Tempo Restaurant: What Happened There?

[ILOKAL]

Sometimes things sound like a good idea at the moment, then after more careful consideration, one realizes it might actually be a better idea to reconsider. That might be what happened with Zapped. Going to Tempo as a lookieloo to case the joint and investigate what was actually a real crime scene involving a case that has drawn international attention and then reporting those findings on a public sleuthing forum just might not be the best thing to do. If Zapped did reconsider I hope he knows we will certainly understand his position and respect him for it.

Zapped, we miss you and look forward to your return! :yourock:

 

[SteveP]

Sometimes things sound like a good idea at the moment, then after more careful consideration, one realizes it might actually be a better idea to reconsider. That might be what happened with Zapped. Going to Tempo as a lookieloo to case the joint and investigate what was actually a real crime scene involving a case that has drawn international attention and then reporting those findings on a public sleuthing forum just might not be the best thing to do. If Zapped did reconsider I hope he knows we will certainly understand his position and respect him for it. Zapped, we miss you and look forward to your return! :yourock:

I agree completely, and other than just getting a feel for the place, and possibly spotting a cam in the area, which we are already confident at least one or two exists, I' m not really sure what else anyone thinks one of us would learn from a visit there. I highly doubt the employees are gonna just open up and start discussing this case or their operations with a stranger that just walks in. JMO

 

[hambirg]

I have to admit, everything that the WS'ers have surmised makes sense to me until we get to the part where JLM "escapes" and gets all the way to Texas! I can understand LE suspecting him and "shadowing" him, hoping that he would revisit the dump site. But to lose him because of his driving at a high rate of speed and getting all the way to TEXAS! It just seems like such a "drop the ball" thing in what seems an otherwise tight series of events by LE. I wonder if they had tabs on him all the way to Texas? Wonder if they were trying to see who he would call, what he would say, what he might do etc. It just seems so very out of step with the rest of the actions by LE that he "got away" right under their noses. It leaves me scratching my head, for sure!

I just realized that this is probably the wrong thread for this comment. My apologies.

I don't think they ever lost him. It was reported that the "overt" followers lost him. We also know his family's phones were tapped. I think JM's phone was likely tapped early on too. I think LE knew he was going to run, so they let him go until the forensics from the search came back. Which is exactly when "Karen" found him on the remote beach in Texas. That served two purposes. If we put this in the context that the FBI was invovled and they believe that JM is a possible serial killer, I think LE wanted to bring him in in the worst way, but didn't have grounds to do so yet. When he ran LE was able to issue the federal fugitive from justice warrant. I think LE was also hoping they would get lucky and JM might try to move or revist Hannah.

 

[Charlie Chan]

I don't think they ever lost him. It was reported that the "overt" followers lost him. We also know his family's phones were tapped. I think JM's phone was likely tapped early on too. I think LE knew he was going to run, so they let him go until the forensics from the search came back. Which is exactly when "Karen" found him on the remote beach in Texas. That served two purposes. If we put this in the context that the FBI was invovled and they believe that JM is a possible serial killer, I think LE wanted to bring him in in the worst way, but didn't have grounds to do so yet. When he ran LE was able to issue the federal fugitive from justice warrant. I think LE was also hoping they would get lucky and JM might try to move or revist Hannah.

Totally agree.....that's more like it. I just could not let myself buy the "lost and on the lam" story! This makes much more sense!

 

[Enni]

Yes, to everything you have said. But HOW did they know it was JLM? Hannah was reported missing late in the afternoon on 9/14. By what had to be quite early on 9/16, LE had apparently (according to the timeline) already identified him! Yet it wasn't until that same day (also the 16th) that LE received a tip that Hannah had been at the DTM, then went to Tempo and got a description and name of the POI AND searched the UVA hospital area. Also, a statement from a university to its students along with the sketch was sent on 9/15!!! Even BEFORE they knew Hannah had been at the mall! So SOMEONE in LE had to have had JLM on their radar as soon as Hannah was reported missing under similar circumstances as MH. So was LE's wild goose chase (with the public) that took place between 9/14 and 9/19 that reported all the various descriptions done in hopes that JLM would lead them to Hannah or was it part of a cover-up for having let a rapist/murderer continue to roam the counties of VA for the past 12 years? IMO

ETA: Ennie, what do you mean by your first sentence? According to LE, JLM WASN'T on their radar prior to 9/19 OR 9/16. That's just it - he WAS walking around freely, allegedly NOT on LE's radar. IMO

I was just saying that I personally don't think JLM was on LE's radar prior to Hannah's disappearance. He was walking around freely b/c he was not yet a suspect in anything.

It seems likely to me that LE got reports early on about JLM and HG having been seen on the mall — both were quite visible and distinctive. Plus, JLM was very well-known in the area.

I don't think we can assume anything from LE's reporting of tips — it seems clear that they deliberately put out inaccurate info in those early days, likely in an attempt to see just how JLM would respond. They may very well have heard from WG (esp. if it's true, as some WS'ers have speculated, that he's a doorman) and/or others well before it was announced to the public.

As far as I know, JLM only spoke briefly to LE about HG when LE came to search his apt., following the car search. He lawyered up prior to the initial arrest warrant (for reckless driving.)

I tend to think that LE must have allowed him to escape, knowing it would be easier to keep him behind bars as a fugitive (no bail.) Otherwise, it's just jaw-dropping ineptitude.

I believe every action on LE's part (incl. FBI) had to do with testing how JLM would react — not as "part of a cover-up for having let a rapist/murderer continue to roam the counties of VA for the past 12 years." No way IMO.

 

[ILOKAL]

I was just saying that I personally don't think JLM was on LE's radar prior to Hannah's disappearance. He was walking around freely b/c he was not yet a suspect in anything.

It seems likely to me that LE got reports early on about JLM and HG having been seen on the mall — both were quite visible and distinctive. Plus, JLM was very well-known in the area.

I don't think we can assume anything from LE's reporting of tips — it seems clear that they deliberately put out inaccurate info in those early days, likely in an attempt to see just how JLM would respond. They may very well have heard from WG (esp. if it's true, as some WS'ers have speculated, that he's a doorman) and/or others well before it was announced to the public.

As far as I know, JLM only spoke briefly to LE about HG when LE came to search his apt., following the car search. He lawyered up prior to the initial arrest warrant (for reckless driving.)

I tend to think that LE must have allowed him to escape, knowing it would be easier to keep him behind bars as a fugitive (no bail.) Otherwise, it's just jaw-dropping ineptitude.

I believe every action on LE's part (incl. FBI) had to do with testing how JLM would react — not as "part of a cover-up for having let a rapist/murderer continue to roam the counties of VA for the past 12 years." No way IMO.

Yet there HAS to be an explanation for LE having been able to identify JLM late on the 14th (Hannah was first reported missing at 4:34 PM that day) to enable the university to make a statement to students regarding "sketch" as early as the 15th! See what I mean? The way I see it is JLM would have HAD to already be on LE's radar in order for that to have happened when it did. IMO

(I want to say it's not that I don't understand what you're saying because I DO, it just doesn't answer the question as to LE's apparent knowledge of him to respond the way they did by NLT the 15th! IMO.)

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

**Clipped for response...

I tend to think that LE must have allowed him to escape, knowing it would be easier to keep him behind bars as a fugitive (no bail.) Otherwise, it's just jaw-dropping ineptitude.

I believe every action on LE's part (incl. FBI) had to do with testing how JLM would react — not as "part of a cover-up for having let a rapist/murderer continue to roam the counties of VA for the past 12 years." No way IMO.

OMG!!! Are you saying you agree with these tactics by LE?? Under no circumstances do I condone this type of behavior....letting someone run across the country with the hopes they will be caught? If it turns out that JM is responsible for MH, HG and anyone else, I'll say LE's tactics of playing with suspects DOES NOT WORK!!!

 

[Enni]

OMG!!! Are you saying you agree with these tactics by LE?? Under no circumstances do I condone this type of behavior....letting someone run across the country with the hopes they will be caught? If it turns out that JM is responsible for MH, HG and anyone else, I'll say LE's tactics of playing with suspects DOES NOT WORK!!!

I'm saying that I think they (LE, FBI) only pretended to let him flee, all the while tracking him (possibly via GPS.)

We know for sure that his family's phones were being tapped. LE just didn't have enough evidence for an arrest at that time.... The "reckless driving" charge was it, and he would have been free on bail within minutes. By running, he became a federal fugitive from justice. (JLM actually inquired about bail in Galveston. He may have learning disabilities, but apparently knows his way around a courtroom. Bail was automatically denied due to the federal charge.)

 

[ILOKAL]

I'm saying that I think they (LE, FBI) only pretended to let him flee, all the while tracking him (possibly via GPS.)

We know for sure that his family's phones were being tapped. LE just didn't have enough evidence for an arrest at that time.... The "reckless driving" charge was it, and he would have been free on bail within minutes. By running, he became a federal fugitive from justice. (JLM actually inquired about bail in Galveston. He may have learning disabilities, but apparently knows his way around a courtroom. Bail was automatically denied due to the federal charge.)

Personally, I've always thought JLM was being "followed" and we know his Father's phone was tapped. JLM also called his uncle, Conly Greer in Louisiana and from what I understand, LE knew about that TOO! There is a lot of information on sites we can't post and some of what I've read indicates that LE knew where JLM was at all times. Allowing Karen to "find" him enabled LE and the FBI to keep a not of their tactics close to the vest. Without sources, please consider this as my opinion. Also recall Longo's calm when stating that JLM presumably was on the run!

 

[Conductor71]

I'm saying that I think they (LE, FBI) only pretended to let him flee, all the while tracking him (possibly via GPS.)

We know for sure that his family's phones were being tapped. LE just didn't have enough evidence for an arrest at that time.... The "reckless driving" charge was it, and he would have been free on bail within minutes. By running, he became a federal fugitive from justice. (JLM actually inquired about bail in Galveston. He may have learning disabilities, but apparently knows his way around a courtroom. Bail was automatically denied due to the federal charge.)

I agree that LE baited JM and encouraged him to "flee" because up to that point they had no grounds to arrest him. If they were tailing him by car all around C'ville within days of HG missing persons status, it seems highly unlikely LE was clueless as to his whereabouts once he crossed state lines. Using a GPS type gadget would have been illegal with just a reckless driving charge, I imagine. Longo has a law degree, so I think he bent the rules as much as he could but was careful not to break any laws for obvious reasons.

We know that his family's phones were wire tapped so LE placed him in LA. They also most likely knew when he entered TX. Apparently, there is some sort of electronic device that could photograph JM at toll booths, and according to a news source LE knew he was in TX. I think that for legal reasons LE had to make it appear that someone serendipitously found JM on the beach. It was easy as all they had to do was alert LE in all involved states; they had Charlottesville's back.

The source also told me they knew he was in Texas because of highway technology.

“It wouldn’t surprise me a bit if police have a way to photograph a car that goes through say a toll that sets off an algorithm or a ping that would lead them to the Galveston area,” said Banks.

http://wtvr.com/2014/09/24/report-c...rs-tripped-up-uva-abduction-suspect-in-texas/

 

[Conductor71]

(JLM actually inquired about bail in Galveston. He may have learning disabilities, but apparently knows his way around a courtroom. Bail was automatically denied due to the federal charge.)

I missed that. From what I had read, bail was a moot point given he was already a proven flight risk. No bond was set according to court document and he waived his right

See attached statutory warnings doc.

 

[Charlie Chan]

Yes, the more I think about it and the more I read others perceptions here, I do believe that he was being followed on his field trip to Texas. And for what it's worth, I agree with that tactic if it was to produce additional information about other victims, accomplices, etc. It certainly was not the FBI's first rodeo......and I have faith in their training and strategy.

 

[hambirg]

Yet there HAS to be an explanation for LE having been able to identify JLM late on the 14th (Hannah was first reported missing at 4:34 PM that day) to enable the university to make a statement to students regarding "sketch" as early as the 15th! See what I mean? The way I see it is JLM would have HAD to already be on LE's radar in order for that to have happened when it did. IMO

(I want to say it's not that I don't understand what you're saying because I DO, it just doesn't answer the question as to LE's apparent knowledge of him to respond the way they did by NLT the 15th! IMO.)

Here's the report about the Washington and Lee sighting.

On September 15, 2014, the Department of Public Safety received information from the Lexington Police Department that they had received a report of the possible sighting of a male subject identified as a person of interest in the abduction and murder of a Virginia Tech student, several years ago, who was visiting the UVA campus.
http://www.newsplex.com/home/headli...lic-Safety-Notice-275375341.html?device=phone

What I'm suggesting is that there was no sighting reported to Lexington Police on Sept 15th. Instead there was a call from the FBI/CPD to Lexington PD or DPS on the 16th.

I can't find anything that suggessts the sketch was released before the 16th. If you can find something please share it.

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

Yes, the more I think about it and the more I read others perceptions here, I do believe that he was being followed on his field trip to Texas. And for what it's worth, I agree with that tactic if it was to produce additional information about other victims, accomplices, etc. It certainly was not the FBI's first rodeo......and I have faith in their training and strategy.

I guess it's a good thing for the people on the beach that JM wasn't in one of his feisty moods before the cops arrived to take him away!

Sounds like we'd have had a better chance of LE picking him up if he would have been suspected of driving drunk rather than of committing murder....

 

[Conductor71]

Here's the report about the Washington and Lee sighting.

On September 15, 2014, the Department of Public Safety received information from the Lexington Police Department that they had received a report of the possible sighting of a male subject identified as a person of interest in the abduction and murder of a Virginia Tech student, several years ago, who was visiting the UVA campus.
http://www.newsplex.com/home/headli...lic-Safety-Notice-275375341.html?device=phone

What I'm suggesting is that there was no sighting reported to Lexington Police on Sept 15th. Instead there was a call from the FBI/CPD to Lexington PD or DPS on the 16th.

I can't find anything that suggessts the sketch was released before the 16th. If you can find something please share it.

The FBI composite sketch was released in 2012 after LE made some sort of DNA analysis that substantiated the rapist as most likely African-American. I think it has been freely circulating since that time but agree with you that LE was behind this wanting to bring the cold cases back in the public eye. However, why would they choose Washington & Lee? Is it arbitrary or strategic that Lexington was put on the map?

Many of the reports on this reveal that the actual "sighting" happened several days up two weeks prior the earliest news report date of Sept 15th? It is not explained why the person waited so long to call LE in Lexington. If indeed that happened at all...

According to the information received from Lexington Police, the report they received came several days after the sighting of the individual had occurred and they have not been in contact with any individuals matching that description or sketch.

http://wtvr.com/2014/09/16/public-safety-notice-issued-that-morgan-harrington-suspect-sighted/

Does that make the tip seem more realistic or genuine?

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

I'm saying that I think they (LE, FBI) only pretended to let him flee, all the while tracking him (possibly via GPS.)

We know for sure that his family's phones were being tapped. LE just didn't have enough evidence for an arrest at that time.... The "reckless driving" charge was it, and he would have been free on bail within minutes. By running, he became a federal fugitive from justice. (JLM actually inquired about bail in Galveston. He may have learning disabilities, but apparently knows his way around a courtroom. Bail was automatically denied due to the federal charge.)

I get the impression some feel it's perfectly fine for LE to manipulate a situation in such a way so they can get a no-bail situation. Number one, what they did with JM was very risky behavior in the way of public safety. Number two, I don't agree with with under-handed manipulation of the system and people's rights.

 

[ILOKAL]

Here's the report about the Washington and Lee sighting.

On September 15, 2014, the Department of Public Safety received information from the Lexington Police Department that they had received a report of the possible sighting of a male subject identified as a person of interest in the abduction and murder of a Virginia Tech student, several years ago, who was visiting the UVA campus.
http://www.newsplex.com/home/headli...lic-Safety-Notice-275375341.html?device=phone

What I'm suggesting is that there was no sighting reported to Lexington Police on Sept 15th. Instead there was a call from the FBI/CPD to Lexington PD or DPS on the 16th.

I can't find anything that suggessts the sketch was released before the 16th. If you can find something please share it.

In my thinking, I don't think it matters that the actual "sketch" was released on the 16th if, in fact, that's when it was released. The connection AND identification (of JLM) HAD to have been made no later than the 15th in order for that statement to have been made ON the 15th. IMO

 

[SteveP]

I get the impression some feel it's perfectly fine for LE to manipulate a situation in such a way so they can get a no-bail situation. Number one, what they did with JM was very risky behavior in the way of public safety. Number two, I don't agree with with under-handed manipulation of the system and people's rights.

On an intellectual level I may agree, but on an emotional level I care about JLM's rights about as much as he cared about Hannah's and his other victims'. JMO

 

[newredtabby]

I get the impression some feel it's perfectly fine for LE to manipulate a situation in such a way so they can get a no-bail situation. Number one, what they did with JM was very risky behavior in the way of public safety. Number two, I don't agree with with under-handed manipulation of the system and people's rights.

You can get whatever impression you want, and other people get their opinions too. What does this have to do with the Tempo thread?

 

[Enni]

I get the impression some feel it's perfectly fine for LE to manipulate a situation in such a way so they can get a no-bail situation. Number one, what they did with JM was very risky behavior in the way of public safety. Number two, I don't agree with with under-handed manipulation of the system and people's rights.

Unfortunately, the entire justice system seems to be rife with gamesmanship and manipulation. Perps regularly plead not guilty even when their lawyers know they're guilty — b/c it gives them bargaining power. Just wait till the trials in this case start.

Personally, I wish it all had more to do with the truth, but that's not the system we have. There are plenty of people in jail who would have walked if they'd only had better representation, more money, etc. And plenty who walked or got reduced sentences b/c they did have more money, better representation, etc. Even for the very same crimes. How is any of this fair? What about justice for the victims / their families?