TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #7

[Oriah]

I'm lost, Oriah. I'm sorry. I can't think of what crime the passports would be evidence for. I personally wouldn't expect LE to hold things that a parent feels may indicate something that causes them fear or concern. If that were the case - they'd need a lot bigger evidence rooms - and that's just for all my fears and concerns when my son was young. :floorlaugh:

It seems to me that the appropriate place for the passports right now would be with the children's current custodial parent - Matt.

I don't recall seeing Susie say what she's done with the passports. I don't know who has them. I don't see a reason for anyone except Matt to have them right now.

I understand, Bean.
Playing devil's advocate here...

Both Gail and Matt have equal parenting rights. No custody issues involved yet... if I understand correctly. There is no documentation that supports any custody issues (such as filing for) prior to Gail's disappearance.

So why would it be an issue if Gail had in her possession the childrens' passports?

Perhaps this is a question for the verified attorney thread- but
how can any type of custodial arrangement be established in absence of a parent; without going through documentation of abandonment, declaration of death, or the like? And if that were the case, would it be necessary for any type of custodial issue?

I must be missing something here.

I guess I don't understand how or why Matt would be concerned about Gail having their childrens' passports. :waitasec:

(To add to that- if I were in a position of possessing legal documentation that might permit travel for a minor who is not my child or under my guardianship... well, I'd be concerned if I DIDN'T notify LE immediately. You know?)

 

[BeanE]

@JamesNooga James Harrison

What happened to Gail Palmgren? Before you decide, read this thoughtful op-ed from Bill Colrus on @NoogaNews: bit.ly/pXz6Lw

http://twitter.com/#!/JamesNooga/statuses/91510275928371200

ETA: Looks like that bitly link won't show up. Here's the full URL:
http://www.nooga.com/9704_winds-of-suspicion-reach-gail-force-in-the-palmgren-case/

ETA again:

My most common recurring thought when contemplating this case is the fact that Palmgren's children don't know when or even if they'll ever see their mom again. All efforts and priorities—more than assigning blame, pressing charges or defending reputations—need to be focused on giving them (and the rest of her friends and loved ones) an answer.

http://www.nooga.com/9704_winds-of-suspicion-reach-gail-force-in-the-palmgren-case/

 

[BeanE]

I understand, Bean.
Playing devil's advocate here...

Both Gail and Matt have equal parenting rights. No custody issues involved yet... if I understand correctly. There is no documentation that supports any custody issues (such as filing for) prior to Gail's disappearance.

So why would it be an issue if Gail had in her possession the childrens' passports?

Perhaps this is a question for the verified attorney thread- but
how can any type of custodial arrangement be established in absence of a parent; without going through documentation of abandonment, declaration of death, or the like? And if that were the case, would it be necessary for any type of custodial issue?

I must be missing something here.

I guess I don't understand how or why Matt would be concerned about Gail having their childrens' passports. :waitasec:

(To add to that- if I were in a position of possessing legal documentation that might permit travel for a minor who is not my child or under my guardianship... well, I'd be concerned if I DIDN'T notify LE immediately. You know?)

BBM. I don't think it was an issue until, in his eyes, she took off.

If I believed my spouse had taken off, and I then found out they'd secretly given our kids' passports to someone to hold - along with cash - and taken actions that indicated they'd been planning to leave, given a very large amount of $$$ (17k) to someone to hold, told me they were leaving, told others they were leaving, given jewelry to someone to hold, etc etc etc, I'd be scared too that they might come back and take our kids and take off with them and I wouldn't see them again.

I might notify my local LE and ask them to keep an eye out, do some extra patrols, to keep an eye out for my spouse in the area or near my kids' schools etc. I dunno if they would do that, but I'd ask.

And I wouldn't be able to get to an attorney fast enough, to get advice on how to best protect from my kids being taken away. I'd be terrified.

