excuses have gotten him this far, and he knows it.

My personal opinion is that he is not a criminal mastermind nor a serial killer. He is a spoiled rich kid who Daddy turned into a narcissistic nightmare. I think the version of the story that he told about taking Natalee out to the beach, her having convulsions (combo of alcohol and whatever he gave her) is probably the truth.

Spoiled child calls Daddy instead of getting her help, and Daddy is the organized detail person who cleaned up the mess. Leaving an 18 year old running around the world telling people of 20 versions of his crimes. Thinking he is untouchable and fueling his narcissistic behavior. He spends the next years running around, spending money, developing both his drug and gambling habits. Much like Casey Anthony he LOVES being infamous.

His need for money after Daddy died (and we know Mom wasn't talking to him prior to this mess) makes him brazen enough to contact Beth for money. That funds his next run of drugs and gambling. Stephany is the unfortunate one that crosses his path and I think he killed her in literally a temper tantrum rage.

But Daddy isn't around to clean this up. If Daddy hadn't been around when Natalie died I think he would have left a scene with as much evidence as this one. He is not an organized criminal mastermind in my opinion. He is on video committing his crimes, he is on video discussing his crimes, he is being tailed by the FBI while taking a cash bribe.

Now he is in jail with a confession pending sentencing, and when that is done he has charges waiting for him here. And Peru can choose to send him here instead of Aruba when they are done with him.

I think Daddy dying is the crux of the visible change to the untouchable mastermind Joran wishes he was and the dumbass that is about to do time in one of the worst prisons in the world.

 

[Guardian_Angel]

karma-girl and suzihawk,

Thanks for your comments. I didn't expect much support for my views, and understand how much against the grain they are. Btw, no, I have never posted under another name here.

I have a personal stake in this case. I've been working on a book about the Holloway case, and it has obviously been severely impacted by this unforeseen event. I will just tell you that my research has shown conclusively that Beth Twitty has told more lies than even Joran has over the years. I have also had it verified, from those in Aruba to newspaper reporters who covered the story locally, that the students were coached by Beth and her entourage, not to provide information about what happened.

So, having a strong view that Joran was not the last person with Natalee, and that Beth and her people knew that, but still persisted in trying to railroad this 17 year old kid, I naturally was incredibly suspicious from the outset about the murder in Peru. Think about it- one of the world's youngest criminal masterminds, who removed all traces of Natalee Holloway, to such an extent that not a fingernail or thread of clothing has ever been found of her, devolves into a laughable, Darwin Award-like klutz five years later. Who would leave a dead body in a hotel room registered in his hame? And, as noted previously, the coincidences of the five year anniversary, extortion plot, and Kalpoe-Dr. Phil trial are all just way too unbelievable.

I have great confidence that Joran didn't willingly confess to anything. He is a habitual liar, and appears to have almost no principles where money is involved, but I don't think he's a murderer. I do agree that, even in a best case scenario, he will probably serve many excruciating years in the horrendous Pervian prison system. I just want to see justice.

Hi Unreals

Although I don't agree with your theory, I do have a question and a comment with the sentances that I bolded.

With regards to Beth making sure no one provided information as to what happened, I can't say that I don't blame her. I wouldn't want anyone talking either. Once people start talking, 2nd hand 3rd hand full blown out of proportion information starts to spread like wildfire.

With regards to the second bolded part, if Beth knew that JVS was not the killer of her daughter, why would she want to nail him? What reason would she have to spend all her energy for the last 5 yrs, going after him, if there was another murderer out there who in fact killed her daughter? I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts.

And lastly, IMHO, JVS would leave a dead body in a hotel room registered in his name, because he can think of a million reason's why he thinks he would never be charged, and being set up is one of them.

 

[impatientredhead]

Just now on InSession, as per Jean C., Joran's new attorney has asked the judge to suppress Joran's confession as he did not have representation at the time the confession was given. Also, that Stephany borrowed money from Joran that night and Stephany attacked Joran. The press conference is set for 10:00 a.m. It should be interesting.

He had an attorney, the attorney's statement is on file. He is the one that explained to him the difference between planning to kill her and crime of passion leading to death as far as the sentence goes.

 

[Waddles]

My personal opinion is that he is not a criminal mastermind nor a serial killer. He is a spoiled rich kid who Daddy turned into a narcissistic nightmare. I think the version of the story that he told about taking Natalee out to the beach, her having convulsions (combo of alcohol and whatever he gave her) is probably the truth.

