Sources: Casey Anthony Intentionally Killed Caylee

[JBean]

What I meant was if Kc was carrying her there's a good chance she may have been dead already, and Kc was trying to make it like she was asleep. If she were alive and awake she would most likely have been walking and had gone over and hugged him before leaving. JMO

I think Caylee would have been stiff as a board if KC was carrying a baby that had died the night before.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Agreed! I believe GA was just covering up the family feud (prob. CA's idea) I CANNOT believe that a 2 year old girl would not emerge from her room prior to 1pm either to eat, play, or use the restroom....just don't BUY it!!! NOPE NOPE NOPE.

Welcome to WS, Seek! That is what I have been saying since George came out with his "story"! Nope is right!! 2 year olds are NOT quiet either! She would have been bored, hungry, wanting to watch videos, read her books, play with her toys, and all over that house.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I think Caylee would have been stiff as a board if KC was carrying a baby that had died the night before.

Yes. Rigor would have set in and so that is not possible, imo.

 

[JaneInOz]

When Caylees remains were found this was specualated about elsewhere

The Anthony is now part of the crime scene as they believe that Caylee died at the house. It is also said that Mallory, Lee’s girlfriend that she text messaged Cindy about the findings. Of course it has not been confirmed yet as Caylee!

DSnipped from http://humbleopinion.wordpress.com/2008/12/11/breaking-news-child-bones-found/

And this interview

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28159418/

All of which makes the events of last Father's Day weekend, when Caylee Anthony suddenly disappeared -- that much more of a mystery.

That Sunday, June 15th, grandmother Cindy took Caylee to visit her great grandfather in his nursing home. This home video, taken during that visit -- contains the last confirmed pictures we have of Caylee.

Cindy: We spent a wonderful day together, and then Casey came home and we had a great evening that evening.

The next morning, Monday, George remembered seeing Casey and Caylee at home before he left for work.

George: I was still home in the morning getting ready to go do my job, you know, later that afternoon.

Cindy: That was the last time you saw Caylee.

George: Yeah. I'm sorry. It's just, it's (crying) it's hard not to cry.

When George and Cindy came home that night, Casey and Caylee were gone. That wasn't out of the ordinary -- Casey occasionally spent the night with Caylee away from home.

But she didn't return the next day, or the one after that.

And then there is thsi

http://www.people.com/people/archive/article/0,,20238200,00.html

He told authorities he believed something could have happened to Caylee accidentally while she was in her mother's care. He said that Caylee, for instance, had a habit of picking up rocks and putting them in her mouth, and that the youngster was apparently also drawn to the family's backyard pool, a possible site for tragedy. And if something did happen, he had no trouble imagining a panicked Casey trying to cover it up any way she could. "I literally believe that Casey would have an emotional breakdown," he said. "I almost believe she would take Caylee and put her somewhere and then tell herself a new story, a new reality of what happened to her."

that is quite freaky

 

[seekjustice]

Did George say he was home the entire morning and hadn't seen Caylee earlier in the day?

No he did not, which needs to be clarified. If he was sitting on the couch watching his food program I would assume he was in the home for a decent amount of time before plopping down on the couch, at any rate I want to hear him say he saw or heard Caylee PRIOR to the time they left at approz 12:50.

 

[SuziQ]

So based on a few comments here and there it seems that its also a very good possibility that she did not plan to do this. That instead the fight with her mother threw her into an impossible rage of which Caylee was the recipient of.

What if she struck her and blood was seeping out of her mouth and nose and she duct taped it to keep it all in ?

My thoughts have always been accident or rage attack. whilst I am saddened that it was not a complete accident I think something that is a rage attack is more understandable than a actual premeditated murder of a 2 year old.

ETA sorry Understandable is NOT The right word I mean something else and I cant think of the word ? but im sure you know what I mean

Determining premed does not require a full out finalized and or a succesfully executed plan. It could be a thought that occured minutes before the murder. Or it could be something that was thought about for a long time and something occured that made the murderer act on their plan at the moment they did.

Let's say someone told you they were going to call LE because you were commiting a crime. You kill them on the spot. That's premeditation. You took long enough to formulate the thought that by killing them, they couldn't call LE on you.

In this case premeditation may not even be about a previous plan of murder. It could be there is evidence that Casey just flat out did not want to be a mom. That would be premeditated because instead of handling the situation of not wanting to be a mom in a legal way, she used murder to get what she wanted.

 

[JaneInOz]

Even if it was rage - that is not accidental - that is aggravating circumstances in the commission of a crime and is a DP crime.

Oh wow really. So if someone loses it for that brief moment in time (not referring necessarily to Casey here) and kills someone thats a DP crime ?

 

[PoppyH]

I think Caylee would have been stiff as a board if KC was carrying a baby that had died the night before.

This is true!! How long does the rigor stage last?? I know it only takes a few hours to set in, I was a NA when I was a teenager, I found a patient stiff as a board one morning, I freaked!!!!! I could not even bend his arms!!

 

[seekjustice]

Welcome to WS, Seek! That is what I have been saying since George came out with his "story"! Nope is right!! 2 year olds are NOT quiet either! She would have been bored, hungry, wanting to watch videos, read her books, play with her toys, and all over that house.

Thanks! Enjoying myself here In regards to Casey carrying Caylee out, I don't believe that happened either. IMO Casey and Caylee left the night of the 15th and were no where around until the flurry of calls when KC wanted to see the EXACT location of GA and CA.

 

[cjcord]

Regarding using duct tape to stop fluid leakage...hmmm.

That doesn't quite sit right with me. Not in this situation at least. If it WAS a rage incident, Casey's adrenaline would have pumping too much for her to think of a logical course of action that way. In this situation, my opinion is that if blood was an issue, she would have wiped it with cloth, wrapped her in a blanket, or simply left it and placed her in the garbage bag.

Of course, I am firmly in the premeditation camp, and attribute the duct tape to being used to silence Caylee. I just don;t see Casey being that resourceful during that time period.

 

[SuziQ]

Good point, but George says she was wearing sunglasses{ If we can believe he actually saw them on the afternoon of the 16th of June} so her head would not have been covered I don't think

If he saw the girls at all on the 16th. I think it's possible that Casey fled with Caylee the night before after Cindy tried to choke her and they never came back home. That's how most people would react after a violent confrontation. IMO, George told the story about the 16th to enhance the story that everything was hunky dory in the house. "They left like any other day" he claims.

 

[Sammiejam]

Edited to remove wrong quote. Sorry JBean, I meant to quote Chilly's question...

I believe he did say that. The first time he saw them was as they were about to leave and KC put her backpack down on a recliner and was talking to him.

CA said she left early in the morning before they were up so therefore didnt see them BUT she said she knew they were in the bedroom because she 'heard breathing" through the closed door...

 

[seekjustice]

If he saw the girls at all on the 16th. I think it's possible that Casey fled with Caylee the night before after Cindy tried to choke her and they never came back home. That's how most people would react after a violent confrontation. IMO, George told the story about the 16th to enhance the story that everything was hunky dory in the house. "They left like any other day" he claims.

Yes! Exactly!

 

[JaneInOz]

Yes. Rigor would have set in and so that is not possible, imo.

But Rigor only lasts for a certain amount of time and then the body softens again

But as I said I dont believe George wouldnt know a dead baby to an alive one.

And doesnt the body turn a different color as well

 

[JaneInOz]

Determining premed does not require a full out finalized and or a succesfully executed plan. It could be a thought that occured minutes before the murder. Or it could be something that was thought about for a long time and something occured that made the murderer act on their plan at the moment they did.

Let's say someone told you they were going to call LE because you were commiting a crime. You kill them on the spot. That's premeditation. You took long enough to formulate the thought that by killing them, they couldn't call LE on you.

In this case premeditation may not even be about a previous plan of murder. It could be there is evidence that Casey just flat out did not want to be a mom. That would be premeditated because instead of handling the situation of not wanting to be a mom in a legal way, she used murder to get what she wanted.

Oh I see..
I was more thinking premed as in planning it for weeks months and so on..but then it comes back to the google searches ( do we have dates for those things )

 

[ThoughtElf]

I really don't see any point in putting back the DP. If you get just one person who is against the DP you can lose the entire case.

If what I read today was right, then the jury can ask for the DP if the evidence indicates "aggravating circumstances" - When the jury does it, it is not subject to all the appeals it is on a first time conviction. That may be what they are going to present in court after they prove their case.

I read your earlier post abut that. And it made me quite happy. I'm leaning towards that direction.

 

[PoppyH]

If he saw the girls at all on the 16th. I think it's possible that Casey fled with Caylee the night before after Cindy tried to choke her and they never came back home. That's how most people would react after a violent confrontation. IMO, George told the story about the 16th to enhance the story that everything was hunky dory in the house. "They left like any other day" he claims.

I believe Cindy had said her and Caylee had taken taken a swim in the evening of the 15th, so if Cindy and KC got into a scrap after the swim, and KC snatched Caylee up and fled, maybee Just maybee LP would be right about the swimsuit being found with the remains...I remember him saying a suimsuit was found, not sure if its true, but it would make sense

 

[Woe.be.gone]

This week, I stood with my mother as we buried my grandmother. Her last few days were awful, and despite morphine, she did suffer. We prayed for God to take her and end her suffering.
I had a long conversation with our preacher about it, and he assured me, that when my grandmothers feet hit that golden path, all the pain, all the sickness immediatly went away. As hard as it is knowing that Caylee suffered in any way, I am at peace knowing now that when she walked that golden road, she forgot it all.:blowkiss:

No gray hair in heaven either. Bless you. I'm sorry for your loss.

 

[JaneInOz]

I believe Cindy had said her and Caylee had taken taken a swim in the evening of the 15th, so if Cindy and KC got into a scrap after the swim, and KC snatched Caylee up and fled, maybee Just maybee LP would be right about the swimsuit being found with the remains...I remember him saying a suimsuit was found, not sure if its true, but it would make sense

And that pink and white towel - but perhaps was actually a Towel bag as someone else suggested and was taken along with knickers or bather bottoms that matched a *bather bikini top* or could be bra top in photos of Casey.
There was a bunch of things found further up. and earlier in the piece. Which LE All took in. Nothing to say she didn't scatter things around
Hence the "havent even found the damn clothes yet"

 

[Torrie]

I'm not buying rage, at least not completely. Rage at CINDY, possibly. KC did searches back in MARCH on google. I believe she was thinking about it. THEN KC and CA had their fight, and KC killed Caylee to spite Cindy. She already had thoughts of doing it, and when Cindy ticked her off badly enough, she thought fine, we'll see who has the last word...and didn't she say JUST THAT to Lee? "i'm just a spiteful b*tch".

That being said, I don't know why, but this new news is really hitting me hard. I guess it makes it all that much more a reality. Last weekend I had nightmares that my stepdaughter wouldn't tell me where my grandchildren were...unlike the As, I was frantic, pleading, begging, finally trying to throttle it out of her...