The State v. Jodi Arias: break in trial until 28 January 2013 #13 *ADULT CONTENT*

[Love Never Fails]

Of course Jodi was not a victim.

But I think Travis was in no way FORCED to have sex with Jodi. I think he was a normal man with normal urges and Jodi was a willing partner.

I really don't see why it's necessary to paint Travis as something he was not. The person he was was pretty doggoned awesome! And not being a Mormon, I don't think the sex was such a big deal.

But the man DID have sex and was not married, and he continued the sex even after he broke off the relationship. I don't see why this makes Jodi a *advertiser censored* and Travis is not. IMO, nobody is a *advertiser censored* when two consenting adults have sex.

Yes, Jodi is murderous monster. Yes, Travis is an victim and in no way deserved to die or even be hurt physically!

But the messed up relationship
that came before? Takes two to tango.

MOO

Exactly. But their relationship doesn't matter. This is a murder trial, not a trial of their sexual appetites. Cut and dried to me. Murder one.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Of course Jodi was not a victim.

But I think Travis was in no way FORCED to have sex with Jodi. I think he was a normal man with normal urges and Jodi was a willing partner.

I really don't see why it's necessary to paint Travis as something he was not. The person he was was pretty doggoned awesome! And not being a Mormon, I don't think the sex was such a big deal.

But the man DID have sex and was not married, and he continued the sex even after he broke off the relationship. I don't see why this makes Jodi a *advertiser censored* and Travis is not. IMO, nobody is a *advertiser censored* when two consenting adults have sex.

Yes, Jodi is murderous monster. Yes, Travis is an victim and in no way deserved to die or even be hurt physically!

But the messed up relationship
that came before? Takes two to tango.

MOO

I think Jodi Arias fits the profile of a female stalker and Travis Alexander is her victim.

Female Stalkers, Part 2: Checklist of Stalking and Harassment Behaviors

•Hacking into your computer, email, Facebook accounts, etc. (i.e., electronic stalking).
•Threatening to harm/kill herself.
•Threatening to harm/kill you.
•Verbally abusing you.
•Physically abusing you.
•Psychologically abusing you.
•Vandalizing your property or a loved one’s property.
* Forcing you or tricking you into having sex

http://www.shrink4men.com/2011/02/1...ecklist-of-stalking-and-harassment-behaviors/

In fact I doubt the same opinion would be held if the victim had been a female. A lot of DV victims have had sex or was forced into having sex with their abuser. I fail to see how that makes them less of a victim of a stalker and murderer.

Or is this the tired old line 'he had to want it or it wouldnt have happened' used if the male is the victim?

 

[katiecoolady]

Janine Driver, body language expert is on In Session this morning analyzing Jodi's behavior, including her "jail house stretch" that Vinnie Politan demonstrated on air.

 

[BD1]

Of course Jodi was not a victim.

But I think Travis was in no way FORCED to have sex with Jodi. I think he was a normal man with normal urges and Jodi was a willing partner.

I really don't see why it's necessary to paint Travis as something he was not. The person he was was pretty doggoned awesome! And not being a Mormon, I don't think the sex was such a big deal.

But the man DID have sex and was not married, and he continued the sex even after he broke off the relationship. I don't see why this makes Jodi a *advertiser censored* and Travis is not. IMO, nobody is a *advertiser censored* when two consenting adults have sex.

Yes, Jodi is murderous monster. Yes, Travis is an victim and in no way deserved to die or even be hurt physically!

But the messed up relationship
that came before? Takes two to tango.

MOO

Totally agree, and if I was a juror, I could feel this way and still convict her. Because in no way did the truth of the relationship make Travis deserving of death. But I really think Travis's past trauma, his current narcissistic traits, his terribly conflicting desire for religious conformity and sexual participation made for a really pathological relationship for both parties, and I think her pathology is real and was seriously, murderously, tripped by his. But you still just can't kill people.

And I do think Travis woud have self corrected, with time and wisdom and support from his religion and loved ones. He would have probably grown into a truely great man.

 

[FrayedKnot]

I think Jodi Arias fits the profile of a female stalker and Travis Alexander is her victim.

Female Stalkers, Part 2: Checklist of Stalking and Harassment Behaviors

•Hacking into your computer, email, Facebook accounts, etc. (i.e., electronic stalking).
•Threatening to harm/kill herself.
•Threatening to harm/kill you.
•Verbally abusing you.
•Physically abusing you.
•Psychologically abusing you.
•Vandalizing your property or a loved one’s property.
* Forcing you or tricking you into having sex

http://www.shrink4men.com/2011/02/1...ecklist-of-stalking-and-harassment-behaviors/

In fact I doubt the same opinion would be held if the victim had been a female. A lot of DV victims have had sex or was forced into having sex with their abuser. I fail to see how that makes them less of a victim of a stalker and murderer.

Or is this the tired old line 'he had to want it or it wouldnt have happened' used if the male is the victim?

Sigh.

Agree to disagree.

But IMO a man doesn't ask for naked pics of a woman he is trying to get away from. Reverse the genders and it still applies.

And it is not a "tired old" anything.

I see two people in a sexually relationship that turned back and yet was still continued by BOTH parties.

Travis never saw this coming. He may have had a bad feeling but he had no idea the depth of her crazy.

 

[atthelake]

First thing she does on looking at the photos...she denies she was there but when Flores shows her nekkid and only shows her face and rest covered up, she turns up hust the right bottomm corner....and saw the time stamp area and put the paper back over it.....


Just caught her saying he didnt rape me....hmmmmm

 

[LambChop]

I have seen nothing to prove TA was seeing Jodi after they broke up and certainly nothing that shows he was still taking trips with her. Anyone have a link?? I know they traveled together while they dated but it's unclear as to whether they were within a group or alone. Even while dating she was in CA and he was in AZ. Once they broke up it was Jodi that moved to Mesa. Now why would she do that? There was truly nothing there for her and she continued to insert herself into his life.

I also have not seen anyone painting him as a saint, only a very religious man but he still was a normal male with the same reactions to a beautiful woman as any male would. Normal single men seem to have a very low resistence when a woman sexually pushes herself on them. To me Travis seemed like a typical normal male and while his religious leaders may find fault with any sexual contact he had with Jodi outside his faith most of us cannot.

Who Travis was is not important in this case other than the fact was he an abusive person or not? It appears from all his friends who thought highly of him that he was not. He was their friend and they are only expressing what their experiences were with him and what they felt he was capable of. Their intent was not to put him on a pedestal, they were just being truthful. While it appears that is what they were doing to us it may be just the way he really was.

Jodi kept going to him. Moved from CA right into his neighbor near him. She kept in contact with him. He clearly wanted no part of seeing her again. But I do think he loved her when they first met and wanted to marry her and maybe not after 2 hours, as in the other story of a married member of the church who spent 2 hours in the car with her and wanted to leave his wife. The more he got to know her the more he realized she was not what he originally thought she was, the kind, caring person she tries to project to others.

The focus is on Jodi. There is no proof Travis was abusive. If the doctor claims Jodi suffers from an abusive relationship who is to say it was not a prior relationship. She did not live with Travis, she lived in California while they dated. In Mesa she lived with a friend, who may have been responsible for Jodi moving back to CA and not TA as most of us believe. So how she can claim he was abusive when she was rarely with him lacks credibility. jmo

 

[FrayedKnot]

First thing she does on looking at the photos...she denies she was there but when Flores shows her nekkid and only shows her face and rest covered up, she turns up hust the right bottomm corner....and saw the time stamp area and put the paper back over it.....


Just caught her saying he didnt rape me....hmmmmm

It looked like she was trying to smell the photos. Ugh.

 

[BD1]

I guess in a strictly criminal sense, it doesn't matter who Travis was except that he wasn't abusive. I am very interested in all of the details and all of the tangled web because I have several young adult boys and am using this as a cautionary tale for them, and I love the psychology behind these stories. It costs me nothing to understand fully how this relationship played out, I can mourn for Travis while still tolerating the notion that he was engaging this crazy woman.

 

[FrayedKnot]

I have seen nothing to prove TA was seeing Jodi after they broke up and certainly nothing that shows he was still taking trips with her. Anyone have a link?? I know they traveled together while they dated but it's unclear as to whether they were within a group or alone. Even while dating she was in CA and he was in AZ. Once they broke up it was Jodi that moved to Mesa. Now why would she do that? There was truly nothing there for her and she continued to insert herself into his life.

I also have not seen anyone painting him as a saint, only a very religious man but he still was a normal male with the same reactions to a beautiful woman as any male would. Normal single men seem to have a very low resistence when a woman sexually pushes herself on them. To me Travis seemed like a typical normal male and while his religious leaders may find fault with any sexual contact he had with Jodi outside his faith most of us cannot.

Who Travis was is not important in this case other than the fact was he an abusive person or not? It appears from all his friends who thought highly of him that he was not. He was their friend and they are only expressing what their experiences were with him and what they felt he was capable of. Their intent was not to put him on a pedestal, they were just being truthful. While it appears that is what they were doing to us it may be just the way he really was.

Jodi kept going to him. Moved from CA right into his neighbor near him. She kept in contact with him. He clearly wanted no part of seeing her again. But I do think he loved her when they first met and wanted to marry her and maybe not after 2 hours, as in the other story of a married member of the church who spent 2 hours in the car with her and wanted to leave his wife. The more he got to know her the more he realized she was not what he originally thought she was, the kind, caring person she tries to project to others.

The focus is on Jodi. There is no proof Travis was abusive. If the doctor claims Jodi suffers from an abusive relationship who is to say it was not a prior relationship. She did not live with Travis, she lived in California while they dated. In Mesa she lived with a friend, who may have been responsible for Jodi moving back to CA and not TA as most of us believe. So how she can claim he was abusive when she was rarely with him lacks credibility. jmo

IMO, the bolded is very sexist.

So in theory, if I were a young woman with a healthy libido and were dating a young man with an equally healthy libido, any sexual contact we would have would be because men are not accountable for their sex drive?

And the "sexual woman" is the one responsible for forcing the poor man to have sex?

IMO that is poppycock. Even though the are many cultures that embrace that same philosophy.

Women who are raped gets stoned to death because they obviously incited lust in their rapist.

 

[BD1]

I guess in a strictly criminal sense, it doesn't matter who Travis was except that he wasn't abusive. I am very interested in all of the details and all of the tangled web because I have several young adult boys and am using this as a cautionary tale for them, and I love the psychology behind these stories. It costs me nothing to understand fully how this relationship played out, I can mourn for Travis while still tolerating the notion that he was engaging this crazy woman.

And to support my 'theory', heck even his most beloved sister and closest friends said "she became like a drug to him" and "yes, we hold him responsible for his actions with Jodi".

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Sigh.

Agree to disagree.

But IMO a man doesn't ask for naked pics of a woman he is trying to get away from. Reverse the genders and it still applies.

And it is not a "tired old" anything.

I see two people in a sexually relationship that turned back and yet was still continued by BOTH parties.

Travis never saw this coming. He may have had a bad feeling but he had no idea the depth of her crazy.

How do we know he asked for those pics to be taken? He is dead and silenced. Do you believe this because JA says so? So be it. But I do not believe one word that comes out of this evil woman's mouth who knows the victim can no longer speak for himself.

I dont believe that a man would want snapshots of himself without an erection either it it was intended to be sexual turn on photos.

I guess you would have said the same thing about me if my ex had succeeded and murdered me. He did come to my home for 10.5 months after I left him uninvited everytime and he did demand that I have sex with him......which I did even though I wanted to throw up. I knew by then if I did not give into his demands he would rage even more and more violent acts would occur.

IMO

 

[Love Never Fails]

Lisa's blog... I haven't seen this posted here... I've seen snips of it in different articles.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/14fv5IFaj1BH0Xw-07Zo8GuFMxgkyohUYth2ePgU3dy5aDiMlN9GW7k0JCkKN/edit

Thanks for a nice read. I wonder if the defense will call her to the stand. Clearly she would enjoy strangling Jodi. IMO

 

[FrayedKnot]

I guess in a strictly criminal sense, it doesn't matter who Travis was except that he wasn't abusive. I am very interested in all of the details and all of the tangled web because I have several young adult boys and am using this as a cautionary tale for them, and I love the psychology behind these stories. It costs me nothing to understand fully how this relationship played out, I can mourn for Travis while still tolerating the notion that he was engaging this crazy woman.

You are right, Travis was not abusive so it does not matter if he was having a sexual relationship with Jodi.

That is why I am having a hard time understanding why some of feel it is necessary to insist that Travis had no will of his own regarding sex with Jodi.

It isn't necessary to absolve him of all responsibility in the sex for him to be a victim. He IS the victim here.

And it's nice to hear your are teaching your boys that they do have a choice!

 

[FrayedKnot]

How do we know he asked for those pics to be taken? He is dead and silenced. Do you believe this because JA says so? So be it. But I do not believe one word that comes out of this evil woman's mouth who knows the victim can no longer speak for himself.

I dont believe that a man would want snapshots of himself without an erection either it it was intended to be sexual turn on photos.

I guess you would have said the same thing about me if my ex had succeeded and murdered me. He did come to my home for 10.5 months after I left him uninvited everytime and he did demand that I have sex with him......which I did even though I wanted to throw up. I knew by then if I did not give into his demands he would rage even more and more violent acts would occur.

IMO

I'm not biting. I said "agree to disagree".

This case is about Travis and Jodi.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

IMO, the bolded is very sexist.

So in theory, if I were a young woman with a healthy libido and were dating a young man with an equally healthy libido, any sexual contact we would have would be because men are not accountable for their sex drive?

And the "sexual woman" is the one responsible for forcing the poor man to have sex?

IMO that is poppycock. Even though the are many cultures that embrace that same philosophy.

Women who are raped gets stoned to death because they obviously incited lust in their rapist.

We are not talking about how the relationship started. We are talking about how it evolved into a stalker domestic violence situation for Travis as it progressed just like females have had to endure.

IMO

 

[LadyEdith]

Of course Jodi was not a victim.

But I think Travis was in no way FORCED to have sex with Jodi. I think he was a normal man with normal urges and Jodi was a willing partner.

I really don't see why it's necessary to paint Travis as something he was not. The person he was was pretty doggoned awesome! And not being a Mormon, I don't think the sex was such a big deal.

But the man DID have sex and was not married, and he continued the sex even after he broke off the relationship. I don't see why this makes Jodi a *advertiser censored* and Travis is not. IMO, nobody is a *advertiser censored* when two consenting adults have sex.

Yes, Jodi is murderous monster. Yes, Travis is an victim and in no way deserved to die or even be hurt physically!

But the messed up relationship
that came before? Takes two to tango.

MOO

Well said.

 

[FrayedKnot]

@Lambchop:

IIRC, several of the photos of them taken on trips were after they ended their "dating" relationship.

And per Travis' friends they continued traveling together after the breakup which concerned them.

And Travis was sending text messages asking for naughty pics and telling her how pretty she was just ONE MONTH before that nutjob killed him.

I really don't think he believed she would go any further than tire slashing.

 

[FrayedKnot]

We are not talking about how the relationship started. We are talking about how it evolved into a stalker domestic violence situation for Travis as it progressed just like females have had to endure.

IMO

"Agree to disagree".

Please.

 

[Laceybug]

Thanks for a nice read. I wonder if the defense will call her to the stand. Clearly she would enjoy strangling Jodi. IMO

It's so sad how much guilt the young lady must feel over TA's death. TA wasn't Jodi's only victim. Its clear that so many people loved and admired Travis. No human is perfect. He made mistakes. He yielded to his temptation of the flesh. He wanted to help anyone and everyone and I'm sure that in his mind he thought he could help Jodi. It's been a very long 4 years for his family and friends. I pray they can find closure when this trial is over. I pray the jury doesn't let them down.