Raven Says . . .

[Jenifred]

That comment bugs me too lauriej. He's got no faith. He's dirty. He's a liar. At best he's scum.

 

[juliagoulia]

Of course he didn't mention what he had faith IN...if he meant himself, that is believable. But talk about building your house upon the sand!

 

[golfmom]

Warning Graphic:

http://www.wagnerandson.com/oj/cause.htm

I'm research stab wounds and attacks and came across an analysis of a knife attack ... something sort of struck home in the following description:

"But, the deep stab wounds could not have been administered while Goldman was bent over (sites of penetration were inaccessible), and so we see that there must have been two phases, the butchery attack against his neck and the stabbing attack, when he was no longer folded over, but may have been "opened up" to lie flat on his back. From the small amount of blood in the internal cavities (and the large amount of blood on his left pants leg), the butchery phase came first."

Interesting huh? Could it follow that after the attack to Janet's neck (and defensive wound to her hand) could the murderer have been the one to roll her over and stab her chest to ensure that she was indeed dead.

IF LE can determine that the chest wound was in fact that last wound Janet received, his own words damn him as the murderer as well. She would not have been in a position on her knees slumped over to receive that final injury, unless the murderer rolled her over. Oh wait? Raven rolled her over ... could it be that he's the murderer !?!?!?!

 

[golfmom]

Working the information on the autopsy has been one of the most emotionally draining sleuthing I have ever done. Usually I leave this area of sleuthing up to others, but I feel called to really understand what happened.

I've googled myself silly and looked and read things ... well, I would rather have not. That said, I feel that my theory and my research is solid.

1. The attack was directly head on. I believe this was the time that Janet's finger was injured. It was a small and ineffective defense to the attack that was yet to come..

2. I know that we've discussed the possibility of the attack occuring from behind. I've research knife wounds and feel confident based on the autopsy description that this wound (backward and downwards) could only have been inflicted face to face. I have a diagram at the link ... WARNING again graphic: http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/Golfmom/autopsyj.jpg

3. Janet drops to her knees. The neck wound is fatal and leaving 2 liters of blood within Janet's right chest cavity.

4. The murderer is worried that she survived the knife attack, perhaps he heard her death rattle, so he rolls her over and stabs her one final time in the chest ... aiming for the heart. This injury passes backwards and slightly to the left. Cutting the pericardium but leaving behind no significant amount of blood! The doctor states that this injury has the potential to be fatal. But it isn't. Why not? Because Janet was already dead when she received the final blow to her chest.

Remind me again, who rolled Janet over?

 

[Moxie]

Working the information on the autopsy has been one of the most emotionally draining sleuthing I have ever done. Usually I leave this area of sleuthing up to others, but I feel called to really understand what happened.

I've googled myself silly and looked and read things ... well, I would rather have not. That said, I feel that my theory and my research is solid.

1. The attack was directly head on. I believe this was the time that Janet's finger was injured. It was a small and ineffective defense to the attack that was yet to come..

2. I know that we've discussed the possibility of the attack occuring from behind. I've research knife wounds and feel confident based on the autopsy description that this wound (backward and downwards) could only have been inflicted face to face. I have a diagram at the link ... WARNING again graphic: http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/Golfmom/autopsyj.jpg

3. Janet drops to her knees. The neck wound is fatal and leaving 2 liters of blood within Janet's right chest cavity.

4. The murderer is worried that she survived the knife attack, perhaps he heard her death rattle, so he rolls her over and stabs her one final time in the chest ... aiming for the heart. This injury passes backwards and slightly to the left. Cutting the pericardium but leaving behind no significant amount of blood! The doctor states that this injury has the potential to be fatal. But it isn't. Why not? Because Janet was already dead when she received the final blow to her chest.

Remind me again, who rolled Janet over?

I feel sick. I think we know who rolled Janet over. God help him.

 

[golfmom]

I feel sick. I think we know who rolled Janet over. God help him.

Moxie, I think not only the time of death but Raven's own statement is the nail in his coffin. Personally, I believe it's just a matter of time before he's arrested. LE is weaving a powerful case of premeditation. Forensics, the gmail information, and why Janet's friends were so worried for her safety will all make an iron-clad case as to Raven being the murderer.

