The Phone Calls in the early morning of Dec.18, 2013 (both PayPhone & cells)

[OkieGranny]

I am not sure, maybe Okiegranny or Jersey Girl might remember I can't seem to locate. I seems to me that in an old post- it was stated that it was NOT HRE at the emergency room, but another woman with the same name? TE has stated "3:41" AM is the number that the clock stopped for him. TE is the first one to give that time, I tend to believe his statement-because he is not ALWAYS as guarded with info as LE.

<respectfully snipped>

I prefer to do the scroll & roll on some of these conversations lately but, since you asked, I do agree with your recollections.

 

[4evernbluejeans]

<respectfully snipped>

I prefer to do the scroll & roll on some of these conversations lately but, since you asked, I do agree with your recollections.

Okiegranny, Idk how you keep up with it all..but you rock!:yourock:

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Yes, apparently there is another HE in MB area (this is true) and it was her in the hospital instead. It seems odd to me that someone else w/ the same unusual name was in the hospital at the same time Heather went missing. And with HIPAA laws, I have no idea how they were able to release that info. We all know that the other Heather Elvis was in the hospital on that date.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

I am not sure, maybe Okiegranny or Jersey Girl might remember I can't seem to locate. I seems to me that in an old post- it was stated that it was NOT HRE at the emergency room, but another woman with the same name? TE has stated "3:41" AM is the number that the clock stopped for him. TE is the first one to give that time, I tend to believe his statement-because he is not ALWAYS as guarded with info as LE. If HE phone WAS immediately disabled at the end of the last call, I assume a) it was shot when she was shot and destroyed. OR b) It suggests the first thing that was done, was to disable the phone-which says to me-premeditation. BC without premeditation- who in the heat, gets the phone first? I am just asking?

Additionally when I personally redial a phone # back to back, rapid fire- I am either annoyed or anxious. Like- PICK UP THE PHONE, PICK UP THE PHONE. Whatever it was that SM had to say, HE called him back six times? After his initial pay phone call? And went to meet him in the dark at PTL? IDK what it was, but HE wanted to hear it. MOO

Why was Heather so impatient? It just seems like a weird reaction for someone who was going to PTL at an early hours to meet the man she supposedly cared for, who told her he was leaving his wife. IDK why her thinking wouldn't be that he was is driving there, maybe he doesn't hear the phone, etc.

It sounds like there might have been something very important she had to tell him. I don't think it was simply are you on your way/still coming/where are you.

 

[PPKik]

Why was Heather so impatient? It just seems like a weird reaction for someone who was going to PTL at an early hours to meet the man she supposedly cared for, who told her he was leaving his wife. IDK why her thinking wouldn't be that he was is driving there, maybe he doesn't hear the phone, etc.

It sounds like there might have been something very important she had to tell him. I don't think it was simply are you on your way/still coming/where are you.

Something very important, or, she was not in control of her phone at that time. We really have no way of knowing who was on the phone making those rapid-fire calls to SM's phone. The likelihood of Heather calling SM's just before meeting him, while only minutes from the Moorers house, seems highly unlikely to me.

This fits with my strong belief that lies have been told about Heather's phone either being in a back and forth with Heather and SM until 6am (and that "fact," suddenly and glibly becoming only "a roundabout number," making no sense whatsoever), or being cut off totally at 3:41am.

Something is definitely wrong with the phone "explanation," and I wonder why LE has found it necessary to conceal the truth about Heather's phone usage.

 

[jillycat]

For me the 6 a.m. issue is right up there with the IE issue. I doubt either have much to do with what happened to Heather and when, or what will convict her killers.

 

[Rochestergirl]

Just to be clear, I am talking about searches using the fundraising money. This idea that nothing about these searches (before or after) can be posted is setting off my BS meter. The more likely explanation is that we aren't hearing about them because they aren't happening. Even if it is somehow dangerous for searches to take place (despite thousands of cases where that was not true and the person who caused problems is dead), they could tell us what happened afterwards. I also have no idea how they would get volunteers, and still manage to keep the location confidential. And in our world today, the idea that not one person is going to say a word about the searches on social media seems extremely far-fetched.

