SURPRISE HEARING Friday 18th August

[smart blonde]

:floorlaugh:
While just preparing my final report for my Fraud Accounting class (for my Masters) my professor strongly emphasized that Wikipedia is NOT a valid source for ANY citations or information and then went on to say he wouldn't suggest it, period.
Just lettin' u know it's not a credible source IMHO and it can not be trusted especially for info on such a heated subject such as the WMIII

I must agree- and, I admit to being a Wikipedia-addict.
I have spent many lost hours on that website!

 

[21merc7]

Guys, today would not have happened if there was not definitive evidence pointing to the real perp.


A Court never changes a life/death sentence without something profound that changes what happened.


A bunch of lawyers/forensic labs don't spend years working many hours for free to help guilty people.

There is evidence that leads to the real murderer or these three young men would not be released. The deal is to protect the State from the millions they could sue for, to protect the State from the embarrassment, to give the State time to recover from the backlash. to give the State time to come about having a trial for the real perp.

This does not happen just because someone asked for it, someone fought for it. It just does not.

I hope no one here is ever wrongfully accused of murder, you may not have the help these 3 were fortunate to receive. Your case may not be public knowledge and you may be just another number waiting in jail, never to be released.

 

[claudicici]

I'm happy and outraged at the same time.
The 3 are so obviously innocent to anyone who REALLY reads all the transcripts and everything else.There is NOTHING that points to their guilt.
This is not justice.I'm happy they are finally free but the case is NOT closed.There is no justice for the little boys.The real killer(s) needs to pay.
The state needs to pay retribution to the 3 !!!!!!!!
This is NOT over !!!!!

 

[deelytful1]

Guys, today would not have happened if there was not definitive evidence pointing to the real perp.


A Court never changes a life/death sentence without something profound that changes what happened.


A bunch of lawyers/forensic labs don't spend years working many hours for free to help guilty people.

There is evidence that leads to the real murderer or these three young men would not be released. The deal is to protect the State from the millions they could sue for, to protect the State from the embarrassment, to give the State time to recover from the backlash. to give the State time to come about having a trial for the real perp.

This does not happen just because someone asked for it, someone fought for it. It just does not.

I hope no one here is ever wrongfully accused of murder, you may not have the help these 3 were fortunate to receive. Your case may not be public knowledge and you may be just another number waiting in jail, never to be released. This is very, very rare.

I really hope this is true!! Can't wait for it!

 

[joe jones]

I am unsure about how I feel about this, I was hoping for a new trial so that all the evidence could be evaluated again, I can understand they wanted to get out of jail but they had a hearing in December and is was bound to result in a retrial

seems they both blinked at the same time, the state felt they would not be able to get a conviction in a new trial, the WM3 having been convicted once possibly felt that taking the Alford plea at least guaranteed there freedom, taking a chance on a new trial and maybe being convicted again was a chance they were not prepared to take

I am still on the fence about there guilt, and now it does not matter how loud they shout or how often they profess there innocence they have all said they are guilty, they can tie it up in a pretty bow they can use all the legalese they want but today they all uttered the word guilty,

I also find the Alford plea just a bizarre way to get justice, either you are guilty or you are not, I now doubt that we will ever have a thorough investigation of the case, the state has said case closed we got our men even though they may not have got a conviction second time round

I hoped that all 3 could have hung on and had a retrial, but then I have not been on death row for 18 years or been in jail for 18 years,

I hope all 3 go on to live productive happy lives,

but for me the questions will always linger as to who did commit the murders of those children all those years ago

 

[gitana1]

<modsnip>
That is not Miskelley's fourth confession. That's his second statement to police in the presence of his attorney. You may be confused because during his first statement, the officers recorded it as three statements but it was all on the same day.

Miskelley passed a lie detector test showing he was NOT involved. So did Jason Baldwin. Echol's was inconclusive. You say someone passed a lie detector test stating that Baldwin confessed to this third party. Which I have never heard of. So, what test are we to believe? The ones that show Misskelley and Baldwin were not involved or the third party one that you state may be out there, showing Baldwin implicated himself.

The fact is, DNA evidence at the scene implicates the step-dad and his buddy, not the WMIII. And Misskelley's statements contradicted the evidence. THAT is part of the reason why celebrities got involved and part of the reason why many people believe them to be completely innocent of these crimes.

 

[21merc7]

I really hope this is true!! Can't wait for it!

There is no other way they would be out deelytful1. Waiting will be a bit of time though, it is a tough political position.

Sorry, must explain, I have worked for attorneys for nearly 20 years. One specializes in Capital Murder defense. No one is released just b/c many fought for it. Evidence must be there. I think this could have been handled much differently and will ask that attorney about it Tuesday when I can talk with him. Politics and money are in the way, and I am sure he will tell me just that, but bet he is steamed right now too and will send off some letters, but it will not change right now and where it stands for these 3 young men.

 

[laurensmom]

Wow just now catching up....lots of unrelated posts to wade through...lipstick on pigs, etc. is that some kind of new band?
seriously.....case discussion posts are all over the place....I was hoping this one thread was sticking to what went on today.

Bottom line for me is: here's Arkansas at its finest.....'yes we believe they're guilty but we think a new trial will be granted and they will be set free...so to keep from having to give them millions of dollars we're gonna let them go' and let's not forget Arkansas letting three convicted child murderers (in their opinion) go free just for the hell of it.

Just wow.

I'm thrilled they are free....but like Joe I would have been happier with a new trial. At first I was disappointed that they took the plea. Then when I saw them on tv at the press conf. looking so broken and found out Jason didn't want to take the plea at first....it made more sense to me. Now all the world knows the kind of justice system they have been up against all these years. Get out while you can.

 

[HRCODEPINK]

The wiki footnote that follows the quote that Disgusted refers to, footnote # 25, states the source as "WM3.org-Case synopsis by Dan Stidham," but when you click the footnote link, you get a "404 page not found."

So, it appears there IS NO SOURCE for the quote being provided.
HTH

Thanks! I can work with that below!

If you don't believe truthful confessions happen all the time, I could compile a list, if you would like.

You are absolutely right. So let's just work with the wrongful confession we are talking about then and we will use what you, yourself cited:

For starters, the article that the Wiki you cited was referring to was on a pro-innocence site. Next, the information is kind of cherry picked from what I am reading since the surrounding information is a little different.

Page 7
"Jessie Jr. was diagnosed himself as being retarded. Doctor's recommended that Jessie Jr. receive special education and family counseling, but this was never done. Tests conducted at our request after his arrest indicated that Jessie Misskelley, Jr. was operating at the level of a five year old child. His reading level was severely retarded, and his overall IQ was in the range of 72, which indicates that he is borderline mentally retarded."

Page 8

"police acting on the information from Vicky Hutcheson, re: the Esbat, picked up Jessie Misskelley, Jr. for questioning. He was taken to the police station at about 9:30 a.m., after Officer Allen told Jessie Sr. that they wanted to talk to Jessie Jr. about Damien. Allen told Jessie Sr. and Jim McNease that Jessie would get the reward money IF he helped in the investigation. In response to police questioning, Jessie said that he had heard that Damien and a guy named Robert Burch had killed the boys."

"NOTE: Jessie was questioned by police despite the fact that under Arkansas law he could only be questioned if his parents consented to a waiver of his Miranda rights in writing, since he was only 17 years. of age."

Re Polygrpah: "...officer Durham said that he was lying about the murders, and even told Jessie that he knew he was lying because "Jessie's brain was telling him so."

Page 9
http://www.wm3.org/CaseIntroduction/Page/DAN-STIDHAMS-CASE-SYNOPSIS

After a bunch of stuff about police misconduct during interrogation that wasn't legal in the first place:

"After rehearsing the scenario, over and over again, he finally told them that he had seen Damien and Jason rape and murder the boys. He unwittingly told police enough to cause himself to be an accomplice. Instead of allowing him to go home as police promised, he was locked up. The interrogation itself lasted almost twelve hours, but only about twenty minutes of audio tape exist regarding the confession. Immediately after the confession, when Jessie realized he wasn't going home, he recanted the entire confession, but it was too late. "

"NOTE: As part of an experiment, Dr. Wilkins and myself were able to get Jessie to confess to committing a robbery that never occurred. This was ruled inadmissible by the Court, and the jury never knew this. I often bragged that I could get Jessie to confess to killing JFK, although he wasn't even born in 1963. I am still convinced I could get him to confess to almost anything. "

Page 11:

Facts of Jessie's confession do not match facts of crime scene

"1. Jessie says boys skipped school May 5, 1993.

FACT: Boys were in school all day, so was Jason Baldwin.