 

[juliagoulia]

Thank you for all of your grim research GM. As sad as it is, I think I understand how it happened. What you laid out makes a lot of sense.

I pray it is only a matter of time before we are talking about a trial and not just an investigation!

 

[LTUlegal]

I think you nailed it, GM. Gosh, I sure wish they'd hurry up & get him. I'm with terminatrixmasterravenbaterhater on this one! :behindbar

I think you've pretty much laid it all out there and nearly wrapped it up in a pretty bow...how could anyone ever claim this case was tried in the media, we've had to get it all done on our own!

 

[snapple]

This makes absolute sense GM. Most times my stomach is in knots just thinking about the senerio that night. Thanks for doing all the emotionally hard work. :clap: I think you hit it right on.

 

[Jenifred]

Remind me again, who rolled Janet over?

Exactly! I think that this is spot on. Raven had to invent a reason for Janet not to be on top of the biggest blood stain.

And I've said there has to be a reason why there wasn't blood in her chest cavity. Even a third year medical student could have told you that there should have been a lot of blood present there too (thanks, dear). But was there? NO.

Can't you hear the deep raspy voice singing:
"He did a bad, bad thing.....He did a bad, bad thing...."

 

[Meech]

Working the information on the autopsy has been one of the most emotionally draining sleuthing I have ever done. Usually I leave this area of sleuthing up to others, but I feel called to really understand what happened.

I've googled myself silly and looked and read things ... well, I would rather have not. That said, I feel that my theory and my research is solid.

1. The attack was directly head on. I believe this was the time that Janet's finger was injured. It was a small and ineffective defense to the attack that was yet to come..

2. I know that we've discussed the possibility of the attack occuring from behind. I've research knife wounds and feel confident based on the autopsy description that this wound (backward and downwards) could only have been inflicted face to face. I have a diagram at the link ... WARNING again graphic: http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y288/Golfmom/autopsyj.jpg

3. Janet drops to her knees. The neck wound is fatal and leaving 2 liters of blood within Janet's right chest cavity.

4. The murderer is worried that she survived the knife attack, perhaps he heard her death rattle, so he rolls her over and stabs her one final time in the chest ... aiming for the heart. This injury passes backwards and slightly to the left. Cutting the pericardium but leaving behind no significant amount of blood! The doctor states that this injury has the potential to be fatal. But it isn't. Why not? Because Janet was already dead when she received the final blow to her chest.

Remind me again, who rolled Janet over?

Great details and attentive search GM :clap:

JUSTICE WILL PREVAIL!

CAN YOU HEAR ME NOW!

 

[golfmom]

All I can figure out as to why he said he found her on her knees, it was the first thing that popped into his head when asked how he got blood on himself.



Another important clue is that they didn't keep Janet's pants. If the pants had substantial blood on them, as they should have if her chest wound had occurred before she ended up on her knees, they would have kept the pants.

 

[terminatrixator]

Raven, you have been heard!:furious:

 

[lauriej]

gm...........i know it's been said...........but i just want to add my own on this...
...what a TOUGH assignment you carried out.............the research, while relaying it to the actual events ...'this ain't t.v...'

...janet has become someone that we've come to know and care about..........i don't believe for a moment that the wounds didn't happen exactly as you've detailed..........

...raven is SUCH a freakin' coward to add in the 'on her knees' part, solely to explain away the transfer of blood...........( and then to have the nerve to give hs mumbo-jumbo crap about WHY she was on her knees..)
...it's so pathetic.........

...RAVEN...........thanks for the "on the knees" stuff...............there are SO many people , daily, on their knees..............praying for swift justice............
...and it's coming...................coming soon..........

 

[OriginalJerseyGirl]

All I can figure out as to why he said he found her on her knees, it was the first thing that popped into his head when asked how he got blood on himself.

If this attack was head on, the blood on him would have been obvious spatter. So I don't think that this is something that just popped into his head. IF this was a head-on attack, I think that he was fully aware of the blood spatter, and probably held her and moved her deliberately to try to disguise the spatter with more blood as if he had been trying to save her. I'm hoping that forensics will be able to tell but I worry since the scene was still so fresh when LE arrived. If you cover wet blood with more wet blood, would you notice the underlying spatter pattern? It seems to me that you would not. Unless the spatter underneath was dry before placing wet blood on top. But I could be wrong - any blood evidence experts among us?

I still believe that the neck wound could have been from behind, if Janet was on her knees or lying on her side, and the perp was standing behind and above her.

Another important clue is that they didn't keep Janet's pants. If the pants had substantial blood on them, as they should have if her chest wound had occurred before she ended up on her knees, they would have kept the pants.

Do we know for sure that they would keep her pants if there was blood on them? The scene sounds such that there should have been blood all over her. Maybe they only kept the shirt because of the knife cuts in it?

 

[OriginalJerseyGirl]

...raven is SUCH a freakin' coward to add in the 'on her knees' part, solely to explain away the transfer of blood...........( and then to have the nerve to give hs mumbo-jumbo crap about WHY she was on her knees..)
...it's so pathetic.........

Reasons Raven could have claimed Janet was on her knees:

1) Needed to be able to explain why he moved her because he was afraid it would be obvious that he had been somehow involved in the murder scene.

2) He needed to make people believe that he didn't know that she was pregnant.

3) He needed to be able to say that he kissed Kaiden and so made up a story about her being on her knees because she was in her normal "bad cramps" position. Of course, being in that position on the office floor in the dark should have seemed odd, IMO, but he wants us to believe that he noticed her in that position on his way to kiss Kaiden but didn't think it necessary to check on her.

4) Some combination of the above.

 

[golfmom]

It's the description of the knife wound as well as the angle that has me convinced that it's a front overhand attack. After slogging through tons of websites, I learned that when wounds are inflicted from the front, the result is usually short and angled. Also, if Janet was attacked from behind and this was the first injury she sustained, there would have probably been no defensive wounds. The neck wound was such that she would have been unable to defend herself after receiving.

.......

JG, I just have to believe that if the blood splatter pattern was important on the pants that LE would have kept them. Personally, I have a hard time with LE releasing the pants under any circumstances, but trying to imagine them turning those pants over to the family soaked in Janet's blood, makes my blood run cold.

......

I do think Raven had blood on him that he needed to explain that night. Did he come up with the best explanation ... uhhhhh noooo ... LOL ... As his own words continually hang him. I look forward to staying tuned to watch the rest of his disasters unfold.

 

[Marstan]

I have been curious about the blood spatter on the perpetrator also, if there was any. Since the time of death and the phone call to 911 was in minutes there wouldn't have been time for any of the blood to dry thus the perpetrator's clothes may have actually been soaked and by moving the body, the original spatter was covered up. I wonder if LE checked the sinks in the bathroom for blood trace? The perp could have washed off any splatter on his arms, face, and legs before LE arrived.

If someone else committed the crime other than the perp himself, wouldn't there have been footprints or something leading out from the bedroom other than Raven's - gosh maybe Raven is guilty - ya think?

 

[golfmom]

"He went upstairs and saw her on the floor in a kneeling position. This was not unusual because it's the position she took whenever she had real bad cramps."

Does anyone know if Janet was in Yoga? This position is called Balasama or child's pose. One of the interesting restrictions is that you shouldn't perform this pose if you are pregnant. Another interesting point is that it would be IMPOSSIBLE to NOT GET BLOOD ON YOUR PANTS IF YOU WERE STABBED IN THE CHEST!

http://www.yogajournal.com/poses/475.cfm

Benefits
Gently stretches the hips, thighs, and ankles
Calms the brain and helps relieve stress and fatigue
Relieves back and neck pain when done with head and torso supported

Contraindications/Cautions
Diarrhea
Pregnancy
Knee injury: Avoid Balasana unless you have the supervision of an experienced teacher.

 

[OriginalJerseyGirl]

I wonder if LE checked the sinks in the bathroom for blood trace? The perp could have washed off any splatter on his arms, face, and legs before LE arrived.

If I'm remembering correctly, they did take one swabbing from the master bathroom floor. Other than that, I don't recall seeing any other mention of that room. And in the kitchen, they swabbed the countertops but I saw no mention of the sink or drain. Of course there are the couple of mysteriously missing items from the search warrant, and who knows what those could have been.