POLL ADDED Connect The Dots-Working theories thread #2

[cluciano63]

After all this time I still have not been able to move away from my theory that this was a one-person crime, either Terri or someone totally unknown to all. I'm probably wrong, as everyone seems to believe there are helpers and accomplices, but I have not yet been able to bring myself to believe that.

If I am wrong, then LE should have a better chance, as it seems that in cases of conspiracy, someone always talks. I don't believe that has happened yet, since they can't find Kyron.

LE's searches these past two weeks give me a sinking feeling that they really are going back to the beginning and are in a mode where they know that they must find Kyron to proceed.

 

[BeanE]

Well, that's one guess.

My guess is that the fact that the searches were resuming...searches on Sauvie Island that would not produce a live little boy...were devastating to a Mother wanting desperately to believe her son is still alive.

In fact, she spoke vehemently about more donations for searches...searches were on her mind.

Desiree was so distraught...so seemingly at wits end...I believe if she was disgusted with the police investigation, she would absolutely have not been able to hold back on that topic. She didn't care if Kaine agreed with her. She stood there alone. Didn't seem like a woman who would or could hold back that day in regard to her frustration.

But her topic seemed to be about searches. Not the investigation.

I think the mystery of whodunnit has been solved.

The mystery of where Kyron is...has not.

She doesn't mention searches at all, SMM. Her concentration is about upping the reward money, but if you take those pleas out, and look at why she wanted the reward money increased, it is, sadly, because no one has come forward with information, and over and over and over she says that's what she wants - someone to come forward with information. It's heartbreaking.

Now it may be that, even at a subconscious level, that LE had told her there would be searches at Sauvie, and she knows that means a Kyron not alive. And that is why she was focused on getting someone to come forward with information - if that person came forward, and gave info, it could stop the searches on Sauvie, the searches for a Kyron who's not alive.

Hope that made sense. It's been weighing heavily on my mind.

Most of Desiree's statement at presser of October 2 (all but the first couple sentences):


And so, I brought everybody out here today because I want to appeal to the public. (pause) I guess (pause) I don't know what else to do. I'm (pause) It's been four months now, and Kyron is still not home, and I would like to appeal to everybody, and ask everybody to help me get the reward increased.

I want to (pause) have everybody come together and show the support for Kyron. This money doesn't come to us. It doesn't go to support Terri. It doesn't go to support me or Kaine or Tony. It supports Kyron. It's to find him, and it goes to the person who comes forward and gives information about where Kyron is at.

There is someone out there that has him, and there is someone out there that knows information, and they have not come forward.

I want that person to come forward.

I have been thinking about this and... I just... I guess I'm at that point where I don't know what else to do.

This is not about supporting Terri Horman. All of the people that are supporting her, her parents and everything... that's great, but why don't they put their money together and help us increase the reward to bring Kyron home?

How 'bout her parents give us 350,000 dollars so that we can bring Kyron home?

Increase the reward to at least what Terri's legal fees are.

I (pause) I just... we're not gonna stop. We will never stop, and we want Kyron home, and we want him home right now, and I want someone in Terri's circle to come forward with information.

I really want to bring Kyron home, and I don't know how else to do that, but to increase the reward, so I would like everybody's help, so that we can get the reward up there to a point where someone will come forward that knows something.

ETA: forgot your wink

 

[stmarysmead]

Yes, you're right on the "searches."

I guess I remembered it that way because it's been weighing on my mind how devastating they must be to her...in light that she seems to very much not want to concede the possibility that Kyron is gone.

In my mind. "wanting him home" was in her way...perhaps...denying the need for searches for remains. Ahhh, it is all so painful to even observe.

On another topic...

Hey, 'bout time you showed up with the wink...

 

[gardeness]

Well, that's one guess.

My guess is that the fact that the searches were resuming...searches on Sauvie Island that would not produce a live little boy...were devastating to a Mother wanting desperately to believe her son is still alive.

In fact, she spoke vehemently about more donations for searches...searches were on her mind.