2. Jessie says boys were killed at noon on May 5, 1993.

FACT: Boys were in school until 3:00 p.m., and were last seen alive at about 6:30 p.m. ME says time of death was 1:00 TO 5:00 a.m. on May 6th, 1993. Jessie worked with Ricky Deese until about 12:30 p.m.

3. Jessie says boys were raped (sodomized).

FACT: Medical examiner says no trauma to boys anuses, something that would have been there if they were raped.

4. Jessie says Jason castrated Christopher Byers with a single swing of a knife.

FACT: Medical examiner says that the penis of Byers was methodically skinned by someone with extensive knowledge of anatomy and the process would have taken some time to complete even under laboratory conditions.

Update: The mutilation was not skillful or meticulous as Peretti said. It was crudely done. This is still quite inconsistent with Misskelley's confession.

5. Jessie says that the boys were tied up with a brown rope.

FACT: The boys were bound with their own shoestrings.

6. Jessie says the boys were beaten with a big ol' stick and cut with a knife.

FACT: No blood was found at the scene, and ME says those injuries could not be inflicted with out a great deal of blood loss. (This leads on to believe that the boys were killed elsewhere and their bodies dumped in the creek. This seems to be corroborated by the fact that search teams were combing the woods that night walked all over the spot where the bodies were recovered.)

Update: Brent Turvey's Profile of the case corroborates our belief that the boys were killed elsewhere.

7. Jessie says Damien choked one of the boys with a big ol' stick.

FACT: Medical Examiner says none of the boys had choking or strangulation injuries.

These are just a few of the most obvious inconsistencies."

And this is the confession we are to believe?

Page 12:

"Ofshe phoned me and informed me that Jessie's confession was the worst false confession that he had ever seen, and that he felt Jessie was innocent. Ofshe's testimony is part of the trial transcript and is very, very compelling evidence of Jessie's innocence. Ofshe, like myself is absolutely convinced of Jessie's innocence."

We could go on and on, but most importantly, there is a Motion that was filed regarding this "second confession" and you can read that information here:

I. JESSIE MISSKELLEY'S SO-CALLED SECOND CONFESSION
http://www.wm3.org/CaseIntroduction/Page/DAN-STIDHAMS-CASE-SYNOPSIS

It is filled to the brim with misconduct on behalf of the prosecution and LE.

I cannot stress enough how very important it is to always look at all of the facts in every case. Unfortunately, not every member of Law Enforcement and the prosecution's side are Yuir M or Jane Young. There are people out there is positions of authority that do the wrong thing and that is what the Constitution is here to protect us from. Those who don't believe that it is possible live in a very sheltered world and I pray that none of them ever in up in the position of those like the WM3.

ETA: There were over 20 pages on that article and I have yet to find the spot that had the quote that you posted. It really may be in there, but I don't have it in me to find it at the moment, but the beginning of the article did say that the article had been changed due to further investigation, etc.

 

[joe jones]

Guys, today would not have happened if there was not definitive evidence pointing to the real perp.


A Court never changes a life/death sentence without something profound that changes what happened.


A bunch of lawyers/forensic labs don't spend years working many hours for free to help guilty people.

There is evidence that leads to the real murderer or these three young men would not be released. The deal is to protect the State from the millions they could sue for, to protect the State from the embarrassment, to give the State time to recover from the backlash. to give the State time to come about having a trial for the real perp.

This does not happen just because someone asked for it, someone fought for it. It just does not.

I hope no one here is ever wrongfully accused of murder, you may not have the help these 3 were fortunate to receive. Your case may not be public knowledge and you may be just another number waiting in jail, never to be released.

there will never be a trial for another suspect, the state will never revisit the issue of these crimes in a court of law, they got the best outcome they could they have 3 men who have said the word guilty even though they are still professing there innocence,

for the state that is enough, they will never want the whole mess revisited, it is over, and if the murderer is soembody other than any of the WM3 he will never be brought to justice

 

[laurensmom]

There is no other way they would be out deelytful1. Waiting will be a bit of time though, it is a tough political position.

Sorry, must explain, I have worked for attorneys for nearly 20 years. One specializes in Capital Murder defense. No one is released just b/c many fought for it. Evidence must be there. I think this could have been handled much differently and will ask that attorney about it Tuesday when I can talk with him. Politics and money are in the way, and I am sure he will tell me just that, but bet he is steamed right now too and will send off some letters, but it will not change right now and where it stands for these 3 young men.

I'm holding on to this as well merc......with all the new testing being done something had to have come back that made a profound effect.

 

[HRCODEPINK]

I wonder if any of the families of the victims, Chris, Michael or Steve, Jr. will sue these 3 in civil court?

I guess the one from death row has a wife or gf, but the other 2 might want to look up Casey Anthony. Lots in common, MOO.

From my understanding, and I may be wrong on this and don't have a source, but can dig up a couple, all but one (I think) all agree that the boys were not guilty and wanted to see them released.

 

[SyraKelly]

I am happy they are out of jail-they were innocent!!
but there is a killer/killers who got away with 3 little boy's murder and we may never see justice for them-MOO!!

 

[deelytful1]

From my understanding, and I may be wrong on this and don't have a source, but can dig up a couple, all but one (I think) all agree that the boys were not guilty and wanted to see them released.

Yep, my understanding too....

 

[UdbCrzy2]

If they were not guilty then why did they plead to a crime they have evidence to clear them immediately?

I know some folks on here support the convicted murders, but NOT ALL DO...

 

[kalekona]

If they were not guilty then why did they plead to a crime they have evidence to clear them immediately?

I know some folks on here support the convicted murders, but NOT ALL DO...

If they weren't innocent why would the state let them go?

See how that works.

 

[Steely Dan]

Wow, you fans are way behind on this case. I'd suggest you do your own research, which you clearly have not. How about for starters you learn about who Jason Baldwin confessed to. Learn that the person he confessed to PASSED a lie detector test about the confession.

The list goes on and on. You wm3 fans don't even have a rudimentary knowledge of this case. It's actually shocking, I thought people here would know more....

Oh, and here's Miskelly's FOURTH confession, AFTER conviction, and AFTER his attorney's tell him he can get a new trial and get off the hook. This is a man clearing his conscience:

http://callahan.8k.com/wm3/jmfeb.html

That's it for me on this one here. You deniers are so far behind, and I don't feel like doing the work for you.

From your link (BTW, the person who transcribed this can't spell worth a lick)

STIDHAM: Uhm.....For the purpose of this tape I would like to find out..inaudible..Judge Burnett and everyone else thinks it's true. Misskelley is purgering himself. Do you have an opinion Mr. Crow?

CROW: I have a very strong opinion that he is purgering himself.

STIDHAM: We feel obligated to inform the court, as officers of the court, ethically we feel that..inaudible..make that for the record of this statement. inaudible

His attorney's felt he was perjuring himself. So I have grave doubts about the truth of this "confession". Misskelley also says this;

MISSKELLEY: I was wearing a white shirt, had a basketball, something on the front of it and I had bluejeans, greasy, and white and blue addidas.

Later in the interview he claims he went to a friends house and then to basketball practice and yet nobody noticed blood on his shirt, which was white?

You may have some knowledge of the case but you haven't analyzed it very well. JMO

 

[deelytful1]

If they weren't innocent why would the state let them go?

See how that works.

:clap:

 

[porkchop]

If they were not guilty then why did they plead to a crime they have evidence to clear them immediately?

I know some folks on here support the convicted murders, but NOT ALL DO...

They took the Alford plea because they wanted to get out of jail. It is easy to sit behind your keyboard in the safety of your home and say you would fight to prove your innocence, but when you are in a 6 by 9 cell and being traded for cigarettes you would jump at the first opportunity to get out.

Plus they weren't going to be cleared immediately, they were going to have a hearing in December to determine if they could get a new trial. If the new trial was granted, there was no guarantee that it would be, then they would have to wait for that trial to start and sit through that one. That could have taken another couple of years and they would still be sitting in jail.

So as you can see taking the Alford Plea got them out of jail immediately as oppose to a trial which could have taken a few years. Also I don't think these three had much faith in not being railroaded again after what happened to them in the first trial. And judging by the comments of some of the people on this board that think they are guilty because they "had evil in their eyes" and nothing more, a new trial wasn't a guaranteed win for them.

 

[21merc7]

there will never be a trial for another suspect, the state will never revisit the issue of these crimes in a court of law, they got the best outcome they could they have 3 men who have said the word guilty even though they are still professing there innocence,

for the state that is enough, they will never want the whole mess revisited, it is over, and if the murderer is soembody other than any of the WM3 he will never be brought to justice

I'm hoping for the next Commonwealth's Attorney, (or District Attorney, name means the same), to take it up. The present obviously will not...

jmo based on impressions from today's presser, and the clear nervousness of any on film... The Judge's gratuity toward all of those people that "helped the Court get this far" in freeing the young men today...