The elusive "other" cell phone - the Blackjack - REVISITED

[Midwest MOM]

BBM
Tied to all the lies,IMO

IMO using the," I left her at the stairs of the apartment", was an excuse/lie she came up with because LE would find out that she was lying and that no one by the name of Zanny ever lived in that apartment...

This is how I regard it (my own made up scenario) "Well Officer as far as I know Zanny lived here, I brought Caylee to her, but I never went into the apartment I would leave her at the stairs..so as far as I knew she did live here, but now YOU are telling me she didn't"

As far as I remember, Casey never told LE the stories she told her parents about sleeping over at Zanny's and having to go back to Orlando with Zanny's apartment keys to get the insurance papers from Zanny's room, which would have put her inside the apartment.

IMO Casey is a very determined liar, she believes her own lies and it is difficult to sway someone like that, ...I say this because my MIL is the same...for all her great qualities she is also a very effective liar and believes her lies, confront her and war breaks out ..

I have not been very successful at proving KC a very effective liar. KC admitted to lying and stealing, she admitted that she does not work at universal studios. The detectives stated nothing about confronting KC and "war breaks out" There is very little information available direct from KC.

I also don't recall anything about the insurance papers, was this from KC?

 

[Spangle]

If Casey had a Blackjack, I would think that even though she may not have been using it because it didn't keep a charge well, that she would have brought it out with her to show it off, especially since her other phone was a cheapy. Nobody's ever seen this phone? Just doesn't seem likely, with her being so appearance conscious, that she wouldn't have shown anyone this phone.

Of course, she would have been using it for a while, before she realized it wouldn't keep a charge. As social as she is, she would have had to have used it in front of several people during that time. And that doesn't even count the 'show off' times.

 

[Spangle]

I have not been very successful at proving KC a very effective liar. KC admitted to lying and stealing, she admitted that she does not work at universal studios. The detectives stated nothing about confronting KC and "war breaks out" There is very little information available direct from KC.

I also don't recall anything about the insurance papers, was this from KC?

From Cindy. It's one of the lies that KC said to Cindy during the 30 days. It's part of one of the excuses for why KC can't bring Caylee to visit CA. Early on CA was telling the story and thought it was true.

 

[countzero]

I have not been very successful at proving KC a very effective liar. KC admitted to lying and stealing, she admitted that she does not work at universal studios. The detectives stated nothing about confronting KC and "war breaks out" There is very little information available direct from KC.

I also don't recall anything about the insurance papers, was this from KC?

No, this is the story CA is relating to LE/FBI during her interview.

Personally, I don't believe KC even told this story to CA or anyone else.

 

[Spangle]

There is enough evidence that she did have a blackjack to believe it. There is the myspace comment to Heather, her co-worker, for one. Also her sim card is similar but yet different to her phone memory, also indicating she had another phone so I don't see why this is such a disputed piece of information. Are all of the photos of her with a phone only one phone? I haven't looked for that specifically, but just ask if anyone else has noticed.

The only importance of the BlackJack is that KC said she used it to call the Nanny and that it needed to be found, to get Nanny's number.

That is it.

Since she claims she used the same sims card for both phones, then all calls she made on both phones would be on the same phone bill. Together. As one phone.

We all know this, but did KC when she think this out, when she made the statements? It sounds like she was making up a lie, that just can't fly.

The unknown phone numbers called, I'm sure at this point, the LE know to whom was called. It would be easy work. For one of the numbers to be the Nanny in question, it would have to be called often. It would have to be called several times the day she claims the Nanny ran off with her. She would have had to call the number while setting there waiting at the apartment complex for her to show back up with the baby.

Another words, this number would have stood out like a sore thumb.

Based upon those 2 things, I can not take seriously the Blackphone stuff. IT just seems like something she made up thinking it would explain away her not having the Nanny's phone number handy. This was early on, when she expected everything she said to be believed without questioning or logic. Like her taking them to her 'job.' Wow, would would think she would see that coming.

The 'gota find the phone' game is alot like the 'gota find the nanny' game. Gota find what is made up. If it's made up, it's not real and can NOT be found.

It me, if she had a second phone, wither it held a charge or not, it would have had it's own phone##.. IF she has such phone, it would be for some sort of work/etc.. that is not publicly known. I say that, because her friends don't seem to know a second number for her.

 

[Midwest MOM]

No, this is the story CA is relating to LE/FBI during her interview.

Personally, I don't believe KC even told this story to CA or anyone else.

I agree, I really struggle with separating KC and CA behaviors. Often I see CA as an extension of KC which is not the case, they are totally separate people. For instance... when confronted, a war breaks out. I had to stop myself and realize that statement describes what I have witnessed from CA not from KC.

With the exception of KC speaking with the CA in the jail house visit. CA seems to receive that kind of reaction from a lot of people not just KC.

I am not meaning to disrespect to the A's and all they are going through, however if I was the defense I would consider them hostile witnesses to the client. I have not seen the unconditional love or the support that they claim they have for their daughter..just the opposite.

 

[Kentjbkent]

I haven't followed this "two cellphone scenario" very close (but will catch up!) but it did catch my eye while reading documents last night that Tony turned a Blackjack phone over to LE at their request (early in the investigation)...and in regards to Casey texting in May that she got a new Blackjack....isn't that around the time she started dating Tony?

maybe...just maybe....she intended Tony's blackjack to be her "new blackjack" when Tony suddenly "lost (couldn't find it..hint...hint...) I know...bad, bad me.....

 

[Intermezzo]

I have not been very successful at proving KC a very effective liar. KC admitted to lying and stealing, she admitted that she does not work at universal studios. The detectives stated nothing about confronting KC and "war breaks out" There is very little information available direct from KC.

I also don't recall anything about the insurance papers, was this from KC?

BBM
For clarification
That statement I posted in the last paragraph of my post and I said my MIL- Mother in Law is an effective liar and when confronted war breaks out. I was not speaking of Casey in that part.

The insurance papers incident came from GA & CA when retelling to LE/FBI of the Zanny was in a car accident in Tampa story that Casey fed them. GA caught her at home on June 24 and she came up with the excuse that she came back to Orlando to pick up the papers from Zanny's apartment but that Caylee remained behind in Tampa with Zanny's roommates or Zanny's sister etc....

 

[Intermezzo]

I haven't followed this "two cellphone scenario" very close (but will catch up!) but it did catch my eye while reading documents last night that Tony turned a Blackjack phone over to LE at their request (early in the investigation)...and in regards to Casey texting in May that she got a new Blackjack....isn't that around the time she started dating Tony?

maybe...just maybe....she intended Tony's blackjack to be her "new blackjack" when Tony suddenly "lost (couldn't find it..hint...hint...) I know...bad, bad me.....

I thought TonyL had a Blackberry.

I may be wrong but, I believe the Blackjack text was in early May and she officially met TL near the end of May.

 

[Noddy]

Just thought I'd add this to the thread as I couldn't find it mentioned: Ryan P tells Yuri M that he can get him a cell phone.

Page one, line 21 of: http://cfnews13.com/uploadedFiles/Pasley, Ryan0730.pdf

RP: (Inaudible) I work at a place I can get you a cell phone buddy. You just let me know.

Just a possible source of the improbable Blackjack.

 

[Midwest MOM]

BBM
For clarification
That statement I posted in the last paragraph of my post and I said my MIL- Mother in Law is an effective liar and when confronted war breaks out. I was not speaking of Casey in that part.

The insurance papers incident came from GA & CA when retelling to LE/FBI of the Zanny was in a car accident in Tampa story that Casey fed them. GA caught her at home on June 24 and she came up with the excuse that she came back to Orlando to pick up the papers from Zanny's apartment but that Caylee remained behind in Tampa with Zanny's roommates or Zanny's sister etc....

aaahh,O.k. now I get it! thanks:bang:

 

[Midwest MOM]

In SK interview with the detectives, he states that TB keeps cloaking his cell phone. page 32 LINE 13 and 14,

What does Cloaking mean?

 

[Spyglass]

To hide or cover.

 

[sleutherontheside]

To hide or cover.

And so the question remains or arises......................WHY would a PR professional need to operate in such a manner. I mean public accessibility is kind of your occupational MO is it not?????

 

[AZlawyer]

For convenience...

Kio gives Casey "Williams" # as 407-856-8405. Reverse look-up gives on intelius for this # gives:

Gives Orlando as current address.

Address history:
5 addresses in Orlando
1 address in Winter Park
4 relatives for the phone owner

Casey Anthony gives 407-619-9286 as her cell phone on 7/15-16.

Gives Winter Park as current address.

Address history:
2 addresses in Orlando
5 relatives for the phone owner.

Kio calls the 407-856-8405 and "it just rings and rings and rings and rings."

This is going back a ways...but according to Westlaw this number is a pay phone in the 9-digit zip code 32809-6077, which seems to be west of the airport.

 

[Balthazar]

I thought TonyL had a Blackberry.

I may be wrong but, I believe the Blackjack text was in early May and she officially met TL near the end of May.

Yes, that's right, TL had a Blackberry - Yuri Melich called him pretending to be a reporter when TL had his police interview so they could get a look at his phone and they specifically asked him what type of phone it was and TL showed them it was a Blackberry.

Casey texted to someone that she had just got a Blackjack for work and there are photos of her sitting at a table with a Blackjack phone and Caylee in the foreground with a Blackjack phone just behind her - it appears to be the same Blackjack in both pictures. So I believe she did have a Blackjack. I don't know what became of it. She was trying to tell Lee from jail what had become of it in one of her jailhouse meetings with him the video of which was released last summer, but I don't know if Lee understood what she was trying to say to him.

 

[Brini]

OK, I realize that 99% of what Casey Anthony says is a half-truth at best, still, I've been re-listening to Casey's phone call to Lee @ end of July that includes info on her other (i.e. "BlackJack") cell phone.

IF, we play along for a minute, and, indeed, there WAS another cell phone (i.e. "BlackJack" or other) Casey appears to be TRYING to tell Lee that she tossed her cell phone @ Universal Park when she was taken their by LE, 7/16. She indicates the last time she had it for "certain" was when she was in through the park "in through the park talking to a couple of mutual friends", and "it wasn't necessarily fun" and "not through work". At this point she knows the calls are made public and must try to get the point across indirectly.

She later indicates that these "mutual friends" are the ONLY ones she talked to about Caylee missing. The two names she gives are complete fabrications (oh, how ironic) and she disagree’s with the spelling of Juliet to try to clue Lee into what she is trying to tell him, but, he doesn't get it (i.e. the “mutual friends” are the LE that accompanied her 7/16)!

She also indicates "J Blanchard Park" as a potential place she lost it too to try to clue Lee into what she is trying to tell him - as in places she's been escorted around to w/ LE 7/15-7/16, but, he doesn't get it.

She is VERY emphatic about telling him how it might've been lost "that's the thing...if it fell out of my bag...if it fell out of my pocket [LONG PAUSE i.e. "DON’T YOU GET IT?!?!?].

My hope is that LE figured this out some time ago and retraced Universal route they took on 7/16 (i.e. Did she go to a restroom unmonitored?), and checked the lost-and-found @ Universal for any/all cell phones. IF there indeed was another cell phone Casey used, regardless of what type, it may have been tossed in a place where it would be hard to tie back to its original owner.

Casey may have stolen the second cell phone to use when she needed to go undetected, and, hence, didn't have a charger to use. J.P. Chatt immediately went shopping for an iPhone the day he returned from Puerto Rico, suggesting that something had happened to his phone.

J.P.’s phone records would be worth a search.

Dunno about the compatibility of the sim chip between Casey’s phone and the other phone. Maybe just a complete ruse there.

Perhaps not new ideas, but, just in case, I thought they were worth sharing.

Well, it's certainly possible that she lied about having the Blackjack. I believe that she had told LE that Zanny's number was in the Blackjack, so she might have been going through the motions.

On the other hand.. one can CERTAINLY see her stealing Chatt's cell phone.

But, what would his phone records have to do with Caylee's murder?

 

[Brini]

Did RG say When he give Casey this cellphone?
I'm thinking it would have been during the time she and Jesse were dating or engaged, 1-2 years ago.
According to Casey she only had it for 1-2 weeks before Caylee went missing, yet there is a text from Casey in May where she tells someone she just got a Blackjack.

IMO She did not have a Blackjack, yet another lie to make herself look "grand"

I doubt that she did, either.

She said she was given the Blackjack "for work." But, it kept losing its charge, and then she lost it in Blanchard.

Meanwhile, telling LE that if they could OOOOONNNNLLLY find the Blackjack, they'd have all of Zanny's numbers.

 

[Brini]

ITA -- Ive been saying the same since the beginning --- who runs their cell up that high? With all the unlimited plans available - even if you have a pre-pay. Something amiss.... think she was a phone sex operator? hmmmmm

No. Phone sex doesn't pay very much. AND, LE would've found it when they checked all her calls on all her bills. Besides, the phone sex calls are usually incoming.

 

[Brini]

I have read this thread but can't remember if I saw this info anywhere.

The carrier would be able to tell LE what type of phone she used and when, correct? I don't believe that any pre-pay phones have a backjack model but I could be wrong.

Anyone????

I sure do wish this case wasn't so convoluted and would just be a KISS case. KWIM

Yes, the carrier would know. Most phones are "locked"-- can only be used with that carrier.