The Crown v Gerard Baden-Clay - Trial Day 1 - 10th June, 2014-Week 1

[Hadey]

In my opinion what comes out of Gerards mouth is "a load of cods wallop".

 

[LadyBird1]

From autopsy report....

There are no injuries typical of what is seen when a body is being washed around in moving water.

I partially observed the body from the bridge

As the body was found below a bridge reported to be 14m high, injuries from a fall from a height need to be considered as a possible cause of death. As she was found directly underneath the bridge there would have to have been some movement of the body after impact with the ground or water. This possibly could have been by herself, by another person or by the tide.

With a fall from such a height I would expect injuries to have been identified at post-mortem examination if the fall was onto the ground. However, if the fall was onto water the degree of injury could be less. If there had been a fall into water, this could have predisposed her to drowning.

One distinct disadvantage to placing a body in the creek upstream, (and unsecured) would be the risk of that body being washed downstream to an unknown destination, possibly out to sea, with the possible scenario that the body might never be found.
No body, no proven death, no insurance money.

 

[kiwijayne]

Loving all the bright sunflowers in here.

 

[Makara]

From autopsy report....

There are no injuries typical of what is seen when a body is being washed around in moving water.

I partially observed the body from the bridge

As the body was found below a bridge reported to be 14m high, injuries from a fall from a height need to be considered as a possible cause of death. As she was found directly underneath the bridge there would have to have been some movement of the body after impact with the ground or water. This possibly could have been by herself, by another person or by the tide.

With a fall from such a height I would expect injuries to have been identified at post-mortem examination if the fall was onto the ground. However, if the fall was onto water the degree of injury could be less. If there had been a fall into water, this could have predisposed her to drowning.

A deceased body dropped from a height would not sustain the same injuries as a living person. Police very early on determined that Allison was deceased before her body was taken to Kholo Creek.

The bridge is reported to be 14m high. Is this at its highest point from the ground I wonder? Which would be approximately the centre of the bridge above the river.

In the attached images below, the blurred image is Allison's body. You can see that she was found closer to the approach to the bridge and IMO it doesn't look like a 14m drop at that spot. You can also see that her body was not directly under the bridge but could be viewed by leaning over the bridge rail.

Click on images to enlarge.

 

[alioop]

There was no blood cause he didn't cut himself shaving .... He would have to scrub the razor for it not to show any trace.

And if there were big bloody chunks of his skin in his razor, wouldn't he have wanted to keep it to show anyone who asked. After all he was very conscious of the marks and even blurted out to the police his reasons for them before they even asked. The marks on his face were the biggest sign that something was terribly wrong. No way he would have scrubbed it clean.

 

[MsAnais]

A deceased body dropped from a height would not sustain the same injuries as a living person. Police very early on determined that Allison was deceased before her body was taken to Kholo Creek.

The bridge is reported to be 14m high. Is this at its highest point from the ground I wonder? Which would be approximately the centre of the bridge above the river.

In the attached images below, the blurred image is Allison's body. You can see that she was found closer to the approach to the bridge and IMO it doesn't look like a 14m drop at that spot. You can also see that her body was not directly under the bridge but could be viewed by leaning over the bridge rail.

Click on images to enlarge.

View attachment 44176

View attachment 44177

Thank you for that Makara :seeya: And for all your work today!

Those pics are very confronting. Just so sad to see the reality of where she lay :facepalm:

Deep blessings to Allison.

 

[MsAnais]

And if there were big bloody chunks of his skin in his razor, wouldn't he have wanted to keep it to show anyone who asked. After all he was very conscious of the marks and even blurted out to the police his reasons for them before they even asked. The marks on his face were the biggest sign that something was terribly wrong. No way he would have scrubbed it clean.

Great point, alioop!! As you say, no way he would have scrubbed it clean. The simple fact was, there was nothing to scrub clean. As we can all see!!!

 

[Couldbe]

And if there were big bloody chunks of his skin in his razor, wouldn't he have wanted to keep it to show anyone who asked. After all he was very conscious of the marks and even blurted out to the police his reasons for them before they even asked. The marks on his face were the biggest sign that something was terribly wrong. No way he would have scrubbed it clean.

Loaded with logic Alioop.....this is a really pertinent point. GBC and his Defence team must be really worried about that aspect. Then again, it could be said that he always rinsed the razor under the tap during the activity of shaving, and in retrospect and under the circumstances, he should not have rinsed the razor; but in his panic about Allison being missing he wasn't thinking straight.

 

[sosocurious]

The girls woke the following morning to the news from their father that their mother wasn't home.
In GBc initial statement he said he got up at 6am. Sarah got uo first and THEN he cut himself shaving.
Sarah got up late this morning - they were tired - I doubt the girls were put to bed at 6.30 - 7.00pm

 

[alioop]

Loaded with logic Alioop.....this is a really pertinent point. GBC and his Defence team must be really worried about that aspect. Then again, it could be said that he always rinsed the razor under the tap during the activity of shaving, and in retrospect and under the circumstances, he should not have rinsed the razor; but in his panic about Allison being missing he wasn't thinking straight.

Yes but it would have taken more than the usual rinsing to remove chunks of skin to an extent they were unable to be detected by forensics.

 

[marlywings]

Came across this before when reading through the autopsy report...

There was also a big defect on the left shin.....
.....there may have been a pre-existing injury, however due to post -mortem changes this could not be confirmed.

 

[sosocurious]

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 1m

Fuller: She had a therapeutic level of anti depressants in her system. #badenclay
Expand

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 34s

Fuller: You'll hear a review was done of flow levels. Her body was not moved by the flow of the water. #badenclay

No movement by water so how could she have been upstream.

 

[Camp Chair]

The girls woke the following morning to the news from their father that their mother wasn't home.
In GBc initial statement he said he got up at 6am. Sarah got uo first and THEN he cut himself shaving.
Sarah got up late this morning - they were tired - I doubt the girls were put to bed at 6.30 - 7.00pm

If the girls ran cross country & later went swimming at BC Snrs (kids in pool when GBC arrived with sausages) I think it's possible they were worn out early that night, but the stated bedtime is conservative - how long would it take for 3 girls to bathe & get ready for bed?

 

[LadyBird1]

And if there were big bloody chunks of his skin in his razor, wouldn't he have wanted to keep it to show anyone who asked. After all he was very conscious of the marks and even blurted out to the police his reasons for them before they even asked. The marks on his face were the biggest sign that something was terribly wrong. No way he would have scrubbed it clean.

If a bloke really truly woke up early in the morning, noted his wife was missing and then decided he needed a shave ...
Nah, try again. (That looks a bit dopey):
Why would a bloke even bother about shaving when he realized that something was amiss? His wife was seriously absent.
As a matter of priorities, where does a morning facial SHAVE fit in?

 

[KG1]

Wowww some faces I've not seen for a LONG time!!!

Welcome back to all of you....great to see you back on board

Thanks Marly, it is good to read the 'old faces' here again. Since I was last around post committal, I have retired from employment as of May 2014. I thought I may even be able to go to Qld to attend part of the trial, but alas, my brother became ill 2 days after my retirement, and I am now caring for him full time; he is improving so that is good. I will try and get on here daily, but with 11 or so pages today, I will be playing catch up. Still have to read part of the last thread.
Hello to all WS friends, and I look forward to wonderful commentary as usual.
Thanks also to all tweeters - without you all and your efforts, we would not be so up to date.
Feeling very much for the Dickies and Allison's little girls - so hard for children.
May justice prevail.

 

[Strangeworld]

Phew! Just caught up. Fabulous work with all the tweets and news updates. It feels so surreal reading things that are only now being reported but that many of us were privy to a while back. But starting to get the sense all those unanswered questions will be answered as the trial goes on.

Definitely seems like they are saying Allison's body was found where it was left. But I am a bit puzzled about whether she was thrown/dropped from the bridge (more likely) or did GBC with/without help venture down into the mud. I doubt this second version.

Also interesting timeline for that night - my heart breaks thinking the girls could have been home, but I also wonder if that is actually true. Can't wait to see if the prosecution try to tear this to shreds, or if the girls were there and heard something. As Isis would be able to confirm, if those girls were coached or 'debriefed' there will be tell-tale patterns to their recounts of the night - the professionals will see straight through it. Stories that are too perfect are just that....stories.

Thank you thank you thank you everyone for all the posts. Just wish I could stay home each day and watch it all unfold live. I'll be living vicariously through you all in the next few weeks.

And just because I'm feeling naughty tonight, this is for you GBC... :behind:

 

[marlywings]

Allison Baden-Clay's body was found under the Kholo Creek bridge. Photo: Court Exhibit

http://www.smh.com.au/queensland/ge...t-hears-details-of-affair-20140610-zs39e.html

 

[Fuskier]

Came across this before when reading through the autopsy report...

There was also a big defect on the left shin.....
.....there may have been a pre-existing injury, however due to post -mortem changes this could not be confirmed.

IMO the hairdressers and Kerry (Allison's friend) would most likely know if Allison had a big defect on her left shin - as both saw her in person in the hours before her murder.

 

[coolcat]

If the girls ran cross country & later went swimming at BC Snrs (kids in pool when GBC arrived with sausages) I think it's possible they were worn out early that night, but the stated bedtime is conservative - how long would it take for 3 girls to bathe & get ready for bed?

I assume they had a bath at grandparents home after swim and dinner.... Not unusual for kids to do this at grandparents house.

 

[Fuskier]

If a bloke really truly woke up early in the morning, noted his wife was missing and then decided he needed a shave ...
Nah, try again. (That looks a bit dopey):
Why would a bloke even bother about shaving when he realized that something was amiss? His wife was seriously absent.
As a matter of priorities, where does a morning facial SHAVE fit in?

Hypothetically, if one wanted to contrive a scenario that morning i.e. she's just gone for a walk and will be back soon expectation, then actions would need to 'fit' such a contrived scenario to make it believable in the eyes of others. Demonstrates significant calculation IMO.
My opinion only.