PR interview

[rashomon]

I cannot access your photo. Can you tell me what it is? Thanks Why Nutt.

Solace, it is a photocopy of the original police report. It says verbatim:

Breakfast room: E 415 & E 417 [I suppose E = exhibit]
Pineapple bowl
Patricia and Burke's fingerprints
Glass on the table in North dining room
Burke Ramsey's fingerprints

It is a bit confusing since the North dining room is not the breakfast room (see floor plan in PMPT).

 

[rashomon]

You know, what has always cemented her guilt to me was the simple things she lied about. So your little girl was hungry when she got home after returning home from a party where she probably did not eat much. You gave her a simple snack of pineapple and milk in a bowl. Why lie about it? It is nothing that would surprise anyone, it's something many moms do.
The only reason I can think of for lying about something like that it that after the autopsy found the pineapple in JBR's digestive tract, it made the timeline a little more accurate between the time the fruit was eaten and the time of death. I think if the pineapple had never been mentioned, when shown the photo of the bowl/spoon/teabag glass on the table, she would have said "Sure, I gave her pineapple as a late night snack and must have forgot to put it away". She would have never made a link between the pineapple and the time of death on her own. I think she really DID forget to put it away, and was shocked when the pineapple was found in JBR. And then she had to deny even owning the bowl! Boy, this "inutruder" must have carried a steamer trunk into the house that night, with all the stuff he had to have brought with him!

By claiming that JB had been fast asleep when they got home, the Ramseys themselves shut the door to any innocent explanation as to why the pineapple got into her stomach. For when confronted with the pineapple evidence, they couldn't backpedal any more and had no choice but to stick to their original version. When concocting their story, they simply had forgotten about the pineapple and its evidentiary potential. Classic example of suspects getting trapped in the web of their own lies.

But why didn't the Ramseys admit JB was still awake when they got home? The reason is simple: like you said, DeeDee, JB snacking on pineapple at around 10 pm and dying an hour or so later narrows down the time line far too much to make any intruder scenario possible.
On getting home, not only did Patsy pack for the Charlevoix trip, she also got suitcases ready for a trip to Florida which was scheduled immediately after Charlevoix. This certainly took quite some time.
If we combine the pineapple evidence with an intruder scenario, this intruder must already have been in JB's bedroom while Patsy was still in the middle of packing suitcases. Totally absurd of course.
So they lied about the time line. They wanted to camouflage the fact that the rage attack on JB had happened one or two hours after they arrived home. They wanted to present a different picture: the family got home, everyone went straight to bed and many hours later, at dead of night, an intruder tried to 'kidnap' JonBenet ...

 

[Albert18]

By claiming that JB had been fast asleep when they got home, the Ramseys themselves shut the door to any innocent explanation as to why the pineapple got into her stomach. For when confronted with the pineapple evidence, they couldn't backpedal any more and had no choice but to stick to their original version. When concocting their story, they simply had forgotten about the pineapple and its evidentiary potential. Classic example of suspects getting trapped in the web of their own lies.

That sums up the pineapple question perfectly.

Looking back, I bet they could have kicked themselves for saying JB was asleep when they got home. This one proven lie alone should have caused this investigation to blow up.

My guess is JB died way too close to the time they arrived home and they had to be nervous about the coroner's time of death estimate. As it turned out, they had nothing to fear from Dr. Meyer.

 

[JMO8778]

By claiming that JB had been fast asleep when they got home, the Ramseys themselves shut the door to any innocent explanation as to why the pineapple got into her stomach. For when confronted with the pineapple evidence, they couldn't backpedal any more and had no choice but to stick to their original version. When concocting their story, they simply had forgotten about the pineapple and its evidentiary potential. Classic example of suspects getting trapped in the web of their own lies.

But why didn't the Ramseys admit JB was still awake when they got home? The reason is simple: like you said, DeeDee, JB snacking on pineapple at around 10 pm and dying an hour or so later narrows down the time line far too much to make any intruder scenario possible.
On getting home, not only did Patsy pack for the Charlevoix trip, she also got suitcases ready for a trip to Florida which was scheduled immediately after Charlevoix. This certainly took quite some time.
If we combine the pineapple evidence with an intruder scenario, this intruder must already have been in JB's bedroom while Patsy was still in the middle of packing suitcases. Totally absurd of course.
So they lied about the time line. They wanted to camouflage the fact that the rage attack on JB had happened one or two husr after they arrived home. thy wanted to present a different picture: the family got home, everyone went straight to bed and many hours later, at dead of night, an intruder tried to 'kidnap' JonBenet ...

then JR lied in DOI (no surprise,of course), about PR getting the suitcases ready for the trip during xmas day.