Spoiled child calls Daddy instead of getting her help, and Daddy is the organized detail person who cleaned up the mess. Leaving an 18 year old running around the world telling people of 20 versions of his crimes. Thinking he is untouchable and fueling his narcissistic behavior. He spends the next years running around, spending money, developing both his drug and gambling habits. Much like Casey Anthony he LOVES being infamous.

His need for money after Daddy died (and we know Mom wasn't talking to him prior to this mess) makes him brazen enough to contact Beth for money. That funds his next run of drugs and gambling. Stephany is the unfortunate one that crosses his path and I think he killed her in literally a temper tantrum rage.

But Daddy isn't around to clean this up. If Daddy hadn't been around when Natalie died I think he would have left a scene with as much evidence as this one. He is not an organized criminal mastermind in my opinion. He is on video committing his crimes, he is on video discussing his crimes, he is being tailed by the FBI while taking a cash bribe.

Now he is in jail with a confession pending sentencing, and when that is done he has charges waiting for him here. And Peru can choose to send him here instead of Aruba when they are done with him.

I think Daddy dying is the crux of the visible change to the untouchable mastermind Joran wishes he was and the dumbass that is about to do time in one of the worst prisons in the world.

Very good post, my thoughts exactly -it's what I meant in my post couple pages back but this one is much better worded

 

[suzihawk]

Just now on InSession, as per Jean C., Joran's new attorney has asked the judge to suppress Joran's confession as he did not have representation at the time the confession was given. Also, that Stephany borrowed money from Joran that night and Stephany attacked Joran. The press conference is set for 10:00 a.m. It should be interesting.

WTH?! I hardly think Stephany borrowed money from HIM. According to all reports, she was the big winner that night and he's the one desparately trying to scrape up the funds to feed himself and pay his hotel bill. :banghead:

 

[angelwngs]

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2010/06/10/peru-police-van-der-sloot-murder-case-prosecutors/

He told the AP in an interview Wednesday evening that the 6-foot-3 (190-centimeter-tall) Van der Sloot, 22, impressed investigators with both his intelligence and brutality.
"He grabbed her and smashed her with an elbow," Guardia said, pointing to his own nose. "A lot of blood spewed out ... Then he strangles her and throws her to the floor."
"He is irascible. He has no self-control," Guardia said.
The general said Van der Sloot took Flores' cash, about US$300 worth of Peruvian currency, and two credit cards.
Guardia said Van der Sloot attested in his confession to killing Flores because she found out about the Aruba case by using his laptop without his permission. But he said police didn't necessarily believe him and think he may have killed Flores before going out and returning to the room with two cups of coffee and rolls.
"This guy is very intelligent but at times has lapses," said Guardia. "And the truth is that he is not a person in possession of all his senses."
A psychological examination is pending, he said.

 

[Guardian_Angel]

With regards to SF borrowing money from JVS, the casino vid appears to show that she in fact puts money on the table for him?

 

[Patty G]

Just now on InSession, as per Jean C., Joran's new attorney has asked the judge to suppress Joran's confession as he did not have representation at the time the confession was given. Also, that Stephany borrowed money from Joran that night and Stephany attacked Joran. The press conference is set for 10:00 a.m. It should be interesting.

Darn, I tuned into IS late and missed this one. :banghead:

I am not surprised with the twist of events now that a lawyer is on board. We all have seen this happen in other case. :crazy:

 

[LaWanda]

In the video of the casino, if they were friendly, why does she put a seat between them? If I saw someone that I knew and didn't really like, I would definitely put whatever distance I could between us ... JMO and all that jazz ...

 

[mahoneys07]

presser link anyone????

 

[Clearly Confused]

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2010/0...peru-womans-mutilated-corpse/?test=latestnews

Van Der Sloot Says He Snacked, Sipped Espresso Near Peru Woman's Mutilated Corpse

As blood oozed from Stephany Flores' head -- and one of her eyes dangled out of a socket -- the man long suspected of murdering Alabama teen Natalee Holloway in Aruba five years ago ate four sponge cakes.

 

[Patty G]

With regards to SF borrowing money from JVS, the casino vid appears to show that she in fact puts money on the table for him?

It shows she put money down on the table, but it doesn't show that the money was for him. She sat down next to the other guy once she placed the money on the table, and the money was to her right. Joran had chips in front of him at that time. The next shot in the video shows Stephany moving next to Joran, and I don't see the money on the table at that point. It never shows Joran picking up the money off the table.

http://www.larepublica.pe/node/271311/01#fotos