Sentencing and beyond- JA General Discussion #6

Welcome to Websleuths!
Click to learn how to make a missing person's thread

DNA Solves
DNA Solves
DNA Solves
Status
Not open for further replies.
Exactly- it's never pointed out how Jodi was never really a Mormon from the moment she was baptized onward. She immediately broke the chastity pledge and took Travis into areas of sex he had no idea about. Yes it's part of her manipulation, and it's that smug hypocrisy that makes me want to slap her face. She holds herself out to be the better Mormon, and although Travis fell down on the premarital sex part ( so he really shouldn't be judging other Mormons), she was the much bigger hypocrit and far worse Mormon. It's rarely pointed out that she only got baptized to snare him, and it bugs me so much that people like Dan Freeman supported her!
She'd already violated the premarital sex rule long before she was baptized. Did the Mormons who came to visit her know she was living/sleeping with Darryl or did they just think they could save her??



My memory about details relating to seems to be fading (I'm good with that ;)), but IIRC her baptism was actually delayed because the church had a problem with the fact she was still living with DB, no matter what lies she told the missionaries etc. about their arrangement.
 
I'm in the minority for sure. Maybe not even in the minority, I might be the only one.

I much prefer Blaney's interrogation style to Flores'.
Blaney - I don't believe you. You are lying. You need to start telling the truth.
Flores- I want to believe you, but I can't. What did Travis do to you? Something must have happened that day.

His style is too soft, too sympathetic, too chatty, too comforting even when he says she is lying.
No way I'm putting Flores down. Maybe his style works for many, but not for , IMO. I just don't like his interrogation method and strategy in general.


The minority of one you might represent is believing MM 100% a victim. :D
 
I'm not bored. I'm in total agreement that's what happened, about controlling her image, anyway. The takes the most she can get for as little as she can get away with. JM says Flores watched with Blarney and realized a woman's touch only made the more contemptuous. The for the most part barely acknowledged Blarney was there. But that media idea....yep, she glommed right on to it. That and the idea of writing a letter on the spot with which to torment TA's family.

I don't believe she was ever close to confessing, though. Not to Flores or Blarney, any more than she actually "broke down" on the stand that day under cross.

The near tears/crying/suddenly vulnerable and quivering and looking overwhelmed/just about to give you what you expect but wait....games are IMO all part of her tried and true tools of manipulation.







BBM

No offense intended, but is there something Freudian going on here in calling Blaney "Blarney?" Made me laugh... :)

From Merriam Webster:

Simple Definition of blarney:

"Talk that is not true but that is nice and somewhat funny and that may be used to trick you."

Could be there's something as simple as karma making itself known... LOL

ETA: Hope, I realize it was probably just auto-correct. Still funny, though. :)
 
The minority of one you might represent is believing MM 100% a victim. :D

I said that? My memory is also fading.

Yes. I do believe MM is a 100% victim of her manipulation. Haha, when I began watching the trial, I thought he was with her on June 4th and held a gun pointed at Travis while stabbed him. Never could believe one girl could do what she had done all by herself.
 
Blaney interrogating was a plan. They thought Jodi might open up to a female

Martinez says in the book that knowing Jodi now they wouldn't have had a female detective speak with her. They now know Jodi felt women were much harder for her to manipulate than men.
Flores let her chat with him, threw the fathoms of rope like Hope said, and he even answered her trivial question -where are you flying out of. He said Oregon. Not 'none of your business'.

And the result was a lot of lies out of her lying mouth for Martinez to use. That was good.

I wonder though, if he was more aggressive, didn't show her the pictures, didn't tell her he knew she was there, and she stuck to -I wasn't there, would we have had a totally different trial? A who-done-it trial even?

This is not what Martinez wants me to do. Looking back and think what if.:notgood:
 
BBM

No offense intended, but is there something Freudian going on here in calling Blaney "Blarney?" Made me laugh... :)

From Merriam Webster:

Simple Definition of blarney:

"Talk that is not true but that is nice and somewhat funny and that may be used to trick you."

Could be there's something as simple as karma making itself known... LOL

ETA: Hope, I realize it was probably just auto-correct. Still funny, though. :)


Thanks for the good laugh. :). Nope, can't blame it on auto correct or Freud. Me, all me. Going through a spell of feeling and thinking more geriatric than not, and typing on a phone for now doesn't help.

Maybe this is a good time and place to plead forgiveness for what seems to have become a fairly permanent inability to not remember a single rule about where to place commas. Seriously. :(
 
Flores let her chat with him, threw the fathoms of rope like Hope said, and he even answered her trivial question -where are you flying out of. He said Oregon. Not 'none of your business'.

And the result was a lot of lies out of her lying mouth for Martinez to use. That was good.

I wonder though, if he was more aggressive, didn't show her the pictures, didn't tell her he knew she was there, and she stuck to -I wasn't there, would we have had a totally different trial? A who-done-it trial even?

This is not what Martinez wants me to do. Looking back and think what if.:notgood:


There's nothing wrong with what if's. But...the State was obligated to turn over what it had on the during discovery. Which means the DT and would have known what Flores knew and JM could prove, whether or not Flores had been more obviously aggressive (as opposed to aggressive by letting her screw herself with lies).

As it was, Flores' approach doomed her, IMO, because of all those lies she let loose so readily. Three stories, not one. What reasonable jury could possibly have believed the stories she told on the stand after that?
 
Actually, what I meant was of Flores knowing she was a cold-blooded murderer and making sure she was no where near his gun. ;)

He did get very protective of his gun when she started taking about guns and then put her hands across the table as though she wanted him to show her his gun.She got very chummy. That part is reeeeaaaaally creepy.
 
*****

I don't want to cast aspersions on Blaney, but the nuanced differences between a big city detective (Flores/Phoenix), and a small town detective (Blaney/Yreka) are pretty clear.

Who knows how things would have worked out had Yreka not been a "Mayberry" kind of place. Several times during the interrogations Arias looked close to confessing. I have a feeling she might have if the "B" team had been a bit stronger. JMO

IMO Blaney had a really tough act to follow. But she was also asked to play a different role in the script than Flores was playing. It was a role that didn't work out because Jodi can't stand women (best punishment ever: stuck with women for 99999 years), and the BFF strategy wasn't going anywhere. It's very possible that Blaney didn't normally play this role during interrogations. And I doubt that she would have come up with it except by request: she's not a BFF type at all. In fact, you can tell she let her hair down for the occasion (there are kinks where her pony tail gets tied), so it was pretty clear there was some kind of strategy behind the whole thing.

I, too, think it all came off kinda clunky, but I also think what Officer Blaney did was admirable: you live and work in podunk (serious podunk) and a big hitter from a big city, a star in the making, shows up and you're to be his sidekick? And before you there's a death-penalty level murderer? And this is a very high stakes situation? That's a lot to ask.

In a million years, I don't think Jodi would have confessed. She'd spent too much time already on a cover-up. I'm sure she thought she could get away with it.
 
I think the proof is in the pudding. ;). Flores' gentle style gave her fathoms of rope with which to hang herself with lies, and she obliged him at every turn. Largely because, IMO, the was arrogant and delusional enough to think she could manipulate him into believing her.

I don't think Blarney did a bad job, and I don't agree with those who think she gave the ideas about abuse etc. the wouldn't have lied about without any assistance. I just agree with JM that she couldn't be effective because the found her too unworthy an opponent/tool.

Agree. Also, JA was all about the media and what they might be thinking already at the beginning of the EF interrogation. She didn't think to contact the Yreka news media about her "false arrest", though, which is kind of interesting. If she did (or her parents) contact them, they didn't respond? They probably knew her personally and assumed she did it. If she didn't contact them, well, that's interesting, too, 'cos she was always already obsessed with media and reputation.
 
