TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #9

[Melodie]

Thanks, Melodie. I've read so many different places that I'm not sure where I saw what anymore, but the medication list was in one of the court documents.... Wasn't it? I'm trying to make sense of the claims that the psychiatrist was treating her for escalating paranoia. The claims of delusional behavior, manic symptoms, etc.

I don't see it here. Like you said, sounds more like depression and sleep issues to me. Maybe an anxiety component, considering the amitriptyline? On the Wellbutrin, I thought it was considered a "stimulating" antidepressant in a category all by itself. Isn't it used to help people quit smoking too?

You're welcome. We may never know what the psychiatrist was treating Gail for, but this list does not suggest to me serious issues. That's not to say that Gail didn't have serious issues, but that it is not proven by this list of drugs. Also, as was mentioned, she may not have been taking all of those medications. One may have been taken for a while and stopped and another one started. We just don't know. She may have been taking something that wasn't on that list, who knows. I don't think the amitryptilline would be used for anxiety. There are so many better drugs for that. The only way it would help is by making you too sleepy to worry. Yes, Wellbutrin has been used frequently to help people quit smoking. It has been somewhat cast aside recently due to the popularity and success of Chantix.

 

[BeanE]

Melodie, what if Gail had just recently started on Adderall?

I know Susan Murphy Milano said that Gail had been diagnosed at 16 as having ADD, but I don't know how Susan would know that, and she didn't say how she came to be under that belief.

So, say Gail was just diagnosed with ADD recently and started on Adderall, or say she had been diagnosed earlier, but just recently switched to Adderall.

Do you see any problems there?

This is from NIH:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0000166/

 

[Melodie]

:twocents:Thank you Melodie...I appreciate the professional "backup" on the "medication" aspect of this case. I just wanted to say that I AGREE TOTALLY WITH YOUR POST:gthanks: PS ----> One more "off label" use for generic elavil is "RLS" (aka restless leg syndrome)

Thanks, Sleuthy :blushing:
Yes, restless leg syndrome or neuropathy. My MIL was taking that for her legs, but had to stop it. Why? ---------> Made her too sleepy..

 

[Pearl*]

The list of meds only comes from matt and it says that gail has been prescribed them. We have no idea if she actually took any of them. Many meds are trial and error so. We are truly clueless what she was taking if anything.

What's bugging me is trying to figure out how that med list supports his claims of her uncontrollable symptoms. Whether she took them or not, he is presenting that list to back his position, and I don't see that it does.

Does it make sense to you, JBean?

 

[Melodie]

Melodie, what if Gail had just recently started on Adderall?

I know Susan Murphy Milano said that Gail had been diagnosed at 16 as having ADD, but I don't know how Susan would know that, and she didn't say how she came to be under that belief.

So, say Gail was just diagnosed with ADD recently and started on Adderall, or say she had been diagnosed earlier, but just recently switched to Adderall.

Do you see any problems there?

This is from NIH:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0000166/

Possibly. Unfortunately, I don't think we have enough information about exactly what Gail was experiencing or exactly which drugs she was taking or when she may have started them or how long she was taking them. Just not enough information here to make any intelligent conclusions. I said a while back, that to me, Gail's state of mind, her possible anxiety, depression, maybe even manic behavior can all easily be attributed to what was going on in her life before she disappeared. Just reading what she was experiencing during that time makes me anxious, paranoid, scared and very, very sad. :twocents:

 

[Sleuthy1]

Which document are the meds listed in please? I'm not finding them.

:waitasec:Matt's original court docs have 8 pages. Channel 9 seems to have only posted 5 of the 8. AD has them all and has posted the list on her FB page...She did so to prove that her friend Gail was not on any antipsychotics or meds used to treat paranoia or delusions etc. It amazed me that he actually came up with the list of four meds and claimed those were being used to treat "her escalating paranoia". MP has his doctorate in pharmacology, I would have thought he make a "more educatated statement" regarding the meds and their uses.:twocents: I always thought (as have others) that Gail was the "more intelligent" one in that relationship:twocents:

 

[Pearl*]

I don't think the amitryptilline would be used for anxiety. There are so many better drugs for that. The only way it would help is by making you too sleepy to worry.

