Rebecca Zahau Wrongful Death/ADAM SHACKNAI FOUND RESPONSIBLE #5

[Lilibet]

I'll continue to be baffled why Mr. Webb was supposed to demonstrate anything at all. This was a wrongful death lawsuit, not a criminal trial and his client was the defendant and the burden of proof rested totally on the plaintiff. That said, Mr. Greer also was not present and yet the Judge allowed a salacious re-creation in his closing. I'll continue to question if that really is allowed and we'll just have to wait and see if the appellate court agrees with Mr. Webb. Unless, the Judge intervenes before then, of course.

BBM

Mr Greer’s re-creation was based on physical evidence (rope length, etc) and Adam’s own description in the 911 call, particularly his claimed need to get on a table to cut Rebecca down...shown to be unnecessary by the recreation. IMO, JMO, MOO, etc.

Using a naked, lifelike mannequin for this re-creation/visual aid in this particular setting is not “salacious” in the minds of normal people. Not even close. Such word usage is your opinion stated as fact with no disclaimer as required, and is inflammatory, inaccurate and insulting to Mr Greer and the Judge who “allowed” the recreation. IMO, JMO, MOO, etc.

Definition:

[FONT=&amp]If you describe something such as a book or joke as [/FONT][FONT=&amp]salacious[/FONT][FONT=&amp], you think that it deals with sexual matters in an unnecessarily detailed way.
[/FONT]
More at link or Google:

https://www.collinsdictionary.com/us/dictionary/english/salacious

I see by your last sentence that you are apparently still expecting and hoping for a mistrial based on juror misconduct as happened in the case you mentioned earlier? (Link below) If my interpretation of your earlier post is accurate, it’s perhaps understandable that you’d hope and/or expect juror misconduct, but juries are all different, and you may well be disappointed. And you may want to rethink what you seem to have implied. The jury system is fundamental to our justice system. While there are human flaws, to hope that someone among these 12 good citizens has been guilty of misconduct seems to be a wish that the jury system is broken (at least in a case your side loses.) I find that to be very disturbing. IMO, JMO, MOO, etc.

Link:

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/s...I-FOUND-RESPONSIBLE-5&p=14037487#post14037487

 

[BBL]

I have seen 3’“recreations” of the wrist lashing and knot but not a single example among them approached the elaborate knot that was used on RZ.

1. SDSO
2. Defense expert
3. ABC News investigation with retired NYPD detective

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/video/retired-nypd-detective-examines-womans-death-case-worth-53478931

None of these attempted recreations achieved a knot similar to the one found on Rebecca.

I completely agree. Taking it a step further, no where have we seen a complete recreation. We've seen a few demos of how the knots were tied, but whta about the rest?

I want to see an example of one of these knot experts demonstrate -without practicing 50-60 times,

1. Tying the knot around the bed
2. Tying their feet together with the exact same intricate knot tied very tightly
3. Gagging themselves
4. Tying their hands behind their back with the SAME tight knots
5. Getting to the balcony while feet tied, gagged, hands tied behind their back..... all while leaving no footprints

Let's see that SDSO!

 

[questfortrue]

Update: Zahau Attorney Submits New Files to Investigators

April 10, 2012

Snip- ""In the Rebecca Zahau case, submissions have been made to the AG and DA. On behalf of her family, thank you for your support," the post read.

Bremner responded to follow-up questions via text message, saying that the attorney general will not review the case until the District Attorney also has been consulted.

"The AG won't act until we have gone to the DA first," she wrote.

https://patch.com/california/coronad...-investigators"
[FONT=&amp]
[/FONT]

Thank you, Lash, for all the references regarding Bremner’s attempts to shake some action out of the CA AG. I confess I’ve a bad habit of simply scrolling past comments which seem more argumentative than contributing to further discussion. But, FYI, to anyone interested in the State Bar RPC (Rules of Professional Conduct) for lawyers in CA and in other states, it is a violation of the RPC to ‘lie’ within a trial or outside ‘extra-judicially’. While investigators and police are permitted to lie to a suspect, attorneys are strictly prohibited from this behavior, and the repercussions for violating this can be harsh. (http://www.calbar.ca.gov/Attorneys/...s/Rules-of-Professional-Conduct/Current-Rules ) [SUB][/SUB]
Of course, we’ve all witnessed the carefully constructed attorney comment meant to mislead or influence public opinion. But that’s another topic.

 

[Verboten]

Well did Robert Chisnall not even learn to tie his own shoes then?

Poster is apparently privy to all trial proceedings, but forgot these things:
--Testimony by Philpott that it was the totality of the knots that made it complex,
--Decision to deny nonsuit for Wrongful Death by judge states, choosing which knot is important
--Testimony by Chisnall it took dozens and dozens of tries (IIRC, 50 to 60 was the number) to practice the
demonstration of how Rebecca would have tied her wrists (as Tortoise points out, odd for such a simple knot that even a bird could tie)

JMO

 

[screecher]

What I would give to have been a thread in JS's shirt when he gave his brother and Webb a verbal thrashing after watching the fiasco of that presser.

Alas, I'll never know :cry:

 

[Mica]

Long article. Worth a read.

Questions, theories, opinions abound after Zahau wrongful death verdict

>>Snip

While he faces no criminal charges, he’s still being labeled a killer.

“I don’t take it personally because it is so ridiculous,” Shacknai said in an exclusive interview with the San Diego Union-Tribune. “I’ve got my doubts about whether the plaintiffs believe it. At the beginning of the trial, I didn’t have any animosity toward them because I thought they wanted to grieve publicly.”

Shacknai said that now, “my natural inclination of tolerance toward the plaintiffs has been challenged to say the least.”

>>Snip

Shacknai said he’s sure an appeals court will overturn the verdict.

Reflecting on the case two days after the verdict was handed down, he said he doesn’t think he made a mistake by testifying. He also said he looked forward to returning to work, where his boss has said he is welcome.

“This may be the only case where someone who was not charged is dragged into civil court, my attorney said,” Shacknai said outside a Little Italy ramen eatery with his girlfriend, Mary Bedwell.

“Our position is, a summary judgment should have been granted and it should never have gone to trial.”

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/courts/sd-me-zahau-death-analysis-20180407-story.html

 

[Lilibet]

More from the San Diego Union Tribune link in above post....

Greer said footing his $250,000 costs of the trial and paid experts nearly bankrupted his firm.

———————————
Webb said:

“If I had to do it over again, I would try the case the same way.”

 

[justice be served]

Long article. Worth a read.

Questions, theories, opinions abound after Zahau wrongful death verdict

>>Snip

While he faces no criminal charges, he’s still being labeled a killer.

“I don’t take it personally because it is so ridiculous,” Shacknai said in an exclusive interview with the San Diego Union-Tribune. “I’ve got my doubts about whether the plaintiffs believe it. At the beginning of the trial, I didn’t have any animosity toward them because I thought they wanted to grieve publicly.”

Shacknai said that now, “my natural inclination of tolerance toward the plaintiffs has been challenged to say the least.”

>>Snip

Shacknai said he’s sure an appeals court will overturn the verdict.

Reflecting on the case two days after the verdict was handed down, he said he doesn’t think he made a mistake by testifying. He also said he looked forward to returning to work, where his boss has said he is welcome.

“This may be the only case where someone who was not charged is dragged into civil court, my attorney said,” Shacknai said outside a Little Italy ramen eatery with his girlfriend, Mary Bedwell.

“Our position is, a summary judgment should have been granted and it should never have gone to trial.”

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/courts/sd-me-zahau-death-analysis-20180407-story.html

None of these quotes of Adam sounds even slightly like him that I have yet heard. Seems way to well delivered compared to what we have seen of him speaking either in testimony or press conference. Sitrick & Co at work again I imagine. IMO

 

[justice be served]

More from the San Diego Union Tribune link in above post....

Greer said footing his $250,000 costs of the trial and paid experts nearly bankrupted his firm.

———————————
Webb said:

“If I had to do it over again, I would try the case the same way.”

Bless Greer from the bottom of my heart............

 

[Verboten]

More from the San Diego Union Tribune link in above post....

Greer said footing his $250,000 costs of the trial and paid experts nearly bankrupted his firm.

———————————
Webb said:

“If I had to do it over again, I would try the case the same way.”

Then there's this jewel from Adam:

“It’s disheartening to have gone through this trial by fire with the Sheriff’s Department and come out OK,” he said in the recent interview. “Meanwhile, you have a plaintiff’s attorney and people on the plaintiff’s side whose salacious insights would be at the bottom of the ‘CSI’ script reject pile.”

 

[justice be served]

The focus has been so much on Dan Webb and that his legal expertise has not been on Wrongful Death cases. Thought I would look at the other 8 lawyers. My source is the State Bar of California as to their present status of employment:

David Elsberg, Selendy & Gay, Complex Commercial Litigation (he is the dark-haired gentleman that sat at defendant’s table) https://selendygay.com/people/david-elsberg/

Robb C. Adkins, Winston & Strawn, former federal prosecutor, white collar, regulatory defense, head of litigation for the firm. https://www.winston.com/en/who-we-are/attorneys/adkins-robb-c.html

H. Allen Black, Winston & Strawn, DC Office. Cannot find him in the CA State Bar as licensed there. Practices Maritime Law (interesting). https://www.winston.com/en/who-we-are/attorneys/black-h-allen.html

Krista M. Enns, Winston & Strawn, Anti-Trust, UCL, Privacy. She also sat at the defense table most of the time. https://www.winston.com/en/who-we-are/attorneys/enns-krista-m.html

Ryan R. Fick, Shows as “inactive” with CA State Bar. Formerly with Grimm, Vranjes, McCormick & Graham?

Drew Robertson, now L.A. County Attorney, Litigation. Formerly with Winston & Strawn.

Mark Vranjes, Grimm, Vranjes, McCormick & Graham, Wrongful Death. This is the only Wrongful Death specialty of the 8! https://www.gvgllp.com/mark-vranjes/

Seth Weisburst, Winston & Strawn, Complex Commercial Litigation. https://www.winston.com/en/who-we-are/attorneys/weisburst-seth.html

My Recap (IMO): So, of this likely multi-million dollar defense team, only one of the 8 has wrongful death experience? I guess Adam could claim that his defense team was not qualified? Just kidding.

 

[justice be served]

Then there's this jewel from Adam:

If Adam said these quotes, IMO, they were given to him. He just doesn't talk (or think) that coherently frankly. MOO

 

[Verboten]

If Adam said these quotes, IMO, they were given to him. He just doesn't talk (or think) that coherently frankly. MOO

Agree!

 

[screecher]

None of these quotes of Adam sounds even slightly like him that I have yet heard. Seems way to well delivered compared to what we have seen of him speaking either in testimony or press conference. Sitrick & Co at work again I imagine. IMO

If Adam said these quotes, IMO, they were given to him. He just doesn't talk (or think) that coherently frankly. MOO

Yes. Reading that article and what he was quoted as saying....my first thought...WTH? Is not Adam's choice of word usage.

Just more bungling of TPTB.

 

[wyatt]

If Adam said these quotes, IMO, they were given to him. He just doesn't talk (or think) that coherently frankly. MOO

My thoughts, exactly.

 

[Imp]

Then there's this jewel from Adam:

Yes, a jewel:

“It’s disheartening to have gone through this trial by fire with the Sheriff’s Department and come out OK,” he said in the recent interview. “Meanwhile, you have a plaintiff’s attorney and people on the plaintiff’s side whose salacious insights would be at the bottom of the ‘CSI’ script reject pile.”

#1 - "Trial by fire"? He had an attorney on speed dial, a quickie interview with LE, an inconclusive polygraph, and a ticket home the same or the next day. And that's his idea of a "trial by fire"?

#2 - "Salacious insights" worthy of the "CSI script reject pile." Say what? Me thinks the literary genius might want to dial it back a bit. :facepalm:

 

[Imp]

None of these quotes of Adam sounds even slightly like him that I have yet heard. Seems way to well delivered compared to what we have seen of him speaking either in testimony or press conference. Sitrick & Co at work again I imagine. IMO

FWIW, I believe this interview was with the same "journalist" who referred to the mannequin as a "sex doll" in an earlier article.

 

[DeDee]

Frankly, I admire Greer more because he had the mannequin made. It’s a perfect and detailed visual aid, so that the jury could see what was and wasn’t involved in cutting Rebecca down. Having the lifelike mannequin made is only being questioned and demeaned by the defense because it didn’t help their case at all. High-powered Webb must really be upset to be outsmarted by a low-key San Diego attorney.

Agree with this, Lilibet. During the Hot Car Death of Cooper Harris in ATL, the Prosecution Team used a toddler size mannequin that was constructed close to Cooper's height and weight. Then, they strapped the mannequin into the original car seat which was strapped into his father's vehicle that held Cooper on the day of his death.

It was a highly effective, and convincing, tool in demonstrating how very close Cooper was to his father, the driver. Cooper had outgrown his car seat so much that the top of his precious head was higher than the top of the car seat. Using the mannequin clearly demonstrated these facts.

It may have made a difference in the amount of shock and awe, during the closing of this civil trial, if the mannequin had been dressed. But, why dress the doll when Rebecca was bound nude? That point is relative and not subjective.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

I notice the author repeats the unproven point that Rebecca was found hanging. And the "sex doll" wording.

Bias much?

JMO.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

I don't think continuing to bash the jury is helping the defense's side at all.