After the family feast of 40 pounds of crawfish....time for some strawberry cake

image.jpg
 
From Brad Smith on the Official Super Duper:


Brad Smith
18 hrs
"Just a reminder to those who believe that Jodi would never willing give a guy a blowie the first week she met him, or that she wouldn't engage in kinky sex or slutty costumes on her own volition.
Abe said after a date with Jodi—when asked if she was wearing magic panties, her response was, "no, but there's magic in my panties". That is a very sexually charged phrase and a young woman who was sexually bashful would never say anything like that. Only a sexually confident and even sexually aggressive woman would say such a thing.
Ryan said after his post-murder makeout session that Jodi was very sexually aggressive and take-charge and was grinding on him and adjusting his penis for maximum enjoyment
Darrell said that Jodi was very sexually aggressive on their first date. When pressed, he realized that it had said to much, so backpedaled a bit and said they were both sexually aggressive with one another.
Abe, Ryan and Darrell all admitted Jodi was sexually confident and a proactive partner.
According to supporters though, Jodi was shy and uncomfortable with Travis. Why? Of all the men, he was her ideal match according to her—why be shy with him and give it up so easily to an older, less attractive guy (Darrell)."

And here's a response by Dr. Robert Glover:
http://www.drglover.com/blog/x_post/why-you-should-run-from-a-seductive-woman-00036.html

Sorry, this is a bit long, but I think you'll get the drift...

There are two ways a woman can be sexually seductive:
The first is from an open, conscious place.
The woman sends signals that she is receptive to you and is available to your sexual advance.
She doesn’t try to "seduce" you, i.e., act overtly sexual, expose herself, or act aggressively.
She gives signals of her receptivity (smiling, making eye contact, laughing at your jokes, touching your arm, leaning in, revealing herself reciprocally) and leaves it to you to be the man and take action (penetrate her with your presence and sexuality).
She isn't going to try to get you to like her by displaying her body parts, using overt innuendo, or being sexually aggressive.
A conscious woman is very seductive (receptive and inviting), but because she knows her worth, not because she needs a man to validate her by being sexually attracted to her.
The second way a woman can seduce is from a closed, unconscious place.
The woman acts sexually aggressive, because she knows what to do to get a man to want her (e.g., give him a *advertiser censored* in the front seat of his car on the first date, make graphic sexual statements or innuendo, or text him shots of her *advertiser censored* after first meeting).
This kind of seduction comes from a place of unconsciousness and insecurity and usually signals a history of being sexually exploited.
This woman doesn't believe men could like her or be attracted to her just as she is. And because the only way they could want her is sexually, she believes she has to use her sexuality.
So there are two types of seduction.
The first is from a place of self-respect, openness, and self-love.
The second is from a place of feeling inadequate and having to resort to sexual manipulation for validation and connection.
It is the second kind of woman from which I run
.
These women are usually beyond insecure – they are deeply wounded and will quickly pull you into their internal emotional abyss. They may initially come on hot, but they usually turn cold just as quickly. They typically have difficulty being honest and faithful (and the more they claim to be, the less I believe them), because they need constant validation from various men. You will often notice that they still have one or more ex’s in the loop.
You will never come out ahead with women like this (unless you have amazing boundaries and don’t fool yourself into thinking that you are doing anything but messing around with a really messed up woman).
 
From Brad Smith on the Official Super Duper:


Brad Smith
18 hrs
"Just a reminder to those who believe that Jodi would never willing give a guy a blowie the first week she met him, or that she wouldn't engage in kinky sex or slutty costumes on her own volition.
Abe said after a date with Jodi—when asked if she was wearing magic panties, her response was, "no, but there's magic in my panties". That is a very sexually charged phrase and a young woman who was sexually bashful would never say anything like that. Only a sexually confident and even sexually aggressive woman would say such a thing.
Ryan said after his post-murder makeout session that Jodi was very sexually aggressive and take-charge and was grinding on him and adjusting his penis for maximum enjoyment
Darrell said that Jodi was very sexually aggressive on their first date. When pressed, he realized that it had said to much, so backpedaled a bit and said they were both sexually aggressive with one another.
Abe, Ryan and Darrell all admitted Jodi was sexually confident and a proactive partner.
According to supporters though, Jodi was shy and uncomfortable with Travis. Why? Of all the men, he was her ideal match according to her—why be shy with him and give it up so easily to an older, less attractive guy (Darrell)."

And here's a response by Dr. Robert Glover:
http://www.drglover.com/blog/x_post/why-you-should-run-from-a-seductive-woman-00036.html

Sorry, this is a bit long, but I think you'll get the drift...

There are two ways a woman can be sexually seductive:
The first is from an open, conscious place.
The woman sends signals that she is receptive to you and is available to your sexual advance.
She doesn’t try to "seduce" you, i.e., act overtly sexual, expose herself, or act aggressively.
She gives signals of her receptivity (smiling, making eye contact, laughing at your jokes, touching your arm, leaning in, revealing herself reciprocally) and leaves it to you to be the man and take action (penetrate her with your presence and sexuality).
She isn't going to try to get you to like her by displaying her body parts, using overt innuendo, or being sexually aggressive.
A conscious woman is very seductive (receptive and inviting), but because she knows her worth, not because she needs a man to validate her by being sexually attracted to her.
The second way a woman can seduce is from a closed, unconscious place.
The woman acts sexually aggressive, because she knows what to do to get a man to want her (e.g., give him a *advertiser censored* in the front seat of his car on the first date, make graphic sexual statements or innuendo, or text him shots of her *advertiser censored* after first meeting).
This kind of seduction comes from a place of unconsciousness and insecurity and usually signals a history of being sexually exploited.
This woman doesn't believe men could like her or be attracted to her just as she is. And because the only way they could want her is sexually, she believes she has to use her sexuality.
So there are two types of seduction.
The first is from a place of self-respect, openness, and self-love.
The second is from a place of feeling inadequate and having to resort to sexual manipulation for validation and connection.
It is the second kind of woman from which I run
.
These women are usually beyond insecure – they are deeply wounded and will quickly pull you into their internal emotional abyss. They may initially come on hot, but they usually turn cold just as quickly. They typically have difficulty being honest and faithful (and the more they claim to be, the less I believe them), because they need constant validation from various men. You will often notice that they still have one or more ex’s in the loop.
You will never come out ahead with women like this (unless you have amazing boundaries and don’t fool yourself into thinking that you are doing anything but messing around with a really messed up woman).


And the third type of seduction is exemplified by the , who seduced from neither a place of self-love or feelings of inadequacy, but because seduction was in her experience the surest path to controlling and eventually possessing the men she believed could provide her with an identity and with a way of life she was incapable and unwilling to create for herself.

Men, beware, reworking one of the oldest adages out there: if she seems too good to be true and she makes you doubt yourself, she probably is too warped to be true and get the hell away forthwith.
 
I know this is never supposed to be free again...that's what the judge said at sentencing. But, I see now that a CA parole board has recommended Leslie VanHouten's release. She's pushing 70, I believe, and has been incarcerated since age 19, I believe. But it should be noted that she was sentenced to DEATH originally, with that being commuted to life only after the death penalty was ruled unconstitutional for a period of time before that ruling was reversed. It's complicated but sadly when a death sentence is commuted to life it is not LWOP. It's just..life. And that means possibility of parole, apparently.

All this just reinforces to me that LWOP was the best possible outcome for Arias. There is no death sentence to someday be found unconstitutional and commuted to life...with the possibility of parole. I understand how the family feels slighted and how others wanted Arias to get a death sentence but when all things are considered there was too much risk of her being released someday had that happened. She might even have a slight chance of getting out decades from now as it is...but that chance is, IMO, lessened by the fact that her sentence says NO CHANCE of parole.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
167
Guests online
1,551
Total visitors
1,718

Forum statistics

Threads
606,125
Messages
18,199,160
Members
233,748
Latest member
70DaysofSilence
Back
Top