Rebecca Zahau Wrongful Death/ADAM SHACKNAI FOUND RESPONSIBLE #5

[Lezah]

I found it, Lezah.

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/s...on-2&p=14010185&highlight=letter#post14010185

What a superstar! Thankyou so much for your time IzzyBlanche

Snippet -

The state attorney general has declined a request by Jonah Shacknai to review San Diego County law enforcement findings about the deaths of his girlfriend and his 6-year-old son.

In a letter sent Wednesday to Shacknai, Chief Asst. Atty. Gen. Dane R. Gillette said Shacknai's request does not fit the criteria set for the attorney general's involvement in such a review.

"Please accept our sincere condolences for your tragic loss and feel free to contact me if you have any questions," Gillette wrote, on behalf of Atty. Gen. Kamala Harris.

The office launches such reviews, Gillette wrote, if there is a conflict of interest on the part of local law enforcement, if a local agency has requested assistance or if there are allegations of malfeasance.

In his request, Shacknai said he continues to support the Coronado Police Department, San Diego County Sheriff's Department and San Diego County medical examiner in their conclusion that Max died from an accidental fall and that Rebecca Zahau committed suicide.

NB - K_Z appeared to snip the quote for the original post - which I recall was from an attorney. I will continue to try to find the original post, but this is the thrust of the issue to which I was referring.

Thanks again for your help finding this IzzyBlanche, I really appreciate it.

 

[MrsThreadgoode]

Sorry if this has already been mentioned, but I couldn’t find the answer by a quick scroll through the latter part of this thread. [emoji20]

IIRC, the day following the jury verdict, the jurors were to return to discuss punitive damages.

Can anyone tell me the outcome of that?

Thank you very much!


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[MyBelle]

I posted that I recall one of verified attorneys on the Board advised a while ago that he suggested that the letter was sent to the wrong legislative arm, so in his opinion Harris had no jurisdiction to open an investigation, even if she wanted to.

I mentioned that I recalled that the attorney suggested that JS would likely be well aware her office could take no action when he wrote the letter, as he ( JS) was an attorney and knew the legal system well enough to know this.

The full written response was not widely published apparently ( I had not seen it personally until you posted the link, for which I thanked you)

I mentioned that this was my opinion of the original posters info to the best of my recollection.

I felt it was probably a Publicity stunt.

After seeing the letter, I tend to agree with my previous comments, in that IMO it’s very carefully worded, and omits any reference to juresdiction.

So overall, a publicity stunt IMO.

( edited to add I will do my best to find the link for you to the original post, and perhaps the team on here can help me if they also recall the post please?

With all due respect, the AG's office is not a "legislative arm." It is the top law enforcement agency in the state and they did have jurisdiction but only under certain circumstances. If Shacknai or Zahau's had accused the SDSO of malfeasance, the decision may have been different.

The AG letter to Shacknai, after their review, determined that those circumstances did not apply. Shacknai responded that he still had full confidence in the law enforcement agencies, SDSO and ME. The case remains in the jurisdiction of those agencies. Anne Bremner also contacted the AG's office by email but I'm not aware if she followed it with a formal request.

“I will be respectfully submitting to you a formal and detailed response to Mr. Shacknai’s letter (which was not copied to me nor to my clients),” Bremner wrote.

“In the interim, I want to be on record that we are not requesting a review. Rather, we are requesting a full independent INVESTIGATION into the circumstances surrounding Rebecca’s tragic death – with full input from us, our investigators and our experts.

https://radaronline.com/exclusives/...a-attorney-general-independent-investigation/

 

[Lezah]

With all due respect, the AG's office is not a "legislative arm." It is the top law enforcement agency in the state and they did have jurisdiction but only under certain circumstances. If Shacknai or Zahau's had accused the SDSO of malfeasance, the decision may have been different.

The AG letter to Shacknai, after their review, determined that those circumstances did not apply. Shacknai responded that he still had full confidence in the law enforcement agencies, SDSO and ME. The case remains in the jurisdiction of those agencies. Anne Bremner also contacted the AG's office by email but I'm not aware if she followed it with a formal request.

https://radaronline.com/exclusives/...a-attorney-general-independent-investigation/

Thank-you for sharing your opinion in more detail.

