The Possible Abuse of Caylee REVISIT

[Chilly Willy]

Respectfully, I disagree. George mentioned that he had asked Caylee if she had a good time with Zanny and Caylee looked at him like she had no idea what he was talking about. IIRC, he regretted not taking it further but claimed that Cindy told him to butt out because he was not LE anymore.

Not sure what you're disagreeing with. There was no Zanny so of course Caylee had no idea what he was talking about.

 

[believe09]

Not sure what you're disagreeing with. There was no Zanny so of course Caylee had no idea what he was talking about.

My mistake-I read your statement to mean that you believed there was a Zanny as in named Zanny. Not a conglomeration of friends and family who might have watched Caylee-but an actual ZFG.

 

[Chilly Willy]

My mistake-I read your statement to mean that you believed there was a Zanny as in named Zanny. Not a conglomeration of friends and family who might have watched Caylee-but an actual ZFG.

No problem. I don't believe in Zanny. I also don't believe in Santa Claus, but don't let that get around

 

[yellowlab]

"The Anthony's didn't love Caylee enough to keep her safe and they didn't love her more than KC. CA must save KC at all costs. IF CA had loved Caylee enough she would NEVER have let KC take her off at nite to spend the nite in various boyfriends beds, laying around on couches at parties where there was booze and drugs and who knows what else and sleeping where? In the trunk of the car??? CA didn't care enough about Caylee to find out what sort of life the poor child was leading. Caylee was a VERY abused child. I wish to God someone had called child protective services long ago."

This post was on another thread, but it says things so well I thought it is worth a thread of its own.

From the time I read that Casey was taking this small child along with her to parties where the child had to sleep on the sofa while mommy partied with her friends I immediately thought "child abuse".

Then when I read about her having the child sleep in the bed with her and boyfriend Rico - I was apalled!

I believe somewhere along the line Cindy stated (either at a hearing or in one of her interviews) that prior to Casey leaving on June 16th that there were very few nights when she and Caylee were not at home. Does anyone really believe this?

These grandparents were financially supporting Casey and allowing her to drag this poor tot around town with her, yet knew she was irresponsible to the extent of stealing regularly from them and that she had expanded to stealing from other family members as well.

I just cannot fathom the scenario that George and Cindy thought Casey was at work and that Caylee was with a babysitter or nanny. I cannot fathom that they did not have any interest in KNOWING who was caring for their grandchild while Casey "worked".

You're last sentence speaks volumes to me.This has been on my mind all these months. No phone no....no location of the nanny ..for over a year ?

 

[bessie]

to be honest, the way casey had referred to caylee as 'the little snothead' when talking to the boyfriend, well...to me it seemed as though the boyfriend had called caylee that to casey before and casey was using his words to make a point, as in, 'well, i can't come over unless of course you want the little snothead to come too...didn't think so'.

or something along those lines. (i know i didn't quote her exactly, but that is what she was saying in the conversation.)

i think casey is evil beyond evil, but in that instance, i think she was using someone else's words back against them simply to make the point of, well i would come over anyway and bring her, but you won't have it because my kid is with me and you obviously don't want her there with us. she might have even said it to kind of make him feel like a jerk for calling her names and trying to get sympathy about it so he would say, okay just come over and bring her too, no big deal.

and i have heard of caylee sleeping in the bed with only one of casey's boyfriends and casey, who happened to be ricardo. who else did this happen with and where is it documented? or are we referring to when caylee was a baby and she was with jesse and casey, who at the time were supposedly both her parents?

That's my take, too. The "snothead" reference in this instance is irrelevant. KC was repeating the bf's words, throwing them back in his face.

BTW, calling a child "snothead" is not in itself cruel. The manner and tone of voice make all the difference. My burly, 6'6" big brother used to call my son "sh*thead" with such tenderness it brought tears to my eyes.

 

[Mom of Five]

Could you please post a link to even one of those cases where a mother lost her parental rights for sleeping around? Who, besides Casey, even knew how many men she slept with? She certainly didn't go home to Cindy and brag about it. Cindy, as naive as it is, thought she was at work. Remember, Cindy couldn't believe that Casey was pregnant.

Apparently some of us had mothers with ESP who knew every single thing we did when we were out of the house, even as adults. I'm sure glad I'm not one of those kids.

Cindy and George did everything they possibly could for Caylee. It's horribly unfair to blame them for Casey's crimes.[/QUOTE]
Bolded by me,
Respectfully, I have to disagree 100% with that statement. I have a Casey for a sister who had a daughter that I have adopted. I did everything to protect my niece who is now my daughter. CA and GA fell short. I do not blame them for Casey's crimes but I hold them accountable for turning a blind eye.
I don't know how many men my sister slept with or how many drugs she was using but I knew there was a serious problem so I contacted child welfare. My parents were like G&C so it was a difficult process but I didn't give up, the stakes were too high. Now my baby is safe and will never end up like Caylee.
I did everything possible, they did not.

 

[believe09]

Are you sure about this? I can't recall off hand but I would swear that I've heard CA tell either OCSO or FBI that she remembers KC talking about Zani the babysitter for at least a year and a half?

This was my recollection as well-and I thought that Casey told Rev Grund that she had hired a nanny to watch Caylee once Rev Grund made it clear that they would not be watching her any longer....

 

[Fuzzymuffin]

IMO it isn't far to go from neglect to abuse. Maybe KC only hit her one time and it was the last time she touched KC. But IMO she was headed there. Caylee was already, at the least, a neglected child. Remember the allegations of neglect by TonE's roommate's girlfriend? She stated that whe she was over at the apartment and KC had Caylee there that Caylee played on the balcony without supervision. I put more weight on her observations than those of the friends.

 

[metalcrystal]

Could you please post a link to even one of those cases where a mother lost her parental rights for sleeping around? Who, besides Casey, even knew how many men she slept with? She certainly didn't go home to Cindy and brag about it. Cindy, as naive as it is, thought she was at work. Remember, Cindy couldn't believe that Casey was pregnant.

Apparently some of us had mothers with ESP who knew every single thing we did when we were out of the house, even as adults. I'm sure glad I'm not one of those kids.

Cindy and George did everything they possibly could for Caylee. It's horribly unfair to blame them for Casey's crimes.[/QUOTE]
Bolded by me,
Respectfully, I have to disagree 100% with that statement. I have a Casey for a sister who had a daughter that I have adopted. I did everything to protect my niece who is now my daughter. CA and GA fell short. I do not blame them for Casey's crimes but I hold them accountable for turning a blind eye.
I don't know how many men my sister slept with or how many drugs she was using but I knew there was a serious problem so I contacted child welfare. My parents were like G&C so it was a difficult process but I didn't give up, the stakes were too high. Now my baby is safe and will never end up like Caylee.
I did everything possible, they did not.

Mom of Five, that's awesome.

 

[bessie]

Could you please post a link to even one of those cases where a mother lost her parental rights for sleeping around? Who, besides Casey, even knew how many men she slept with? She certainly didn't go home to Cindy and brag about it. Cindy, as naive as it is, thought she was at work. Remember, Cindy couldn't believe that Casey was pregnant.

Apparently some of us had mothers with ESP who knew every single thing we did when we were out of the house, even as adults. I'm sure glad I'm not one of those kids.

Cindy and George did everything they possibly could for Caylee. It's horribly unfair to blame them for Casey's crimes.[/QUOTE]
Bolded by me,
Respectfully, I have to disagree 100% with that statement. I have a Casey for a sister who had a daughter that I have adopted. I did everything to protect my niece who is now my daughter. CA and GA fell short. I do not blame them for Casey's crimes but I hold them accountable for turning a blind eye.
I don't know how many men my sister slept with or how many drugs she was using but I knew there was a serious problem so I contacted child welfare. My parents were like G&C so it was a difficult process but I didn't give up, the stakes were too high. Now my baby is safe and will never end up like Caylee.
I did everything possible, they did not.

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:
I've been trying to lay off the A's since Caylee's remains were found, but the truth's the truth. I faced a similar situation with a sibling. It stopped short of having the children removed because I took action early. It wasn't easy and it wasn't pretty. I stood my ground, appearing tough as nails on the outside while inwardly crying my heart out. I wasn't thrilled about the notion of starting over again as a parent of young children in my late 40's, but I would've done it in a heartbeat had it come to that.

 

[shannahg]

Could you please post a link to even one of those cases where a mother lost her parental rights for sleeping around? Who, besides Casey, even knew how many men she slept with? She certainly didn't go home to Cindy and brag about it. Cindy, as naive as it is, thought she was at work. Remember, Cindy couldn't believe that Casey was pregnant.

Apparently some of us had mothers with ESP who knew every single thing we did when we were out of the house, even as adults. I'm sure glad I'm not one of those kids.

Cindy and George did everything they possibly could for Caylee. It's horribly unfair to blame them for Casey's crimes.

I am not sure how Cindy was, especially since she has already indicated her daughter has some qualities of a sociopath so she seems worldly enough. But I can definitely vouch for my own poor mom....she had no clue and was totally trusting! I didn't get in a whole lot of trouble as a teenager but I did have my moments of coming in after drinking with friends...or having my boyfriend in my room while mom was up front watching tv (we're just 'talking' k?). Some mom's are just not attuned to what their kids can and will get into. JMO!

 

[CentralFLMama]

I personally think its a stretch to call taking a kid to parties where there is alcohol and drugs "abuse" ... probably not the greatest idea but not abuse. Having her sleep in the same bed as a boyfriend - really bad idea on many levels. Neglectful. Dumb. And certainly Casey DID abuse Caylee in some way in June when she killed her - but I just cant call taking her to parties abuse.

 

[Mermaid]

Ricardo did say in his interview with LE that Caylee was a little flirt.

A grown man making a statement like that bothers me for many reasons.

Was Caylee brought to so many parties and places that she had to find some sort of way to get the attention from the "men" Casey brought her around I do not mean sexual, I mean just regular attention a toddler would want.
Maybe Caylee was imitating the way her own Mom acted around men.
Either way... not something you normally hear from a grown man when describing a 2 year old toddler.
:waitasec:

That is odd and it also makes me feel uncomfortable. I agree, Caylee was most like mimicking (sp?) Mommy.

 

[not_my_kids]

Hi, all. I come back from holiday break and I see this thread and almost thought we had something confirmed.
Now that I have read he thread so far, I'll give my input. I don't think that Casey allowing Caylee to sleep in the same bed with her and RM constitutes abuse. Stupidity, definitely. And although I don't see it as abusive, it soes make me wonder. Casey was not being a esponsible mother to allow her child to sleep in bed with her and the current flavor of the month, but what about his judgement? I don't know very many men that wouldn;t be a little uncomfortable with a two year old they weren't related to crawling in their bed.
Course, then again, I am one of those moms that has never allowed to let my kids to sleep in bed with me...ever.

 

[absolut_alexis]

I personally think its a stretch to call taking a kid to parties where there is alcohol and drugs "abuse" ... probably not the greatest idea but not abuse. Having her sleep in the same bed as a boyfriend - really bad idea on many levels. Neglectful. Dumb. And certainly Casey DID abuse Caylee in some way in June when she killed her - but I just cant call taking her to parties abuse.

Here is the Florida definition. I don't know where the parties fits in, exactly. The potential for things to get messy is so high that it could fit several categories.

D. Description of Harm (Child):

ABUSE: Any willful or threatened act or omission that results in any physical, mental, or sexual injury or harm that causes or is likely to cause the child's physical, mental, or emotional health to be significantly impaired. NEGLECT: Any act or omission where a child is deprived of, or allowed to be deprived of, necessary supervision, food, clothing, shelter, or medical treatment, or a child is permitted to live in an environment when such deprivation or environment causes the child's physical, mental, or emotional health to be significantly impaired or to be in danger of being significantly impaired. The foregoing circumstances shall not be considered neglect if caused primarily by financial inability unless actual services for relief have been offered to and rejected by the caretaker responsible.

THREATENED HARM: A situation, circumstances or behavior which leads a prudent person to have reasonable cause to suspect abuse or neglect has occurred or may occur in the immediate future if no intervention is provided.

SPECIAL CONDITIONS: A situation that does not rise to the reasonable cause to suspect harm level, but requires intervention.

 

[Mermaid]

ps - @mermaid wow it must be tough for you working with CA and seeing some of the things people say about someone you know and like (myself included) :ashamed0005:

(snipped)


Zero, I don't know her well enough to like or dislike her, but I am friendly with many co-workers who hold her in high esteem. I don't agree with a lot of what she has done, but I can certainly understand where she is coming from, and I know she is beside herself with grief.

 

[pirate]

Casey was no mother of the year. However, there is not one reported instance of anyone saying anything other than that she was a good mother when she was with her daughter.

That is not true. In the first batch of discovery documents there was an interview with a friend of Tony the boyfriends- I believe it was a girlfriend of one of his roomates who said that Casey was not very attentive to Caylee.


Regarding the parties- I also remember hearing that Caylee was at the "no clothes" party. That's a far cry from a normal adult party and she had no business being there or at any similar parties.

Regarding sleeping in bed w/ mom and man du jor- no way. Mom was teaching her that sharing beds with men was no big deal and was therefore encouraging promiscuity. She should have been dating these men for 3-6 months before they were introduced to Caylee.

And finally, regarding abuse. Someone else mentioned this here last week and was attacked relentlessly but I'm going to say it as well. In the few videos we've seen of Caylee, I sensed some emotions that did not seem to show her to be a happy child. Some anger, some fear, some sadness and even resignation.

I know anger and defiance is fairly typical in a two and three year old. That I could excuse if I didn't see the fear and resignation in her eyes when she was cuddling up with her great granddad.

Caylee was not a typical toddler. And it is not speaking ill of her to point out that she probably had more challenges than the typical child her age (instability, a self centered mother, exposure to inappropriate events, no daddy in her life) and therefore acted out and was not as happy as she should have been.

 

[curiositycat]

I personally think its a stretch to call taking a kid to parties where there is alcohol and drugs "abuse" ... probably not the greatest idea but not abuse. Having her sleep in the same bed as a boyfriend - really bad idea on many levels. Neglectful. Dumb. And certainly Casey DID abuse Caylee in some way in June when she killed her - but I just cant call taking her to parties abuse.

Alcohol is one thing..drugs are illegal. If there is a bust in a house where there are children the children will be taken away from parent at least on a temp basis. So yeah, taking a child to a party like that is abuse. JMO. Caylee was the only child in a group of partying adults. The testimony of Amy proved that she didn't always watch Caylee, she would be "somewhere else" while Caylee was asleep. Sometime, she reported, Caylee would wake up. Not a good thing. When a child is taken into a sexually charged situation, such as the "clothes optional party", you may have some sickos in the crowd. There is just no way a child should be in that environment. NONE.

JMO

 

[Mermaid]

If your an employee there - then I would suggest not posting things that LE doesn't want posted - I don't know if anyone else would agree, but you are saying things that quite frankly heresay and could get you in trouble

Just trying to not let you go down a road like we've seen others that THINK they have an inside track - a few have disappeared from here for reasons that aren't nice and they were grilled here

I only post my opinions. I appreciate the warning. I felt uncomfortable with her being accused of "not being a good nurse."

 

[mydailyopinions]

I only post my opinions. I appreciate the warning. I felt uncomfortable with her being accused of "not being a good nurse."

I agree, and appreciate your opinion. There is always more sides to a story than what is put out there on TV.