Ron C. #4

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:applause::applause:

, because no one who wants Junior--and hopefully Haleigh--safe can afford to allow their vision to become so tunneled as to dismiss the possibility that what some are alleging may in truth have happened. For starters the ONLY person who can possibly know whether Crystal's own account of dad's abuse behind closed doors is true or false is CRYSTAL. Secondly she is not the only one who is reporting dad's violence or abuse (neighbor AmandaK eg frequently heard what she described as abusiveness by dad). And third it seems there is inconsistency between the explanations offered by dad eg for an incident at school and the injuries that resulted. And for all of these reasons, it is always best to err on the side of caution where any child's safety is concerned.

A parent who receives what they believe are mounting credible reports of abusiveness toward his or her children has not only the right but an implicit and obvious duty to protect those children--and to act on their behalf. We've crucified this same mother and others for being remiss or not doing enough earlier. When in the past she lacked the means ie was at a disadvantage w/out resources or representation; and because the abuse experienced or witnessed by Crystal during her marriage had been directed toward or previously limited to her, does not mean that w the perspective of time, as more facts and reports emerge which give cause for concern for the children (not the least of which is one child vanishing) in light of new reports or new information, and w finally some representation of her own, that she can or should not reconsider or fight to ensure Junior at least is protected from those risks. First we fault her for not doing more when she lacked proof and couldn't--but then turn around and fault her for doing something once she hears the reports and has the means.

In this situation it isn't "alienation" (if this is how one perceives it) that represents the most immediate threat or gravest danger to either child but the environment, now exposed, from which Junior's sister has already mysteriously "disappeared" from whom no one has since seen or heard for a month and a half. The lives of Mark Klaas, Ed Smart and other parents of children gone missing were subject to the same scrutiny and any threat or risk w/in Polly's or Elizabeth's eg environment would have been identified as well. If there are factors which turn out to have indeed put Haleigh and/or her bro at risk, those who dismiss this, as mere "mind games and trashing" IMO share that burden. What IS clear is that Haleigh's disappearance has brought to light many risk factors and concerns about the environment in which both she and Junior have been living. Of course he has nothing to say about mom now (about whom nobody is alleging any continued high risk behaviors) because he knows he is the one who insisted on taking the children from her and thus the one who bears full responsibility in this situation.

And as debs rightly points out, if there turns out to be no cause for concern or these reports lack merit, the investigation can quickly establish that too--in which case Junior can remain and Lord willing one day Haleigh brought back safe, to what is then a proven safe, stable, abuse- and drug-free home. But everyone should want those issues cleared up or addressed to eliminate continued or further risks to any child. JMO

:parrot:

Well said kiki and excellent points! I'd also like to add another dimension for consideration; Abuse allegations are often dismissed simply because the of the assumption that, in the case of divorced parents w/child(ren) & primary or shared custody/visitation issues,...the parent is attempting to alter the custodial arrangement with the child(ren) and thereby the claims are viewed as false. Oftentimes schools, healthcare providers,...become tunnel visioned - at the onset - simply because of their knowledge that the child's parents are divorced. Sadly many legitimate abuse claims are dismissed or overlooked because of this fact alone - simply because the child(ren) comes from a broken/divorced home. What will be more interesting, in my opinion, will be the "new and revised" statements and/or testimony made by Haleigh's physician, school, and any other "obligated to report by law" professionals or personnal NOW - now that the spotlight is on Haleigh/Past abuse claims and any and all past reports/ conclusions made will be scrutinized - watch closely because this is when/where we will see claims of "enlightenment upon reflection" by doctor's, the school,...and their excuse will be that hindsight is 20/20. I've seen this too many many times - when it's too late for the child(ren).
MOO
 
As many agreed. BoyTownMom pegged it. Thank goodness there are some here familiar enough w how the system works to evaluate the case history, articulate what disparities exist w/in the system, and someone to now thankfully speak up on Crystal's behalf. Like it or not, custody is awarded on a necessarily fluid, and ongoing basis subject to redetermination. Only those w something to fear including dad himself could have the least objection to this mother having at last competent counsel. Why, if I didn't know better, I might even think you were a tad bitter... JMO ;)

:parrot:

And what makes you think that Crystal's last lawyer is less competent than the one she has now? From what I've seen, this new lawyer has done NO GOOD for her client.
 