If I added to that that I believed my spouse had mental issues, I'd be beyond terrified. I'd probably be a complete maniac. But that's just me. :floorlaugh:

 

[Emeralgem]

BBM. I don't think it was an issue until, in his eyes, she took off.

If I believed my spouse had taken off, and I then found out they'd secretly given our kids' passports to someone to hold - along with cash - and taken actions that indicated they'd been planning to leave, given a very large amount of $$$ (17k) to someone to hold, told me they were leaving, told others they were leaving, given jewelry to someone to hold, etc etc etc, I'd be scared too that they might come back and take our kids and take off with them and I wouldn't see them again. I might notify my local LE and ask them to keep an eye out, do some extra patrols, to keep an eye out for my spouse in the area or near my kids' schools etc. I dunno if they would do that, but I'd ask.

And I wouldn't be able to get to an attorney fast enough, to get advice on how to best protect from my kids being taken away. I'd be terrified.

If I added to that that I believed my spouse had mental issues, I'd be beyond terrified. I'd probably be a complete maniac. But that's just me. :floorlaugh:

As I see it seems he wasn't too concerned about leaving his children with a woman who he claims had mental issues when he left for a conference, paid for by BCBS, and then ducked out of the conference to be with another woman.. And IIRC spoke ONLY one time with (acccording to him) his mentally deranged wife..
He didn't seem to have a problem letting his children go off to Alabama with her either when he returned back home unexpectedly on the 29th...JMHO..

ETA.. JMHO. But frankly I can't see where Mr. MP is concerned with his childrens welfare at all...JMHO

 

[BeanE]

As I see it seems he wasn't too concerned about leaving his children with a woman who he claims had mental issues when he left for a conference, paid for by BCBS, and then ducked out of the conference to be with another woman..
He didn't seem to have a problem letting his children go off to Alabama with her either when he returned back home unexpectedly on the 29th...JMHO..

I don't see a correlation between the circumstances you list, and the circumstances I was discussing.

Having mental issues, in and of itself, doesn't render a person entirely incapable of caring for children, and doing an adequate job of it, the same as having diabetes doesn't render a person entirely incapable of caring for children, and doing an adequate job of it.

It's only when the mental illness - or diabetes - goes out of control - as both illnesses may do at times - that there may be a problem.

 

[Emeralgem]

I don't see a correlation between the circumstances you list, and the circumstances I was discussing.Having mental issues, in and of itself, doesn't render a person entirely incapable of caring for children, and doing an adequate job of it, the same as having diabetes doesn't render a person entirely incapable of caring for children, and doing an adequate job of it.

It's only when the mental illness - or diabetes - goes out of control - as both illnesses may do at times - that there may be a problem.

Sorry..

 

[glorias]

I guess I assumed LE or PI Mathis or just somebody around town had told him about Susie Button, the hardware store person, Carol, or something. And there's that picture that reporter took of a Jeep that looks like Gail's.

(snipped)

I had people tell me about sightings of Gabe they hadn't told anyone else, and I had to get them to call it in, and I had to send the info to the family and PIs. I didn't see those sightings in the media. I didn't see them talked about anywhere.

So I guess if I had said on here there had been sightings, people would have called me a liar. :floorlaugh:

Let's not speculate on what hypothetical names I would call people on WS, please. Thanks.

I didn't say Matt lied about the sightings, which I have repeatedly explained, and I don't know why a handful of people keep misstating what I have said. I said this bit about the sightings was an exaggeration, later saying perhaps "re-framing" is a better word. The lie, as I have said over and over and over again, was when Matt said he didn't know how long Gail was at the lake house on the 29th/30th.

Callie Starnes followed up with Matt's comment about the sightings with this article:

http://timesfreepress.com/news/2011/may/17/possible-sightings-missing-signal-mountain-mother-/

At a press conference held today, however, authorities have said that, while some “have been credible,” nothing has been “confirmed or substantiated.”

