Suspect #1: Dellen Millard *Charged* 1st Deg Murder 15 May 2013 #1

[MsSherlock]

Absolute proof is not required, just proof beyond a reasonable doubt.

BTW, I do appreciate the way you keep presenting considerations for the defense. It lets us think about the challenges that will be presented in court.

Exactly Musical- "beyond a reasonable doubt". Which leads me to what LE does have: the tattoo, eye witnesses, the burner phone, the phone number, the phone calls, the test drive, the other test drive, CCTV footage from traffic cams and neighbor, the Yukon, the Harley, the Harley trailer, the big trailer in Mom's drive way, TB's truck in the trailer, the hangar, the Eliminator, a charred body on the farm, a chop shop happening at the hangar, properties transferred immediately, a second suspect arrested, and all this is topped off with DM, who's under arrest and exercising his constitutional right to silence. IMO, DM may be smart not talking to LE, but certainly with a list like the aforementioned he may be wise to start some communication between his Lawyer and LE. JMHO, the whole notion of someone framing DM is really far fetched. I think a jury from Mars would have a hard time finding "reasonable doubt" with the actual facts we know today let alone the evidence that has a publication ban on it. MOO

 

[Blomquist]

So much presumption here. It's very difficult to stay on track with the facts only as so much emphasis is on speculative determinations... Shaky I agree with you on many points, I like how you stick to facts and not totally fabricated assumptions.

 

[Shaky pi]

Again, the word here is "reasonable". Is it reasonable to conclude that

a) two strangers arrive to take a desirable, expensive vehicle for a test drive
b) while the rightful owner of the vehicle goes with them, he has a heart attack
c) these two strangers become frightened that he died
d) these two strangers do not call authorities or ambulance, but instead take him to a remote location where he is burned beyond recognition
e) these two strangers keep the deceased's truck in an unknown location
f) these strangers are associated with a building that appears to have stolen auto parts
g) these strangers in charge of stolen vehicle parts are the ones who showed up to test drive the valuable vehicle

Sure, the Crown always has their work cut out for them, but in this case, I believe it is the defence that will have to scramble to come up with "reasonable" doubt.

JMO

youdont know who the 3rd suspect is , or if more then one not yet arrested , nor their parts in this case , d m is doing exactly what you would expect , he aint sayin nothing , People , i said before and will say again . guilt there , but not murder , i believe crown will give the defense whatthey have , although im sure they will forget an item or 2 ,, we will hear some details....people in general are not great at keeping secrets .....

 

[Blomquist]

Again, the word here is "reasonable". Is it reasonable to conclude that

a) two strangers arrive to take a desirable, expensive vehicle for a test drive
b) while the rightful owner of the vehicle goes with them, he has a heart attack
c) these two strangers become frightened that he died
d) these two strangers do not call authorities or ambulance, but instead take him to a remote location where he is burned beyond recognition
e) these two strangers keep the deceased's truck in an unknown location
f) these strangers are associated with a building that appears to have stolen auto parts
g) these strangers in charge of stolen vehicle parts are the ones who showed up to test drive the valuable vehicle

Sure, the Crown always has their work cut out for them, but in this case, I believe it is the defence that will have to scramble to come up with "reasonable" doubt.

JMO

There is so much reasonable doubt here without all the evidence that I see the defense as having a field day at this point.
AS yet we do not have the sequence of events as the prosecution wants to see it...or how the defense will lay it out. Therefore we cannot even play ball in this court at this time. IMO

 

[Alethea Dice]

Exactly Musical- "beyond a reasonable doubt". Which leads me to what LE does have: the tattoo, eye witnesses, the burner phone, the phone number, the phone calls, the test drive, the other test drive, CCTV footage from traffic cams and neighbor, the Yukon, the Harley, the Harley trailer, the big trailer in Mom's drive way, TB's truck in the trailer, the hangar, the Eliminator, a charred body on the farm, a chop shop happening at the hangar, properties transferred immediately, a second suspect arrested, and all this is topped off with DM, who's under arrest and exercising his constitutional right to silence. IMO, DM may be smart not talking to LE, but certainly with a list like the aforementioned he may be wise to start some communication between his Lawyer and LE. JMHO, the whole notion of someone framing DM is really far fetched. I think a jury from Mars would have a hard time finding "reasonable doubt" with the actual facts we know today let alone the evidence that has a publication ban on it. MOO

LE has the burner phone? Which accused was in possession of it? Do you have a link for this?

