The Crown v Gerard Baden-Clay, 11th -12th June - Trial Days 2 & 3 - Week 1

[marlywings]

I'm wondering whether some were just eftpos cards? (nowdays with 'visa debit' they can sometimes look like credit cards) or if the cards were loosely described that way in constable's statement. Looking at financial analysis in bail hearings docs, the BC family had quite a number of Suncorp savings accounts, including their daughters. I don't recall there being enough credit cards itemised by the forensic accountant that could amount to a table 'scattering'. Just my thoughts typed out loud. In saying that, to some a scattering could be 2/3.... or a dozen.

Or, another alternative could be that new cards recently arrived in the mail to replace old ones. Younger kids sometimes like to hang on to these for play.

Agree though, in context, it could well represent an argument over finances. Interesting to see if more to come.


MOO

I think what we all need to keep in mind the documents which we have are from the bail hearing. Only that small amount of evidence was required for bail to be denied.

All up I think we have only heard a fraction of the total amount of evidence.

17 witnesses so far.

Another 60 to go

 

[Total]

Yes, if he walks he walks with all the insurance money (has he claimed bankruptcy to clear previous debt?), all Allison's assets and probably custody of the girls. I feel sick at the thought......................

I sincerely hope not for the girls' sake, but if he did he would have a very very hefty legal bill that would come in the mail as well as previous debts.

 

[bikerchick]

Was OW & NBC in the actually court listening to evidence today??

Unsure as I could only get to secondary court room and didn't have full view of trial courtroom


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[DrWatson]

For the first time in two years, I would beg to differ, Doc.
We are between 1.6 & 1.8 ks from Showgrounds and can hear as clear as a bell, sometimes.
I really think it has a lot to do with the topographical location of your house, the wind direction, other weather conditions etc.
Those sirens were so loud at our place, I thought they were at our front gate.

I am still baffled by the relevance of the multiple witnesses, from varying, even opposing directions, though.

Trying to write an Exec Summary for a research grant. These are not conducive circumstances to be writing it under!

I certainly take your point about the topography of the land between any two spots. Even the fireworks at show times are muted and in the distance from our place, yet we're less than a Km from the showgrounds.

Clarkson Place (and I also take Bikerchick's point) is perhaps more elevated and maybe sounds from the centre of Brooky can be heard up there? Whereas we have a slight rise between our place and the showgrounds.

So maybe we're in a deaf spot (the audio equivalent of a blind spot ) but Clarkson Place is in a position more conducive to sound conduction.

One of the witnesses who DID hear screams, and who has already testified at earlier hearings, and who we know, lives almost directly across the road from the B-C house.

So the prosecution are putting a lot of weight on these screams - yet none of the three girls heard anything and didn't get woken up.

For those suggesting the possibility of them being medicated, they would know they'd taken medicine. And that would imply a definite degree of planning and forethought. So I'm not too sure about that theory - which still leaves the question as to why none of the three girls heard anything - allegedly....

:banghead:

 

[Groundedgirl]

For the first time in two years, I would beg to differ, Doc.
We are between 1.6 & 1.8 ks from Showgrounds and can hear as clear as a bell, sometimes.
I really think it has a lot to do with the topographical location of your house, the wind direction, other weather conditions etc.
Those sirens were so loud at our place, I thought they were at our front gate.

I am still baffled by the relevance of the multiple witnesses, from varying, even opposing directions, though.

Trying to write an Exec Summary for a research grant. These are not conducive circumstances to be writing it under!

Agree - completing a final report for research here and its taking much longer than it should!!!

 

[Trooper]

I sincerely hope not for the girls' sake, but if he did he would have a very very hefty legal bill that would come in the mail as well as previous debts.

the payout doesn't even begin to cover his debts.. the point of Alisons death , the insurance money, was to stave off the impending brickfalling thud of his payments due at that time.

Since then, he has incurred a legal bill that would choke a horse and rider, and probably the farriers and saddlemakers as well.

His original debts remain intact and due. They are merely delayed in payment due to his circumstances ( on remand, and ungettable at by his creditors)

 

[DrWatson]

I sincerely hope not for the girls' sake, but if he did he would have a very very hefty legal bill that would come in the mail as well as previous debts.

Isn't his defence all being done on Legal Aid?

 

[possumheart]

time was running out for Gerard.. the insurance policy people had sent a letter on April 6th telling him that the premium - $1100.00 hadn't been paid , the policy was now in danger of relapse, if the money wasn't there by May 9th, the policy would be considered expired...

he couldn't even pay the insurance policy bill.. and he had only 30 days before it became invalid...... .. tuff times, ey ?

they had sent a letter to Alison, also ,asking if she was still having Gerard as her beneficiary... it wasn't responded to, according to the files...

Which is why I think there just has to be an element of sociopathology involved. He thought he had enough 'good guy' points to be untouchable and unthinkable as the perpetrator. The 'widower' cloak was appealing.

... and he was not above cheating on his mistress whilst 'working on his marriage'.

:sick:

(I promise not to break into T. S. Eliot again until they close the cell on him).

 

[Groundedgirl]

Would you take antihistamine for caterpillar irritations?

 

[Groundedgirl]

Isn't his defence all being done on Legal Aid?

That's what make me think he had claimed bankruptcy - to make him eligible

 

[drsleuth]

I certainly take your point about the topography of the land between any two spots. Even the fireworks at show times are muted and in the distance from our place, yet we're less than a Km from the showgrounds.

Clarkson Place (and I also take Bikerchick's point) is perhaps more elevated and maybe sounds from the centre of Brooky can be heard up there? Whereas we have a slight rise between our place and the showgrounds.

So maybe we're in a deaf spot (the audio equivalent of a blind spot ) but Clarkson Place is in a position more conducive to sound conduction.

One of the witnesses who DID hear screams, and who has already testified at earlier hearings, and who we know, lives almost directly across the road from the B-C house.

So the prosecution are putting a lot of weight on these screams - yet none of the three girls heard anything and didn't get woken up.

For those suggesting the possibility of them being medicated, they would know they'd taken medicine. And that would imply a definite degree of planning and forethought. So I'm not too sure about that theory - which still leaves the question as to why none of the three girls heard anything - allegedly....

:banghead:

allegedly being the key word ;-)

 

[bearbear]

I certainly take your point about the topography of the land between any two spots. Even the fireworks at show times are muted and in the distance from our place, yet we're less than a Km from the showgrounds.

Clarkson Place (and I also take Bikerchick's point) is perhaps more elevated and maybe sounds from the centre of Brooky can be heard up there? Whereas we have a slight rise between our place and the showgrounds.

So maybe we're in a deaf spot (the audio equivalent of a blind spot ) but Clarkson Place is in a position more conducive to sound conduction.

One of the witnesses who DID hear screams, and who has already testified at earlier hearings, and who we know, lives almost directly across the road from the B-C house.

So the prosecution are putting a lot of weight on these screams - yet none of the three girls heard anything and didn't get woken up.

For those suggesting the possibility of them being medicated, they would know they'd taken medicine. And that would imply a definite degree of planning and forethought. So I'm not too sure about that theory - which still leaves the question as to why none of the three girls heard anything - allegedly....

:banghead:

could they be medicated without knowing, drug added to fruit juice etc?

 

[Oddsocks]

Phenergan has a very strong flavour

 

[Trooper]

Isn't his defence all being done on Legal Aid?

should he be found not guilty, and therefore able to collect the insurance money ,Legal Aid has a lien on all and any monies the defendant may have access to, and used for covering the amount that the defendant acquired in pursuing his case..

Naturally, a lot of folks have a lien on that money, not least the Au Tax office.... ..

 

[Total]

Doc what if they were given it without them knowing? For instance in a drink or mixed in with something sweet. We simply don't know as I don't think the girls were tested.

But when my kids were young they slept through everything including sudden wind gusts slamming doors right next to their heads and parties held in the house. Once asleep I could move them in and out cars, nothing could wake them. All without drugs, just a bedtime story and a song . Not all my friends were so lucky.

 

[Trooper]

That's what make me think he had claimed bankruptcy - to make him eligible

He hasn't claimed bankruptcy as yet.,. claiming that isn't as easy as it might appear, actually. A hell of lot of hoops to jump through, and it would be , naturally, fought against him doing that by his debtors...

 

[drsleuth]

could they be medicated without knowing, drug added to fruit juice etc?

Yes. I'm a Registered Nurse & we go to great lengths at times to get some kids in ED to take meds ( with the parents consent of course ) . Some kids are a nightmare to give medication too......we hide it in all sorts ( yoghurt is good as it disguises the taste! )

 

[Trooper]

He is, to all intents and purposes bankrupt... the forensic accountant made this obvious, but he isn't a legally declared and/or claimed bankrupt,..

as yet.

 

[Oz Jen]

Can I run this past the blokes in here please...
Whenever my husband cuts himself shaving, it is always little 'nicks', never long scrapes. (And he most certainly doesn't go back to repeat the cuts twice more.)
I'm wondering: 1/ Has any other male cut themselves shaving in a similar manner to GBC?
2/ If GBC's 'shaving cuts' were bad enough to seek medical attention/clarification from 2 doctors, why didn't he put bandaids on them? If he had, I'm wondering if Kieron Ash would have accepted the "Oh, this? Just nicked myself shaving. Anyway, about my beloved missing wife? I'm distraught" line?
Just quietly, Kieron Ash is my hero!

 

[Freya1977]

Gah, don't rattle me! LOL I don't know, I guess it does depend on the individuals in the jury. I'd have thought Casey Anthony was a slam dunk case but there you go. How much reading did your attorney friend do about the case, were they digging into bail documents and the like or just reading mainstream media? I think the blood in the car, the scratches and the mobile phone forensics are going to take some explaining. I don't think the evidence about the razor having no evidence of blood on it has been tended yet? Those are pretty solid bits of evidence in a sea of pretty damning circumstances and demeanour.

He's been quite active in following the case from the beginning so he is pretty up to speed on all of that evidence.

The thing is, yes there was blood in the car....but it was THEIR car, so it isn't inconceivable that her blood was there for some other reason. I'm not saying I believe that but just that it can raise doubt. Now if she had never had any contact with that car, her bloood would be so much more damning.

The phone evidence is not THAT damning IMO. All we really have is that his phone went on and off charge through the night. Is there anything else? Maybe I've forgotten something - it's been a while since I've read all the evidence.

One thing that's bothering me is that the kids say she was in her PJ's on the couch.....but she was found in walking clothes and sneakers. This could add weight to the "walking in the morning" theory.

I don't know.....I don't think it's a slam dunk by any stretch. As you say, we've seen people with more evidence walk free! :banghead: