POI: Michael Pak

[scandi]

Well thank you I have been reading a lot on here but just started to post. Some very interesting stuff!!! Also very confusing because it seems there is a lot of different story's out there about the night SG went missing.
Can anyone please share a link with me about "the party" because from everything I have read and documentary I have watched have said nothing about a party or about a drifter. A link about a drifter would be nice also.
Everything I have read on my own so far has stated that MP sat in his car for three hours sleeping/playing online poker. Got a call to go inside and then got tired of it and went back to his car. That is when JB chased/scared SG out of his house and she feel down the stars and that would have been around the time the 911 call ended. Also have read a lot about the falling down the stars being heard on the 911 call (none of us will prob never know the truth about that). But any in sight or links would be helpful for me to understand more. Thanks

Denada ;} It's too late for me to get links tonight but there is info about the drifter - none of it specific, a rumor or two. I remember when MP went into J
B's house he saw her on the phone and a bit frantic I think. I didn't think her phone call ended at JB's because wasn't she also talking on the phone at
GC's house. She was hiding from someone {MP I guess} under the boat and then ran down Anchor Way where she knocked on the door of the mother and son {W side of Anchor Way, can't remember their name} and she took off from there running S on Anchor Way and was never seen again. Each stop she made they told her they would call LE and it scared her to where she left and ran on.

That's just a brief scenario

 

[nugzter]

A lot of the things I have found well googleing about the case. I will try and find them and get the links up here for you soon.

May I suggest looking here..
[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=159244"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[Vivalor]

May I suggest looking here..
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Yep thinking that must of been where I read about SG falling down JB steps and then again falling down Coletti steps. I am thinking maybe I read it wrong and that it said she had her phone in hand. Thanks for reminding me where I had read that at

 

[Vivalor]

Vivalor, Which documentary did you see? Theres a few on youtube.

I have read the 48 hour one, and American serial killer true stories. I watched one other one I can not remember the name of. I will have to look it up and get back to you about because this girl needs some shut eye.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

I do remember hearing or reading that SG fell down the steps. I dont remember where though. Her earing was found not far from the base of his steps.

I know that she fell down the steps at Coletti's, and I've read one msm article that stated she also fell down the steps at Brennan's. I'd have to track down those links, though. Let me see what I can find.

ETA: here's an account of her falling down both Brewer and Coletti's steps:

http://www.newsday.com/news/breaking/gilbert-vanishing-reaches-one-year-mark-1.2849214

A short time later, Pak said she bolted from the house, phone in hand, and fell down the front steps before running away.

Down the street, Gustav Coletti, 75, was up early. An antique car buff, he said he had planned to drive to upstate Rhinebeck for a car show.

He was shaving sometime after 5 a.m. when a woman's screams and pounding on his front door gave him a shock.

"I opened the door and she jumped into the house," said Coletti, a past president of the Oak Beach Community Association.

It was Gilbert. She said her life was in danger. "I'm calling the police," Coletti recalled telling her.

Gilbert begged him not to and ran from his house, again falling down the steps, Coletti said

 

[Redbird]

I know that she fell down the steps at Coletti's, and I've read one msm article that stated she also fell down the steps at Brennan's. I'd have to track down those links, though. Let me see what I can find.

ETA: here's an account of her falling down both Brewer and Coletti's steps:

http://www.newsday.com/news/breaking/gilbert-vanishing-reaches-one-year-mark-1.2849214

A short time later, Pak said she bolted from the house, phone in hand, and fell down the front steps before running away.

Down the street, Gustav Coletti, 75, was up early. An antique car buff, he said he had planned to drive to upstate Rhinebeck for a car show.

He was shaving sometime after 5 a.m. when a woman's screams and pounding on his front door gave him a shock.

"I opened the door and she jumped into the house," said Coletti, a past president of the Oak Beach Community Association.

It was Gilbert. She said her life was in danger. "I'm calling the police," Coletti recalled telling her.

Gilbert begged him not to and ran from his house, again falling down the steps, Coletti said

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=134024&page=20

#480
Here is a different version of Gus's story where SG only says Help me, Help me. Not that she begs him not to call the police. As a matter of fact I can't recall any interview with GC saying she begged him not to call the police. This is an example of what we have been dealing with from news stories. I didn't know reporters could use "poetic license."

 

[Peter Brendt]

Here is a quote from a December 15, 2010 newsreport including info that may help you out:

http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/2010/12/boyfriend_and_the_driver_of_sh.html

Boyfriend and the driver of Shannon Maria Gilbert recount hours just before Jersey City woman went missing

By Charles Hack/The Jersey Journal
on December 15, 2010 at 9:56 PM

Quote:

The New York driver, who requested his name not be used, said he dropped off Gilbert to the home of a client in Oak Beach at about 2 a.m. on May 1. Gilbert's price: $250 an hour, the driver said.