In that case, amitriptyline plus sonata could really pack a punch, I would think. Maybe needed to counter the two stimulating drugs?

Like you said though, many unknowns there, such as whether she was taking them all and whether she had been taking them recently.

I think Irish Eyes question about hormone interference is a good question. What's your take on that?

 

[Sleuthy1]

Melodie, what if Gail had just recently started on Adderall?

I know Susan Murphy Milano said that Gail had been diagnosed at 16 as having ADD, but I don't know how Susan would know that, and she didn't say how she came to be under that belief.

So, say Gail was just diagnosed with ADD recently and started on Adderall, or say she had been diagnosed earlier, but just recently switched to Adderall.

Do you see any problems there?

This is from NIH:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0000166/

:twocents:Just curious. Is there a specific reason WHY we should not believe what AD has stated about the Adderall and Gail being diagnosed with ADD in high school? She is an insider and very familiar with this case, and Gail was AD's best friend. AD has not been found to have given any of us information that has been found to be false. Although, at some time or another...what AD shared here and on the radio was just "rumor" or a fact as stated by her and her alone. It does not mean that it is not true. Maybe you could shed some light on that...Is there a reason we should NOT take AD at her word?:waitasec:

 

[BeanE]

:twocents:Just curious. Is there a specific reason WHY we should not believe what AD has stated about the Adderall and Gail being diagnosed with ADD in high school?

It wasn't Arlene who said that Gail had ADD diagnosed at 16. It was, as I posted - and you quoted - Susan Murphy Milano, and she didn't say where she got that info.

Here's the interview where Susan says it. Radio show from Wednesday July 27. It's at about the 17 minute mark.
http://www.therothshow.com​/demos/recent/hour2Jul2711​.mp3

 

[Pearl*]

Sleuthy, does AD know when the Adderall came on board?

 

[glorias]

respectfully snipped for space

I would not want someone to make a list of all of the bottles of pills in my bathroom and say that this is my medication list. That would be false. Only Gail and her physician would know exactly what she was taking every day.

I second that. The aforementioned cat of mine had the feline herpes virus and the vet prescribed a low dose of Famvir, which is off label (and I'm not sure actually helped). Famvir is prescribed for humans for genital herpes. My cat's script was filled at my usual pharmacy, and the nasty look I got from the lady at the counter was priceless. If I disappeared and someone found the Famvir or the old Famvir prescription, they'd probably think the wrong thing.

I know this sounds funny but I should say I'm not trying to joke -- just a cautionary tale to add to Melodie's excellent comments already on why medications may not mean what we think they mean.

 

[jeni4smith]

:twocents:Just curious. Is there a specific reason WHY we should not believe what AD has stated about the Adderall and Gail being diagnosed with ADD in high school? She is an insider and very familiar with this case, and Gail was AD's best friend. AD has not been found to have given any of us information that has been found to be false. Although, at some time or another...what AD shared here and on the radio was just "rumor" or a fact as stated by her and her alone. It does not mean that it is not true. Maybe you could shed some light on that...Is there a reason we should NOT take AD at her word?:waitasec:

AD in her first media interviews said if GP had any mental issues then she was the queen of england...... then the first jammer interview she had no idea that GP was even seeing a dcotor about any issues in alabama. THen in later interviews she comes out witha drug list and claims that GP had ADD since high school... GP was taking meds for leg issues... that is just a start where her claims change with time.. BUt in the beggining she had no idea about any of GP meds at all ..... now she is an expert so you should beleive her and no one else... so i guess she is the queen of england !!!

 

[JBean]

What's bugging me is trying to figure out how that med list supports his claims of her uncontrollable symptoms. Whether she took them or not, he is presenting that list to back his position, and I don't see that it does.

Does it make sense to you, JBean?

No not at all.

 

[BeanE]

:twocents:Just curious. Is there a specific reason WHY we should not believe what AD has stated about the Adderall and Gail being diagnosed with ADD in high school? She is an insider and very familiar with this case, and Gail was AD's best friend. AD has not been found to have given any of us information that has been found to be false. Although, at some time or another...what AD shared here and on the radio was just "rumor" or a fact as stated by her and her alone. It does not mean that it is not true. Maybe you could shed some light on that...Is there a reason we should NOT take AD at her word?:waitasec:

In regards to what and who we should believe or not believe, and what our options and guidelines are for that, I'm going to let a mod address that for you.

