Post sentencing discussion

[ColonelMustard]

Dear Colonel/la* Mustard,

Love ALL your posts of today :loveyou:
. . . you're really hitting the mark . . .

*that post about gender of forum members was so much fun too

Why, Paul_1900, ah DO declare'! (southern accent plus mint julep)

 

[ColonelMustard]

It seems to me that OP had severe difficulty coping (nothing to do with his disability) and led a chaotic life where he was out of control, but tried to hyper-control some parts of it. To compensate. And there was just nobody around to point out where he was going wrong. I actually think that once he has settled down, a lot of pressure will be off him. He can hyper-control his own environment (a small cell) and the prison will impose structure and clear boundaries for behaviour.

I don't think he'll enjoy it. But I think it may benefit him. Whether he'll remember any lessons learned when he's released, I don't know.

Very interesting.

 

[ColonelMustard]

I totally agree. This whole thing is ridiculous. I mean, the judge who made the decision will now decide if that decision should be appealed? Talk about a conflict on interest.

That is weird, isn't it?

 

[jay-jay]

Remember back right after the verdict, but before the sentencing someone here at WS wrote a post about how the verdict was possibly a clever ploy by Masipa herself - she wanted to ensure that the PT appeals the CH verdict so that it could be overturned to murder. Had JM given a harsher sentence, the DT would possibly have appealed, and subsequently get a lesser sentence. The speculation was that Masipa wanted to guarantee a murder sentence, but could only get it if she gave a lesser verdict, with high hopes that the PT appeals.

Does anyone else remember this? I wouldn't know where to start searching for this post, but I thought it was interesting. But to be honest, I personally don't see the mind of masipa being this devious. JMO!

I remember it .. and I thought of it a few times over the past few days, too .. whoever said it may well have been right! Lux, I think?

Edit: .. gahhh .. I've done it again .. just seen it's already been answered!

 

[foxbluff]

The text to the Myers was to Desi, Cecil's wife. What Cecil Myers reported were not the actual words of the message, just the gist. The WhatsApp was sent at 20:42 (it may have been read later) and reads "My Des!!!! I'm staying in PTA again it's sooooooo far to drive I just decided to stay here today and work! See u for valentines day xxxx". That sounds like Reeva to me. See Timeline for details.

First of all, Mr.Fos, I want to join the many others here who have thanked you for your continued hard work!

Apologies if the following has already been mentioned as I'm back on Pg. 18 still playing catch up... also, apologize that the "B I U" feature that would make my reply clearer is currently missing:

Would you mind double checking the time for the subj whatsapp? IIRC it was reported somewhere that this same whatsapp was sent by RS during the afternoon (the "precise time" of message wasn't given). The verbatim message was given (verbatim EXCEPT it didn't include "My Des!!!!" portion)... whoever was reporting simply commented that it was sent in the afternoon from RS "to a friend." TIA

 

[Paul_1900]

Someone upthread mentioned that the family must have been happy as CH was the best they could have hoped for.

Maybe, they were paying Roux to get him acquitted. I'm sure Oscar thought so!

Plus didn't Uncle Arnold say in one of his first on air musings right after the murder, something about, ..."if this even goes to trial."

Unrelated but related: Aunt Lois saying to Nel during the trial, "Shame. Shame on you."

Whatever's going on with them, we know they are sure that OP and their family are victims of it.

Exactly, and this - combined with other unpleasant attitudes - was adding constantly to my distaste for the whole family, to an extent where I don't know how much rubbed off on OP . . . though he has his own pretty share of it, just by his own doing and behaviour.

 

[ColonelMustard]

I'm so excited about the appeal that I'm babbling on and on here.

My cat's so upset that I'm not paying any attention to her that she keeps trying to pull my laptop over backwards, which, given these exceptional developments, is highly annoying.

I told her that, instead, she needs to make herself useful and suggested she go in the kitchen and make me a pot of Mexican cocoa.

I'm still waiting.



...think I hear her snoring in the other room.

