Found Deceased Spain - Esther Dingley, from UK, missing in the Pyrenees, November 2020 #3

[PeggyHenry]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed>
Search for Esther Dingley: Spanish police say it's 'impossible' and all but give up - ReadSector

"The local woman called Lucia described to MailOnline how she saw a person with light brown hair lying down, not moving around or waving their hands.

But she claims she was fobbed off by the Guardia Civil who failed to send anyone to investigate.

A Guardia Civil spokeswoman told MailOnline the figure inside the camping car was a plain-clothed forensic officer – working at 10pm without protective clothing and driving an unmarked vehicle."

So glad you found this report..thanks!

 

[Hatty]

I stand corrected...didn’t know they ran a night shift. That does dispel some of my disbelief. But the lack 0f protective clothing while processing a very small confined area runs the risk of cross contamination, doesn’t it?

Unless they had reason to believe it was a murder/rape scene, then no. They had probably already established that it wasn’t.

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

DC is Esther's long time partner and as such is considered a "family member", therefore a victim.

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[Grouse]

I stand corrected...didn’t know they ran a night shift. That does dispel some of my disbelief. But the lack 0f protective clothing while processing a very small confined area runs the risk of cross contamination, doesn’t it?

Not to mention lying on the bed! Doesn't do much to dispel my disbelief I'm afraid.

 

[PeggyHenry]

Yes, She did contact other family members from the Pic.

I am thinking more and more about signs she has gone voluntarily missing or - and I hate to say this - ended her life.

My thoughts are...

1. DC comments about how joyful and happy she was, and indeed she states this in her messages, along with lots of reassuring “I love you’s”. IME suicide victims often feel elated and happy just before they end their lives, because they have made a decision to end their mental pain. Families are often therefore hugely shocked and have not seen the signs.

2. ED returned to the Pic de Sauvegarde where she had already been the day before. DC says it was because she liked it and that the trip wasn’t about “peak bagging”. ED seems to have spent a good half hour talking to her family members and DC from here. Again, it was apparently the norm to regularly chat to her family and DC, but did she want to return to a beautiful place and say her goodbyes?

3. She alludes several times to not having signal and that she will message when she can. We know that had she followed the proposed route, she would have had signal the following day. Could she have been trying to stop them worrying about not hearing from her to give herself a head start before they alerted SAR?

4. One of her last comments to DC is that she hopes the refuge de Vénasque has a winter room. A) This appears to suggest a lack of planning to stay there and B) although we can’t be sure, it looks like she never arrived there. It wasn’t very far away so this would mean a very quick change of mind after telling DC her plans.

5. A big red flag for me is her post on her personal FB page on 19th October - a couple of days before she set off on her solo trip. She mentions having recently been going through a difficult time and having to do some “deep soul searching”. She mentions Alex Boye and the lyrics from his song “I’m still breathing”. She cries when out running and talks of realising she’s not alone.

On You Tube the song has the hashtag #suicideprevention.

6. SAR have been unable to locate ED in a large area around her possible routes, despite intensive searching.

So what are the conclusions?

If ED had decided to end her life, she could have gone anywhere. She could have taken any mountain route far away from the one she stated she was going on, to avoid being found. She had at least three days start before SAR were called.

I really hate even writing these thoughts because Esther seems to be the most delightful, kind, generous, happy lady and I just want to see her safely home with DC who IMO adores her and always has her happiness and very best interests at heart.

Yet, I have the feeling she is a tortured soul and battles with life and its challenges.

Regarding her hope that the Refuge de. Venasque has a winter room.. she must therefore have intended to go there from the Pic. If there is no evidence she got there then something happened very shortly after leaving the pic en route to RdV. I know we have come to this conclusion before but it does seem very likely as there is no gps tracing of her phone from shortly after 4pm. So if there is no sign of her or her belongings between those two points then what explanations can there be? Her intentions were straightforward yet she does not arrive at RdV. Keeping it simple ...

 

[stmarysmead]

Regarding her hope that the Refuge de. Venasque has a winter room.. she must therefore have intended to go there from the Pic. If there is no evidence she got there then something happened very shortly after leaving the pic en route to RdV. I know we have come to this conclusion before but it does seem very likely as there is no gps tracing of her phone from shortly after 4pm. So if there is no sign of her or her belongings between those two points then what explanations can there be? Her intentions were straightforward yet she does not arrive at RdV. Keeping it simple ...

And therein lies the mystery. Dan describes the intensive search...particularly in that area.


“The search for Esther commenced at first light on Thursday 26th November, the morning after she was due to return to the motorhome in Benasque, with search teams deployed in both France and Spain, some walking with dogs and some in helicopters flying over the area. These are highly trained, highly proficient experts who have been working in this specific area of the mountains for many years. They know the terrain and locations that are likely to cause difficult for hikers.
For the first two days of the search, visibility on Pic de Sauvegarde was hampered slightly by a light dusting of snow and some cloud, although nothing that prevented the search teams ascending the routes from both sides of the mountain and the helicopters could still see most of the mountainside.
From Saturday 27th – Tuesday 1st December, the sunny weather returned, the light dusting of snow mostly melted and visibility was excellent. In addition to continued search teams retracing Esther’s planned route and other nearby trails, helicopter search teams continued to fly up and down the slopes.
The Spanish police also spent a day scanning the slopes of Pic de Sauvegarde with high powered telescopes from the opposite side of the valley. At times literally dozens of search and rescue personnel were walking the trails looking for any trace of Esther or her equipment.
The focus of the search was Esther’s last known location, planned route and nearby alternatives, with searchers sweeping back and forth over the hillside away from the trails, literally looking under large rocks and descending into crevices in the landscape.
In addition to this immediate area, as the map below indicates, trails in a very wide surrounding area were also walked. For more distant trails, search teams on the ground were flown in with helicopters. Water bottles and a pair of gloves were found, indicating the closeness of the search, but nothing belonging to Esther.”

in his summary he adds this conclusion:

i) If Esther did have an accident, it must have been instantly incapacitating, preventing her from deploying any form of shelter (which would have absolutely been visible to the search teams – Esther knows how to make herself visible in the mountains). This further narrows the possibilities of places she might have fallen. There simply aren’t that many places where an individual can fall a significant distance from the trail and become both incapacitated and invisible instantly. Obviously such places were the focus of the search already and no sign of Esther was found.
j) The only real possibility for a long fall is from the peak itself, but the helicopter went up and down the slopes many times and saw nothing whatsoever, and nor did searchers with high- powered telescopes looking from a distance.
k) The idea Esther sheltered anywhere other than the Refuge de Venasque makes no sense. She had stayed in dozens of such buildings and this one was unlocked and available. She could see almost the entire route from the summit and had told people she planned to go there.”

 

[sundaaaay]

This case really confuses me

...Another thing I pondered about this evening, pure speculation, I wonder is ED the sort of person who might interfere with a hunter. She is vegan and loves her dogs and I would say quite principled. Say if a hunter was trying to shoot an animal and she tried to stop him or scared the animal away. Don’t give out to me for speculating please

 

[RickshawFan]

Seems like an awfully short conversation given that she could fully re-charge her phone 5 times during the 3 day hike.

Snipped for focus. The charger was also for the Bindi headlamps. The Bindis are only rechargeable and only last 2 hours (I would guess severe lumens drop after 1); they take 4 hours to recharge, presumably from an outlet, not a charger.
The batteries in any of these devices would not perform well in the relevant conditions.

 

[wary]

Some people who harm themselves experience a strong but calm feeling that their actions are the right thing for them, at that time.
ED clearly loved and valued DC and her wider family. She and DC had spent many years together and I imagine became intensely dependent upon each other during their 6 years travelling together.
If she resolved to harm herself she would have known the terrible trauma DC and her family would experience. For that reason, if that was her decision, I believe she would have left a note for them, maybe explaining her actions and absolving them from her decision.
Suicide has a different dimension for loved ones, even to a fatal accident, or death through illness.The van is the most logical place any note would be, at that time, and the police will have found it.

A solid majority of people who kill themselves don’t leave notes.

 

[Palemaiden]

Regarding her hope that the Refuge de. Venasque has a winter room.. she must therefore have intended to go there from the Pic. If there is no evidence she got there then something happened very shortly after leaving the pic en route to RdV. I know we have come to this conclusion before but it does seem very likely as there is no gps tracing of her phone from shortly after 4pm. So if there is no sign of her or her belongings between those two points then what explanations can there be? Her intentions were straightforward yet she does not arrive at RdV. Keeping it simple ...

 

[Hatty]

Regarding her hope that the Refuge de. Venasque has a winter room.. she must therefore have intended to go there from the Pic. If there is no evidence she got there then something happened very shortly after leaving the pic en route to RdV. I know we have come to this conclusion before but it does seem very likely as there is no gps tracing of her phone from shortly after 4pm. So if there is no sign of her or her belongings between those two points then what explanations can there be? Her intentions were straightforward yet she does not arrive at RdV. Keeping it simple ...

That area has been searched intensively so if she wasn’t found and she definitely did not stay at the Refuge then either

a) SAR has missed her or
b) She carried on past the Refuge or took another route. She could have arrived too early at the Refuge and felt she could make more headway in daylight - or, if we consider the voluntary disappearance/suicide scenario, she may not really have had any intention of staying there....

 

[Palemaiden]

All the evidence points to ED continuing her journey to the refuge de V. a relatively short distance from where she was last confirmed to be on the Pic De S. To change route or take a route elsewhere doesn't make sense in the late afternoon going into early evening and darkness,as others have pointed out previously. Does the answer lie in the small lakes around the refuge and below the pic De s. The lakes can't be searched currently and I don't believe were searched by ROV or dived during the initial search which is incredibly difficult and time consuming, especially at altitude, therefore surely the water can't be ruled out with complete certainly.

 

[patCee]

A solid majority of people who kill themselves don’t leave notes.

That does seem to be true. Of course it varies, just like the many different reasons people decide the methods they use to harm themselves with women less likely to do so than men it seems.

In reviewing records of 657 suicide deaths autopsied at the University of Iowa Hospital and Clinics in Iowa City, Jane Persons, PhD, a postgraduate medical student at the university, reported that men were far more likely to die by suicide than women were -- 509 men died at their own hands compared with 146 women

https://www.medpagetoday.com/meetingcoverage/cap/82375

IF ED has chosen that way out, I hope she does leave a note for her loved ones so at least they know and won't spend possibly years wondering.

 

[PeggyHenry]

All the evidence points to ED continuing her journey to the refuge de V. a relatively short distance from where she was last confirmed to be on the Pic De S. To change route or take a route elsewhere doesn't make sense in the late afternoon going into early evening and darkness,as others have pointed out previously. Does the answer lie in the small lakes around the refuge and below the pic De s. The lakes can't be searched currently and I don't believe were searched by ROV or dived during the initial search which is incredibly difficult and time consuming, especially at altitude, therefore surely the water can't be ruled out with complete certainly.

The lakes have to be a possibility but somehow I don’t see her falling from a path into a lake or voluntarily entering one. Another possibility is that maybe she was interrupted in her journey from the Pic to the refuge. An interruption to her schedule occurred somehow. She encountered another individual who was descending ? I don’t know, just thinking ....

 

[Palemaiden]

The lakes have to be a possibility but somehow I don’t see her falling from a path into a lake or voluntarily entering one. Another possibility is that maybe she was interrupted in her journey from the Pic to the refuge. An interruption to her schedule occurred somehow. She encountered another individual who was descending ? I don’t know, just thinking ....

 

[Palemaiden]

Agreed, and only time will tell, but yes my view is that of a 3rd Party intervention which would be the only way for ED to find herself in the deeper parts of the lakes out of view of sight and helicopter / searchers looking down on the lake.

 

[PeggyHenry]

I’m thinking myself in her boots. I’ve reached the Pic summit and I’m feeling good at the top. There is still the odd hiker perhaps in the vicinity. It’s around 4pm, daylight and I’ve touched base with family. Ok .. I was intending to stay over at RdV so best get on ... or I guess I could go down to the van and get a warm and cosy night...there’s still time. Bumps into another hiker...

 

[CoverMeCagney]

I’m thinking myself in her boots. I’ve reached the Pic summit and I’m feeling good at the top. There is still the odd hiker perhaps in the vicinity. It’s around 4pm, daylight and I’ve touched base with family. Ok .. I was intending to stay over at RdV so best get on ... or I guess I could go down to the van and get a warm and cosy night...there’s still time. Bumps into another hiker...

Except the van was about 10 miles away so certainly not enough time for her to walk back there before sunset.

Can’t rule out her bumping into another hiker though. Or heading back to La Besurta for the night instead, or possibly trying to hitch a lift back to the van.

 

[Hexe]

in his summary he adds this conclusion:

i) If Esther did have an accident, it must have been instantly incapacitating, preventing her from deploying any form of shelter (which would have absolutely been visible to the search teams – Esther knows how to make herself visible in the mountains). This further narrows the possibilities of places she might have fallen. There simply aren’t that many places where an individual can fall a significant distance from the trail and become both incapacitated and invisible instantly. Obviously such places were the focus of the search already and no sign of Esther was found.

And I don't agree with this conclusion. A head injury could have left Esther fully mobile, yet confused and not thinking rationally. You don't need much for such an injury, a couple of rocks falling from the slope above you, one bad step, resulting in a fall... Not necessarily even a long one...

 

[Grouse]

This case really confuses me

...Another thing I pondered about this evening, pure speculation, I wonder is ED the sort of person who might interfere with a hunter. She is vegan and loves her dogs and I would say quite principled. Say if a hunter was trying to shoot an animal and she tried to stop him or scared the animal away. Don’t give out to me for speculating please

I posted a similar speculative thought previously. As well as her dogs she loves the chamois goats, which she described as her friends on SM, and which are hunted up there.