Since we aren't allowed to discuss FB pages other than HE or SM/TM. It is on BBs fb arranging meetings. That's all I'll say so I don't get a tme out.

 

[PPKik]

For me the 6 a.m. issue is right up there with the IE issue. I doubt either have much to do with what happened to Heather and when, or what will convict her killers.

Although I agree with you about the IE issue as it makes no sense and there have been too many versions to keep track of (from sexting to indecent exposure) and two many time frames when whatever it was, supposedly happened, I completely disagree about the "6am issue."

The phone calls, who made them, and who answered them is a huge piece of evidence, imo. There is not a whole lot that we know that is concrete. There may be videos, there may have been a kidnapping and murder in two minutes at PTL, etc.

The phone records, whatever the truth is in reality, are very unlikely to be altered or even could be altered.

LE insisted Heather was communicating until 6am. Suddenly they say: "Heck, that was just a 'roundabout number'; we didn't mean it."

I think they changed the time frame when they got that video analyzed, showing SM's truck, or one like his, heading to PTL.

What remains a question to me is: Why did LE insist on 6am (while having access to all the phone records and pings), while Terry Elvis was insisting 3:41am?

Then LE switched to that time, too, 3:41am. What did Terry know before LE knew it?

 

[Dr. Know?]

I think the 6am call will only be answered at trial. I'm interested in all the calls at trial tbh.

I don't think the 6am is so complicated though. What company you are billed from does report times differently. Fact. Statements made were possibly before that Fact was noticed. It was pointed out here by many posters how their Verizon bill read. CA time even for back Easterners is usally 3 hours difference at that time of year. Also, she may have recieved text up until then or voice mail. Not hard to understand. Anxious to know what it is though like others.

Or it was the M's using Heather's phone after they murdered her. bad words...again. That's the choices I come up with. You?

 

[CuriousCricket]

I think the 6am call will only be answered at trial. I'm interested in all the calls at trial tbh.

I don't think the 6am is so complicated though. What company you are billed from does report times differently. Fact. Statements made were possibly before that Fact was noticed. It was pointed out here by many posters how their Verizon bill read. CA time even for back Easterners is usally 3 hours difference at that time of year. Also, she may have recieved text up until then or voice mail. Not hard to understand. Anxious to know what it is though like others.

Or it was the M's using Heather's phone after they murdered her. bad words...again. That's the choices I come up with. You?

When were the indecent exposure pixs sent to Heather?

Thanks,

 

[magnolia]

Something very important, or, she was not in control of her phone at that time. We really have no way of knowing who was on the phone making those rapid-fire calls to SM's phone. The likelihood of Heather calling SM's just before meeting him, while only minutes from the Moorers house, seems highly unlikely to me.

This fits with my strong belief that lies have been told about Heather's phone either being in a back and forth with Heather and SM until 6am (and that "fact," suddenly and glibly becoming only "a roundabout number," making no sense whatsoever), or being cut off totally at 3:41am.

Something is definitely wrong with the phone "explanation," and I wonder why LE has found it necessary to conceal the truth about Heather's phone usage.

BBM

I wonder why LE has found it necessary to conceal the truth about the whole case. Why were the results of the search warrants withheld from the public. Sorry, I don't buy the ongoing investigation explanation. I think more could have been disclosed without jeopardizing their investigation and techniques. The public will never be privy to everything they know. All that said, if you give it a lot of thought, you can probably come up with an answer to your BBM. IMO

 

[eileenhawkeye]

I think the 6am call will only be answered at trial. I'm interested in all the calls at trial tbh.

