Sheila and Katherine Lyon-sisters missing since 1975 - #2

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Concerning the jailhouse confessions/ bragging about the murders, a perp might well be truthful to a cell mate in sharing the horrible details, except when it comes to the true location of the bodies, jmo.
 
beachlvr0810 said:
Do you have Luke Welch's DOD?
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Valentine's Day 1984, see attached obit. Looks like he did not leave a surviving wife or have any children. This seems unusual considering how prolific the W family has been.

Here's a question for you. Whatever happened to Luther's sister, Rachel Lee Welch? She is never mentioned again in any of the other sibling's subsequent obits as having predeceased them, or having survived them.

Luther Welch obituary.jpg
 
RichardLewis said:
Valentine's Day 1984, see attached obit. Looks like he did not leave a surviving wife or have any children. This seems unusual considering how prolific the W family has been.

Here's a question for you. Whatever happened to Luther's sister, Rachel Lee Welch? She is never mentioned again in any of the other sibling's subsequent obits as having predeceased them, or having survived them.

View attachment 79391
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She died in Maryland on March 9th, 1987.
 
dotr said:
Concerning the jailhouse confessions/ bragging about the murders, a perp might well be truthful to a cell mate in sharing the horrible details, except when it comes to the true location of the bodies, jmo.
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I agree some inmates can't help themselves bragging about what they have done. It is quite common for sex offenders to brag about children they have attacked as it can turn them on reliving the attacks.
 
WaynezWorld said:
Passing the buck and the blame on to the deceased gets my attention.

It's odd that an innocent man would blame a deceased relation unless he had some knowledge of the activity, and at that, having knowledge of a child murder and telling no one does not reflect kindly on your soul.
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This also caught my attention a while ago.

Richard must have had some "knowledge" to suggest that a dead relative was a better place for the police to look than himself, but this "knowledge" could range from, second-hand gossip/speculation decades after the fact to actually observing events (murder or coverup.), although Richard's lawyer's other statements don't imply the later. Richard via his Lawyer claims to have shared all his information with the police.

There are also a few other dead relatives, including Lloyd's dead girlfriend/wife, who Lloyd showed up in VA with some time in 1975.
 
steveP120 said:
This also caught my attention a while ago.

Richard must have had some "knowledge" to suggest that a dead relative was a better place for the police to look than himself, but this "knowledge" could range from, second-hand gossip/speculation decades after the fact to actually observing events (murder or coverup.), although Richard's lawyer's other statements don't imply the later. Richard via his Lawyer claims to have shared all his information with the police.

There are also a few other dead relatives, including Lloyd's dead girlfriend/wife, who Lloyd showed up in VA with some time in 1975.
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It's very convenient to have a dead fall guy. Of course you are dragging the deceaseds name through the worst kind of mud possible, but a dead man cannot dispute or confirm any allegations. The statements of RAW's lawyer leads me to believe his involvement. The blaming of the dead and the description of RAW as not a good reader/writer hints they are trying to deflect the inevitable indictment.

Steve you were very skeptical about the Washington Post story and maybe it was warranted, but I think it is becoming clear now that there is a lot more information behind the search warrant affadavits, especially since it has been leaked to not only the Post but to WUSA9. The Post did not have the detail about the pool table, but they likely got the inside story from someone in LE who has read much deeper into the information behind the warrants.

I don't think anyone is jumping the gun on this one, it's been a long 18 months since LLW was named a person of interest. Hopefully LE is playing careful and getting it right. I'm checking the news on this at twice a day, my gut feeling is the indictment comes soon.
 
WaynezWorld said:
It's very convenient to have a dead fall guy. Of course you are dragging the deceaseds name through the worst kind of mud possible, but a dead man cannot dispute or confirm any allegations. The statements of RAW's lawyer leads me to believe his involvement. The blaming of the dead and the description of RAW as not a good reader/writer hints they are trying to deflect the inevitable indictment.

Steve you were very skeptical about the Washington Post story and maybe it was warranted, but I think it is becoming clear now that there is a lot more information behind the search warrant affadavits, especially since it has been leaked to not only the Post but to WUSA9. The Post did not have the detail about the pool table, but they likely got the inside story from someone in LE who has read much deeper into the information behind the warrants.

I don't think anyone is jumping the gun on this one, it's been a long 18 months since LLW was named a person of interest. Hopefully LE is playing careful and getting it right. I'm checking the news on this at twice a day, my gut feeling is the indictment comes soon.
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The search warrant affidavits were not "leaked". They are matters of public record and anyone can walk into the courthouse and ask to see them. The Post, WUSA, and the Roanoke newspaper were the only ones that were industrious enough to do so.
 
WaynezWorld said:
Steve you were very skeptical about the Washington Post story and maybe it was warranted, but I think it is becoming clear now that there is a lot more information behind the search warrant affadavits, especially since it has been leaked to not only the Post but to WUSA9. The Post did not have the detail about the pool table, but they likely got the inside story from someone in LE who has read much deeper into the information behind the warrants.
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I don't recommend identifying anyone not identified by police, both because it may be slander and interfere with an ongoing police investigation, but if one combines the information leaked (not the most reliable info) from both the Washington Post and WUSA 9 reports, one gets a good idea who the second relative implicating Richard is. The first relative is the unreliable Lloyd, who may have recanted.

I really hope the police have more evidence and can make a solid case against the guilty party or parties, but I am a bit skeptical of most things. My gut feeling is that they have next to nothing on Richard, who has not been charged with anything, and without DNA evidence of a body a very tough no-body case against Lloyd. My gut feeling, with no evidence to back it up, is that the police might have some bad behavior on Richard in the 1970s such as drugs, cheating or near-underage sex as with his 16-year-old wife, but little to do with the Llyon sisters other than a pattern of behavior.
 
Falcon500 said:
The search warrant affidavits were not "leaked". They are matters of public record and anyone can walk into the courthouse and ask to see them. The Post, WUSA, and the Roanoke newspaper were the only ones that were industrious enough to do so.
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Many search warrants with attachments are sealed for a short period of time while the investigation is underway. This happened with the original search warrants.

That Roanoke TV station has been good about posting the search warrants online when they are available.
If anyone has seen the new officially released search warrants online, please post a link.
I am not sure, but it does sound like the information in the search warrants was leaked only to the Washington Post and WUSA9 so far.
 
steveP120 said:
I don't recommend identifying anyone not identified by police, both because it may be slander and interfere with an ongoing police investigation, but if one combines the information leaked (not the most reliable info) from both the Washington Post and WUSA 9 reports, one gets a good idea who the second relative implicating Richard is. The first relative is the unreliable Lloyd, who may have recanted.
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That Roanoke TV station, using unnamed law enforcement officials, yesterday named the second relative who implicated Richard Welch.

http://www.wset.com/story/29709160/welch-nephews-allegedly-tie-uncle-to-lyon-sisters-case

and a rather gruesome story of rape murder and cover up.

I personally have mixed feeling on news media naming people on the basis of (often illegal) leaks, and I disprove of people trashing others on the basis of leaks or associations with Lloyd.
 
Nadia Singh ‏@NSingh_WDBJ7 [video=twitter;629731350396932096]https://twitter.com/NSingh_WDBJ7/status/629731350396932096[/video] Bedford, VA Leslie Engleking, brother of Patricia Welch arrested in Lyons Sister case moments ago in Bedford. @WDBJ7
 
Leslie Engleking was charged with perjury and Amy Welch and Gladys Stangee were charged with obstruction of justice in connection to the rape and murder of 10-year old Shiela Lyon and her sister, 12-year old Katherine Lyon. All three have posted bond.

The three are all related to Richard Welch, who is being looked at as a person of interest in the disappearance of the two girls. Engleking is Welch's brother in law, Welch is his granddaughter and Stangee is his sister.

Cold case detectives from Bedford and Montgomery Counties are convinced that the Welch family is engaged in an on-going cover-up of an almost unbearably horrible crime. Prosecutors have already charged Richard Welch's sister Patricia Welch with perjury. She is now potentially looking at two to 10 years in prison.

Last month, grand jurors indicted Lloyd Welch on charges of murder and abduction with intent to defile.
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http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/2015/08/07/suspects-brother--law-arrested-lyon-sister-case/31307799/
 
cgoodwin22 said:
such a powerful article...

http://www.salon.com/2015/08/09/the...wonders_why_the_biggest_clue_went_unexamined/
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I'll say! Basically, it says a friend saw the girls with Welch; they even made a very accurate sketch that showed his scar but at some point someone else said a guy was interviewing kids at malls, so they focused on him instead until a few yrs ago when a new team saw the girls interview in the Lyons sisters file. She also says the Welch sketch was not widely distributed

Have to say that she is right on with everything she writes; it is so true and why we are where we are today with a lot of different topics; because our parents were the secret generation.
 
Roselvr said:
Have to say that she is right on with everything she writes
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It's a very good article, but "right on with everything" is a bit too far for me since much of what happened will 40-years after the fact be impossible to prove or even make a good guess.

IF it turns out there was only one actor such as Lloyd, it will be impossible to prove at what stage in the sex crime murder happened. Lloyd on his own did not have the resources (car, safehouse) to hold anyone for more than a few minutes. I don't Lloyd alone had the resources to hold/kidnap two young girls alone; any one of the two could scream or run.

It's my GUESS that if Lloyd was acting alone, he lost control of the situation very fast, used violence to attempt to regain control and ended up with a crime-gone wrong. But my main point is that unless Lloyd gets religion and confesses to the worst possible case, we will never know what happened.

After being verbally confronted by a friend (who made the long-hair-man sketch) of the two girls for excessive staring, Lloyd may have also been in a bad mood.

In my opinion, the author appears to be projecting her own experience with long-term sexual abuse on the sisters.

Of course if several parties were involved with the actual murders, parties who actually had the resources to kidnap two girls for days, and the parties start turning on each other, we might have a good idea of what happend.
 
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