student kills self after webcam spying UPDATE: Conviction Overturned

[Paintr]

http://abcnews.go.com/US/rutgers-university-subpoenaed-tyler-clementi-death/story?id=11822324

Rutgers spokesman E.J. Miranda said in a statement thats the Rutgers police department and the university are working with the prosecutor's office.

"In some instances a subpoena is required before the university can release confidential student records that are protected by the Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act," Miranda said.

 

[AliceInPain]

Rest in peace Tyler.

I hope the nobodies who bullied him (because I believe it was bullying) gets punished severely, and anyone who ever thinks of doing this to another human being learns and thinks twice before they do anything.

There was a very good post a few pages back about the difference between pranks and bullying. ? Can't find it. Please bump if you do : )

Also, I find it interesting after looking around on Facebook, nearly everyone who attends the school are on the bullies' side... Hm.

 

[LinasK]

Personally I am not sure why the situation with Tyler is called bullying. I think what is alleged here is invasion of privacy, not bullying. When Erin Andrews was videotaped I've heard no one claim that guy bullied her.

Although, videotaping him was not the same exactly as direct taunting, it exposed him to future ongoing taunting by broadcasting to the world what should have been his privacy. Whether it be a sexual act/ gay or straight/ male or female victim/ dressing, undressing/ sleeping/ using the bathroom/ showering, bathing... they had NO right to violate his privacy- that's the bottom line, that's no harmless prank!

I'm quoting myself in response, and FWIW, I believe harassment is a form of bullying, much like stalking!

 

[LinasK]

Nope we couldn't video people or record their audio. New times.

Actually, we could, the average person just couldn't broadcast it to the world, and we knew it was wrong!!! So did these two, the technology they used isn't brand new either...

 

[Filly]

Good for your DD. Sometimes it is the only thing that stops one of these obnoxious bullys, unfortunately.
My son was bullied for 2 yrs. I found it hard to believe no adult in the school saw it going on. So, I went over there and asked to speak to an administrator and told her I wanted her to call that kid into the office and I had quite alot to say to him. She said she couldnt do that but she would call his parents. It FINALLY stopped.
My friends son was picked on for a long time by a school bully and one day lost it and broke his hand after punching him so hard lol
yes, bullying has always gone on and I sure wish someone would study them, do they have something wrong with their brains? It just doesnt make sense to me why other kids enjoy so much to make other kids lives so miserable.

Feddup I am very glad your son is alright now.

Bullies are bullies because they lack something IMO. They're missing something or have been bullied themselves at some point.

What do I know? I just know you let someone walk on ya it never stops. You have some kids can deal with it. My sibling did. He'd be like "Who cares? They're nobodies who will go nowhere while I succeed". That didn't fly with me. I know violence begets violence and all that, but the way I dealt with them teasing my sibling was to punch them in the mouth.

Mean, ugly, spiteful people. It takes the focus off of them if they pick on someone.

 

[Filly]

Actually, we could, the average person just couldn't broadcast it to the world, and we knew it was wrong!!! So did these two, the technology they used isn't brand new either...

Ummmmmmm it's brand new to me. Back in my day we didn't even have a video camera. Polaroid's were another thing. In all honesty some guy's we hung with had Polaroid's of this poor, poor girl. We're talking late 70's. Her and quite a few guys. They were showing them off and I was like "Lemme see". I threw them down the sewer. I didn't even know the poor girl, but my heart broke wide open for her. I felt so bad this poor girl subjected herself to that. Sadder those creeps used her and treated her that way.

People seriously s*ck. Sometimes I am embarassed to be human.

 

[gxm]

The men that the woman posted about on Jezebel.com did not consent to be talked about - it is the same thing.

Charlie09, the subjects of gossip rarely "consent" to being talked about as they are not usually present when they are being talked about. Should it be illegal to "talk about" other people? We'd have to arrest most of the population!

 

[gxm]

I think these two kids carried out a despicable prank with horrible consequences. That said, from what I've read, I do not think the offenders realized that the young man had not come out yet (as it seems, to his family) and how much emotional distress they would cause him. I do not think prosecutors will be able to prove a hate crime or that they intentionally wanted to harm Tyler. For now, it looks like invasion of privacy IMO, but we'll see if more details are uncovered as the case progresses. A senseless and terrible act regardless, and even worse for the tragic outcome. Horrible. My heart goes out to Tyler's family.

 

[jjenny]

I think these two kids carried out a despicable prank with horrible consequences. That said, from what I've read, I do not think the offenders realized that the young man had not come out yet (as it seems, to his family) and how much emotional distress they would cause him. I do not think prosecutors will be able to prove a hate crime or that they intentionally wanted to harm Tyler. For now, it looks like invasion of privacy IMO, but we'll see if more details are uncovered as the case progresses. A senseless and terrible act regardless, and even worse for the tragic outcome. Horrible. My heart goes out to Tyler's family.

I don't think it makes any difference whether the suspects knew if he was out or not. For what they are charged with (invasion of privacy), it makes no difference.
The prosecutor will not have to prove whether they intended for him to became extremely distraught or not. They aren't charged with any sort of bias crime and at least at this moment it does not look like they will be.

 

[jjenny]

Charlie09, the subjects of gossip rarely "consent" to being talked about as they are not usually present when they are being talked about. Should it be illegal to "talk about" other people? We'd have to arrest most of the population!

Exactly. You can't really prohibit mean behavior or gossip. However morally questionable the actions might be, they are not always illegal. While videotaping someone in a sexual encounter without their knowledge and broadcasting that on the internet without consent is illegal.

 

[Paintr]

My question is why has Rutgers not expelled the two students who violated the stated rules put forth by the university? Do they have to wait for these charges to be proven in court before they can act?

 

[WhyaDuck?]

My question is why has Rutgers not expelled the two students who violated the stated rules put forth by the university? Do they have to wait for these charges to be proven in court before they can act?

They likely may be waiting to see how the charges shake down, while conducting their own report on it. In my experience, these things are usually handled by university senates, which only meet once a month (usually), so they might be waiting for the students office to compile a report so they can meet/vote on it. That's just my speculation, though.

I think being ejected from housing can be quicker, though.

I haven't heard what's going on with all that.

 

[jjenny]

My question is why has Rutgers not expelled the two students who violated the stated rules put forth by the university? Do they have to wait for these charges to be proven in court before they can act?

I do not believe they would have to wait for the charges to be proven in court, so I am not sure what the deal is.

 

[Lou Cyper]

I was under the impression his family knew and were OK with his sexual orientation. The way I read things, it wasn't just the breach of his privacy, it was after it happened, there were vocal people treating Dahrun Ravi as if HE was the victim.. "how can you go back in there.." etc.

That's pretty horrible stuff right there and if you're already struggling with thoughts that people are going to be out to get you based on their homophobia, the thought that even though you've had a crime committed against you, people are worried about the perpetrator. That's got to be depressing.

The other day I saw on a 'friends' facebook status that she found out someone was gay and was posting how wrong it was and they should be 'fixed up' and some hero replies "I'll get my gun'. I mean seriously, there's some damned horrible people out there who refuse to live and let live because someone else doesn't fit the pigeon holes that makes them comfortable.

 

[jjenny]

I am not sure if his family knew that he was gay. His friend from high school was interviewed, and said Tyler did not date either males or females in high school, just was concentrating on playing the violin and not dating. So if he was interested in males he might have not done so out in the open while he was living in home. And if he was anonymously posting on some gay oriented website, how many parents really know all their children do on the internet? So I think that possibly his family did not know.

 

[Paintr]

http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20432861,00.html?xid=rss-topheadlines



Friend: Charged Rutgers Student Molly Wei Feels Attacked


"She feels that everyone is attacking her," a close friend tells PEOPLE after Wei and Clementi's roommate, Dharun Ravi, were charged with two counts of invasion of privacy for allegedly live streaming on the Internet a sexual encounter between Clementi and another man.

Wei's friend also says he has read Facebook comments calling her a monster and saying she deserves to burn in hell.

"She is trying to stay optimistic," he says. "She's really upset about this, she definitely feels bad, and wishes it didn't go the way it did."



I suppose Tyler also felt bad, was really upset, tried to stay optimistic and felt attacked also.

 

[jjenny]

http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20432861,00.html?xid=rss-topheadlines



Friend: Charged Rutgers Student Molly Wei Feels Attacked


"She feels that everyone is attacking her," a close friend tells PEOPLE after Wei and Clementi's roommate, Dharun Ravi, were charged with two counts of invasion of privacy for allegedly live streaming on the Internet a sexual encounter between Clementi and another man.

Wei's friend also says he has read Facebook comments calling her a monster and saying she deserves to burn in hell.

"She is trying to stay optimistic," he says. "She's really upset about this, she definitely feels bad, and wishes it didn't go the way it did."



I suppose Tyler also felt bad, was really upset, tried to stay optimistic and felt attacked also.

I am really not sure what Molly specifically is accused of doing. When Ravi was tweeting, he didn't tweet "we did this" or "we did that." It was always singular " I went to Molly's room and turned on my webcam." If she just let him use her computer, what exactly is her level of culpability?

 

[Lou Cyper]

I am really not sure what Molly specifically is accused of doing. When Ravi was tweeting, he didn't tweet "we did this" or "we did that." It was always singular " I went to Molly's room and turned on my webcam." If she just let him use her computer, what exactly is her level of culpability?

It's like any crime, if a friend you're with commits a crime and you just stand back and dont do anything, you've implied complicity.

It's like all cases of bullying, there's always people standing by wishing they could say or do something, but they dont. Outwardly it can appear that they approve and they just might think it's OK or not, but you cant read someone's thoughts to truly know.

Having said all that, I get the impression she wasn't an active participant and will probably get off. If I was Ravi, it'd be sweating bullets right about now.

 

[jjenny]

It's like any crime, if a friend you're with commits a crime and you just stand back and dont do anything, you've implied complicity.

It's like all cases of bullying, there's always people standing by wishing they could say or do something, but they dont. Outwardly it can appear that they approve and they just might think it's OK or not, but you cant read someone's thoughts to truly know.

Having said all that, I get the impression she wasn't an active participant and will probably get off. If I was Ravi, it'd be sweating bullets right about now.

As far as I know, a bystander is under no obligation to report crimes, although some states do have good samaritan laws. But that's assuming she actually knew Ravi was doing something illegal. When other people are on the computer, do you always look over their shoulders to make sure they aren't doing anything illegal?

 

[gxm]

As far as I know, a bystander is under no obligation to report crimes, although some states do have good samaritan laws. But that's assuming she actually knew Ravi was doing something illegal. When other people are on the computer, do you always look over their shoulders to make sure they aren't doing anything illegal?

I agree. I'm guessing that her charges will eventually be dropped. At this point, the charge against her is probably to induce her to give testimony against Ravi.