IMO Crystal was neither railroaded or a victim of the system. She HAD fair representation in the court. She had a lawyer...too bad if they weren't as good as Ron's lawyer.
And about the equal resources???? She could have gotten a job. No one was stopping her but herself.

editing myself as I was a bit rude to Tichad and didn't mean to be. sorry again!!

What is it called when a parent without custody of the kids doesn't return your children to you at the specified time? but instead takes them out of the country?

I still want to know why Ron didn't lose visitation but instead gained custody by pulling this little abduction of the children stunt?
 
editing myself as I was a bit rude to Tichad and didn't mean to be. sorry again!!

What is it called when a parent without custody of the kids doesn't return your children to you at the specified time? but instead takes them out of the country?

I still want to know why Ron didn't lose visitation but instead gained custody by pulling this little abduction of the children stunt?

First off, I did not claim to be a lawyer. There are other fields in family court besides lawyer.

Second off, can you link me to where you got your info from please.

Thirdly, HELLO?? I know what I am talking about
 
First off, I did not claim to be a lawyer. There are other fields in family court besides lawyer.

Second off, can you link me to where you got your info from please.

Thirdly, HELLO?? I know what I am talking about
Sorry, thought you were an attorney! my bad :doh:

Nancy Grace interview this week, Ron states (my summary) he took control of the children 5 months prior to the time he went to court to obtain custody. Crystal states she allowed Ron to take the kids for visitation and he never brought them back.
 
editing myself as I was a bit rude to Tichad and didn't mean to be. sorry again!!

What is it called when a parent without custody of the kids doesn't return your children to you at the specified time? but instead takes them out of the country?

I still want to know why Ron didn't lose visitation but instead gained custody by pulling this little abduction of the children stunt?

Actually Crystal didnt have custody of the children back then. Either of them did. When Ronald and crystal split up she took the children that doesnt mean in the eyes of the court she has custody.
 
Actually Crystal didnt have custody of the children back then. Either of them did. When Ronald and crystal split up she took the children that doesnt mean in the eyes of the court she has custody.

did they establish paternity prior to the split because they weren't married and usually in that situation the man doesn't have a legal right to the children until paternity has been established and he is granted visitation/custody.

He should have went about it all legally and not blindsided her by just taking off with the kids. just saying and moo
 
huh. I guess I heard them discussing OTHER complaints brought to them by OTHER people, not the school.
Thats what they say anyway:) Im actually interested to see what comes of it. Thats the good thing about lawyers they know how to spin things.
 
did they establish paternity prior to the split because they weren't married and usually in that situation the man doesn't have a legal right to the children until paternity has been established and he is granted visitation/custody.

He should have went about it all legally and not blindsided her by just taking off with the kids. just saying and moo
Actually it was never brought to court until Ronald filed for custody. So in the courts eye no one had custody. And from what I can tell crystal never filed anything after she left Ronald. But yes during court he would have to provide proof for full custody. Whether he blind sided her or not she agreed for him to take the children out of state. Once she agreed all bets were off so to speak.
 
This is what part of the problem is I think, someone mentions something and it is later correct but not everyone catches the correction. Ron did not abduct the kids and take them out of the country. Crystal gave Ron permission to take the kid to Texas and Mexico (refer to court documents) on return from the trip he had reason to believe she was using cocaine again and did not return the children, instead he did what any responsible part would do he filed for custody of the children. Had he returned the children knowing that she was possibly using cocaine and something happened to the children people would be all over him for being irresponsible and returning the children to her.

editing myself as I was a bit rude to Tichad and didn't mean to be. sorry again!!

What is it called when a parent without custody of the kids doesn't return your children to you at the specified time? but instead takes them out of the country?

I still want to know why Ron didn't lose visitation but instead gained custody by pulling this little abduction of the children stunt?
 
