Ron C. #4

[Shelby77]

This isn't rumor, these are facts stated by both parties and found in the record. The children were living with Crystal, which made her the custodial parent, until he kidnapped them.

he manipulated the system. he didn't go through the proper legal channels. Any attorney would have told him the parent with physical custody at the court date will more than likely end up with custody. Just saying it was sneaky and underhanded. Tells me all I need to know about him, and really one could look at it as continued manipulation and emotional abuse of Crystal.

If he really had anything on Crystal (abuse/neglect/drugs) he should have turned her in to child protective services and filed for custody - not sweet talk her into a visitation/vacation he wasn't legally entitled to, then refuse to return the kids afterward.

Nobody, at any time in the documents that I read, including Crystal, used the word kidnap, in any way. So where did you find that "fact"? (In response to your first sentence)

Maybe, in your mind, Crystal had custody, but I, the judge, and apparently LE all disagree. The mother does not automatically get custody if nobody has yet filed. They are just as much his children and he had just as much right to them as Crystal. You may not like it but that's the way it works.

And to add, I think he handled the situation quite responsibly, and most certainly went thru every proper legal channel. Uh, the legal channel is the court system, is it not?

Looks like we will just have to agree to disagree on this one....and happy Friday!

 

[Indigo]

I think I am following you, but we do not have enough information on the other girl except a myspace comment and what Misty has said. Was the other girl using drugs? Did Ron know this was not true therefore took no steps to get custody of the baby? Was the other girl using drugs and Ron knew and did nothing? We simply do not know.

We know Crystal by her own admission used drugs during her preg, so Ron had every reason to believe she was using again.

But Ron didn't wait to file for determination of paternity before he filed for custody of Haleigh and Jr.

Date Docket Description
2005-09-16 001.PETITION TO DETERMINE PATERNITY AND RELATED RELIEF
http://www.mytvjax.com/media/news/1/3/e/13e1a8a0-e082-477f-9698-11a796f76a10/petineer.pdf


Yet, when asked if he had children other than Haleigh and Jr., Ron answered, "Possibly."

This indicates he didn't follow the same pattern.

 

[kidz110]

I know I feel like I am beating my head against the wall and I am sure you feel the same how about we share some Tylenol. My point is DCF has investigated and did not determine their was abuse and remove the children from Rons home. Like I said earlier I think any allegations of abuse should be investigated. Media is watching them that is correct, but media did not provide the pictures and media did not force the attorney or Crystal to go on national TV and make the allegations of abuse and show pictures.

Perhaps what caused them to provide the media with information and pictures is the fact that DCF didn't do anything before. Perhaps they feel that earlier complaints by Crystal weren't investigated as thoroughly as they should have been. By involving the media, the pressure is now on DCF to do a complete and thorough investigation. One child is already missing. I can understand Crystal's urgency. Would I do it this way--media and all? I don't know. I can say I wouldn't, but I've never been in her shoes. I don't believe I would curse at and hang up on the 911 operator, but people keep reminding me I've never been in RC's shoes either.

 

[nomoresorrow]

I respect your opinion mine is just different. There was nothing at the time of the custody hearing to indicate Ron was not a good parent and needed to be monitored.

I beg to differ. The information may not have been presented on 12/27/05 but it was raised shortly thereafter - therefore there was nothing stopping the court from reopening the case and taking a closer look IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE CHILDREN. Additionally it appears obvious to me that the magistrate placed a great deal of wieght on the mention of TN's employment with the sherriff's department, the fact that Ronald was living with her (or claimed to), thus giving the magistrate a false sense of assurance that TN was at least equally available to the children, especially in light of the care and health concerns portrayed by RC and relating to Haleigh's TS and Jr's heart murmur.
MOO
http://www.mytvjax.com/media/news/1/...0/petineer.pdf

 

[cuppy199]

Perhaps what caused them to provide the media with information and pictures is the fact that DCF didn't do anything before. Perhaps they feel that earlier complaints by Crystal weren't investigated as thoroughly as they should have been. By involving the media, the pressure is now on DCF to a complete and thorough investigation. One child is already missing. I can understand Crystal's urgency. Would I do it this way--media and all? I don't know. I can say I wouldn't, but I've never been in her shoes. I don't believe I would curse at and hang up on the 911 operator, but people keep reminding me I've never been in RC's shoes either.

Or maybe they did and didnt find anything. Clearly none of us know what DCF found and documented. With Haleigh missing I dont think they would have a problem getting DCF to look into it without going to the media. As for the 911 call I have heard alot worse then that and it wasnt any where near the nightmare that these parents are going throw.

 

[Busylady]

But we know nothing about the mother of the other possible child. There may have been nothing about her for Ron to be concerned with in regards to her care of the child therefore he did not pursue custody. We just do not know.

My understanding is when you file for custody the court requires paternity to be determined. This not something Ron went to court for and asked to do this to prove he is the father of Haleigh and RJ it was part of the requirements to obtain custody.

But Ron didn't wait to file for determination of paternity before he filed for custody of Haleigh and Jr.

Date Docket Description
2005-09-16 001.PETITION TO DETERMINE PATERNITY AND RELATED RELIEF
http://www.mytvjax.com/media/news/1/3/e/13e1a8a0-e082-477f-9698-11a796f76a10/petineer.pdf


Yet, when asked if he had children other than Haleigh and Jr., Ron answered, "Possibly."

This indicates he didn't follow the same pattern.

 

[Busylady]

Department of Child and Family Services. It is called different things in different areas. Some call it DCFS some DCF some CPS (Children Protective Services) and there are probably tons of others.

What does DCF stand for??

I will delete this as soon as someone gives a clue here.

 

[Tom'sGirl]

What does DCF stand for??

I will delete this as soon as someone gives a clue here.

Department of Children and Families

 

[Busylady]

I understand where you are coming from, but wouldnt the magistrate also place a great deal of weight on the fact that Crystals father was a deputy sheriff? (not sure what county or time period he was). TN was not a dispatcher even for Putnam County and Crystals father might not of been involved with Putnam County either.

Also if you look at the court dockets not just the custody papers - it was reviewed many times IIRC 2007 was the last entry.

I beg to differ. The information may not have been presented on 12/27/05 but it was raised shortly thereafter - therefore there was nothing stopping the court from reopening the case and taking a closer look IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE CHILDREN. Additionally it appears obvious to me that the magistrate placed a great deal of wieght on the mention of TN's employment with the sherriff's department, the fact that Ronald was living with her (or claimed to), thus giving the magistrate a false sense of assurance that TN was at least equally available to the children, especially in light of the care and health concerns portrayed by RC and relating to Haleigh's TS and Jr's heart murmur.
MOO
http://www.mytvjax.com/media/news/1/...0/petineer.pdf

 

[cuppy199]

I beg to differ. The information may not have been presented on 12/27/05 but it was raised shortly thereafter - therefore there was nothing stopping the court from reopening the case and taking a closer look IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE CHILDREN. Additionally it appears obvious to me that the magistrate placed a great deal of wieght on the mention of TN's employment with the sherriff's department, the fact that Ronald was living with her (or claimed to), thus giving the magistrate a false sense of assurance that TN was at least equally available to the children, especially in light of the care and health concerns portrayed by RC and relating to Haleigh's TS and Jr's heart murmur.
MOO
http://www.mytvjax.com/media/news/1/...0/petineer.pdf

TN working as a dispatcher for the sheriff makes her extra special and she can make things dissapear or make people life a living he!!. No way sorry thats just not gonna happen. She would be lucky to get someone out of a ticket. Im sure the court took into account that Ronald wouldnt always live with his mom. IMO you give these people way more power then they really have. The judges decided on what was before them whether anyone agrees or not that was their judgement.As for the other stuff I personally will wait and see what happens then I will will voice my opinion on it

 

[nomoresorrow]

(BOLD ME)

TN working as a dispatcher for the sheriff makes her extra special and she can make things dissapear or make people life a living he!!. No way sorry thats just not gonna happen. She would be lucky to get someone out of a ticket. Im sure the court took into account that Ronald wouldnt always live with his mom. IMO you give these people way more power then they really have. The judges decided on what was before them whether anyone agrees or not that was their judgement.As for the other stuff I personally will wait and see what happens then I will will voice my opinion on it

Where in my post did I make that claim OR for that matter, that assertion? Do please point that out to me because I truly do not appreciate your re-interpretation of my words with YOUR WORDS! I don't give people power either. MOO

 

[txsvicki]

I think it's odd that Ron was having a relationship with the other girl and possibly has another child. Why doesn't he want to know and why doesn't the other girl want him to know for sure and gave up any child support or help. Why doesn't anyone look at this possible angle.

 

[Busylady]

It is hard to sleuth the mother up here because we cannot mention her name or post links about her because her name has not been made public as being involved in this.

There have been discussions downstairs, which might answer some of your questions.

I think it's odd that Ron was having a relationship with the other girl and possibly has another child. Why doesn't he want to know and why doesn't the other girl want him to know for sure and gave up any child support or help. Is Ron slowly having his children taken from him and doesn't even realize what's going on. Why doesn't anyone look at this possible angle.

 

[CHICANA]

This isn't rumor, these are facts stated by both parties and found in the record. The children were living with Crystal, which made her the custodial parent, until he kidnapped them.

he manipulated the system. he didn't go through the proper legal channels. Any attorney would have told him the parent with physical custody at the court date will more than likely end up with custody. Just saying it was sneaky and underhanded. Tells me all I need to know about him, and really one could look at it as continued manipulation and emotional abuse of Crystal.

If he really had anything on Crystal (abuse/neglect/drugs) he should have turned her in to child protective services and filed for custody - not sweet talk her into a visitation/vacation he wasn't legally entitled to, then refuse to return the kids afterward.

I think if she would have filed for custody when she had them, she would have won.
She probably didn't think she had anything to worry about. I would have thought that based on his criminal record no judge in his right mind would have given him custody.

 

[Indigo]

But we know nothing about the mother of the other possible child. There may have been nothing about her for Ron to be concerned with in regards to her care of the child therefore he did not pursue custody. We just do not know.

My understanding is when you file for custody the court requires paternity to be determined. This not something Ron went to court for and asked to do this to prove he is the father of Haleigh and RJ it was part of the requirements to obtain custody.

Thanks, BusyLady. Here's the link for anyone who wants to read about the process:


http://www.flcourts.org/gen_public/family/forms_rules/983a.pdf

 

[nomoresorrow]

I didnt re- interpretation of your words those were my words. I just happen to use your quote. I didnt do it to upset you. If I did Im truely sorry if it affended you in any way that was not my tention.

I appreciate that cuppy. My reference to TN's job/occupation - specifically for the sheriff's department had/has nothing to do with her having some sort of priviledges such as you described - I know for a fact that the court looks extremely favorably, in custody matters, upon a parent (esp. a single parent) who has close ties with their parent(s) & the child(rens) grandparents whom are actively involved and participants in the child(rens) care. The mere mention of TN's employer "naturally" lended and further increased her credibility. (a natural assumption made by most that any individual that works within LE on some level MUST be of upstanding character) Perhaps I should have clarified that - on second thought - no perhaps about it, I should have clarified it initially and therefore I apologize. I'll work on that from here on.

MOO

 

[Shaymus at The Rock]

I understand where you are coming from, but wouldnt the magistrate also place a great deal of weight on the fact that Crystals father was a deputy sheriff? (not sure what county or time period he was). TN was not a dispatcher even for Putnam County and Crystals father might not of been involved with Putnam County either.

Also if you look at the court dockets not just the custody papers - it was reviewed many times IIRC 2007 was the last entry.

Was he a current or former deputy sheriff ? If former, how long ago was it ? What county was it ? How "related" is that sheriff's department to the ones in Putnam and Alucha (sp?) counties ? IMO, that's what you need to know.

 

[Shaymus at The Rock]

I think it's odd that Ron was having a relationship with the other girl and possibly has another child. Why doesn't he want to know and why doesn't the other girl want him to know for sure and gave up any child support or help. Why doesn't anyone look at this possible angle.

Good questions. IIRC, Misty alleged that the baby has problems due the birth mother's drug abuse during the pregnancy. Maybe that's why Ron isn't interested. If the mother's extreme drug abuse is on going, that may be why she doesn't want to contact authorities about child support. The victim here, that innocent little baby.

 

[abbra]

Is Ron collecting Social Security Benefits for Hayleigh because of her disability? If not is he the main source of income for his family or does he receive help from Social Services even though he works. ie: foodstamps, medicaid. I don't know if anyone asked this question before. If he was collecting disability for Hayleigh the department reviews cases and asks for expenditure lists to make sure the money was spent on Hayleigh- right down to the penny and parents better have receipts when they are audited.
Usually Social Services and Social Security Disability work in conjunction with each other and keep each other abreast of information regarding their clients even if the client is a minor. If a parent is appointed by the courts to be the childs guardian then these agencies make it a point to monitor the childs environment closely to make sure the parent is providing a proper clean environment, adequate food and clothing, decent child care and proper medical care. They also run backround checks on parents to make sure they don't have a criminal backround and are responsible enough to raise the child.

 

[Jenmrk]

My son has a very similar situation with his on/off girlfriend with my grandson, we are in Florida, the baby has my son's last name and he did sign the birth certificate, however in Florda that does not establish paternity, in order for my son to have ANY rights to his son he has to establish paternity, at this point she can keep him away from my son as she see's fit, if he were to take him right now and not give him back he would be charged with kidnapping, this comes straight from my sons lawyer and my husband is LEO here and he spoken to a few judges about this, my question is had Ron established paternity when he took the kids from Crystal and refused to give them back?