Desiree was so distraught...so seemingly at wits end...I believe if she was disgusted with the police investigation, she would absolutely have not been able to hold back on that topic. She didn't care if Kaine agreed with her. She stood there alone. Didn't seem like a woman who would or could hold back that day in regard to her frustration.

But her topic seemed to be about searches. Not the investigation.

I think the mystery of whodunnit has been solved.

The mystery of where Kyron is...has not.

I agree with BeanE's response to most of this post, but to add my thoughts to the part bbm--I disagree that it has been solved.

I don't think that LE has connected the dots--they are stumped by the parts of Terri's alibi that are validated--the grocery stores (a receipt from one, a chat with a friend from another, and video surveillance, most likely), the gym, and FB posts. They are trying to take every piece of information, not evidence, that they have and force an explanation into the hour and a half of unaccounted time (i.e."driving around").

If LE had any evidence, Terri would be in jail right now. Consider this: LE attempted a rushed "sting" for the MFH in order to get Terri in jail. I don't see any other reason for this sting attempt. LE admits it never went past "talking", so what was the rush? The rush was to get Terri in jail. If LE ever had any evidence on Terri for any crime, she would already be in jail. moo mho

 

[stmarysmead]

I agree with BeanE's response to most of this post, but to add my thoughts to the part bbm--I disagree that it has been solved.

I don't think that LE has connected the dots--they are stumped by the parts of Terri's alibi that are validated--the grocery stores (a receipt from one, a chat with a friend from another, and video surveillance, most likely), the gym, and FB posts. They are trying to take every piece of information, not evidence, that they have and force an explanation into the hour and a half of unaccounted time (i.e."driving around").

If LE had any evidence, Terri would be in jail right now. Consider this: LE attempted a rushed "sting" for the MFH in order to get Terri in jail. I don't see any other reason for this sting attempt. LE admits it never went past "talking", so what was the rush? The rush was to get Terri in jail. If LE ever had any evidence on Terri for any crime, she would already be in jail. moo mho

Please read Sarah7855's excellent "connect the dots" post (192)on this thread...

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=115967&page=8

It includes this quote...from this article.

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/09/kyron_horman_case_as_costs_top.html

Quote:
"All this information has been compiled, a lot of questions have been answered. We’re now focusing on what we have collected and targeting those areas to help the district attorney’s office to develop a case that they can prosecute successfully."

Respectfully, I think LE and the District Attorney know more than we do.

 

[gardeness]

Please read Sarah7855's excellent "connect the dots" post (192)on this thread...

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=115967&page=8

It includes this quote...from this article.

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/09/kyron_horman_case_as_costs_top.html

Quote:
"All this information has been compiled, a lot of questions have been answered. We’re now focusing on what we have collected and targeting those areas to help the district attorney’s office to develop a case that they can prosecute successfully."

Respectfully, I think LE and the District Attorney know more than we do.

Thanks--I've been following this forum today and had already read her post, which, IMO contains PR statements and spin. I am quite positive that LE and the DA know more about this case than I, lol--but I, as a rational thinker, can deduce some ideas from their actions or lack of actions. I am completely open to changing my mind once real evidence has surfaced.

 

[germaine]

If LE had any evidence, Terri would be in jail right now. Consider this: LE attempted a rushed "sting" for the MFH in order to get Terri in jail. I don't see any other reason for this sting attempt. LE admits it never went past "talking", so what was the rush? The rush was to get Terri in jail. If LE ever had any evidence on Terri for any crime, she would already be in jail. moo mho

LE has told us that is not the case. Imo, it's obvious that they wanted her in jail on another charge (MFH) while they built their ironclad case relating to Kyron's disappearance. That happens all the time. At the time of the sting, they realized there was a good possibility that that case relating to Kyron would possibly or probably be a circumstantial one, difficult to prove beyond a reasonable doubt. Which is, as been pointed out here over and over again, not the same as probable cause for an arrest. Not even close.

As far as not arresting her on the MFH, those cases are generally prosecuted when there is an irrefutable solicitation and at least a discussion of price, if not an actual exchange of money. They are almost always prosecuted with a "sting" type operation b/c otherwise you have exactly what we have here -- a case where the person doing the hiring can say, oh, it wasn't me who sent those texts on my phone, or I was just joking, or I was just angry at that moment, I didn't mean it. Doesn't mean she didn't do it, or that there's no evidence of it. Just means that it's not evidence that will definitely hold up in court to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. So if that's what you mean when you say they don't have "any evidence" -- then you are probably right. But I get the sense that's not what you mean. jmoo

 

[Calliope]

<snip>

Respectfully, I think LE and the District Attorney know more than we do.

One would hope so.

 

[pufnstuf]

One would hope so.

Of course they do. That's why the constant criticism of the job they're doing is unfounded.

 

[BeanE]

Of course they do. That's why the constant criticism of the job they're doing is unfounded.

hmmmm... I only recall seeing one critical comment of the job LE is doing in this case, and it was a mild comment at that.

 

[Calliope]

Of course they do. That's why the constant criticism of the job they're doing is unfounded.

How do we know it's unfounded if we don't know what they know, ya know?

 

[pufnstuf]

How do we know it's unfounded if we don't know what they know, ya know?

Because, without knowing what LE knows, continuous uninformed criticism amounts merely to setting up strawmen just to knock them down.

 

[gardeness]

LE has told us that is not the case. Imo, it's obvious that they wanted her in jail on another charge (MFH) while they built their ironclad case relating to Kyron's disappearance. That happens all the time. At the time of the sting, they realized there was a good possibility that that case relating to Kyron would possibly or probably be a circumstantial one, difficult to prove beyond a reasonable doubt. Which is, as been pointed out here over and over again, not the same as probable cause for an arrest. Not even close.

As far as not arresting her on the MFH, those cases are generally prosecuted when there is an irrefutable solicitation and at least a discussion of price, if not an actual exchange of money. They are almost always prosecuted with a "sting" type operation b/c otherwise you have exactly what we have here -- a case where the person doing the hiring can say, oh, it wasn't me who sent those texts on my phone, or I was just joking, or I was just angry at that moment, I didn't mean it. Doesn't mean she didn't do it, or that there's no evidence of it. Just means that it's not evidence that will definitely hold up in court to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. So if that's what you mean when you say they don't have "any evidence" -- then you are probably right. But I get the sense that's not what you mean. jmoo

I think you missed my point--that, IMO, LE has no evidence on Terri whatsoever.

 

[Kimster]

It's not looking like a working theory thread anymore? :waitasec:

Please review the first post. Thanks!

 

[Calliope]

Because, without knowing what LE knows, continuous uninformed criticism amounts merely to setting up strawmen just to knock them down.

The same can be said for uninformed praise.

We just don't know ...

 

[Calliope]

It's not looking like a working theory thread anymore? :waitasec:

Please review the first post. Thanks!

lol @ Kermit.

ok

Back to the dots, scattered as they may be. Sorry.

 

[germaine]

I think you missed my point--that, IMO, LE has no evidence on Terri whatsoever.

No, I got your point. I just don't think it's correct or reasonable under the circumstances and my post explained why I think that. I don't need to belabor the point though. We can agree to totally, completely and in every way shape and form disagree lol

 

[Bluestars]

I think Terri is responsible. I believe that because the teacher and at least one other student were BOTH lead to believe Terri took Kyron to a doctor's appointment that day. That tells me this was premeditated and that she planned this.

If there was someone in the truck, either watching the baby while Terri was in the SF or just sitting in the truck, then I think that person is an accomplice.

I think Dede is involved and helped cover up the crime when whatever Terri was doing didn't work like she had planned, or was more difficult than she planned. I think if Dede is involved, that she was lied to by Terri and made to believe things that were not true.

All of this is my opinion. I think it's possible that the things LE found out that they wish they didn't know may involve either the other person in the truck (if it is shocking) or things that may have happened to poor little Kyron.

 

[Calliope]

What led the teacher to believe Kyron was taken to his doctor's appointment?

 

[Bluestars]

What led the teacher to believe Kyron was taken to his doctor's appointment?

I believe Terri lead the teacher to believe she was taking Kyron to the doctor. A student even thought the same thing. That makes two people that we know of. I wonder if the entire class knew it.