Sheri Coleman, sons Garett and Gavin murdered 5-5-09, Columbia, IL. Pt5

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Here you go, Panthera~
Originally Posted by SeriouslySearching
I found a photo of a girl who resembles her quite a bit. She works at the Tampa Gold Club and is called the House Entertainer named Treasure.

You have to enter, go into gallery photos, and she is standing in a black dress next to shelves with Champagne bottles.

http://www.seshowclubs.com/

Here is a photo of Miss Motive to compare it to:

Miss Motive
Click to expand...
 
analytical said:
I'm sorry if you think my hearing of the program was incorrect. However, you can "vet" it when the transcript comes out tommorrow.

I do believe Dr. Perper said Dr. Baden didn't conduct "certain tests" one being "vitreous humer"
Click to expand...
You did hear correctly that he was referencing tests that weren't done, and at the time I'd even asked you the name of them that I'd missed! :)
 
Stella5 said:
We've heard from a local source (not me, or my sources) that would be the truth. Could be rumor, but he's been right so far.
Click to expand...

Thanks:) I tried looking to see if this has been discussed but this thread is getting a bit lengthy :eek:

CC...what an idiot. They always search the husband's computer. :bang: I have a feeling he'll end up confessing sooner than later out of moral conviction...probably would have already if it wasn't for his sleezeball attorney.
 
analytical said:
I'm sorry if you think my hearing of the program was incorrect. However, you can "vet" it when the transcript comes out tommorrow.

I do believe Dr. Perper said Dr. Baden didn't conduct "certain tests" one being "vitreous humer"
Click to expand...

I did NOT say you heard the program incorrectly.

I said there is no way in he!! that Perper has seen any forensics. He can flap his jaws all he wants on NG, but that doesn't make it so. And I really like Perper, so this is nothing against him.
 
Also, wasn't Baden brought in to confirm the original ME's findings? I'd bet the original ME took and tested all the samples needed. And is Vitreous humer a standard test for determining TOD? IMO, the bodies were so fresh TOD would not be hard to determine at all. It's when they get past the 12 hour stage that it becomes problomatic.
 
SuziQ said:
This thing about the invitations, if true, really bothers me. Did they have a date on them? Because divorces take a looong time and are very unpredictable when you have property to split and child custody issues. Death of a spouse on the other hand make you single instantly. I can't believe that Ms Motive would not have know CC and SC weren't getting a divorce, but what if Chris told her they were and ran out of time because of this new wedding coming up?
Click to expand...
LOL I guess the invitations upset me a bit earlier, too. :eek:

If she was flying in to meet him at their old house, she had to know he needed to keep things hush hush about them being together. Neighbors would have seen her freely coming and going if not. There are tons of other ways she should have known he was still married, too.
 
SuziQ said:
Also, wasn't Baden brought in to confirm the original ME's findings? I'd bet the original ME took and tested all the samples needed. And is Vitreous humer a standard test for determining TOD? IMO, the bodies were so fresh TOD would not be hard to determine at all. It's when they get past the 12 hour stage that it becomes problomatic.
Click to expand...

EXACTLY!!!

The issue is not what was said, it was what Perper knows. And at this point it's just his guess. He does NOT know. We've seen it before with Caylee, they'd go back & forth when neither really knew.
 
Based on Perper's incorrect statement about the TOD being between 3-5, I'm pretty sure Perper has no real info about the Coleman's autopsy.
 
mgardner said:
<snip>
Sources said Baden looked over the autopsies in the Coleman case and would be willing to testify to the fact the time of death for the victims was most likely before 3 a.m. and no later than 5 a.m., which would put Chris Coleman at home at the time of the murders. This was just the final piece in a complex array of evidence that allowed prosecutors to move forward with charges.

This puts CC at the crime scene, using ligature strangulation. This has to be the most painful way to die. And he did this to his own wife and children.
<snip>
Mel
Click to expand...

I am mainly a lurker -- I think it was Caylee's disappearance that brought me here. This site gives such insight into crimes and those committing them. I returned to gain insight as this case was unfolding. I knew this group was good, but until it was explained on the Coleman threads, I never realized your backgrounds. Wow!

The Coleman case has weighed heavily on my heart - probably because I am an ex military dependent (AF) and generally have a high regard for those who serve our country. Marines are suppose to be the cream of the crop? How further from the truth does CC make this statement? I will never ever understand how a father can kill his own children, let alone his wife. Never. Moms murdering their little children - dads murdering wives and children. What has happened to the moral fabric of our nation? My heart aches for the people who truly loved these victims and are now left with their memories and nothing more, or less. Senseless. Absolutely. Senseless.
 
FishingFunnyFrog said:
Thanks:) I tried looking to see if this has been discussed but this thread is getting a bit lengthy :eek:

CC...what an idiot. They always search the husband's computer. :bang: I have a feeling he'll end up confessing sooner than later out of moral conviction...probably would have already if it wasn't for his sleezeball attorney.
Click to expand...
I wouldn't be holding my breath for him to suddenly gain a conscience or a soul.

