Suspect #3: True or False

[SleuthK]

So IF Smich was driving the Yukon and TB was likely killed in his own truck, why is Smich charged with first degree murder. They must have evidence of his direct involvement in TB's death to charge him. Sheesh. JMO

Becasue they both went on the test drive. MS may have been the driver of the Yukon when it was caught on video (where this was has not been released).

 

[dotr]

It looks like the motor was the real interest. It would have been nice to get some kind of hint as to what was abnormal about the test drive. Was it their demeanor, certain questions, length of test drive, where they went for the test drive, etc. Or was it this guy just had a gut feeling?

Maybe it was the way the guys were behaving with each other?..

 

[puppyraiser]

The clothing descriptions are interesting. In all the online photos of DM, I can't recall seeing orange or red attire on him. I have see those two same colours together in a photo on other people though (orange t shirt, red hoodie). Was DM trying to set up someone else who looks like him?

 

[minisam]

Interesting article...

http://www.therecord.com/sports-story/3244013-public-cash-supported-failed-hangar-plan/

 

[redheart]

So I gather the idea was to murder somebody in order to steal a 7 year old diesel engine which, were it to be purchased new today would cost abt $21,000, and then pull and transfer said engine into their existing 9 year old vehicle. Am I missing something?

Yes, yes you are. You're missing the part where the murderers have "wiring" that is different than the rest of us. <mod snip>

 

[axe2grind]

So I gather the idea was to murder somebody in order to steal a 7 year old diesel engine which, were it to be purchased new today would cost abt $21,000, and then pull and transfer said engine into their existing 9 year old vehicle. Am I missing something?

Or they could have planned on using Tim's truck as a replacement for DM's red dually Ram. I haven't heard anything about the red truck they drove to Baja hauling the trailer, but they must still have something like that, that would have been used to drop the trailer/Tim's truck at Dm's mom's house.

If they ever find that truck, it would be interesting to know the condition of the motor and transmission.

I would still go with the desire to use the motor from Tim's truck in the yellow Jeep and turn it into a "monster" truck. There are lots of videos on youtube of conversion projects people have done like that.

 

[matou]

If there is a third suspect, Kavanagh said police do not have any leads on who it might be.
Millard&#8217;s girlfriend, whose identity is protected by a court-ordered publication ban, is not believed to be involved, the detective said.
&#8220;Millard&#8217;s girlfriend has been cleared of that,&#8221; he said.
As for the rest of names on a long list of people Millard and Smich have been ordered not to contact &#8212; including several known friends &#8212; Kavanagh would not distinguish between whether they are potential witnesses or suspects.
&#8220;They could be both,&#8221; he said.

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2...rd_suspect_exists_lead_investigator_says.html

 

[Gibson67]

how do they know that they did not pull over to where the yukon was parked, TB fought with them, was killed and maybe DM got into the yukon..they dont seem to know who was driving what right now so any scenario is possible. They saw the Yukon following at some point..Im sorry but I really think there is more than just these two involved to carry out such a horrific death.

 

[Gibson67]

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2...rd_suspect_exists_lead_investigator_says.html

so in other words they have no evidence to charge a 3rd suspect..the silence of these people to protect each other is like some gang or something.

 

[puppyraiser]

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2...rd_suspect_exists_lead_investigator_says.html If there is a third suspect, Kavanagh said police do not have any leads on who it might be. Millard’s girlfriend, whose identity is protected by a court-ordered publication ban, is not believed to be involved, the detective said. “Millard’s girlfriend has been cleared of that,” he said.
As for the rest of names on a long list of people Millard and Smich have been ordered not to contact — including several known friends — Kavanagh would not distinguish between whether they are potential witnesses or suspects.
“They could be both,” he said.

Question for our Mods: does this comment open the door to revisit certain people associated with DM and MS?

 

[axe2grind]

I'm as confused as everyone else.. why they would have gone the way they went, that Tim's phone would end up in the parking lot outside Brantford. I'm just thinking out load here...and trying to imagine how two people could manage this.

No doubt Tim was in trouble as soon as they left the driveway, since his phone signal was lost a couple of kilometres up the road near the Ancaster Fairgrounds. That's only a couple of minutes drive.

If it was just two people involved:

Where would they have left the Yukon? On the side of the road, or as far away as the Ancaster Fairground and walked 15-20 minutes to Tim's... no further than that. I thought the video showing the Yukon following the test drive was from a neighbour's house right next door. (Maybe that is wrong information.) That would have needed 3 people, or some quick action to subdue/kill Tim as soon as he was in the truck and then Smich hop out and get in the Yukon if it was just down the road. I doubt they would try anything just down the driveway in case something went wrong with their plan and Tim got away. I also can't see them walking all the way from the Ancaster Fairground to get to Tim's house. If there were only two people involved, more than likely Tim was killed before or where they stopped to pick up the Yukon. (I think there's a 3rd person involved) Hopefully the police know WAY more than they're telling the media.

At what point did the truck get put in the trailer?

If they had the red truck/trailer waiting in a parking lot somewhere, like where Tim's cell phone was found, it would have been sitting for a while as they drove back from there to Tim's house to start the test drive. That could be an hour or more. (Tim's truck was seen driving through Brantford, but that is before you get to the point where the cell phone was found.) Someone would have seen the red truck and trailer in an odd location.

Maybe Tim's truck was put in the trailer before Tim's body was removed, but it depends on how well they could align the doors of Tim's truck with the side door on the trailer to get Tim's body out of the truck once they got to the farm. There would be evidence of that inside the trailer for sure.

Or they continued on to the farm, dropped off/burned Tim's body and then loaded the truck into the trailer there. It would have been much less suspicious for DM's trailer to be on his own property.

If the trailer is clean, then likely the truck wasn't put into the trailer until it got to the hangar where the seats would likely have been removed first as well.

 

[SnoopyJay]

Just wondering...has anyone noticed on DM's steam account how there is another user named "3thumbS" who activated their account 4 days after DM activated his, and who last used his/her account 5 days after DM last used his account. Hope that makes sense. Seems like an interesting coincidence. Could possibly be someone DM spoke to and possibly conspired with? Also notice that their accounts were activated just weeks before WM died.

Sorry if this was already discussed, I have been trying to keep up with all of the many threads.

 

[Paragirl]

"A third suspect in the Tim Bosma murder case might not be on the loose after all, the lead investigator into the mysterious killing said."

“It’s possible that there’s only two involved and it’s also possible that there may have been a third. And so we’re looking into that and we still have some doors to shut, some avenues of investigation.”

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/police-question-existence-of-third-suspect-in-bosma-killing/article12370401/

 

[gimme sugar]

Was DM the only one that walked up the driveway? Or did both of them come to the front door? Does anyone have any details on this?

Both went to the house.

As for video footage, my guess, being very familiar with that area, I think it came from the Ancaster Fairgrounds. JMO.

 

[Gibson67]

Quoting myself to add that the forensics testing of TB's truck must have only shown evidence of DM being behind the wheel, otherwise why wouldn't LE entertain the possibility that DM got out of the truck and drove the Yukon.

“In reality, it could have been Smich,” said Staff Sgt. Kavanagh. “Smich could have got out of the Bosma truck and into the Yukon. So that’s why I say I’m not sure.”
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...ird-suspect-in-bosma-killing/article12370401/

how do we know DM was not the passenger in this test drive and Smich was driving..did SB see them actually get in the truck and drive away? Maybe he was driving for the first test drive but who is to say he drove on the second one>

 

[nettie_82]

Maybe forensics have come back on the yukon (second vehicle) and the only fingerprints in TB's truck and the Yukon are from DM and MS? Maybe this is why LE are now saying maybe only two people involved?

 

[Carli]

Maybe forensics have come back on the yukon (second vehicle) and the only fingerprints in TB's truck and the Yukon are from DM and MS? Maybe this is why LE are now saying maybe only two people involved?

Alternatively, it could mean that the Yukon was not the following vehicle, couldn't it? Correction - or at least the Yukon that was following was not the same as the one that belongs to DM.

 

[jash]

how do we know DM was not the passenger in this test drive and Smich was driving..did SB see them actually get in the truck and drive away? Maybe he was driving for the first test drive but who is to say he drove on the second one>

I suspect SB did see DM get behind the wheel (and told LE this) but we don't know for sure.

At the May 10th press conference, Kavanagh said in describing the first test-drive: "It was almost identical scenario. The fact that two individuals walked up to this male's business, not having a vehicle. The test drive was the same - one, the taller individual, in the driver's seat, the potential victim in passenger seat, and one male behind him."

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-QQvNrsjgBk"]Hamilton Police Press Conference - Update on Tim Bosma (missing person) for May 10, 2013 - YouTube[/ame] (starts @ 8:05)

I'd be shocked if police do not have any evidence (finger prints, hair, DNA etc.) of DM in the driver's seat of TB's truck.

 

[THXGuru]

Maybe LE is stumped, surely they've torn computers apart...questioned so many POI's and are getting no where. They are spending tons of money on this case and are at a dead end.
...OR maybe they're hoping that by saying there is no 3rd person, someone out there will get sloppy and do something to give themselves up!

I cannot see how Tim was murdered in the vehicle by DM's hands alone, there had to be someone else in the truck!! Unless he was shot or tasered...

What about MS's black eye and mark on his face...if LE did that when they arrested him, it would be kind of odd for MS to hide it from the reporters in the courtroom that day if he was innocent...you would think he'd want the world to see what LE did to him, (in his eyes) unjustly!!

Was it not written somewhere that a third man dropped them off and said he'd be back later to pick them up? Not that everything in print in factual but I definitely recall reading there was a third person. Or, was this just info relayed from the two who showed up to test drive the trucks?

IMO, the 3rd suspect would not be a danger to the public if he/sh were known to police and cooperating with police, in custody or deceased. Now without a POI, the 3rd suspect if he/she exists could be anywhere AND could be even more dangerous to the public. This person would have access to any of the information we can glean, can use this information to continue eluding police and perhaps go after revenge. If I were certain folk who have been named in the MSM, I would be going into hiding myself until this person was in custody. At this point, I don't have a lot of confidence in the TPS :banghead:

This is really confusing. I was under the impression that (a) MS was suspect #2 i.e. along for the test-drive; and (b) the video of the Yukon tailing TB's truck was captured shortly after the test-drive began. Am I wrong about this?

If there really is no suspect #3, then DM and MS likely drove themselves to Ancaster in the Yukon and parked it within walking distance of TB's house. Then the two of them, along with TB, got into the Ram for the supposed test-drive. Then TB was incapacitated/killed near the parked Yukon (either at the beginning or end of the test-drive), and MS hopped out leaving DM and TB in the truck while he followed in the Yukon. I don't think it would make sense to leave DM driving an alive-and-well TB with MS in another vehicle ... too much could go wrong for their plan.

I wonder if HPS is changing their tune about a suspect #3 because the forensics came back from Yukon and only showed traces of DM and MS behind the wheel?

Well, if LE do not know if there was a third suspect or not, then it is a blow to LE and a positive thing for those who are charged. I find it hard to believe that LE appeared so sure that there was a third suspect only to change their tune this far down the road, this just simply does not make sense.

IMO, LE should come clean with the facts of what they do know and what they don't know regarding a third suspect. Not knowing whether there was a third suspect is a clear indicator that they may not who did what...(remember, DM and MS are innocent until they are proven guilty).

 

[bessie]

In light of today's news, we're going to re-open this thread for comments.

The discussion is NOT OPEN to speculation about particular individuals.


Police question existence of third suspect in Bosma killing

JILL MAHONEY and KATHRYN BLAZE CARLSON The Globe and Mail
Published Thursday, Jun. 06 2013, 6:00 AM EDT
Last updated Thursday, Jun. 06 2013, 6:17 AM EDT

&#8220;As an investigator, you always talk about tunnel vision and I think it&#8217;d be tunnel vision for me to say that I definitely believe there&#8217;s a third person or to say there wasn&#8217;t,&#8221; Staff Sergeant Matt Kavanagh said Wednesday. &#8220;It&#8217;s possible that there&#8217;s only two involved and it&#8217;s also possible that there may have been a third. And so we&#8217;re looking into that and we still have some doors to shut, some avenues of investigation.&#8221;