For clarity, when I used the term ‘legislative arm’ I was not quoting from the original posters language, as the post was from ‘my best recollection’ as I explained, and not verbatim.

This was my own terminology and I apologize if this was not clear from my post, I would never be so presumptuous as to attempt to reword an expert on the law, as was the original poster.

However, that aside, you have not persuaded me with your reasoning, and I still agree with my original opinion, based on the first posters comments, that this was likely a publicity stunt, conceived to give the illusion of concern to the public IMO.

We shall both just have to agree to disagree. but I appreciate you sharing your own opinion.

( I will still try and find the original post to share and review)

EDITED TO ADD ( after reviewing your reply in further detail...

From your reply -

“ ...The AG letter to Shacknai, after their review, determined that those circumstances did not apply....”

It appears you do concur that the AG letter confirmed that a review of the AG’s office did not meet the criterion for a review......which was my principle point....

Just my opinion...




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[MyBelle]

Thank-you for sharing your opinion in more detail.

For clarity, when I used the term ‘legislative arm’ I was not quoting from the original posters language, as the post was from ‘my best recollection’ as I explained, and not verbatim.

This was my own terminology and I apologize if this was not clear from my post, I would never be so presumptuous as to attempt to reword an expert on the law, as was the original poster.

However, that aside, you have not persuaded me with your reasoning, and I still agree with my original opinion, based on the first posters comments, that this was likely a publicity stunt, conceived to give the illusion of concern to the public IMO.

We shall both just have to agree to disagree. but I appreciate you sharing your own opinion.

( I will still try and find the original post to share and review)


Just my opinion...




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I look forward to seeing that link! I'm fairly confident no attorney on this forum ever posted that the AG's office did not have jurisdiction which is what you claimed. Until I see the link, I continue to challenge your claim.

 

[Lezah]

I look forward to seeing that link! I'm fairly confident no attorney on this forum ever posted that the AG's office did not have jurisdiction which is what you claimed. Until I see the link, I continue to challenge your claim.

That’s fair enough IMO

 

[MyBelle]

You know, I read that and then apparently blocked it from my memory because it was so despicable. Call me crazy, but I don't think anyone outside the defense bubble will take kindly to listening to them continue to disrespect the dead victim, especially anyone who watched the presser with KG, Mary and her husband. To know what the Zahaus have been through for 7 years, and then to hear the defense call the recreation of her hanging body a "sex doll" is beyond the pale. I'd suggest they stop talking and writing.

I'm wondering if Sitrick & Co. didn't try to talk Webb off the ledge before he went in front of the cameras and then issued his statement? If not, they aren't much of a reputation management firm.

Mr. Greer admitted it was a sex doll and said it cost $8,000. Not sure why Mr. Webb is being criticized by stating a fact which he intends to bring up on appeal. The manufacturer of the doll has an age restricted website. I won't post link because it is a pornographic site.

Greer said out of court that the figure, actually a sex doll, cost $8,000 to purchase and alter to look more like Zahau.

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/courts/sd-me-zahau-trial-20180405-story.html

 

[Tortoise]

Sorry if this has already been mentioned, but I couldn’t find the answer by a quick scroll through the latter part of this thread. [emoji20]

IIRC, the day following the jury verdict, the jurors were to return to discuss punitive damages.

Can anyone tell me the outcome of that?

Thank you very much!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Here you are Mrs Threadgoode

[FONT=&amp]Jurors were asked to return to San Diego Superior Court one last time Thursday for possible further proceedings to determine whether they would award punitive damages to the Zahau family.

[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]C. Keith Greer, attorney for Zahau's mother, Pari Zahau, told the judge she would not seek punitive damages against Shacknai, 54, who works as a tugboat captain on the Mississippi River.

[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]With that, Judge Katherine Bacal formally dismissed the jurors. They left through a secure hallway and did not talk to the attorneys or reporters.

[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Later, asked why he didn't seek punitive damages, Greer said, "There was already enough."

http://www.latimes.com/sd-me-zahau-trial-20180405-story.html


[/FONT]

 

[Myvice]

I have to agree with Lezah that the letter was a PR stunt. If nothing more, it countered any idea the public may have had that JS would get any special attention because of his wealth. Many people wouldn't realize he got exactly what he wanted, an end to the investigation of his brother. I find it interesting that the response letter ended up in the hands of the media where it could be shared with the public.

 

[MyBelle]

Thanks for your insider insight. Now I’m curious who the “minder” was. Based on his behavior at the presser, AS certainly needs one! He is a loose cannon!

I’ve asked this before, but do you personally have any idea why Webb in particular was hired to defend AS? This case is so far removed from Webb’s normal defense of huge corporations. Did he know JS from work with Medicis or something? He clearly thought the case was a slam dunk. Ha!

I think Mr. Webb was hired because this case was tried in the court of public opinion for years and the verdict was anticipated. He's considered one of the top litigators in the country and I think very capable of winning on appeal. JMO

 

[questfortrue]

Guys, Can anyone give me any suggestions of examples of cases I can read into where suicide as COD was recategorized to undetermined ?

~RSBM~

The Wall case didn’t go from suicide to indeterminate, but rather evolved from a suicide theory to a homicide prosecution. The question about such cases is excellent on many levels.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2992217/Utah-doctor-guilty-murder-death-ex-wife.html

First one sees how families will fight to reopen investigations. What struck me in the case of the Utah doctor, John Brickman Wall, was that it would have stayed within the police conclusion of suicide had Pelle von Schwedler Wall, son of the victim, not fought to reopen the investigation. He spent his entire inheritance fighting for justice for his mother.

Secondly, there seem to be similarities to defense strategies. Wall’s ex-wife was found drowned in the bathtub, huge amounts of Xanax in her system. From the defense came the statements: “The defense said the home revealed signs of a troubled woman who died trying to calm herself with medication.” And Wall’s lawyers claimed there was “no proof he [Wall] was in von Schwedler's house.”

Lastly, in reference to the Wall homicide, Pelle also armed himself with an analysis by Richard Walter, regarded as one of the top profilers in the country and a founder of the Vidocq Society. More on Walter in another comment.

 

[questfortrue]

BBM

Bully boys indeed. This case has certainly attracted a similar crowd over the years. Such ugliness with these two. No class, just sounding like street fighters. Adam’s head high, jutting jaw, puffed chest, moving from side to side like a boxer...and the t-shirt to show his “physique”...a real tough guy. Nothing has changed since his “gotta girl...hanged herself” 911 call laced with profanity. Pure anger and arrogance.

I loved how Adam kept interrupting Webb, showing disrespect. And Webb kept desperately stressing how “normal” Adam and Mary are. All their friends in Memphis? So? Many murderers live a faux normal life, dude.

Not one ounce of class, like...”We understand the Zahau’s grief over their tragic loss. However, we expect to be vindicated in the future.” Nope. And no surprise there.
JMO

LOL Not to divert from present discussion, but your comments on the 'bully boys' was too perfect to pass by. This is one fast moving thread so forgive the 'back-diversion.'

You expressed so well my impression of this tough guy. I want to mention Richard Walter again because of his vast history with violent crime. His interviews have presented a type of crime scene which reflects a component of angry retaliation. If it’s a sexual crime it may also include elements of what Walter calls the “three D’s”, referring to inflicting a sense of dread, making certain she is dependent on whatever he chooses to do, and lastly degrading her physically and emotionally.

Additionally, paraphrased from Walter: After leaving a killing what police do not understand, according to Walter, is that a perpetrator may have a “sense of well-being and a sense of relief and a sense of charm, because they've just had 50 pounds of emotional baggage taken off their shoulders.” In the polygraph, Adam asserted with sureness and confidence he did not need a lawyer and that he had nothing to hide. My :twocents:

 

[Tortoise]

I think Mr. Webb was hired because this case was tried in the court of public opinion for years and the verdict was anticipated. He's considered one of the top litigators in the country and I think very capable of winning on appeal. JMO

I'm surprised that one of the top litigators in the country doesn't appear to have a grip on the concept of circumstantial evidence.

Or maybe he does, and he fully intends to mislead the public when he announces "there wasn't a speck of evidence that Adam Shacknai had anything to do with the death of Rebecca Zahau".

He must have conveniently forgotten his motion for nonsuit failed.

 

[Lilibet]

I think Mr. Webb was hired because this case was tried in the court of public opinion for years and the verdict was anticipated. He's considered one of the top litigators in the country and I think very capable of winning on appeal. JMO

Oh, I agree that Mr Webb is a top litigator (and special prosecutor before that). He has impeccable credentials. This just seemed like an unusual case for him to take on, so I was curious how he got involved. Since posting I’ve been informed that his firm has done work for JS and his former company, so that connection made sense. I don’t mean that in a negative way.

Even though the public opinion majority never thought Rebecca committed suicide, the jurors were confined to the evidence presented and I would think they honored that commitment. I realize we may disagree on that. Speaking personally, I wasn’t sure which way the verdict would go, even though I felt Greer presented a strong case. Juries are hard to predict. I got the impression that Webb was blindsided by the verdict and didn’t anticipate it. He’s very capable and we will have to see how the appeal goes.

 

[tootsat441]

Totally agree, this was a very calculated move by JS. Here is CBS News comments about it.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/why-ce...th-of-girlfriend-is-a-strategic-masterstroke/

 

[Morag]

“I’m standing tall. I’m not worried about these posers. They got away with something once. They got lucky. They say it’s better to be lucky than good, They got lucky one time. I don’t think they’re going to get lucky again.”

He seems to think the Zahau family is lucky. “Posers”? Whatever does he mean by that? I don’t think I’ve ever heard an adult use that word.

 

[MyBelle]

The Wall case didn’t go from suicide to indeterminate, but rather evolved from a suicide theory to a homicide prosecution. The question about such cases is excellent on many levels.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2992217/Utah-doctor-guilty-murder-death-ex-wife.html

First one sees how families will fight to reopen investigations. What struck me in the case of the Utah doctor, John Brickman Wall, was that it would have stayed within the police conclusion of suicide had Pelle von Schwedler Wall, son of the victim, not fought to reopen the investigation. He spent his entire inheritance fighting for justice for his mother.

Secondly, there seem to be similarities to defense strategies. Wall’s ex-wife was found drowned in the bathtub, huge amounts of Xanax in her system. From the defense came the statements: “The defense said the home revealed signs of a troubled woman who died trying to calm herself with medication.” And Wall’s lawyers claimed there was “no proof he [Wall] was in von Schwedler's house.”

Lastly, in reference to the Wall homicide, Pelle also armed himself with an analysis by Richard Walter, regarded as one of the top profilers in the country and a founder of the Vidocq Society. More on Walter in another comment.

FYI: The Wall case went from indeterminate to homicide, thanks to the son's efforts. Plus, all along police said the death was suspicious. That's not happened in the Zahau case where both the LE and ME conclusions still stand.

A medical examiner ruled she died from drowning as well as a fatal amount of Xanax but said he wasn’t sure if it was a homicide or suicide. Police called the death suspicious but didn’t arrest Wall until April of this year.

https://www.twincities.com/2013/10/03/slc-pediatrician-ordered-to-stand-trial-on-murder/

 

[MyBelle]

I'm surprised that one of the top litigators in the country doesn't appear to have a grip on the concept of circumstantial evidence.

Or maybe he does, and he fully intends to mislead the public when he announces "there wasn't a speck of evidence that Adam Shacknai had anything to do with the death of Rebecca Zahau".

He must have conveniently forgotten his motion for nonsuit failed.

I'm confident in Webb's grasp of the law and in his memory.

 

[MyBelle]

Totally agree, this was a very calculated move by JS. Here is CBS News comments about it.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/why-ce...th-of-girlfriend-is-a-strategic-masterstroke/

Yes and I agree. It was a brilliant strategic legal move!

 

[justice be served]

Totally agree, this was a very calculated move by JS. Here is CBS News comments about it.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/why-ce...th-of-girlfriend-is-a-strategic-masterstroke/

Thank you for posting this and welcome to WS! It is pretty obvious what the undercurrent of this author points to. Here, reader, look over at this shiny red object instead of learning what the search warrant shocks were and Adam’s inconclusive poly. JS’s reputation management company are so transparent in my mind. I do not think they give enough credit to how smart their audience is. Kind of reminds me of SDSO treating the public the same way.