 

[why_nutt]

then JR lied in DOI (no surprise,of course), about PR getting the suitcases ready for the trip during xmas day.

When you look at the state of John Andrew's bed, and the supposed "packing" that Patsy had done in preparation for the cruise, the evidence does tend not to lead in the direction of Patsy's having done much of it, certainly not enough to be able to just come back from Charlevoix, grab the suitcases, and leave again for the trip. Here is a crime scene photo of John Andrew's room where Patsy was "packing":

What I see there is just a bunch of what looks like JonBenet's clothing (a pink bathing suit, a fur-trimmed coat she was photographed wearing on December 22nd, a black and white checked outfit that appears to be a dress she wore in pictures taken when she was three or four), apparently randomly thrown on the bed with one small suitcase nearby, but not anywhere near what people would usually considered "packed" for a trip. If Patsy was spending any significant amount of time in the bedroom preparing for the trip, how does this picture show it?

 

[JMO8778]

When you look at the state of John Andrew's bed, and the supposed "packing" that Patsy had done in preparation for the cruise, the evidence does tend not to lead in the direction of Patsy's having done much of it, certainly not enough to be able to just come back from Charlevoix, grab the suitcases, and leave again for the trip. Here is a crime scene photo of John Andrew's room where Patsy was "packing":

What I see there is just a bunch of what looks like JonBenet's clothing (a pink bathing suit, a fur-trimmed coat she was photographed wearing on December 22nd, a black and white checked outfit that appears to be a dress she wore in pictures taken when she was three or four), apparently randomly thrown on the bed with one small suitcase nearby, but not anywhere near what people would usually considered "packed" for a trip. If Patsy was spending any significant amount of time in the bedroom preparing for the trip, how does this picture show it?

It doesn't;I figured JR had his reasons for saying PR was doing the packing in the big kids' rooms on xmas day.And the part in DOI where PR says JR liked to use soft sided bags for the clothes bc that made it easier to pack them on the plane sounds like bull to me...sounds like she had a few garbage bags with clothes thrown in them and was trying to say those were the luggage.So it doesn't seem she packed much at all;hadn't gotten to it yet,and the murder occured bf she was able to finish packing.

 

[Ames]

When you look at the state of John Andrew's bed, and the supposed "packing" that Patsy had done in preparation for the cruise, the evidence does tend not to lead in the direction of Patsy's having done much of it, certainly not enough to be able to just come back from Charlevoix, grab the suitcases, and leave again for the trip. Here is a crime scene photo of John Andrew's room where Patsy was "packing":

What I see there is just a bunch of what looks like JonBenet's clothing (a pink bathing suit, a fur-trimmed coat she was photographed wearing on December 22nd, a black and white checked outfit that appears to be a dress she wore in pictures taken when she was three or four), apparently randomly thrown on the bed with one small suitcase nearby, but not anywhere near what people would usually considered "packed" for a trip. If Patsy was spending any significant amount of time in the bedroom preparing for the trip, how does this picture show it?

The suitcase and the clothes, I believe...are also part of the staging. I don't think that Patsy got to pack anything that night. So, after JB's death and the ransom note...she went into JAR's bedroom, threw a little suitcase on the bed, and just started grabbing clothes and throwing them in the suitcase....I am SURE she was panicked and in a frenzy. She had to do this, so it would fit their trip story. I believe that they had a trip planned, but...I just don't believe that Patsy ever got around to packing...because of Christmas, and the parties.

 

[Ames]

It doesn't;I figured JR had his reasons for saying PR was doing the packing in the big kids' rooms on xmas day.And the part in DOI where PR says JR liked to use soft sided bags for the clothes bc that made it easier to pack them on the plane sounds like bull to me...sounds like she had a few garbage bags with clothes thrown in them and was trying to say those were the luggage.So it doesn't seem she packed much at all;hadn't gotten to it yet,and the murder occured bf she was able to finish packing.

I agree...IF she ever packed at ALL.

 

[JMO8778]

I agree...IF she ever packed at ALL.

true,there weren't suitcases lined up to go beside the door..I wonder what she did on xmas day bf going to the White's,besides coloring her hair? looks like not much,maybe just doing some laundry to take on the trip,since the housekeeper wasn't there? Seems the gown and the blanket were recently washed and dried,and stuck together due to static cling.If that was JB's fav gown,I'm guessing she was going to pack it for the trip.(and maybe the blanket to take along on the plane trip?)