The Harley and the Harley trailer have nothing to do with the murder. Of course, a connection can be made IF it's determined that it was a chop shop. That hasn't been determined yet, or hasn't been announced that I'm aware of. I'm sure those charges will be laid as well if the evidence is found to show it was in fact a chop shop. We also don't know yet if the Eliminator has anything to do with the murder. IF it was used after the murder, that information has not yet been released.

The tattoo was only identified by the first test drive. It wasn't in the original description from SB. We also have no idea what, if any, footage they have from traffic cameras or the neighbours. We only know that the Yukon was caught on video following as they left Tim's residence. The video wasn't clear enough to even determine the vehicle at first, let alone who or how many were in it. And now we're being told that maybe no one was in it.

 

[Blomquist]

LE has the burner phone? Which accused was in possession of it? Do you have a link for this?

The Harley and the Harley trailer have nothing to do with the murder. Of course, a connection can be made IF it's determined that it was a chop shop. That hasn't been determined yet, or hasn't been announced that I'm aware of. I'm sure those charges will be laid as well if the evidence is found to show it was in fact a chop shop. We also don't know yet if the Eliminator has anything to do with the murder. IF it was used after the murder, that information has not yet been released.

The tattoo was only identified by the first test drive. It wasn't in the original description from SB. We also have no idea what, if any, footage they have from traffic cameras or the neighbours. We only know that the Yukon was caught on video following as they left Tim's residence. The video wasn't clear enough to even determine the vehicle at first, let alone who or how many were in it. And now we're being told that maybe no one was in it.

We have no idea that it was actually DM's Yukon either. So with no suspect three we must assume the Yukon was on auto pilot....maybe MillardAir had one put in from one of the planes :floorlaugh:

 

[Shaky pi]

Did any 1 here ever watch JFK , theres the facts of what you and are were fed , then theres what we dont know , suspects we havnt even heard about , Facts we havnt heard about yet .. police and crown put just enough out there to keep forums like this hopping , we all speculating ,, we all have our thoughts of guilt and reasonable doubt , i do think we all agreeon theft and confinement , but with out more fact s , we can only speculate .. period . without other suspects and without cause of death , who actually did it and when , without trail of truck on night of test drive . and driver or drivers of yukon , we really dont have alot to keep building a case .

 

[Annie1004]

Again, the word here is "reasonable". Is it reasonable to conclude that

a) two strangers arrive to take a desirable, expensive vehicle for a test drive
b) while the rightful owner of the vehicle goes with them, he has a heart attack
c) these two strangers become frightened that he died
d) these two strangers do not call authorities or ambulance, but instead take him to a remote location where he is burned beyond recognition
e) these two strangers keep the deceased's truck in an unknown location
f) these strangers are associated with a building that appears to have stolen auto parts
g) these strangers in charge of stolen vehicle parts are the ones who showed up to test drive the valuable vehicle

Sure, the Crown always has their work cut out for them, but in this case, I believe it is the defence that will have to scramble to come up with "reasonable" doubt.

JMO

I believe the DEFENSE has its work cut out for them, not the Crown. Even in jail without bail and accused of first degree murder, there are still those who think poor DM was framed and is possibly innocent. When hell freezes over!

 

[Shaky pi]

There is so much reasonable doubt here without all the evidence that I see the defense as having a field day at this point.
AS yet we do not have the sequence of events as the prosecution wants to see it...or how the defense will lay it out. Therefore we cannot even play ball in this court at this time. IMO

to many holes , we dont really know alot , bet uwe dont even know 5 percent , and we wont untill facts get spilled , or court date in like 2015 or so ,,other people of interest not arrested yet ... dont defendants have the right to a speedy trial ( what is considered speedy exactly - just curious )

 

[Snoofo]

LE has the burner phone? Which accused was in possession of it? Do you have a link for this?

The Harley and the Harley trailer have nothing to do with the murder. Of course, a connection can be made IF it's determined that it was a chop shop. That hasn't been determined yet, or hasn't been announced that I'm aware of. I'm sure those charges will be laid as well if the evidence is found to show it was in fact a chop shop. We also don't know yet if the Eliminator has anything to do with the murder. IF it was used after the murder, that information has not yet been released.

The tattoo was only identified by the first test drive. It wasn't in the original description from SB. We also have no idea what, if any, footage they have from traffic cameras or the neighbours. We only know that the Yukon was caught on video following as they left Tim's residence. The video wasn't clear enough to even determine the vehicle at first, let alone who or how many were in it. And now we're being told that maybe no one was in it.

Yes I was never quite sure how they could go from not being able to tell what kind of car was following, "possibly an SUV" they said, to stating it was the Yukon, unless they had already found some hard evidence in the YUkon that gave them that kind of confidence to change their opinion.

And although LE has been doing a great job and Kavanagh looks and sounds like a solid man, the whole idea of suspect 3 not being a threat (which implies you know suspect 3) turning into possibility that suspect 3 doesn't exist, makes me think LE knows a lot less than we thought they did.

 

[Alethea Dice]

to many holes , we dont really know alot , bet uwe dont even know 5 percent , and we wont untill facts get spilled , or court date in like 2015 or so ,,other people of interest not arrested yet ... dont defendants have the right to a speedy trial ( what is considered speedy exactly - just curious )

Apparently about 3 years in Canada.

 

[hopingforjustice]

A man I do business with (also in the Ancaster area) also had a Dodge truck for sale on Kijiji at the same time. He did not list a phone number..just email contact. He received an email from a woman leaving a number for him to call. When he did he got a message service and just left his number. A male called back in a very abrupt tone asking what he wanted. He said..I just returned your email about my truck. The guys demeanor changed immediately and they discussed details. Someone in the background yelled "ask him if he will bring it to Mississauga". He said no...and never heard from them again.
When He told me about this I told him to call in. He called the TIPS line that night and told them all details and left his contact info. He was told that if there was a need for further info he would be contacted, otherwise he could call in 6-8 weeks to see what transpired from his call. When he told me this the next day, I gave him the dedicated number for the TB tip line and he called that night with the same info as well as giving them his report number from the night before.
He has never heard from anyone.

The number he called does not match the number listed on LB phone bill.

What's your take? I would have thought LE would have followed up on this..

 

[Blomquist]

I believe the DEFENSE has its work cut out for them, not the Crown. Even in jail without bail and accused of first degree murder, there are still those who think poor DM was framed and is possibly innocent. When hell freezes over!

Can you elaborate on why you are so convinced of his guilt when we have very little evidence at this point.

Do you think there is any need for a trial or do you feel he is guilty by way of the court of public opinion? TIA

 

[musicaljoke]

Apparently about 3 years in Canada.

Hmm... yeah, that would be speedy alright. Full steam ahead even. The lag in our court system is appalling.

Picton was charged with murder in Feb. 2002. The final Supreme Court decision was rendered in July 2010. If Picton had more money for lawyers, it might have gone on a lot longer.

 

[ellie b]

Can you elaborate on why you are so convinced of his guilt when we have very little evidence at this point.

Do you think there is any need for a trial or do you feel he is guilty by way of the court of public opinion? TIA

"very little evidence" !!!??? Don't make me laugh ! I'm sorry but the evidence that even we the general public (LE must have tons more) know about is pretty overwhelming against DM about his involvement in TB's murder and horrid disposal of his body.MOO

 

[ellie b]

A man I do business with (also in the Ancaster area) also had a Dodge truck for sale on Kijiji at the same time. He did not list a phone number..just email contact. He received an email from a woman leaving a number for him to call. When he did he got a message service and just left his number. A male called back in a very abrupt tone asking what he wanted. He said..I just returned your email about my truck. The guys demeanor changed immediately and they discussed details. Someone in the background yelled "ask him if he will bring it to Mississauga". He said no...and never heard from them again.
When He told me about this I told him to call in. He called the TIPS line that night and told them all details and left his contact info. He was told that if there was a need for further info he would be contacted, otherwise he could call in 6-8 weeks to see what transpired from his call. When he told me this the next day, I gave him the dedicated number for the TB tip line and he called that night with the same info as well as giving them his report number from the night before.
He has never heard from anyone.

The number he called does not match the number listed on LB phone bill.

What's your take? I would have thought LE would have followed up on this..

Yes, I agree, surprised that LE did not follow up.

 

[musicaljoke]

A man I do business with (also in the Ancaster area) also had a Dodge truck for sale on Kijiji at the same time. He did not list a phone number..just email contact ...

What's your take? I would have thought LE would have followed up on this..

They might have looked into it with just the info you provided and didn't need to contact anyone directly, or maybe it's one of the 700 tips that will be followed up on yet. Or maybe they don't need the information ... or maybe ... who knows? The investigation will continue for quite a while and all the tips will land on someone's desk, so it's not likely that it will be lost. You might never hear anything more about it, though.

 

[Eldee]

When you google DM's steam account profile, up comes his picture with the bloody eye. you can click on all the friends, read about his likes and game preferences etc......
Wouldn't you think, by now, that this page would be closed and only accessible to the police. Everything else is gone except this page. Weird. Has LE ever mentioned this page and picture in his pressers?

 

[jash]

When you google DM's steam account profile, up comes his picture with the bloody eye. you can click on all the friends, read about his likes and game preferences etc......
Wouldn't you think, by now, that this page would be closed and only accessible to the police. Everything else is gone except this page. Weird. Has LE ever mentioned this page and picture in his pressers?

What else is gone? I haven't noticed anything of DM's disappearing. His Facebook has been up the entire time.

And no, no mention of the Stream page or photo by LE (although I believe it did make it to MSM).

 

[Carli]

Did any 1 here ever watch JFK , theres the facts of what you and are were fed , then theres what we dont know , suspects we havnt even heard about , Facts we havnt heard about yet .. police and crown put just enough out there to keep forums like this hopping , we all speculating ,, we all have our thoughts of guilt and reasonable doubt , i do think we all agreeon theft and confinement , but with out more fact s , we can only speculate .. period . without other suspects and without cause of death , who actually did it and when , without trail of truck on night of test drive . and driver or drivers of yukon , we really dont have alot to keep building a case .

Generally, yeah - but theft and confinement? Not so much. As I read it, the confinement charge is defeated with proof that a person willingly went with those charged, without force or duress etc being used. This was obviously the case with TB who volunteered. There's an assumption that he was murdered inside the truck, based I guess on information (from where?) that seats had been removed together with the opinion they must have been removed to destroy evidence of the murder. Obviously, IF he was murdered inside his truck, that would pretty much confirm he was confined there. Otherwise....?

Also, regarding the alleged theft of TB's truck. This was discussed earlier on another thread somewhere when I suggested maybe DM actually thought he bought it. Cash in full and papers changed hands on the spot (and what happened later was a robbery gone bad by person or persons unknown.) As I recall, most people felt such an on-the-spot transaction was unlikely, if not impossible. However, in fact, it may be unwise but it's certainly not impossible. Whether something like this happened all depends on whether the transfer form on the back of the ownership papers was signed, imo, and they could prove to be essential evidence IMO. (Obviously no re-registration would have taken place - DM was promptly incarcerated and may not actually have intended this vehicle to have plates anyway.)

There are, of course, other possibilities that would discount theft of the vehicle but to examine them would take us outside the rules, IMO.

Anyway, just a couple of additional thoughts to add to consideration of the little we know, IMO.