I don't think the 6am is so complicated though. What company you are billed from does report times differently. Fact. Statements made were possibly before that Fact was noticed. It was pointed out here by many posters how their Verizon bill read. CA time even for back Easterners is usally 3 hours difference at that time of year. Also, she may have recieved text up until then or voice mail. Not hard to understand. Anxious to know what it is though like others.

Or it was the M's using Heather's phone after they murdered her. bad words...again. That's the choices I come up with. You?

I feel that when your daughter is missing, you would be studying the phone records so extensively that you would realize what time zone they were in. I also doubt this is the first time Terry has ever looked at something from the phone company. Does it say on it "All times in Pacific"?

 

[eileenhawkeye]

BBM

I wonder why LE has found it necessary to conceal the truth about the whole case. Why were the results of the search warrants withheld from the public. Sorry, I don't buy the ongoing investigation explanation. I think more could have been disclosed without jeopardizing their investigation and techniques. The public will never be privy to everything they know. All that said, if you give it a lot of thought, you can probably come up with an answer to your BBM. IMO

One thing that baffles me is LE was not able to get a search warrant until weeks later, when the Moorers admitted to IE/OJ (or lied)....I can't recall exactly. So with PTL + phone records + video footage, it still was not enough. I am guessing there was nothing at PTL, so it made the phone records and footage irrelevant for getting the warrant? Would Sidney be the last person to talk to Heather be enough? I guess not. I would like to know if a search warrant was requested prior, why it was denied, etc.

 

[Ghostwheel]

One thing that baffles me is LE was not able to get a search warrant until weeks later, when the Moorers admitted to IE/OJ (or lied)....I can't recall exactly. So with PTL + phone records + video footage, it still was not enough. I am guessing there was nothing at PTL, so it made the phone records and footage irrelevant for getting the warrant? Would Sidney be the last person to talk to Heather be enough? I guess not. I would like to know if a search warrant was requested prior, why it was denied, etc.

BBM: I'm not sure that they had the video footage or the truck from said footage identified at that point. It was never said exactly when they located that footage or how long it took to ID the truck. But even besides, that, it does not mean it was not enough. It might mean they were waiting for the right time (in LEs plan) to serve the search warrants. It is even possible that right then wasn't the time they were planning on serving the warrant, but the escalation of people shooting at the Ms had gotten to the point where they decided they had enough and could do it just then. LE often wants to get whatever ducks they have lined up just the way they want them, in the order they want them to line up, gathering more ducks along the way and putting them in the sequence.

It is my opinion that once the truck on video footage was tracked down to the only one in the county that had those particular features AND belonged to the Ms, that is what instigated the search warrant. Whether it really coincided with the IE/OJ charges or not, I don't know.

 

[Ghostwheel]

Something very important, or, she was not in control of her phone at that time. We really have no way of knowing who was on the phone making those rapid-fire calls to SM's phone. The likelihood of Heather calling SM's just before meeting him, while only minutes from the Moorers house, seems highly unlikely to me.

This fits with my strong belief that lies have been told about Heather's phone either being in a back and forth with Heather and SM until 6am (and that "fact," suddenly and glibly becoming only "a roundabout number," making no sense whatsoever), or being cut off totally at 3:41am.

Something is definitely wrong with the phone "explanation," and I wonder why LE has found it necessary to conceal the truth about Heather's phone usage.

BBM: As a thought, so that the Ms can continue to lie and be caught in lies about their own phone communications? If they know the exact times, they can come up with all kinds of lies to fit the timeline, but when you don't know the exact timeline, you can't explain everything away unless you really are innocent. JMO.

 

[PPKik]

BBM: As a thought, so that the Ms can continue to lie and be caught in lies about their own phone communications? If they know the exact times, they can come up with all kinds of lies to fit the timeline, but when you don't know the exact timeline, you can't explain everything away unless you really are innocent. JMO.

I see what you're saying about possibly tripping them up, but I still don't see the benefit of changing the story of the phone records.

If the Moorers believed LE thought Heather was alive and communicating until 6am, how does that change anything for them? It puts the Moorers, or one of them, in a longer "back and forth" with Heather. It makes it look worse, doesn't it?

On the other hand, we have Terry insisting, starting at some point, that all communication stopped at 3:41am, while LE is insisting on something different. Then, LE switches to Terry's time. How and why did this happen?

Terry did criticize LE, but he also praised them and called most of them his "friends." I would think that if his friends told him they wanted to mislead the Moorers by giving out the wrong times on the phone logs, Terry, in the best interest of the case and finding Heather, would not contradict them, but he did.

For a long time he was at odds with the investigators and Chief Rhodes, insisting on a different time. Why did he do this, and, how did he know that 3:41am was the time everything stopped and Heather was killed (according to LE)?

 

[Ghostwheel]

I see what you're saying about possibly tripping them up, but I still don't see the benefit of changing the story of the phone records.

If the Moorers believed LE thought Heather was alive and communicating until 6am, how does that change anything for them? It puts the Moorers, or one of them, in a longer "back and forth" with Heather. It makes it look worse, doesn't it?

On the other hand, we have Terry insisting, starting at some point, that all communication stopped at 3:41am, while LE is insisting on something different. Then, LE switches to Terry's time. How and why did this happen?

Terry did criticize LE, but he also praised them and called most of them his "friends." I would think that if his friends told him they wanted to mislead the Moorers by giving out the wrong times on the phone logs, Terry, in the best interest of the case and finding Heather, would not contradict them, but he did.

For a long time he was at odds with the investigators and Chief Rhodes, insisting on a different time. Why did he do this, and, how did he know that 3:41am was the time everything stopped and Heather was killed (according to LE)?

I hear what you are saying, but in my mind, Heather's phone data stopped at 3:41. To me, that means her phone was no longer able to send or receive anything. It does not mean another phone could not try to contact her phone. And that is where I am stuck. Yes, Heather's phone stopped at 3:41, but anyone else could have communicated to her phone account (to her number) anytime after that. We know that her parents did, I'm sure her friends did. A non-working phone does not equate to a non-working account. So there could be communication from someone else's number to Heather's number, and if it was SM's phone, that means back and forth communication between numbers, even if Heather's physical phone could not communicate. Terry Elvis is right: his daughter's phone stopped communicating at 3:41. AND the original report could also be right: SM's phone communicated with Heather's phone number. (and someone just said phone, because that is what normal people think-they don't think that the phone number is not forever attached to the physical phone.

I liken it to what I just went through with my daughter's phone. Her smartphone decided it wanted to go though a perpetual reset cycle. I sent her text messages and thought she got them, because they were not in my phone's send queue. But because her phone was continually resetting itself, it had no access to the mobile network. So she never got those messages. Yet our phone bill says she did. According to our phone bill, there was communication from my phone to her phone, but it was really just from my phone number to her phone number. When we got her a new phone, all the message I had sent previously came in to the new phone. They were sitting out in a queue somewhere (but not on my phone's queue), waiting for a physical phone that could receive them.

ETA: After a certain amount of time Heather's phone would no longer work unless charged, no matter what. If it had been me, after a week, I'd have gotten another phone and switched the number to the new phone, then checked anything that came in. This, or information gathered from the phone account provider, could have told them that a message was set to come in to Heather's phone at 3:42 and could not do so. JMO.

 

[PPKik]

When were the indecent exposure pixs sent to Heather?

Thanks,

I wonder if anyone knows, or even if there were any! IE charges and IE photos. Where there both or none?

 

[4evernbluejeans]

So Ghostweel, let me ask you this- suppose TE on the day he could not get a hold of HE by phone, contacted the provider-we know he did. Saw that the calls ended at 341am, could he with in a day or so have had her number installed to a working phone and removed any "qued" but not received calls and or texts? IDK how that works-

 

[4evernbluejeans]

Or rather viewed instead of "removed"