He said he spent three hours in his SUV outside the gated community, playing poker over the Internet and sleeping, when Gilbert's client phoned him at about 5 a.m., saying Gilbert was refusing to leave the house.

The driver said he drove back to the client's house and found Gilbert, who was clothed, in the living room on the phone with a 911 operator, saying that a man was after her.

"I said 'Shannon, Get a grip. Let's go,' and she said, 'You guys are trying to kill me.' So I said, 'OK, I am leaving.' But then she said, 'Don't go.'"

Gilbert eventually ran from the house, the driver said. The driver said he ran after Gilbert, who is bipolar and has a history of cocaine abuse, but then lost track.

He said drove around the gated community and outside the complex -- texting and calling her furiously on his cell phone -- before leaving the area 6 a.m. and believing that Gilbert would somehow make her way back to Jersey City.

Suffolk police today refused to release the audio or transcripts of the 911 call and provide any information about their response to the call.

Gilbert's live-in boyfriend at the time, Alex Diaz, 28, of Jersey City, said he last saw her on April 30.
"I was waiting and waiting (for Gilbert to come home)," Diaz said today. "After two days I thought she was not coming back."

Thinking that Gilbert had left him, Diaz, who now lives with his father on Duncan Avenue, said he called Gilbert's sister to see if she had returned home to her parents' home in Ellensville, N.Y.

Diaz said he also reached out to the driver, which is when the driver learned that Gilbert had never returned home.

On May 3, the boyfriend and the driver returned to Oak Beach in search of Gilbert and checked local beaches and area hospitals, according to the driver.

The driver said they tried to file a missing person report in Suffolk County, but police told them it had to be filed in Jersey City, Gilbert's hometown.



Concerning the he Barbara Brennan 911 call:

http://www.newsday.com/news/breaking/cops-remains-likely-those-of-shannan-gilbert-1.3385742

Cops: Remains likely those of Shannan Gilbert
Originally published: December 13, 2011

The last reported sighting of Gilbert was closer to the inlet near the home of another neighbor, Barbara Brennan, who called police at 5:22 a.m. Police came within 10 minutes of the call, but could not find her, Varrone said.


SO...:

4:51 a.m.: Shannan Gilbert calls 911 (according to statemens by MP, SG call 911 while still inside JB's house), the call last 23 minnutes

5:14 a.m.: Gilbert 911 call ends

?:?? a.m : Shanna Gilbert banging on Collettis door etc

?:?? a.m : Gustav Colletti call 911, and it has been stated police arrived 45 minutes later

5:22 a.m.: Barbara Brennan called 911 (NOTE!!! In my SG timeline thread I have listed Gustav Colletti's 911 call as been made 5:22am and that is probably an error, I have probably confused Barbara Brenna's 911 call with GC's 911 call, SORRY!!!)

NOTE!!!. only 8 minnutes pass between SG's 911 call ending and Barabara Brennan calling 911

5:32 a.m.: Police arrive, this was stated by Suffolk Chief of Detectives Dominick Varrone in December 13, 2011 newsday.com newsreport

On another note:
It has been stated by other LISK researchers that intial reports have said that police arrived somewhat between 5:55am and 6:05 AM , and due to that Coletti have stated that police arrived 45 minutes after his 911 call, then his 911 call was probaly made somewhat between 5:10am and 5:20am

Here is the report that stated that the police arrived "45 minutes later" after Colletti called 911:

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/06/jersey_city_prostitute_still_m.html

Published: Sunday, June 12, 2011
Quote:

After calling 911 that morning, Coletti said he went to the gatehouse, which is about a 30-second walk from his home, and waited until the police arrived. They didn’t arrive until about 45 minutes later, sometime before 6 a.m., according to neighbors and family.

WHAT WE NEED TO KNOW:
what time EXACTLEY did Gustav Colletti call 911

Does anyone have that 100% CORRECT information avaible???

Nice work. So now we can be sure, since SG's 911 call ended at 5:14 that GC's call can't be BEFORE 5:14. BB called at 5:22. That makes a maximum of 8 minutes. Police arrived at 5:32, that makes 10 minutes from the BB's call. BB didn't see Pak or his SUV. So, even under the assumption, he knew her location, ander the assumption, he would be some trained knug-fu fighter, who could render her unconscious without leaving any trace of blunt force trauma on the bones, under the assumption, that BB just missed the SUV hunting the girl down (the girl she was so worried about, she called 911), 10 Minutes is a narrow time window in which MP would have to get her, subdue her, turn around and leave through the gate.
On the other hand, GC was after his call on the way to the gate. That wouldn't, even if he would be slow, take longer than 5 minutes. His call es somewhere between 5:14 and 5:22. So the latest time he would be at the gate would be around 5:27. That narrows the time window, MP would have had by another five minutes at least. And if GC's call was any minute earlier than 5:22, the time window closes even more. So, MP left definitively before 5:27. He may or may not has searched outside a bit longer. I see no way to pin that time down. But the time inside is pretty nicely determined and the time window is too narrow IMO.

 

[Peter Brendt]

I don't know of any reports stating he was seen on Anchor Way. I feel like a little kid here because I want to say... but but but... MP was reported to have been seen following her. If she went down Anchor Way I assume that means he followed her down Anchor Way. (However, I concede that it makes no sense for him to have been the perp and stuck around town for the many months that followed)

If I remember right, someone said, the turn into Anchor Way is easy to miss. So chances are, MP, while still following SG missed Anchor Way. Lets for a moment assume, he was what he said he was ... not familiar with the area. Then how would he have known? And looking out for someone one believes is ahead may can led to focusing forward and miss the turn to the side (Windsor had this really nice video).

 

[Peter Brendt]

The phone calls between her and MP before she called 911 and started to freak out. Maybe he said something. Maybe some one had texted her something and he later (if he did have anything to do with it) erased the text.
I say that she was scared of MP and only him (maybe) because she didn't run to him. I as a woman can say this much if someone wanted to kill me or if someone was chasing me I wouldn't think twice about leaving my purse behind and if I dropped it I wouldn't even look back. I would how ever run right to my drive. The driver you would think would be a safe place...If he was a friend as well as a driver then I would look at him as back up if need be. But she didn't run to him. And when she seen his head lights coming she ran and hide. I feel like she was scared of him for some reason.
I say maybe something was done to scare her of MP and not JB because she didn't want to leave his house and from what I read (if true) JB had to chase/scare her out of the house.
I am not really sure what your talking about when it comes to the purse I wasn't really referring to that. I actually haven't read throw all the post yet, still working on it. I just kind of randomly responded to what I agreed with. Sorry if I was a bit confusing I am new here and still trying to learn the ropes.

Also, a little off topic but was going to add in at some point anyways that I was reading up on drugs and asked a few users what kind of drugs they thought would make her act like that. They all said meth. They all agreed with each other and said that crack or coke wouldn't do that but meth would. Not sure how importation that even is. Also been reading a lot on people saying she could have been drugged. Guess my big question is why would you drug a call girl who is there to have sex and willing to do drugs?

I asked some ER doctors. The ideas were meth and also cocaine plus ecstasy variants. My personal guess would be the second because most Ecstasy variants are also known to influence the body's temperature control.
However, both possibilities can lead to paranoia, delusions, up to accute temporary psychotic breaks. SG not only didn't run to her driver. She also run off the next and the over next place (GC and BB) that could have given her shelter.
And the purse ... we can forget the purse, that was my mistake, someone said, the purse was found at Anchor Way, but it wasn't, it was the jacket.

 

[nugzter]

From 05:32 the time LE arrived take off 45 mins that leaves 04:47, BEFORE SG even made the call. So the 45 min remark may not be accurate. IMO
And that only gave SG 8 mins to be at and talk to GC then SPRINT to BB's. I run a 7 min mile sober with running shoes. So SG was hauling A$$. So somewhere the times are off in the News reports.

 

[jillybean51]

I also want to know more about the drifter.Thanks

 

[fred&edna]

I also want to know more about the drifter.Thanks

There was a thread entitled "The Drifter" it was full of interesting posts... it was closed (I really don't remember why and don't even know if it still exists). There is another closed thread "The Wanderer" it was the second attempt to start a drifter thread... you might be able glean something from that.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=193529"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[Vivalor]

I asked some ER doctors. The ideas were meth and also cocaine plus ecstasy variants. My personal guess would be the second because most Ecstasy variants are also known to influence the body's temperature control.
However, both possibilities can lead to paranoia, delusions, up to accute temporary psychotic breaks. SG not only didn't run to her driver. She also run off the next and the over next place (GC and BB) that could have given her shelter.
And the purse ... we can forget the purse, that was my mistake, someone said, the purse was found at Anchor Way, but it wasn't, it was the jacket.

I've thought about drugs maybe messing with her body temperature and plus you would think by the time she made it to where her body was found she would have been exhausted. Maybe even just finally collapsed.
And for the life of me I can not figure out why she would of ran from GC house. The only thing I can say. And it is just purely me speculating and judging from an indecent that had personally happen to me in the past is... If I truly thought someone was going to kill me. And had just got of the phone with police who didn't show up. I don't think I would feel safe with a 75 year old man. I mean surly MP could have hurt him and then taken her. In the back of my head I would be thinking MP would come in house and find me.
Also, a while back I was attacked headbutted, and strangled. (probably why I have turned into such a crime junkie) But I remember that night when I had gotten away and was screaming for help a big guy came out with a cell phone and called 911. My attacker took off running to the west when he seen I had found help. I for some reason did not feel safe with the guy. I for reasons I can't even to this day explain took off running to the east and hide in a corner of a building and it was really dark. And about 30 min later the cops where driving around and found me.
Once the police took me back to the crime scene and were trying to figure out what happen I was still scared of the guy who had helped me and kept telling the cops that I thought he was helping hide my attacker.
My point is that sometimes when a traumatic event happens to someone they do thing in pure panic that don't make any sense at all. The cop told me that it was normal to feel like that. Never once did I get any crap from the police for running away or talking crazy about the guy who called 911. Every cop who showed up understood why I ran and my train of thought. Never once was I questioned about my credibility and I was not on drugs.
My point being that if something very traumatic happen to SG my guess is that she was not going to do things that would make any sense to any of us. If she was in a pure panic she probably didn't know what to do or where to run and who to trust.
I know this is just me putting out my two cents not facts. And basing this off my own personal experience. But I can say if I never went through what I did her running from GC would stump even more.

 

[Redbird]

One of GC's first account of events was that he didn't let her in, just called 911. I tend to think that was the true account because it would explain why she didn't stay at his house.

 

[Vivalor]

From 05:32 the time LE arrived take off 45 mins that leaves 04:47, BEFORE SG even made the call. So the 45 min remark may not be accurate. IMO
And that only gave SG 8 mins to be at and talk to GC then SPRINT to BB's. I run a 7 min mile sober with running shoes. So SG was hauling A$$. So somewhere the times are off in the News reports.

Your so right. I also read some where that the LE didn't show up till 6:20am. And once again who knows if the reporter was even reporting on facts or if it was just a reporter trying to make money.
Also I was reading on here about someone possibly erasing the surveillance video from the gate area.
I do know that some surveillance videos are on a timer and things get erased automatically if they don't get attended to with in a certain amount of time. Does anyone know how long it took LE to ask for the surveillance video or if it was one that was on a timer?
And does anyone know for sure if there was even a surveillance recording. I know that sometimes some surveillance cameras don't even record and are just there to let you know who you are letting in and to make people think they are being recorded.

 

[deedee21]

One of GC's first account of events was that he didn't let her in, just called 911. I tend to think that was the true account because it would explain why she didn't stay at his house.

GC said he told SG "Sit in that chair". Perhaps she was standing in the doorway and would not step in. If GC was nervous about what was happening on the other side of the door, he would not have engaged MP.

 

[Vivalor]

One of GC's first account of events was that he didn't let her in, just called 911. I tend to think that was the true account because it would explain why she didn't stay at his house.

And I for some reason could see this to be true. Maybe he was thinking she was just a ploy for her and others to rob him? And later on once he found out the whole story was feeling embarrassed and ashamed that he didn't help as much as he could of and said something different so he didn't look like he helped her get caught by an attacker. Just a thought.

 

[deedee21]

Vivalor. Thanks for your post. It gives insight into the mind of someone who is in a panic. Google fieldnotes blog. Read inquiry. Alot of information. The link is on this forum somewhere. Cant find it.

 

[Vivalor]

Vivalor. Thanks for your post. It gives insight into the mind of someone who is in a panic. Google fieldnotes blog. Read inquiry. Alot of information. The link is on this forum somewhere. Cant find it.

I guess that has been the way I have been going about trying to figure out what happen to SG. Instead of trying to think like an attacker...maybe thinking like a young woman in pure panic the answers to her actions will lie.
I was also going to say when you think about it....where I went and hid my attacker could of found me, dragged me away and killed me. And the last anyone would of seen of me was me running from the guy who called 911. I just got lucky that he didn't and the police showed up within minuets of the attack and found me within 30 min of driving around to look for me and my attacker.

 

[Peter Brendt]

From 05:32 the time LE arrived take off 45 mins that leaves 04:47, BEFORE SG even made the call. So the 45 min remark may not be accurate. IMO
And that only gave SG 8 mins to be at and talk to GC then SPRINT to BB's. I run a 7 min mile sober with running shoes. So SG was hauling A$$. So somewhere the times are off in the News reports.

I doubt the 45 minutes. Time seems to pass slower when someone is waiting for something ... for example the police finally arriving while having a feeling, things are quickly going down south. So, IMO, the reliable time points would be 5:14 and 5:22 and in between would be GC's 911 call.
You ran a mile sober ... I'm impressed, haven't done that in at least ten years :floorlaugh: