The case for murder

[Mrs. Holmes]

Does anyone know if DS had another man in her life? Dating etc. I wonder if H<modsnip> stayed at her house?

 

[stilettos]

..after failing to even mention the 4 subgaleal hemorrhages at the press conference-----news 8 called him out on it once the AR was released..

http://www.cbs8.com/story/15406681/...to-zahau-family-attorney?clienttype=printable



-------------there you go, he noted them in the AR, thought nothing of them----and she "may" have hit her head causing them to occur.

( thanks for the usual brush-off nothing answer M.E.lucas..)

Oh my dear Lord...like that is clinical? :banghead:

 

[Mrs. Holmes]

I agree with you. I also still think RZ was hogtied. Why else is there an extra long segment (7 feet) of rope dangling according to autopsy? Take a look at this picture of woman in hogtie.

<modsnip>
Does this not resemble the description by ME of how her wrists and ankles were tied with figure 8 bindings?

Adam Shacknai had stated that he cut her wrists ties to loosen them. What if he purposefully cut down the rope between the wrist and ankle ties so that the hogtie is destroyed? Had there been a clear hogtie, it would have made RZ's so-called suicide IMPOSSIBLE.

Look also at this alternate version at

<modsnip>
What if RZ was first hogtied and made to kneel in a chair in front of her captor who kept hitting her on her forehead with dogbone to cause the four head contusions? And then when murderer/tormentor grabbed her off chair to lead her to balcony, he accidentally knocked the chair over as he hoisted her over his shoulder. This would be consistent with why wicker chair was knocked over.

----
JMO :detective:

Chilling.... and very possible.

 

[Mrs. Holmes]

All of that rope has to be properly examined to see how all the cuts match up and what instrument was used to cut each part.

 

[curiousjo]

Does anyone know if DS had another man in her life? Dating etc. I wonder if Howard stayed at her house?

Someone mentioned that DS has a boyfriend, and his daughter posted something about MS brain injury. But, never heard actual name of BF. Anyone know it?
Also recall somthing about him answering DS door at some point... I assumed they that was at the Coronado Island home.

In regards to Howie, it would be interesting to know if he stayed at DS home. He is her AZ neighbor.

 

[sorrell skye]

Lt. Nesbit said the only way Zahau's phone could be examined would be to dismantle it, and the department deemed that was unnecessary, adding there's "nothing on the phone central to the evidence. We don't have any unanswered questions."

http://www.fox5sandiego.com/news/ks...ds-to-zahau-attorney-20111001,0,4865783.story

bbm

How would the SDCSD know there's "nothing on the phone central to evidence" unless the phone is forensically examined?

"We don't have any unanswered questions."

There's no such thing as every question being answered and every fact being known. One of the most important characteristics for a good investigator to possess is the willingness & ability to question. An excellent investigator continues to question, even when it may appear that the answers have been discovered, because an excellent investigator desires to prove herself/himself wrong, in the burning hope of arriving @ the truth.

My training is in kinesiology, human anatomy, and psychology. One of the very first things I was taught was that one must always remain open to possibilities, always remain skeptical, always question; in the pursuit of truth, in the pursuit of scientific exploration.

Science ALWAYS has unanswered questions. A true investigator or researcher (whether a CSI or a researcher in any other scientific field) will never say "I don't have any unanswered questions."

In my experience, when someone says "I don't have any unanswered questions", what they are really saying is:

1. They lack enough knowledge on the subject at hand to frame intelligent questions.

Or

2. They have already arrived at a preconceived conclusion, thereby refusing to be open to any information that may challenge their preconceived conclusion, i.e. a form of cognitive dissonance.

Or

3. They have only paid attention to information that bolsters their preconceived conclusion, i.e. confirmation bias.

Or

4. Any combination of the above

The bottom line: There are ALWAYS unanswered questions.

 

[lauriej]

Lt. Nesbit said the only way Zahau's phone could be examined would be to dismantle it, and the department deemed that was unnecessary, adding there's "nothing on the phone central to the evidence. We don't have any unanswered questions."

.

..that's twice that nesbitt has said something idiotic about the phone..

http://www.cbs8.com/story/15520745/...us-cell-phone-new-witnesses-accounts-reported

In the early days of the investigation, Jonah Shacknai told detectives he had left the voicemail message, Lt. Nesbit recalled.

"If we could have gotten it (the voicemail), yes, it would have been helpful but it was not critical to the case," said Lt. Nesbit.

..pardon???

..one of THE reasons nesbitt himself gave via powerpoint at the PC as to WHY rebecca suddenly decided to wander around the mansion gathering up various supplies to do herself in------and it "would have been helpful" ???

..( i need a glass of wine).

 

[sorrell skye]

..that's twice that nesbitt has said something idiotic about the phone..

http://www.cbs8.com/story/15520745/...us-cell-phone-new-witnesses-accounts-reported

In the early days of the investigation, Jonah Shacknai told detectives he had left the voicemail message, Lt. Nesbit recalled.

"If we could have gotten it (the voicemail), yes, it would have been helpful but it was not critical to the case," said Lt. Nesbit.

..pardon???

..one of THE reasons nesbitt himself gave via powerpoint at the PC as to WHY rebecca suddenly decided to wander around the mansion gathering up various supplies to do herself in------and it "would have been helpful" ???

..( i need a glass of wine).

I hear ya, Lauriej - I'm having a glass of vino right now - I need it, too, lol!

Thank You for pointing that out!

"It would have been helpful but it was not critical to the case."

There's "Nothing on the phone central to the evidence."

"We don't have any unanswered questions."

Ai yai yai!

ETA: If there is nothing on the phone central to the evidence, and if the contents of the phone are not critical to the case, and if there are no unanswered questions, then release the phone to the family, as they have requested.

 

[coopzoo]

I hear ya, Lauriej - I'm having a glass of vino right now - I need it, too, lol!

Thank You for pointing that out!

"It would have been helpful but it was not critical to the case."

There's "Nothing on the phone central to evidence."

"We don't have any unanswered questions."

Ai yai yai!

Seriously, I don't see how anyone can read/hear these statements and feel "satisfied" with the conclusion drawn in this case. :twocents:

 

[Wendy101]

Someone mentioned that DS has a boyfriend, and his daughter posted something about MS brain injury. But, never heard actual name of BF. Anyone know it?
Also recall somthing about him answering DS door at some point... I assumed they that was at the Coronado Island home.

In regards to Howie, it would be interesting to know if he stayed at DS home. He is her AZ neighbor.

BBM: hwow:

 

[lauriej]

http://www.thehinkymeter.com/2011/10/04/rebecca-zahau-case-a-dynamic-loading-analysis-of-the-fall/
Rebecca Zahau case: A Dynamic Loading Analysis of the Fall

..another excellent article by Valhall..

---snipped----

At this point Rebecca&#8217;s neck experienced the severe jerk of the stretching rope. In approximately 0.2 seconds she went from a downward velocity of 20.7 ft/s to stopped, and then experienced recoil as the load on the rope went to just her static 100 lb weight. Her neck experienced between 8.9 and 10.7 g&#8217;s. Her total fall time was between 1.3 and 1.4 seconds and her center of gravity, with the rope stretched under her weight, came to rest 12.8 to 12.9 feet below the railing.

This would have placed her feet at approximately 15.7 to 15.8 ft below the railing. This would have placed her neck at approximately 11.1 feet below the railing, or 6.4 ft above the ground.

...i am definitely going to take the calculations of an actual rocket scientist---over LE who pulled out their measuring tape to do the calculation at the scene..

...with rebecca's neck only 6'4" inches above the ground----yet more reason that adam did NOT need that table to stand on to cut her down.

...he could easily have supported her body with one arm, reached up (slightly) and cut the rope.

...why did he make a point of telling LE that not only did he drag the table over-----but, it broke ON the way---and yet he stood up on it anyway?

...it sounds more to me that he was working in an "alibi" for there to BE a broken table-------why??

 

[sdcali]

I remember LE finishing up the RZ part of the PC basically saying--we don't know what happened. This is our best guess at the scenario. And they have no unanwered questions? Really? HEY SDSO...I have a ton of unanswered questions. Wanna hire me? I'll even work for free. I love catching bad guys.

 

[time]

http://www.thehinkymeter.com/2011/10/04/rebecca-zahau-case-a-dynamic-loading-analysis-of-the-fall/
Rebecca Zahau case: A Dynamic Loading Analysis of the Fall

..another excellent article by Valhall..

---snipped----



...i am definitely going to take the calculations of an actual rocket scientist---over LE who pulled out their measuring tape to do the calculation at the scene..

...with rebecca's neck only 6'4" inches above the ground----yet more reason that adam did NOT need that table to stand on to cut her down.

...he could easily have supported her body with one arm, reached up (slightly) and cut the rope.

...why did he make a point of telling LE that not only did he drag the table over-----but, it broke ON the way---and yet he stood up on it anyway?

...it sounds more to me that he was working in an "alibi" for there to BE a broken table-------why??

Why would anyone hang themselves from such a high place (binding themselves, hands and feet so elaborately) and leave enough rope they ended up only 12" from the ground? Seems that is not enough room for error and you could end up breaking your legs but not strangling yourself.

Something does not make sense about that rope length, the broken table legs, and the bent legs. Maybe it's because she was dead before she was thrown over the balcony, maybe she was never thrown over the balcony but hoisted from below, maybe she was hogtied (and hence the legs and distance), and/or maybe she hit the table below and that's how it broke? I don't know...

 

[time]

Did SDSO or anyone ever fully discuss how her neck was tied? I thought they just said similar to her wrists and ankles maybe? Did they or were they claiming that Rebecca tied the rope around her neck and then worked backwards to tying it to the bed? In other words, all one piece of rope? That doesn't make sense either... it would make more sense in this case that if someone hung themselves from that balcony, they'd fix the rope and then hang themselves from below or lower themselves from the balcony.

Per my previous post, I guess I forgot to take into account the bed lurching... but still.

 

[SunnieRN]

Even if Rebecca had been hoisted from below, when they let go of ther, the bed would have lurched. Sudden weight piulling against the bed. Ti my way of thinking, the bed never moved enough to justify the small amount the bed moved. Especially with the fact that there were no rug marks from the bed moving.:waitasec:

 

[stilettos]

BBM: hwow:

hwow: Yep, what a twisted web of folks involved here.

 

[elfie]

http://www.thehinkymeter.com/2011/10/04/rebecca-zahau-case-a-dynamic-loading-analysis-of-the-fall/
Rebecca Zahau case: A Dynamic Loading Analysis of the Fall

..another excellent article by Valhall..

---snipped----



...i am definitely going to take the calculations of an actual rocket scientist---over LE who pulled out their measuring tape to do the calculation at the scene..

...with rebecca's neck only 6'4" inches above the ground----yet more reason that adam did NOT need that table to stand on to cut her down.

...he could easily have supported her body with one arm, reached up (slightly) and cut the rope.

...why did he make a point of telling LE that not only did he drag the table over-----but, it broke ON the way---and yet he stood up on it anyway?

...it sounds more to me that he was working in an "alibi" for there to BE a broken table-------why??

Another great analysis and good points about the table leg!

Val proposed a likely scenario as to why Rebecca's injuries weren't more extensive given the long drop--the movement of the bed absorbed enough of the shock to bring the drop to just under the required amount.

Well done!

Did Rebecca really ever go over the balcony?

Someone said that a painted thumb print was visible under the message on the door. Was a latex glove or paper, or plastic bag used to transfer her painted thumb print to the door?

 

[SunnieRN]

Another great analysis and good points about the table leg!

Val proposed a likely scenario as to why Rebecca's injuries weren't more extensive given the long drop--the movement of the bed absorbed enough of the shock to bring the drop to just under the required amount.

Well done!

Did Rebecca really ever go over the balcony?

Someone said that a painted thumb print was visible under the message on the door. Was a latex glove or paper, or plastic bag used to transfer her painted thumb print to the door?

Or was her own thumb used, explaining the paint on her hand somewhat? I can only imagine the anguish Rebecca must have been feeling, thinking that no one may know she was murdered and that her family might think she killed herself.

 

[elfie]

Or was her own thumb used, explaining the paint on her hand somewhat? I can only imagine the anguish Rebecca must have been feeling, thinking that no one may know she was murdered and that her family might think she killed herself.

Just breaks your heart.

I have an indelicate question--wouldn't she have evacuated at the time of death? I this always the case? It was never mentioned.

 

[Salem]

GUYS - stop bickering. It is not necessary. Rather than bicker, use the ignore feature on your profile page. If you need help with that, send me a pm. But stop bickering. It is getting tiresome and some posters are beginning to feel bashed and no longer want to participate.

This forum is for EVERYBODY. EVERYBODY may state their opinion and their interpretation of the facts.

I am going to start removing posts that appear to be badgering or hostile, even if otherwise the post appears to be within TOS. What this means is, if you reply to a post just to state a different opinion, or argue the other poster's opinion and your post adds nothing constructive to the discussion, I will remove it. If I remove 5 or more posts for anyone poster from this point forward for "harrassment" the poster is going on a TO.

This should be a friendly discussion, even though the opinions differ, about the facts and circumstances of what happened in both Max and Rebecca's deaths. No matter which side of the fence you stand on, there are a lot of discrepancies and questions in this case. There is no reason to badger. If you disagree with a post, move past it. It is not necessary to respond to every post.

If you have questions, let me or any member of the Mod Team by way of pm.

Thanks,

Salem