 

[Lux et Veritas]

... [Pistorius] family is not keen to pay the bill and a dispute is brewing over it. A source close to the family said there was “definitely great unhappiness” about the legal fees which were “much higher” than the family expected. ...

http://www.citypress.co.za/news/oscars-r17-5million-legal-headache

TRANSLATION:

We did not get the acquittal on all counts we paid for.

 

[BritsKate]

It seems to me that OP had severe difficulty coping (nothing to do with his disability) and led a chaotic life where he was out of control, but tried to hyper-control some parts of it. To compensate. And there was just nobody around to point out where he was going wrong. I actually think that once he has settled down, a lot of pressure will be off him. He can hyper-control his own environment (a small cell) and the prison will impose structure and clear boundaries for behaviour.

I don't think he'll enjoy it. But I think it may benefit him. Whether he'll remember any lessons learned when he's released, I don't know.

RBBM

That's pretty common for a narcissist actually. They're incredibly manipulative and attempt to control everyone and everything. The most successful are often high-powered CEO's and entrepreneurs - but even they often have chaotic, 'out of control' social lives - multiple divorces, poor relationships with peers, family, and their kids, etc. It's gotta be like a juggler keeping 20 balls up in the air - their whole being is based on lies, manipulation, control and a fragile facade - and eventually a ball, or ten, are going to fall. No one can tell a narcissist where they're going wrong because narcissists are never wrong. Never. And...if someone does call them out for their bad behaviour, a narcissist will adapt their behaviour to be more covert (like less physical, but more emotional or financial abuse) or the narcissist will simply cut ties - totally - with their detractors.

Personally, if I'm right with my armchair dx, I don't see OP learning any lessons from this experience. Not killing Reeva, not facing trial, not prison, and not post-prison restrictions. OP, if he is a narcissist, will always feel he is 'above' any punishment and is being maliciously persecuted. I'm not an optimist when it comes to NPD - they're highly resistant to treatment as nothing is wrong with them - it's the rest of the world at fault. And in this case no treatment will even be available since apparently nothing is amiss. Um. Yeah. Okay.

In prison, I think he will adapt very well - that's what narcissists do out of necessity for survival - they adapt constantly and become highly skilled at it.

JMO and FWIW

ETA: An appeal! :confetti:

 

[Paul_1900]

Thanks for link to the social/probation officer story!

It's just amazing news about witness AV (Annette Vergeer). She applied for permission from her state employers to consult with OP and write a report privately -but then did it before they had said yes or no! She put her whole social work career on the line for Oscar, only to have the judge ignore her evidence anyway, because it was so bad. I wonder if she still thinks it was the right thing to do?

I think she was wrong in so many ways, a disgrace to her profession too ( and all her colleagues doing good work ! ). She s/b moved to some other position where she won't be able to cause so much harm. I saw on her FB page she has 2 daughters, probably raised all by herself - otherwise I'd be more harsh in my opinion.

 

[Interested Bystander]

You are right


I also remember reading about that point some time ago, i.e. right of state to appeal on questions of fact. SA law commission worked on it, suggestions for changes on law were implemented subsequently in many countries, referring to suggestion made by that said SA commission. . . but ironically up to date NOT implemented in SA law :sigh: . . . would make life much easier for Nel and his team


Cannot find article, but saved a link to document. No idea if latest status though.
http://www.justice.gov.za/salrc/dpapers/dp89_prj73_agappeal_2000.pdf

This is the report I have been reading. I think it the same work but slightly longer. It probably contains nothing extra of note. As you say for whatever reason it seems not to have been implemented in SA Law yet it was written 14 years ago! I too do not know if this was the last time it was discussed. Hopefully this will now change.

http://www.justice.gov.za/salrc/reports/r_prj73_appeal_2000dec.pdf

 

[sleuth-d-]

Removal of Reeva's bag from the crime scene was not acceptable or respectful.

just wondering, did mrs steenkamp ever make any comment about receiving this bag from aimee? [or anyone on the scene that night?]

 

[ColonelMustard]

There are many many other funny pictures with artistic value! It's worthwhile to look at them!!! (See "Flems Photoshop".)

Thanks SO much FG.

It feels REALLY good to laugh, now that we now it's appeal city for OP.

 

[Cherwell]

Am I right in thinking that they are going to appeal the Seekoei case at the same time as the other matters? Perhaps that's why this is bypassing Masipa and going straight to the Supreme Court?

 

[foxbluff]

I'm so excited about the appeal that I'm babbling on and on here.

My cat's so upset that I'm not paying any attention to her that she keeps trying to pull my laptop over backwards, which, given these exceptional developments, is highly annoying.

I told her that, instead, she needs to make herself useful and suggested she go in the kitchen and make me a pot of Mexican cocoa.

I'm still waiting.



...think I hear her snoring in the other room.

:floorlaugh: Perhaps Soozie will let you borrow the "owned by a cat" thingy?

O/T - Though I'm Southern, mint juleps are a tad too strong for me... straight bourbon with a snip of mint iirc. Instead, I'm sitting on the veranda sipping chardonnay.

 

[ColonelMustard]

I think she was wrong in so many ways, a disgrace to her profession too ( and all her colleagues doing good work ! ). She s/b moved to some other position where she won't be able to cause so much harm. I saw on her FB page she has 2 daughters, probably raised all by herself - otherwise I'd be more harsh in my opinion.

MASIPA HAS A FACEBOOK PAGE?!

She's hipper than I thought.

Probably also beat Queen Elizabeth to Twitter!

 

[mister happy]

RBBM

That's pretty common for a narcissist actually. They're incredibly manipulative and attempt to control everyone and everything. The most successful are often high-powered CEO's and entrepreneurs - but even they often have chaotic, 'out of control' social lives - multiple divorces, poor relationships with peers, family, and their kids, etc. It's gotta be like a juggler keeping 20 balls up in the air - their whole being is based on lies, manipulation, control and a fragile facade - and eventually a ball, or ten, are going to fall. No one can tell a narcissist where they're going wrong because narcissists are never wrong. Never. And...if someone does call them out for their bad behaviour, a narcissist will adapt their behaviour to be more covert (like less physical, but more emotional or financial abuse) or the narcissist will simply cut ties - totally - with their detractors.

Personally, if I'm right with my armchair dx, I don't see OP learning any lessons from this experience. Not killing Reeva, not facing trial, not prison, and not post-prison restrictions. OP, if he is a narcissist, will always feel he is 'above' any punishment and is being maliciously persecuted. I'm not an optimist when it comes to NPD - they're highly resistant to treatment as nothing is wrong with them - it's the rest of the world at fault. And in this case no treatment will even be available since apparently nothing is amiss. Um. Yeah. Okay.

In prison, I think he will adapt very well - that's what narcissists do out of necessity for survival - they adapt constantly and become highly skilled at it.

JMO and FWIW

ETA: An appeal! :confetti:

Lance Armstrong comes to mind.. an extreme example.

 

[Paul_1900]

I remember it .. and I thought of it a few times over the past few days, too .. whoever said it may well have been right! Lux, I think?

Edit: .. gahhh .. I've done it again .. just seen it's already been answered!

Don't worry, we are all a bit excited today, no ?? :skip:

 

[jilly]

Someone upthread mentioned that the family must have been happy as CH was the best they could have hoped for.

Maybe, they were paying Roux to get him acquitted. I'm sure Oscar thought so!

Plus didn't Uncle Arnold say in one of his first on air musings right after the murder, something about, ..."if this even goes to trial."

Unrelated but related: Aunt Lois saying to Nel during the trial, "Shame. Shame on you."

Whatever's going on with them, we know they are sure that OP and their family are victims of it.

Yes....quite a reversal here compared to the family's hugging/smiling and yucking it up after the Verdict. They thought they had it in the bag.

 

[mister happy]

MASIPA HAS A FACEBOOK PAGE?!

She's hipper than I thought.

Probably also beat Queen Elizabeth to Twitter!

Not Masipa. It's the social worker witness with the Cruella hair.