This is what part of the problem is I think, someone mentions something and it is later correct but not everyone catches the correction. Ron did not abduct the kids and take them out of the country. Crystal gave Ron permission to take the kid to Texas and Mexico (refer to court documents) on return from the trip he had reason to believe she was using cocaine again and did not return the children, instead he did what any responsible part would do he filed for custody of the children. Had he returned the children knowing that she was possibly using cocaine and something happened to the children people would be all over him for being irresponsible and returning the children to her.

It's nice to see someone else point out that when one parent hears something that could put the child in danger, that parent acts on it in the appropriate manner, like reporting it to the authorities! That is what Crystal is doing now.
 
Actually it was never brought to court until Ronald filed for custody. So in the courts eye no one had custody. And from what I can tell crystal never filed anything after she left Ronald. But yes during court he would have to provide proof for full custody. Whether he blind sided her or not she agreed for him to take the children out of state. Once she agreed all bets were off so to speak.

Mothers have custody of their children from birth, they don't have to legally obtain custody.
Ron had no legal right to even visitation and he didn't return them when he was supposed to. I just think his mom hired a sneaky attorney that advised Ron on how to work around the law to get those kids away from her. of course that's just moo
 
It's nice to see someone else point out that when one parent hears something that could put the child in danger, that parent acts on it in the appropriate manner, like reporting it to the authorities! That is what Crystal is doing now.

Yes, debs and when do people think is the best time to look into allegations of abuse? Now, next year ... or when people start telling you it is more than even you knew. I don't think one single member of this forum would hesitate to start efforts to secure this child's safety. May be too late for the other child, but can try to rescue the one remaining. jmo
 
This is what part of the problem is I think, someone mentions something and it is later correct but not everyone catches the correction. Ron did not abduct the kids and take them out of the country. Crystal gave Ron permission to take the kid to Texas and Mexico (refer to court documents) on return from the trip he had reason to believe she was using cocaine again and did not return the children, instead he did what any responsible part would do he filed for custody of the children. Had he returned the children knowing that she was possibly using cocaine and something happened to the children people would be all over him for being irresponsible and returning the children to her.

ok, well then lets say she gave 100% permission for him to take the kids out of the country (I don't want to be contentious here). He still had no legal right to keep the children when she said it was time to return them. If he had any real proof of her doing anything wrong... the legal course of action would be exactly what Crystal is doing now, turn her into child protective services and file for custody - not just take the child & never return it.

Child abductions happen every day, many good mothers abduct their daughters to try and prevent sexual abuse and guess what.... they still go to jail for doing it.

So what I've been trying and trying to say is why didn't he go to jail, but instead got legal custody....??? this proves to me she didn't have decent legal representation.
 
I have no problem if Crystal believes there is abuse for her report it to authorities and have it checked out. Investigating it does not require going to the national media, plastering pictures on the internet, it requires notifying the proper authorities and providing them with any information you have. Crystal has told so many different stories to the media that have since been proven not true, and conflicting statements it is really difficult to see that she has the childrens best interest at heart. It appears to be nothing more than a trash Ron mission, gain sympathy money, and get custody of JR in the process. MOO

Yes, debs and when do people think is the best time to look into allegations of abuse? Now, next year ... or when people start telling you it is more than even you knew. I don't think one single member of this forum would hesitate to start efforts to secure this child's safety. May be too late for the other child, but can try to rescue the one remaining. jmo
 
My point is he did take the legal action he filed for custody. I also would have to check Florida law but I do believe he would of had rights and it would not be legally considered kidnapping. If you read the court documents it states that she called the law on him after he had been back for a month or so and they told her they could not force him to give her the children he had just as much right to them as she did.

ok, well then lets say she gave 100% permission for him to take the kids out of the country (I don't want to be contentious here). He still had no legal right to keep the children when she said it was time to return them. If he had any real proof of her doing anything wrong... the legal course of action would be exactly what Crystal is doing now, turn her into child protective services and file for custody - not just take the child & never return it.

Child abductions happen every day, many good mothers abduct their daughters to try and prevent sexual abuse and guess what.... they still go to jail for doing it.

So what I've been trying and trying to say is why didn't he go to jail, but instead got legal custody....??? this proves to me she didn't have decent legal representation.
 
I have no problem if Crystal believes there is abuse for her report it to authorities and have it checked out. Investigating it does not require going to the national media, plastering pictures on the internet, it requires notifying the proper authorities and providing them with any information you have. Crystal has told so many different stories to the media that have since been proven not true, and conflicting statements it is really difficult to see that she has the childrens best interest at heart. It appears to be nothing more than a trash Ron mission, gain sympathy money, and get custody of JR in the process. MOO

Whether people like it or not, the national media is watching every move these people make. That means that things that would usually go QUIETLY through the system are flashed about. Crystal's attorney is putting DFS on notice because DFS has been called before and they have information that abuse has happened. Did anyone else get notices the last time she contacted DFS?? NO! The media wasn't there, that's why.
 
I have no problem if Crystal believes there is abuse for her report it to authorities and have it checked out. Investigating it does not require going to the national media, plastering pictures on the internet, it requires notifying the proper authorities and providing them with any information you have. Crystal has told so many different stories to the media that have since been proven not true, and conflicting statements it is really difficult to see that she has the childrens best interest at heart. It appears to be nothing more than a trash Ron mission, gain sympathy money, and get custody of JR in the process. MOO

He is faring much better with Crystal than he would with me. On a side note - this will probably end up as the clash of the titans - the Grandmothers. LOL!! I believe both of them work through their children in this case to achieve their own desires. jmo
 
IN MY OPINION based solely upon what is KNOWN by the court (records and by his own admission) regarding Mr. Cummings;
*This opinion is entirely and solely about RC's parenting> not in comparison to CS

1. Mandatory drug testing bi-weekly for 6 months> If the first 6 months are without incidence (test positives) > Following 6 months will be reduced to once per month. At the States discretion and if deemed necessary, unscheduled "without notice" tests may be performed at any time. Failure to comply will be an automatic assumption of guilt > further investigations will be initiated.

2. Mandatory attendance required a minimum of 2 AA or NA meetings weekly for 12 consecutive months > Signature of a senior program sponsor will be required for attendance verification, to be submitted to the state. (DCF,...)

3. Mandatory attendance required weekly Parents Anonymous for 12 consecutive months > Signature of a senior program sponsor will be required for attendance verification, to be submitted to the state. (DCF,...)

4. Mandatory Mental Health Counseling attendance required bi-weekly for 12 consecutive months > Fees for services will be based on a sliding-fee scale > The court/state IS NOT entitled to the confidential records pertaining to conversation(s) between RC and his therapist > the therapist will agree to uphold the law and manditorily report anything that falls within those standards > the therapist must submit to the state verification of RC's attendance.

5. No relations in any capacity are allowed with non-family member minors (18 years of age -) The court/state is limited in their ability to enforce this condition but in an effort to do so there will be 1 mandatory and pre-scheduled home visit monthly by an appointee of the state/court for 12 consecutive months > there will be 1 mandatory and unscheduled "without notice" visit monthly by an appointee of the state/court for 12 consecutive months > Denial of entry is not allowed and will result in an immediate investigation and possible remaindance of custodial rights.

6. The court/state will make a reassessment in the 10th month of the above forementioned parental requirements > RC will be notified of the pending scheduled date to appear in the matter of the reassessment results > RC will be given adequate opportunity to speak and to present information that is deemed relative by the court regarding the long-term well-belling and best interest of his child(ren) > There will be a final hearing scheduled in which RC will be required to appear and will be given the final decision of the court in this matter.


The above would be my requirements for RC based upon what I know thus far AND completely leaving Crystal (the biological mom) out of the equation altogether.
MOO
 
I am sorry but there is no reason whatsoever to put those photos on the internet, there is no reason whatsoever to have your attorney talking on national media about it. A simple we talking to the proper authorities would of done the trick. This will not help DCF with an investigation if anything it will hinder it. In reading comments about this all over the internet, the majority of comments just justify that DCF did the right thing initially by not claiming abuse and removing the children from Rons home.

Whether people like it or not, the national media is watching every move these people make. That means that things that would usually go QUIETLY through the system are flashed about. Crystal's attorney is putting DFS on notice because DFS has been called before and they have information that abuse has happened. Did anyone else get notices the last time she contacted DFS?? NO! The media wasn't there, that's why.
 
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