This was info given after Callie turned her camera off, apparently, because it wasn't in the video. This is, as far as I know, the last we've heard of these sightings. It's pretty clear that when Matt said:

As you can see, the Jeep has been spotted, we’ve been told, on a few occasions out there, so we’re asking for anybody who’s seen that to immediately call their local police and let us know and get more clues to where Gail could be.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=6505842#post6505842"]TN TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #2 - Page 13 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]


Clear link between Jeep sightings and Gail, his implication was that Gail had been sighted. That's why a reporter asked for more information:

Is there anything you can say about the sighting? It was mentioned that her Jeep had possibly been spotted. Can you elaborate on any of that?

Turned out they were unconfirmed sightings that weren't of Gail at all. It wasn't "the Jeep" providing "clues to where Gail could be" but just some Jeeps with similarity.

 

[glorias]

I really wish we could post the documents, instead of going by what people, including reporters, say the documents say.

I'm going by what JBean said.

[ame="http://websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6505265&postcount=276"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - TN TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #2[/ame]

The docs do not say she removed it, only that she had recently changed the PINs on the retirement accounts in her name.

Perhaps you should clarify this with JBean because I'm "going by" what she said. She has seen the documents and that's what she wrote about it, and that is where I'm getting the info.

 

[glorias]

Arlene mentioned she was taking meds for ADD in the radio interview, plus a few more meds. It's unlikely for ADD diagnosis in an older adult, but if she was seeing someone previously for depression for the death of her brother and/or father, she may have been diagnosed....maybe even when she was a teen and has been on the meds since?

It affects up to 5.29% of people worldwide

http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/content/abstract/164/6/942

While it's not wildly common (see for example arthritis which affects nearly 20% of people) it's still not all that rare. As you said, someone who had ADHD in childhood is likely to have it as an adult. Gail was only a little older than me and I recall students in classes with me in the 1980s diagnosed with ADHD, so it's definitely possible she was diagnosed when she was a teen as you suggested.

 

[BeanE]

Let's not speculate on what hypothetical names I would call people on WS, please. Thanks.

I didn't say Matt lied about the sightings, which I have repeatedly explained, and I don't know why a handful of people keep misstating what I have said. I said this bit about the sightings was an exaggeration, later saying perhaps "re-framing" is a better word. The lie, as I have said over and over and over again, was when Matt said he didn't know how long Gail was at the lake house on the 29th/30th.

Callie Starnes followed up with Matt's comment about the sightings with this article:

http://timesfreepress.com/news/2011/may/17/possible-sightings-missing-signal-mountain-mother-/



This was info given after Callie turned her camera off, apparently, because it wasn't in the video. This is, as far as I know, the last we've heard of these sightings. It's pretty clear that when Matt said:



TN TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #2 - Page 13 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community


Clear link between Jeep sightings and Gail, his implication was that Gail had been sighted. That's why a reporter asked for more information:



Turned out they were unconfirmed sightings that weren't of Gail at all. It wasn't "the Jeep" providing "clues to where Gail could be" but just some Jeeps with similarity.

The Sheriff’s Office says there have been reports of possible sightings of Palmgren’s Jeep Rubicon in Tennessee, Georgia and Alabama, but none of the sightings have been substantiated or confirmed.

WRCB – Updated: May 18, 2011 4:42 PM EDT

http://www.wrcbtv.com/global/story.asp?s=14661367

 

[glorias]

The Sheriff’s Office says there have been reports of possible sightings of Palmgren’s Jeep Rubicon in Tennessee, Georgia and Alabama, but none of the sightings have been substantiated or confirmed.

WRCB – Updated: May 18, 2011 4:42 PM EDT

http://www.wrcbtv.com/global/story.asp?s=14661367

Yep. That's exactly right. That article is an almost exact duplicate of the one I quoted above.

 

[Sleuthy1]

Arlene mentioned she was taking meds for ADD in the radio interview, plus a few more meds. It's unlikely for ADD diagnosis in an older adult, but if she was seeing someone previously for depression for the death of her brother and/or father, she may have been diagnosed....maybe even when she was a teen and has been on the meds since?

You'll have to shake my memory about Arlene's mention of schizophrenia. ??

:twocents:
Treatment of adhd for children, adolescents or adults is based on a multimodal treatment approach. The most effective therapy is a combination of psychopharmacotherapy (usually psychostimulant medication) and psychotherapy.

http://web4health.info/en/answers/adhd-adult-attention.htm

http://web4health.info/en/answers/adhd-treat-chronic.htm

<snipet>Medication can be the essential part of a good therapy, but it is not always necessary to take pills. There are (at least) two possible approaches to use medication for adults with ADHD. The most effective treatment choice is to use stimulants like methylphenidate or amphetamines. Very often adults need a lower dose than children, but they have a longer day so they need additional daily doses or longer acting stimulants (e.g. Concerta, Ritalin LA or Adderall XR). Psychostimulants are not approved for the treatment of adult ADHD, but they have been used for a long time with excellent results. (Actually, the amphetamine Adderall XR is going to get FDA approval very soon.)<snipet>

http://www.helpguide.org/mental/adhd_add_adult_symptoms.htm

<snipet>Understanding ADD / ADHD in adults
Attention deficit disorder is not just a problem in children. If you were diagnosed with childhood ADD/ADHD, chances are, you’ve carried at least some of the symptoms into adulthood. But even if you were never diagnosed with ADD/ADHD as a child, that doesn’t mean you can’t be affected by it as an adult.<snipet>

<snipet>Myths and Facts about ADD / ADHD in Adults

MYTH: ADD/ADHD is just a lack of willpower. Persons with ADD/ADHD focus well on things that interest them; they could focus on any other tasks if they really wanted to.

FACT: ADD/ADHD looks very much like a willpower problem, but it isn’t. It’s essentially a chemical problem in the management systems of the brain.

MYTH: Everybody has the symptoms of ADD/ADHD, and anyone with adequate intelligence can overcome these difficulties.

FACT: ADD/ADHD affects persons of all levels of intelligence. And although everyone sometimes has symptoms of ADD/ADHD, only those with chronic impairments from these symptoms warrant an ADD/ADHD diagnosis.

MYTH: Someone can’t have ADD/ADHD and also have depression, anxiety, or other psychiatric problems.

FACT: A person with ADD/ADHD is six times more likely to have another psychiatric or learning disorder than most other people. ADD/ADHD usually overlaps with other disorders.

MYTH: Unless you have been diagnosed with ADD/ADHD as a child, you can’t have it as an adult.

FACT: Many adults struggle all their lives with unrecognized ADD/ADHD impairments. They haven’t received help because they assumed that their chronic difficulties, like depression or anxiety, were caused by other impairments that did not respond to usual treatment.

Source: Dr. Thomas E. Brown, Attention Deficit Disorder: The Unfocused Mind in Children and Adults<snipet>

http://www.webmd.com/add-adhd/features/adult-adhd-therapy-finding-right-therapist

<snipet>Adult ADHD Therapy: Finding the Right Therapist
By R. Morgan Griffin
WebMD Feature Reviewed by Brunilda Nazario, MD
For adults with ADHD, the standard treatment is medication. But experts say that ADHD therapy -- and other psychosocial treatments -- can play a key role alongside drugs.
“I think for many adults with ADHD, therapy is essential,” says David W. Goodman MD, assistant professor of psychiatry at the Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine.
While ADHD medicines are effective, they may not be enough. To use a phrase popular among ADHD specialists, pills don’t build skills. Even with medication, a person may still be struggling with the residual effects of adult ADHD - the disorganized habits, the low self-esteem. Therapy can address some of these key issues.
“With the ADHD medication as a foundation, it’s the psychosocial treatments that can come in and finish the job,” says J. Russell Ramsay, PhD, co-director of the University of Pennsylvania’s Adult ADHD Treatment and Research Program.
So how does ADHD therapy differ from traditional therapy? And how do you find a therapist? WebMD turned to the experts to get the details.<snipet>

:twocents:So...you see ...people go to therapy for a number of different reasons. It is not always indicative of severe psychiatric instability issues(ie: clinical depression, paranoid schizophrenia etc.). Sometimes people just need a little help managing their Adult ADD / ADHD or maybe someone just has a mild depression due to a death(s) in the family(sudden loss of a loved one) or along that same line of thinking....the loss of a loved one doesn't mean eternal death....it could mean the "death of a marriage"...IMHO:twocents:

 

[BeanE]

I'm going by what JBean said.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - TN TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #2

Perhaps you should clarify this with JBean because I'm "going by" what she said. She has seen the documents and that's what she wrote about it, and that is where I'm getting the info.

Oh. You didn't say a thing about JBean or anything she posted in your post that I was responding to. You quoted and linked an article. :waitasec:

Right, those are excellent points and they illustrate why I don't think Matt was lying per se but exaggerating. Maybe re-framing is a better word. The article I was referring to said:

Quote:

A week after Gail was last seen, Matthew Palmgren filed papers to claim Gail took jewelry, changed pin numbers to bank accounts containing hundreds of thousands of dollars, and took the children's passports.

http://www.wrcbtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=14627648

ETA: This makes no sense to me. Your point seemed to have been that you were claiming that Matt was "exaggerating" or "re-framing" by not stating in his docs they were Gail's retirement accounts. What JBean posted says, clearly, "retirement accounts in her name".

The article you quoteded and linked in your post to which I was responding leaves out both pieces of information - the retirement accounts and that the accounts were in her name - making it appear that Matt left that out of his docs, which you've now double-confirmed via JBean's info from those docs that he did not.

So, since you did actually know that Matt did include both those pieces of information, what in the world was your point? You seem to have proven that he wasn't exaggerating or re-framing anything. :waitasec:

 

[glorias]

Oh. You didn't say a thing about JBean or anything she posted in your post that I was responding to. You quoted and linked an article. :waitasec:

Good thing I didn't use that article to explain about the retirement accounts, then. The article doesn't say anything about the retirement accounts. It was only quoted to show what Matt had claimed in the court documents about PINs, jewelry, passports.

You said earlier that you "wish we could post the documents, instead of going by what people, including reporters, say the documents say."

But those who have the documents can't post them, and we can only use media articles for substantiated news. We had a bit of a kerfluffle here several weeks ago when someone claimed that the media articles could not be trusted for information, and I believe the official word on that was the media articles could be trusted.

So if you're saying otherwise, as in we can't go by what reporters say the documents say, then I think we have a problem. I'll ask a moderator for some guidance on this. It's a good point and I think it should be addressed.

 

[EllaMae]

It affects up to 5.29% of people worldwide

http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/content/abstract/164/6/942

While it's not wildly common (see for example arthritis which affects nearly 20% of people) it's still not all that rare. As you said, someone who had ADHD in childhood is likely to have it as an adult. Gail was only a little older than me and I recall students in classes with me in the 1980s diagnosed with ADHD, so it's definitely possible she was diagnosed when she was a teen as you suggested.

I work in the mental health field, and we have tested, diagnosed, and then treated people even into their sixties for ADD and ADHD. In most cases that I've seen, older adults seeking treatment for those disabilities were never diagnosed as children, or were in fact misdiagnosed. Undiagnosed ADD and ADHD can lead to depression, and even drug addiction because people will self medicate to get relief. They don't understand what's wrong, but they do know that they are miserable, or that they are having difficulties in life that they can't explain or control.
Of course, we don't know when Gail was diagnosed, but it's very common for ADD and ADHD to go untreated into adulthood.

 

[Sleuthy1]

BBM. I don't think it was an issue until, in his eyes, she took off.

If I believed my spouse had taken off, and I then found out they'd secretly given our kids' passports to someone to hold - along with cash - and taken actions that indicated they'd been planning to leave, given a very large amount of $$$ (17k) to someone to hold, told me they were leaving, told others they were leaving, given jewelry to someone to hold, etc etc etc, I'd be scared too that they might come back and take our kids and take off with them and I wouldn't see them again.

I might notify my local LE and ask them to keep an eye out, do some extra patrols, to keep an eye out for my spouse in the area or near my kids' schools etc. I dunno if they would do that, but I'd ask.

And I wouldn't be able to get to an attorney fast enough, to get advice on how to best protect from my kids being taken away. I'd be terrified.

If I added to that that I believed my spouse had mental issues, I'd be beyond terrified. I'd probably be a complete maniac. But that's just me. :floorlaugh:

_______________________________________________________________
:twocents:

http://divorcedwomenonline.com/2010/08/17/how-to-leave-an-abusive-husband/

http://www.livestrong.com/article/135192-steps-leave-abusive-relationship/

http://www.squidoo.com/leave-husband

http://www.virginiadivorceattorney.com/library/how-to-escape-an-abusive-relationship-virginia-beach-divorce-lawyer.cfm

http://www.virginiadivorceattorney.com/library/divorcing-your-abusive-husband-divorce-lawyers-virginia-beach.cfm

http://www.helpguide.org/mental/domestic_violence_abuse_help_treatment_prevention.htm

<snipet>Computer and Internet safety for abused and battered women
Abusers often monitor their partner’s activities, including their computer use. While there are ways to delete your Internet history, this can be a red flag to your partner that you’re trying to hide something, so be very careful. Furthermore, it is almost impossible to clear a computer of all evidence of the websites that you have visited, unless you know a lot about computers.

Use a safe computer. If you seek help online, you are safest if you use a computer outside of your home. You can use a computer at work, a friend’s house, the library, your local community center, or a domestic violence shelter or agency.
Be cautious with email and instant messaging. Email and instant messaging are not the safest way to get help for domestic violence. Be especially careful when sending email, as your abuser may know how to access your account. You may want to consider creating a new email account that your abuser doesn’t know about.
Change your user names and passwords. Create new usernames and passwords for your email, online banking, and other sensitive accounts. Even if you don’t think your abuser has your passwords, he may have guessed or used a spyware or keylogging program to get them. Choose passwords that your abuser can’t guess (avoid birthdays, nicknames, and other personal information).<snipet>

http://relationship.lifetips.com/cat/64781/abusive-relationships/index.html

<snipet>Leaving an Abusive Relationship
The process of leaving an abusive relationship is difficult and dangerous. Safety is the primary concern. Even if you do not think your partner poses a risk, leaving often triggers an increase in violence. It is best to prepare as much as you can ahead of time.
Ask a friend or family member to keep items you gather to take with you. Make sure the person you choose will not tell your abuser about your plans to leave. Do not take anything that will be noticed as missing.
Things to Stash Away:
Money
Contact information for a local domestic violence shelter
Prescribed medications
Legal documents for you and your children (e.g. birth certificates, social security cards)
Photographs or written evidence of the abuse
Financial records and account numbers
Personal belongings possessing sentimental value
Clothing and personal needs

Things to Arrange:
A plan that safely removes yourself and you children from the home
Transportation for yourself, children and belongings
A safe place to stay
How to manage being gone from home for an extended time
Referral to a lawyer or legal advocate to obtain a personal protection order, temporary child custody order, etc.<snipet>
:twocents:

 

[BeanE]

Yep. That's exactly right. That article is an almost exact duplicate of the one I quoted above.

So. There were sightings of the Jeep. Reported by LE. Matt mentioned this in the press conference. Nothing exaggerated. Nothing re-framed.

I hear family members say the same thing about sightings in case after case after case after case.

I see people on WS say this in case after case after case after case.

"There was a sighting of the person."

"There was a sighting of the person's car."

Then oodles of discussion and articles and everything else as people wait to see if any of them will be confirmed.

Susie Button and the Jeep is a good example. Carol and Big Rock Rd and the Jeep is another example.

 

[BeanE]

Good thing I didn't use that article to explain about the retirement accounts, then. The article doesn't say anything about the retirement accounts. It was only quoted to show what Matt had claimed in the court documents about PINs, jewelry, passports.

You said earlier that you "wish we could post the documents, instead of going by what people, including reporters, say the documents say."

But those who have the documents can't post them, and we can only use media articles for substantiated news. We had a bit of a kerfluffle here several weeks ago when someone claimed that the media articles could not be trusted for information, and I believe the official word on that was the media articles could be trusted.

So if you're saying otherwise, as in we can't go by what reporters say the documents say, then I think we have a problem. I'll ask a moderator for some guidance on this. It's a good point and I think it should be addressed.

Right, those are excellent points and they illustrate why I don't think Matt was lying per se but exaggerating. Maybe re-framing is a better word. The article I was referring to said:

Quote:
A week after Gail was last seen, Matthew Palmgren filed papers to claim Gail took jewelry, changed pin numbers to bank accounts containing hundreds of thousands of dollars, and took the children's passports.
http://www.wrcbtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=14627648

The jewelry turned out to be her family's jewelry and the PINs were to three retirement accounts in her name. Yet the paperwork he filed in court against his wife mentioned these things as supporting evidence for needing a restraining order. "I need a restraining order because my wife took our jewelry and money and ran off" is different than "I need a restraining order because my wife gave her family heirloom jewelry to someone else and changed PINs on retirement accounts in her name and then ran off." It's not a lie, but it's an exaggeration, a re-framing of what occurred.

[ame="http://websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6903673&postcount=562"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - TN TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #7[/ame]

Same post I quoted to which you're responding.

 

[Sleuthy1]

In my opinion, good PIs work very, very quietly. Mathis is supposed to be good.

The children have been allowed to visit with their maternal relatives, and I assume, during those visits, to speak. They could, of course, have sat in silence - I dunno.

I respect a parent's decision not to have their child interviewed by LE, particularly in the position these children are in.

Great to see another bean!!!! :great:

:twocents:BBM
<modsnip>?
Diane and Kevin were only allowed visitation with the children, if and when, there was another member of Matt's family (if not himself) present during the visitation. This occurred when they were both still in TN(which was quite sometime ago). The children were not allowed to speak freely (as they have in the past). The children were instructed not to talk about their mother with anyone. That instruction included their own maternal aunt and uncle. Speak YES....speak "freely", as they had before their mother went missing ...Then that answer ...would be ....No.
Respectfully, BeanE , never assume what you don't know to be 100% true...because you may be mistaken in your assumption.:twocents: IMHO ~ I believe this was ONE of the reasons K & D sought out legal representation and filed their own papers in Hamilton County Court, albeit, an uneventful outcome to date.

 

[Sleuthy1]

I work in the mental health field, and we have tested, diagnosed, and then treated people even into their sixties for ADD and ADHD. In most cases that I've seen, older adults seeking treatment for those disabilities were never diagnosed as children, or were in fact misdiagnosed. Undiagnosed ADD and ADHD can lead to depression, and even drug addiction because people will self medicate to get relief. They don't understand what's wrong, but they do know that they are miserable, or that they are having difficulties in life that they can't explain or control.
Of course, we don't know when Gail was diagnosed, but it's very common for ADD and ADHD to go untreated into adulthood.

Thanks for the "backup" EllaMae....I appreciate your additional wisdom with regard to Adult ADD and ADHD. It seems as though people had their own ideas about this and it is nice to see an another professional opinion in addition to mine. I was hoping MELODIE would chime in as well, as she is a long time RN and I am sure would have additional :twocents: to throw in with us. I posted a great deal of Adult DD and ADHD LINKS for all those who care to do their own research on this. I suggest that it is a good read and might explain other concerns that have been discussed with regard to Gail's mental status...as there are two sides to every coin. Once again, Thank you for your additional :twocents:...I appreciate it !:rocker: