The Verdict - Do you agree or disagree?

[Sustained]

I don't recall a defense expert stating there was decomp in the car. Can you guide me to who said that?

Do defense experts work to protect the citizens of Orange County Florida everyday from people like FCA ? Did Inspector Bloise & Jason Forgey get huge pay increases or kickbacks from the State for their testimony ? Please tell me how Gerus & Bones were emotionally tied to this case for 3 years ...

 

[Baznme]

How is that insulting or attacking? logicagirl did not attack becca or even her opinion. She was addressing Sustained regarding the people who believe the evidence wasn't there. They clearly see it a different way than those of us who believe premeditation was proven.

The way I took the portion of logicalgirl's post you bolded, it sounded as if she is saying the "not guilty" posters have their minds made up. It's basically going round and round in circles on points we will never agree on.

The same could be said by the "not guilty" posters about us "guilty" posters, I'm sure and it just goes to show that we all interpret what is said and what we see differently. :twocents:

ITA. Thanks for putting it into perspective and snapping me back to reality. I'm sorry for Caylee that this was the result but, it's fruitless to rehash the rehashed and re-rehashed at this point IMO. See you on the other threads.

 

[Sustained]

I don't believe I did. And, if there was a definite smell of human decomp in the trunk, why did it take so long for them to confiscate it? And, additionally, why didn't the officer who secured the vehicle (applied tape to every opening of the car) smell it?

How do you know the officer who taped the car had ever smelled a decomposing body before ? I bet Inspector Bloise has ... numerous times ...

 

[askfornina]

i have a question for all you guilty posters. are there any pieces of evidence that you can concede were just not up to par? i believe the 84 searches is the most obvious answer here so im seeking other answers. thanks.

 

[beccalecca1]

Originally Posted by beccalecca1
Wasn't it confiscated on the 17th? They were in the garage in the early AM hours of the 16th, when GA told YM about the smell in the trunk. IIRC, they didn't pick it up until SB saw the story on the news and alerted LE about it being in his towyard and the smell. Why not, when you're there interviewing the family and discover information about a smell from ex-LE, investigate that?? Perhaps because you were near the car and didn't smell anything? But, when you get another tipster call in, then you decide to investigate it and base everything off of this "smell" that for some reason wasn't there the first night?

I believe that is an error. I beleive the notice on the car was sent registered to the A residence sometime around the 4th of July weekend and was put in the front door of the home. They didn't notice it until the 15th and went and picked up the car at that time. I'm not understanding your complete question, but that's OK.

I'm not referring to when the A's picked up the car, I'm referring to when LE picked up the car, IIRC it was July 17th after SB called LE to report his knowledge after watching the news. Notice, he didn't report his knowledge when he believed it smelled like human decomp, he waited until he saw the case all over the news.

And, from what I understand about this smell, it's nothing like you've ever smelled before. Don't you think if LE was confiscating a car, securing it up close and personal in all cracks, smelled something they've never smelled before, then were called to trial 3 years later (naturally remembering this because it's something you've never smelled before and it sticks in your mind once you smell it) they would testify that they, in fact, did smell something funny that day?

We have to remember they knew there was a bag of trash in that car so if you don't know what the smell of decomp is, until that has been established, you wouldn't know the trash/garbage from that odor.

I don't believe the officer who secured the car knew anything about it. I could be wrong, but IIRC, she only testified to securing the car and not smelling anything. As far as the other LE who were at the A's house that night, some/possibly all have smelled human decomp before, but didn't find it necessary to automatically secure the car and declare it a crime scene. They bought the trash story because the smell wasn't distinct to human decomp, IMO.

Snipped the logic stuff, because I'm hoping it doesn't need to be posted anymore.

 

[Baznme]

I respect your opinion. And since I respect your opinion I'm not going to post that you lack logic and insult you that since this is how you think or believe that you must be delusional and think the blue sky is green.

That was simply a play on words to emphasize the differences of opinion. Nothing to indicate anyone was delusional nor was there a claim that anyone "lacked" logic. The logic is different in opinion and I have a difficult time seeing that side at times. That's all.

Not intended as an insult pcrum12 but, I think beccalecca1 does just fine on his/her own. I may not agree with the posts but they are explained in detail and at times offer a facet of the conversation that has never been looked at before. That's why we come here.

 

[beccalecca1]

Do defense experts work to protect the citizens of Orange County Florida everyday from people like FCA ? Did Inspector Bloise & Jason Forgey get huge pay increases or kickbacks from the State for their testimony ? Please tell me how Gerus & Bones were emotionally tied to this case for 3 years ...

I'm not sure how any of this guides me to what defense experts stated there was decomp in the car. Do you know who said this?

 

[Sustained]

I'm not sure how any of this guides me to what defense experts stated there was decomp in the car. Do you know who said this?

You know as well as I do that no paid defense expert would ever admit to decomp being in the car ? Why would the DT pay someone to torpedo their theory that no body was in the car ?
And since the burden of proof is on the State, I tend to believe people like Jason Forgey, Yuri Melich & Inspector Bloise.

 

[sacrablue]

I don't believe I was disputing if the duct tape was present. I was disputing that people argue that the hurricane washed away all DNA evidence, but miraculously the duct tape held it's original position. I'm just not buying it.

I don't believe the duct tape affixed itself to the mandible because it was not affixed to the mandible. It was lying over the mandible area, but not attached in any way.

And, IMO, the main thing that hurt Dr. G's opinion was her saying 100% of all accidents are reported. One member of the jury was a nursing student, and as a member of the medical field you know nothing is ever 100%. Nothing. If Dr. G's said "a majority", "95%", etc... I think it would have held more water. But, when she used the words "100%", it made her appear to be emotionally involved and not able to make an objective opinion. JMO :innocent:

I enjoy this case because some of the evidence is new to me while other evdence I know like the back of my hand.
First, this duct tape thing has people struggling with trying to understand how the evidence worked or didn't work. DNA is housed in a living cell. If the cells break down, loose their outside walls the DNA also starts to break down. Example there is no DNA in decomp fluids. The cells have fallen appart for reasons environmental.
Duct Tape is made with different products. A cotton type core or strands for flexibility and durability. A elastic rubber cement placed on one side and a reflective silver coating put on the other. Does come in other colors.
When the tape is submerged in water it begins to break down.
When the tape is left in the sun, the UV and UVA rays break it down

All this is a good thing because if it didn't biodegrade our earth would be covered in plastic and duct tape.

Now how could the duct tape remain in position but have no DNA?
The tape degraded to the point top and bottom surfaces disintegrated. So any surface that was touched on June 16 was gone. So cells are gone as well and DNA is gone.
How did tape remain in position? The core of the tape is a wooven fabric material. It still kept its integrity and shape by looking at pictures. It would also act as a sling or belt around the skull.

 

[Baznme]

I'm not referring to when the A's picked up the car, I'm referring to when LE picked up the car, IIRC it was July 17th after SB called LE to report his knowledge after watching the news. Notice, he didn't report his knowledge when he believed it smelled like human decomp, he waited until he saw the case all over the news.



I don't believe the officer who secured the car knew anything about it. I could be wrong, but IIRC, she only testified to securing the car and not smelling anything. As far as the other LE who were at the A's house that night, some/possibly all have smelled human decomp before, but didn't find it necessary to automatically secure the car and declare it a crime scene. They bought the trash story because the smell wasn't distinct to human decomp, IMO.

Snipped the logic stuff, because I'm hoping it doesn't need to be posted anymore.

I believe as time goes on, we're going to hear from all these people that were in their respective jobs at that time. As life goes on, people change jobs, have time to reflect, etc. We'll be hearing about this for years to come just as in the case of OJ. The answers will come and maybe then we'll all have the true "aha" moment. I'm leaving this thread to try to find one that will be more constructive and hopefully help someone that needs to be found. How's that for logic, huh?

Happy posting........

 

[beccalecca1]

How do you know the officer who taped the car had ever smelled a decomposing body before ? I bet Inspector Bloise has ... numerous times ...

When the officer was asked if she smelled anything while taping the car, she replied no.

Furthermore, I posted above that my understanding of human decomp is nothing like you've ever smelled before. Once you've smelled it, it's always in your mind when you hear about it. I would think that if this officer smelled something like that, she would've mentioned it.

 

[beccalecca1]

That was simply a play on words to emphasize the differences of opinion. Nothing to indicate anyone was delusional nor was there a claim that anyone "lacked" logic. The logic is different in opinion and I have a difficult time seeing that side at times. That's all.

Not intended as an insult pcrum12 but, I think beccalecca1 does just fine on his/her own. I may not agree with the posts but they are explained in detail and at times offer a facet of the conversation that has never been looked at before. That's why we come here.

BBM

"her own" And thanks!

 

[Baznme]

When the officer was asked if she smelled anything while taping the car, she replied no.

Furthermore, I posted above that my understanding of human decomp is nothing like you've ever smelled before. Once you've smelled it, it's always in your mind when you hear about it. I would think that if this officer smelled something like that, she would've mentioned it.

Only if you've experienced it. If you haven't, you do not know what it is until you can associate it with a body.

 

[beccalecca1]

You know as well as I do that no paid defense expert would ever admit to decomp being in the car ? Why would the DT pay someone to torpedo their theory that no body was in the car ?
And since the burden of proof is on the State, I tend to believe people like Jason Forgey, Yuri Melich & Inspector Bloise.

logicalgirl posted that defense and state experts agreed to there being human decomp in the car, which I then posted who on the DT expert witness list stated this.

Since the sky is blue/green comment, I just wanted some clarification because I was apparently horribly misinformed on that... but then in this post I'm not misinformed?

 

[sacrablue]

When the officer was asked if she smelled anything while taping the car, she replied no.

Furthermore, I posted above that my understanding of human decomp is nothing like you've ever smelled before. Once you've smelled it, it's always in your mind when you hear about it. I would think that if this officer smelled something like that, she would've mentioned it.

I know a little about this one too. Two things come into play. What happens when a child gets locked in a trunk of some cars? They suffocate. Trunks are designed to be water tight. They are sealed tight so it is possible for a trunk to have odor molecules inside that can't get out. Remember what we smell comes from molecules spread in some manner from a source.
Number two. Odor molecules are 100 (just guessing) times more active in heat and sun. If the Pontiac was put in the shade I would expect the smell not to be as elevated compared to outside in hot sun.

 

[coco puff]

The DP should have never been on the table in the first place.....

The most defenseless and helpless of victims, who loved and trusted her killer ends up dead in a swamp before the age of three. No better candidate for the DP then her.

 

[beccalecca1]

I enjoy this case because some of the evidence is new to me while other evdence I know like the back of my hand.
First, this duct tape thing has people struggling with trying to understand how the evidence worked or didn't work. DNA is housed in a living cell. If the cells break down, loose their outside walls the DNA also starts to break down. Example there is no DNA in decomp fluids. The cells have fallen appart for reasons environmental.
Duct Tape is made with different products. A cotton type core or strands for flexibility and durability. A elastic rubber cement placed on one side and a reflective silver coating put on the other. Does come in other colors.
When the tape is submerged in water it begins to break down.
When the tape is left in the sun, the UV and UVA rays break it down

All this is a good thing because if it didn't biodegrade our earth would be covered in plastic and duct tape.

Now how could the duct tape remain in position but have no DNA?
The tape degraded to the point top and bottom surfaces disintegrated. So any surface that was touched on June 16 was gone. So cells are gone as well and DNA is gone.
How did tape remain in position? The core of the tape is a wooven fabric material. It still kept its integrity and shape by looking at pictures. It would also act as a sling or belt around the skull.

I don't think I made my original post clear, I apologize.

I know how the DNA process works, so I understand why there may not be DNA on the duct tape (although there was one allele on marker D3, 17. This leads me to believe that it was original DNA, not contamination DNA).

My point on my original post was the argument that there wouldn't be more evidence to connect Casey because of the Tropical storm that blew through the area, flooded it, and got rid of anymore evidence that could have connected Casey. Well, that's a fine and dandy idea, but if I were to believe that idea (which truly doesn't seem illogical), then I have to believe the idea that the tropical storm and floods destroyed the original state of the crime scene... including the duct tape.

I'm not sure which pictures you're referring to (I didn't see any pictures of the skull with the tape there, which would probably help clear this up for me if I had), but the pictures of the tape alone only show it flat. So, if flat was the integrity and shape it kept as this post states, then how can a flat piece of duct tape not only stick to a hair mat but also cover the nose and mouth?

 

[beccalecca1]

Only if you've experienced it. If you haven't, you do not know what it is until you can associate it with a body.

So, if you're smelling human decomposition but don't see a body, you could easily confuse it with trash?

But, if you smell human decomposition (that apparently can be mistaken for trash) but see a body, then you know it's not trash and it's human?

 

[Sustained]

When the officer was asked if she smelled anything while taping the car, she replied no.

Furthermore, I posted above that my understanding of human decomp is nothing like you've ever smelled before. Once you've smelled it, it's always in your mind when you hear about it. I would think that if this officer smelled something like that, she would've mentioned it.

Wrong ... Officer Beasley testified that she "didn't recall if she did or not".

Since Officer Beasley sealed the car by place a piece of evidence tape over the cracks of the door and trunk, she never opened any doors of the vehicle or the trunk. So how do we know if the smell was emanating through the car's seals along the door and trunk ?

And she sealed the car after CA's 911 call where CA screams "there smells like there's been a dead body in the damn car" and after the car was driven home by GA who also testified that he smelled human decomp in the car.

This truly is speculative doubt and grasping at straws ...

 

[beccalecca1]

I know a little about this one too. Two things come into play. What happens when a child gets locked in a trunk of some cars? They suffocate. Trunks are designed to be water tight. They are sealed tight so it is possible for a trunk to have odor molecules inside that can't get out. Remember what we smell comes from molecules spread in some manner from a source.
Number two. Odor molecules are 100 (just guessing) times more active in heat and sun. If the Pontiac was put in the shade I would expect the smell not to be as elevated compared to outside in hot sun.

OK.... so how do you explain SB talking about the smell of the car when he went to the windshield to get the VIN number? The car was locked, so he couldn't enter, but he smelled something.