I agree he is an idiot for not realizing they would get him with his computer, cell phone, and other things. He is the sleezeball...his attorney is only his henchman, imo. LOL
 
SuziQ said:
Also, wasn't Baden brought in to confirm the original ME's findings? I'd bet the original ME took and tested all the samples needed. And is Vitreous humer a standard test for determining TOD? IMO, the bodies were so fresh TOD would not be hard to determine at all. It's when they get past the 12 hour stage that it becomes problomatic.
Click to expand...
Exactly! Compared with so many cases, this one would be quite easy for the ME. Body temperature probably also determined that they had been dead longer than CC claimed.
 
I did find this info. I moved here in the early 1990's and I live near the church. (meaning it is in my sights everyday) The church in the current location was built between 1995 and 1998. But from this info the congregation started in 1988.

Company Name: Grace Church Ministries
Address: 2100 State St, Chester, IL 62233-1100
Alt Business Name:
Location Type: Single Location
Est. Annual Sales: $220,000
Est. # of Employees: 9
Est. Empl. at Loc.: 9
Year Started: 1988
State of Incorp:
SIC #Code: 8661
Contact's Name: Ronald Coleman
Contact's Title: Pastor
NAICS: Religious Organizations
 
in re: are vitreous humer tests "necessary/standard"

http://www.arrakis.es/~jacoello/date.pdf

page 4 ;;; "VITREOUS POTASSIUM:
The body maintains an increased concentration of potassium in the intracellular fluid. This
increase is 2- to 40 times the concentration of potassium within the plasma. This high concentration
requires a balance between the electrical charges inside and outside the cell membrane and is
maintained in this relatively high concentration be active metabolic forces that “pump” the
electrolytes selectively across the membrane. A return to equilibrium occurs after death at a steady
rate because the pumping mechanism is no longer active and the cell wall becomes a semi-permeable
membrane that allows the potassium to leak through the membrane to approach equilibrium. The leak
is at a steady rate because of the mechanical limits of the membrane. This steady rate provides a
built-in clock that allows a projection back to the time of death. An ideal sample, protected from most
trauma is the vitreous fluid of the eye. Calculations are most accurate when samples are obtained
within 12 hours after death.
One formula developed for estimating the time of death based on a uniform potassium leak rate
of 0.14 mEq/L/hr. is:
(7.14 x K+ concentration) - 39.1 = hours since death
Soon after this data was published the formula was found to be inapplicable for some locations
and/or situations. It is suggested that your medical examiner determine the rate for your specific
location."
 
OT: Sorry if I seem snippy today. Lots going on with this case, finding a body near Channahon, IL, and other things. I am so angry at these lowlife husbands who find it so easy to rid themselves of their families or wives. :furious:
 
Wasn't it originally rumored that it was Sheri's dad that had been in prison and that they were estranged at one point? It's probably back in thread 1 or 2... I'll go find it later, but IIRC that's what was said. So the Ron Coleman rumor has probably been twisted somewhere tight in a grapevine or two.
 
chestergal said:
I did find this info. I moved here in the early 1990's and I live near the church. (meaning it is in my sights everyday) The church in the current location was built between 1995 and 1998. But from this info the congregation started in 1988.

Company Name: Grace Church Ministries
Address: 2100 State St, Chester, IL 62233-1100
Alt Business Name:
Location Type: Single Location
Est. Annual Sales: $220,000
Est. # of Employees: 9
Est. Empl. at Loc.: 9
Year Started: 1988
State of Incorp:
SIC #Code: 8661
Contact's Name: Ronald Coleman
Contact's Title: Pastor
NAICS: Religious Organizations
Click to expand...



That church info makes more sense. Also, I have now received info from two different sources that the rumor regarding the embezzlement and imprisonment is false. He has not been in prison.
 
analytical said:
in re: are vitreous humer tests "necessary/standard"

http://www.arrakis.es/~jacoello/date.pdf

page 4 ;;; "VITREOUS POTASSIUM:
The body maintains an increased concentration of potassium in the intracellular fluid. This
increase is 2- to 40 times the concentration of potassium within the plasma. This high concentration
requires a balance between the electrical charges inside and outside the cell membrane and is
maintained in this relatively high concentration be active metabolic forces that “pump” the
electrolytes selectively across the membrane. A return to equilibrium occurs after death at a steady
rate because the pumping mechanism is no longer active and the cell wall becomes a semi-permeable
membrane that allows the potassium to leak through the membrane to approach equilibrium. The leak
is at a steady rate because of the mechanical limits of the membrane. This steady rate provides a
built-in clock that allows a projection back to the time of death. An ideal sample, protected from most
trauma is the vitreous fluid of the eye. Calculations are most accurate when samples are obtained
within 12 hours after death.
One formula developed for estimating the time of death based on a uniform potassium leak rate
of 0.14 mEq/L/hr. is:
(7.14 x K+ concentration) - 39.1 = hours since death
Soon after this data was published the formula was found to be inapplicable for some locations
and/or situations. It is suggested that your medical examiner determine the rate for your specific
location."
Click to expand...

Just for sake of clarity... I never said you heard it wrong.

Dr. Baden has done over 20,000 autopsies in his career; and I would venture to guess that the pathologist that was called in or heck even Jennifer herself who was at the scene did those tests. It's a given. You can look at a dead persons eyes and see them cloud over before your eyes once they take their last breath. That's one of the reasons medical personnel close the eyes of the dead, because it is not a pretty sight. I've watched plenty of last breaths happen and have seen the eyes cloud over.
 
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