The Canvas Laundry Bags

[sumbunny]

It is a quandary.

Normally I try to avoid hypothesis, and wait for the facts to lay themselves out, but here I'll make an exception.

Could the body have been in the trunk, relatively un-contained for the 2 plus days of detected decomposition, and then wrapped up/contained more securely with laundry bag, etc for the remaining time?

Perhaps this would explain what appears to be a relatively small amount of staining in the trunk liner compared to the reported excessive smell, as well as the elevated levels of chloroform.

I agree completely with your theory. Body started leaking, casey then bagged her 2 days later.

I believe primarily she had her wrapped in a blanket.

the bagging came after she realized the body started to leak. She also probably thought that the bagging would contain the smell along with the leaking...(thus the laundry sheet to attempt to cover the horrid smell)

I believe all the bagging, was done in the garage. The neighbour did notice casey backing into the garage on two different occassions after the 16th.

This makes perfect sense. First time to bag her...apparently it still leaked ..came back, bagged her again, and then put the laundry bag over the 2nd bag in order to be able to carry the remains without tearing the bag.

*gak* so awful to talk about.

 

[Theonly1]

I'm not very surprised about the remains being scattered. I've had personal experience with raccoons making short work of Wheeling Steel garbage cans with locking lids. I don't think a fabric laundry bag with the top held open by a metal hoop would provide much of a challenge to the local critters.

.

Heh. In our garage raccoons have entered at night via the cat's running hole, unscrewed a plastic lid from a cat food container and helped themselves. They are very intelligent creatures.

 

[dunlurken]

Just to clarify -- The laundry bag i.e. Whitney Design item #2516, which was found with Caylee, is a circular design. The rectangular laundry hamper found at Hopespring is shown below.

http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFiles/3374B TO 3463B REDO.pdf

You just posted something extremely useful. The "tag" below the pic says the canvas bag was found inside a large trash bag inside the Anthony's home I think it said garage. CRS. Maybe that's where the confusion is coming in.

 

[Theonly1]

I agree completely with your theory. Body started leaking, casey then bagged her 2 days later.

I believe primarily she had her wrapped in a blanket.

the bagging came after she realized the body started to leak. She also probably thought that the bagging would contain the smell along with the leaking...(thus the laundry sheet to attempt to cover the horrid smell)

.

This makes sense especially in light of the fact the documents mention how stained the Pooh blanket was. What it was stained with was not yet determined--be it decomp, urine, feces or whatnot.

 

[fortytwo]

Yeah, it was approximately 87 feet or so from the light pole.

Casey was so LAZY-LAZY-LAZY.

How about it was less than 19 ft. from the curb. If there hadn't been a tree in the way the bag could have been thrown from a car.

 

[Rumpole]

I see the discusion has turned on itself somewhat.

HotDogs: Read earlier posts - clearly explain that the laundry bag pictured in docs is "same brand" not the same style or shape. The bag at the remains had a cat. # and it is the round one. Besides you can see it is the damned round one.

fortytwo: The confusion about which bag was inside which was down to an ambiguous passage in previous docs. It could have been either. As it turmns out you were right and I was wrong. But proposing a hypothesis and testing as facts are found is what science and sleuthing is all about. In my defense - I was imagining a cloth bag with draw stings and not an epic construction of canvas an a WATERPROOF VINYL lining. If i had known of that I MAY have assumed it would be too awkward for Dopey to manoeuvre.
These remains site photos are obviously very early. Before tape and the tent. I believe the skull etc is still in situ. These photos taken from beyond the main remains looking back towards Suburban. The skull etc would be just out of shot on the right. No doubt there were sets of photos from all angles that we are not shown.

 

[Macushla]

Isn't it shocking how CLOSE to the road, the laundry bag (Caylee) was dumped! The reports say the black garbage bag with yellow ties, had been inside the white canvas laundry bag.


I just grabbed our trusty tape measure and measured from our curb back towards our house. I was astonished at how short a distance 19' is when you are looking at it. Of course there was no vegetation between me and the curb, or water either for that matter, but it is still amazing at how lazy anc callous KC was.

 

[fortytwo]

I see the discusion has turned on itself somewhat.

HotDogs: Read earlier posts - clearly explain that the laundry bag pictured in docs is "same brand" not the same style or shape. The bag at the remains had a cat. # and it is the round one. Besides you can see it is the damned round one.

fortytwo: The confusion about which bag was inside which was down to an ambiguous passage in previous docs. It could have been either. As it turmns out you were right and I was wrong. But proposing a hypothesis and testing as facts are found is what science and sleuthing is all about. In my defense - I was imagining a cloth bag with draw stings and not an epic construction of canvas an a WATERPROOF VINYL lining. If i had known of that I MAY have assumed it would be too awkward for Dopey to manoeuvre.
These remains site photos are obviously very early. Before tape and the tent. I believe the skull etc is still in situ. These photos taken from beyond the main remains looking back towards Suburban. The skull etc would be just out of shot on the right. No doubt there were sets of photos from all angles that we are not shown.

(bold above by me)

's okay, Herc. I wasn't trying for an ITYS. (new acronym, :waitasec.

I wasn't right or wrong. Or even trying to be. It just seems like our best first line of offense in this kind of problem solving seems to be separating what we know from what we think we know or would like to know.

 

[fortytwo]

Isn't it shocking how CLOSE to the road, the laundry bag (Caylee) was dumped! The reports say the black garbage bag with yellow ties, had been inside the white canvas laundry bag.


I just grabbed our trusty tape measure and measured from our curb back towards our house. I was astonished at how short a distance 19' is when you are looking at it. Of course there was no vegetation between me and the curb, or water either for that matter, but it is still amazing at how lazy anc callous KC was.

Knowing that, and having seen the actual site photos including the "path" and growth to either side certainly does make RK's story much more plausible, don't you think?

If I were looking for a discreet spot for a "rest stop" in a crowded residential neighborhood that would be a very attractive location.

 

[Rumpole]

Open style of this bag changes my thinking a bit.

Possible that Dopey put things like clothes and blankets on top of body to disguise?

The picture that LE say shows Caylee in the striped shorts looks like a younger Caylee, so old clothes? I can almost remember that Kids grow out of clothes in very short time.

I see the renewed interest in Hapless GA and his change speak. At the least, his testimony could pin point date of body dumping.

My overall hypothesis stands, but I could accept body dumped on 20th or 24th.

 

[FORDANIEL]

The pic I have cropped here from the crime scene is amongst the thousands at My Fox Orlando Set #4 pic 17 onwards. About 7 or 8 pics of interest:

http://media.myfoxorlando.com/photogalleries/021809remainsfoundOCSOpictures_set4/indexGallery.htm

I believe that if you look at pic # 24 going left to right you will see the skull and the bags,the measurments seem right to me.

 

[Rumpole]

These pics might show the striped shorts and t-shirt found.

Has anybody seen larger, better resolution pics of these events:

 

[tabbykiki]

Open style of this bag changes my thinking a bit.

Possible that Dopey put things like clothes and blankets on top of body to disguise?

The picture that LE say shows Caylee in the striped shorts looks like a younger Caylee, so old clothes? I can almost remember that Kids grow out of clothes in very short time.

I see the renewed interest in Hapless GA and his change speak. At the least, his testimony could pin point date of body dumping.

My overall hypothesis stands, but I could accept body dumped on 20th or 24th.

Herc,
That is true that kids outgrow clothes pretty quickly... I have three young ones and I can tell you though their shorts seem to last for a couple of summers, especially the elastic ones. I can see where they are the same shorts in the pic and at the crime scene. Especially if they are 24 mos in size (I believe that is the size they had listed). Caylee was 2-1/2 and looked to be built on the small side IMO. I can see that she probably wore those shorts when she was younger (when the pic was taken) and they still fit last summer.

 

[Rumpole]

Herc,
That is true that kids outgrow clothes pretty quickly... I have three young ones and I can tell you though their shorts seem to last for a couple of summers, especially the elastic ones. I can see where they are the same shorts in the pic and at the crime scene. Especially if they are 24 mos in size (I believe that is the size they had listed). Caylee was 2-1/2 and looked to be built on the small side IMO. I can see that she probably wore those shorts when she was younger (when the pic was taken) and they still fit last summer.

I can go along with that for the shorts.

 

[SL_Zero]

Can't say for sure, but the first thought that comes to mind is to keep it clean and dry in the Florida humidity. What they refer to as "air" down there most people would call bathwater.

:floorlaugh:

well put. as a fl native ive always loved the wet air. never heard it referred to as bathwater. hilarious. my ny-er husband will die laughing when i show him this.

i dont think that it would get mildewy in the garage, unless there is seriously something wrong with their garage. stuff gets funky when its rained on (like patio furniture etc, but cloth in a garage should be fine.

also, love your u-name.

 

[fortytwo]

:floorlaugh:

well put. as a fl native ive always loved the wet air. never heard it referred to as bathwater. hilarious. my ny-er husband will die laughing when i show him this.

i dont think that it would get mildewy in the garage, unless there is seriously something wrong with their garage. stuff gets funky when its rained on (like patio furniture etc, but cloth in a garage should be fine.

also, love your u-name.

Thank You.

I recall a visit to FL. in '76. It was Thanksgiving weekend, and I was staying in a campground near Coral Gables. My most vivid memory was that if you hung out laundry it would just get wetter.

I promptly fled for more northern climes, and that, in short, is why I'm here in NC.

 

[Everly]

You mean, the State putting GA on the stand, getting the canvas bag out of evidence, holding it up for GA and the jury and saying, "Mr. Anthony was THIS the LAUNDRY BAG you saw in the trunk of the Sunfire on June X, 2009?"

[I can hear the objections now...]

He'd probably say "well I thought it was a laundry bag but I just didn't know a pizza could look so much like a laundry bag and smell like decomp."

 

[sua_sponte]

About the bags being stuck together - if the canvas bag had a plastic lining, it's very possible that the FL heat fused the trash bag and the canvas bag together.

Re the laundry bag being stored in a black trash bag at the Anthony home - if it wasn't in active use, it very likely that Cindy would cover it to prevent it from collecting dust. Especially in a laundry/garage area. It's also possible that both laundry bags were stored together in on that shelf, and would explain why Cindy never noticed one missing.

Also- Tony mentioned that Casey had been doing laundry at his house. That bag may have already been in use by Casey so Cindy would not have considered it missing.

About George seeing "clothes" in her trunk on the day of the gas can incident - I believe he probably did see that laundry bag in there and just assumed it was clothes. I wonder if the police told the Anthony's that the body was found in a canvas laundry bag, and that is what sent George over the edge towards suicide??

 

[sua_sponte]

Oh- and another thought on why she didn't bag the body for a couple of days - rigor mortis. Does anyone know when it would have set in, and when it would have let up?

 

[Rumpole]

About the bags being stuck together - if the canvas bag had a plastic lining, it's very possible that the FL heat fused the trash bag and the canvas bag together.

Re the laundry bag being stored in a black trash bag at the Anthony home - if it wasn't in active use, it very likely that Cindy would cover it to prevent it from collecting dust. Especially in a laundry/garage area. It's also possible that both laundry bags were stored together in on that shelf, and would explain why Cindy never noticed one missing.

Also- Tony mentioned that Casey had been doing laundry at his house. That bag may have already been in use by Casey so Cindy would not have considered it missing.

About George seeing "clothes" in her trunk on the day of the gas can incident - I believe he probably did see that laundry bag in there and just assumed it was clothes. I wonder if the police told the Anthony's that the body was found in a canvas laundry bag, and that is what sent George over the edge towards suicide??

I do not know wheter to believe GA or not. I totally would accept he did see laundry or he didn't. If he did then the body almost certainly dumped soon after that incident (24th)

If he did not see into the trunk at all then body could still have been there, he just didn't see it, or it had already been dumped on 20th.