 

[BBB167893]

Well, we all know there was a LOT of info given to the Rs and their lawyers that shouldn't have been.

Isn't that the truth!

 

[DeeDee249]

Albert 18, you're right about that coroner's report. Looking back on his actions the night of the 26th, you can see he spent only 10 minutes with JBR in the house. Of course, the coroner's first contact with the decedent is to pronounce them dead, even when that fact is very obvious. This is a legal procedure also. BUT I have rarely heard of a coroner who skipped the procedure of trying to determine the time of death with a liver stab to record core temperature and testing the vitreous matter of the eye for potassium levels. The autopsy mentions the degree of rigor mortis in the arms and legs at the time of autopsy, more than 30 hours after the murder. It was already beginning to dissipate in the arms, and rigor passes off in the same way as it begins: the smaller muscles first. I believe the rigor in the arms was described as "mild" compared to the legs. But rigor can be affected by the ambient room temperature and humidity for one, and also by the physical activity of the deceased just before death (like if she had been screaming, hysterical, trying to run away, etc.) , the type of clothing worn, and whether they had a fever or normal body temperature. TOD in a case like this is SO important because it appears to have occurred very close to the time when the family had returned home and JRB was alive and the family may not have been soundly asleep. This doesn't give an "intruder" much time to commit this complicated crime, write the note, and leave the house, especially excluding the time PR was awake and doing last-minute preparations for the trip. What would that leave? an hour? To enter the home (or emerge from hiding), wake/grab JBR, make her comfortable enough with you to have a pineapple snack with you, fashion the garrot, strangle her slowly, assault her, bash her skull in when she screams (hoping her parents didn't hear it), drag her into the wine celler after discovering there WAS a wine cellar, writing a 3-page note and placing it carefully on the exact stairs where it would have to be known the parents would see it, and...well, it all kinds falls apart, doesn't it?
Unless it's been redacted from the report, nowhere is a TOD recorded. What an opportunity was lost that night. One of many....

 

[Dru]

Wow, thanks so much for the fingerprint report! I've heard lots of people say that the prints on the pineapple bowl were PR's, but didn't know if there was real proof of that.

That, to me, makes her whole "Did you check the bowl for prints?" question completely insane. She had to know her prints were on the bowl! What, was she hoping one of the gazillion friends she'd invited over for the 'kidnapping' was going to move the bowl for her and she'd have some other innocent to throw under the bus?

Why on EARTH didn't she come up with an innocent explanation for her prints? She must have known the subject would come up. Even an, "Oh, I put the pineapple in that bowl the day before and stuck the whole thing in the fridge," answer would have made more sense than the whole, "Gosh, no! I've never seen that bowl before! I have one just like it though! But it's only for steamed carrots! We only use it on Easter! What's it doing out at Christmas with pineapple in it?! And that's the wrong spoon!....." garbage she was serving up on a platter (but not that platter, officer, that's not mine...)
:banghead:
Aaaargh!

 

[JMO8778]

Wow, thanks so much for the fingerprint report! I've heard lots of people say that the prints on the pineapple bowl were PR's, but didn't know if there was real proof of that.

That, to me, makes her whole "Did you check the bowl for prints?" question completely insane. She had to know her prints were on the bowl! What, was she hoping one of the gazillion friends she'd invited over for the 'kidnapping' was going to move the bowl for her and she'd have some other innocent to throw under the bus?

Why on EARTH didn't she come up with an innocent explanation for her prints? She must have known the subject would come up. Even an, "Oh, I put the pineapple in that bowl the day before and stuck the whole thing in the fridge," answer would have made more sense than the whole, "Gosh, no! I've never seen that bowl before! I have one just like it though! But it's only for steamed carrots! We only use it on Easter! What's it doing out at Christmas with pineapple in it?! And that's the wrong spoon!....." garbage she was serving up on a platter (but not that platter, officer, that's not mine...)
:banghead:
Aaaargh!

That is sooo true,and it reminds me of her also asking the question 'was there any blood on the drapes?' Now why on earth would she ask those odd q's if they didn't pertain to evidence she was worried about?? I'm betting her attorneys admonished her for asking questions at all..they probably told her to keep as quiet as possible and only answer the questions that were asked of her as neutrally as possible.(and that part she did a good job of).Although she came off as an amnesic idiot who didn't even recognize her own household items and couldn't ever remember a darn thing other than exactly what she wanted to.(Or, rather she came off as a huge liar).People with selective memory problems often are trying to hide something..the truth.

 

[Toltec]

My WOW reaction was in reference to Burke's fingerprints being on the drinking glass! BlueCrab theorized that Burke drank tea in the breakfast room while JonBenet ate pineapple.

The clothes on the bed look as if Patsy grabbed handfuls of clothes from JonBenet's drawers and closet and dumped them on JAR's bed. Some of the clothes described JB's previous worn them...did they still fit her?

Was Patsy going to pack a fur coat for the trip on the Disney Big Red Boat?

 

[Ames]

true,there weren't suitcases lined up to go beside the door..I wonder what she did on xmas day bf going to the White's,besides coloring her hair? looks like not much,maybe just doing some laundry to take on the trip,since the housekeeper wasn't there? Seems the gown and the blanket were recently washed and dried,and stuck together due to static cling.If that was JB's fav gown,I'm guessing she was going to pack it for the trip.(and maybe the blanket to take along on the plane trip?)

Go back and read PR interview....that pink Barbie nightgown that was found near her body was NOT her favorite...or so says Patsy. She says in the interview, that JB had a pair of Jeannie looking pj's....I guess she means with the flared bottoms with elastic around the ankle...that were her favorite.

 

[DeeDee249]

It's always been the simple things PR lied about that make me see her as guilty. The bowl was part of her set of dishes. At least one R said as much in one interview when shown a photo of the bowl and asked if the bowl was familiar. Of COURSE her prints might be on it. It was probably taken in and out of the fridge several times. So to deny even owning it, means there is a good reason why. It's distancing herself, but in such a way as to seem unbelievable. It's just as silly as their saying "Yeah, we have a flashlight just like that but THAT one isn't ours." Or "That is a water glass". As if by saying that, no one would ever use it for anything else. Like a spent tea bag. To me, PR always seemed to use "magical thinking". Her saying something made it reality.

 

[icedtea4me]

It's always been the simple things PR lied about that make me see her as guilty. The bowl was part of her set of dishes. At least one R said as much in one interview when shown a photo of the bowl and asked if the bowl was familiar. Of COURSE her prints might be on it. It was probably taken in and out of the fridge several times. So to deny even owning it, means there is a good reason why. It's distancing herself, but in such a way as to seem unbelievable. It's just as silly as their saying "Yeah, we have a flashlight just like that but THAT one isn't ours." Or "That is a water glass". As if by saying that, no one would ever use it for anything else. Like a spent tea bag. To me, PR always seemed to use "magical thinking". Her saying something made it reality.

Yeah, it's like one can imagine Patsy thinking "You buffoon! Don't you know the difference between a water glass and a tea glass? Do you honestly expect us to drink tea out of a water glass? How positively gauche!"


-Tea

 

[JMO8778]

It's always been the simple things PR lied about that make me see her as guilty. The bowl was part of her set of dishes. At least one R said as much in one interview when shown a photo of the bowl and asked if the bowl was familiar. Of COURSE her prints might be on it. It was probably taken in and out of the fridge several times. So to deny even owning it, means there is a good reason why. It's distancing herself, but in such a way as to seem unbelievable. It's just as silly as their saying "Yeah, we have a flashlight just like that but THAT one isn't ours." Or "That is a water glass". As if by saying that, no one would ever use it for anything else. Like a spent tea bag. To me, PR always seemed to use "magical thinking". Her saying something made it reality.

I think it indicates mental illness.It's not even logical thinking.

 

[JMO8778]

Yeah, it's like one can imagine Patsy thinking "You buffoon! Don't you know the difference between a water glass and a tea glass? Do you honestly expect us to drink tea out of a water glass? How positively gauche!"


-Tea

lol,or put the tea bag on the side of the glass...SHE does not make tea that way..so I guess the 'intruder' did it while he was thinking about making grits? LOL

 

[Ames]

yes odd that she denied it,she could have said they must have gotten there from when she put the bowl up.but...she denies the bowl was theirs.

Did she deny it in another interview...that the bowl was theirs? Because in this interview she says its theirs...

12 TRIP DEMUTH: Do you recognize the bowl?
13 PATSY RAMSEY: Yeah.
14 TRIP DEMUTH: Where do you keep them?
15 PATSY RAMSEY: In the kitchen.