 

[Irish_Eyes]

AD in her first media interviews said if GP had any mental issues then she was the queen of england...... then the first jammer interview she had no idea that GP was even seeing a dcotor about any issues in alabama. THen in later interviews she comes out witha drug list and claims that GP had ADD since high school... GP was taking meds for leg issues... that is just a start where her claims change with time.. BUt in the beggining she had no idea about any of GP meds at all ..... now she is an expert so you should beleive her and no one else... so i guess she is the queen of england !!!

If someone asked me if my son had ADHD, I would say yes.
If someone asked me if my son had mental issues or was unstable or paranoid, or delusional, I would say no.
Just because someone has ADD or ADHD doesn't mean they have mental issues.
Just because someone takes medication for RLS doesn't mean they have mental issues either.

The drug list came from MP. Doesn't mean it's proven that she was prescribed those, or if so, if she was taking them.

I've never heard AD claim to be an expert.

 

[believe09]

Why in the world would anyone who loved someone post a picture of a document on their facebook page about the medications her friend is taking? I can think of fewer things more intensely private.

 

[Pearl*]

:twocents:Just curious. Is there a specific reason WHY we should not believe what AD has stated about the Adderall and Gail being diagnosed with ADD in high school? She is an insider and very familiar with this case, and Gail was AD's best friend. AD has not been found to have given any of us information that has been found to be false. Although, at some time or another...what AD shared here and on the radio was just "rumor" or a fact as stated by her and her alone. It does not mean that it is not true. Maybe you could shed some light on that...Is there a reason we should NOT take AD at her word?:waitasec:

I know you were addressing BeanE in this post, but I personally need a refresher on exactly what AD said. Has she made any comment about diagnosis and/or medication issues? Does she maybe know what Gail was actually taking of what she was prescribed?

 

[JBean]

Which document are the meds listed in please? I'm not finding them.

Hi Beane. Matt also filed an Ex-Parte Motion for retraining order and temorary custody.Contained in that filing are other claims. Including:
"she is currently prescribed significant prescription medication such as ....."
There is a missing affadavit that I have not seen nor do I now what it says. But it is referenced after it details the medications Matt says she is prescribed. It also says she "has been under the care and treatment of a psychiatrist....for quite some time."

Don't know about TN or AL, but here in CA typically psychiatrists are used for meds and med checks but not for any kind of talk therapy.

 

[believe09]

:twocents:Just curious. Is there a specific reason WHY we should not believe what AD has stated about the Adderall and Gail being diagnosed with ADD in high school? She is an insider and very familiar with this case, and Gail was AD's best friend. AD has not been found to have given any of us information that has been found to be false. Although, at some time or another...what AD shared here and on the radio was just "rumor" or a fact as stated by her and her alone. It does not mean that it is not true. Maybe you could shed some light on that...Is there a reason we should NOT take AD at her word?:waitasec:

Honestly, no one is obligated to.

 

[glorias]

It wasn't Arlene who said that Gail had ADD diagnosed at 16. It was, as I posted - and you quoted - Susan Murphy Milano, and she didn't say where she got that info.

Here's the interview where Susan says it. Radio show from Wednesday July 27. It's at about the 17 minute mark.
http://www.therothshow.com​/demos/recent/hour2Jul2711​.mp3

AD says she's on Adderall and SMM adds to it saying Gail was diagnosed with ADD. I think she said at 17, but maybe it was 16. Here's what I transcribed really quickly, it starts at 17:00 into Hour 2:

SMM: So, let's go back...

AD: I've got a copy of the paperwork that he filed in the court, and he lied. You know...

SMM: How did he lie?

AD: He said that she was psychotic. Not one drug on there. He said she was on Adderall...

SMM: And we had checked all the drugs. We know why some of them were taken for restless leg syndrome. She had ADD diagnosed when she was 17 years old, there is all of these things, and it had nothing to do with anything.

For some reason, that link you had didn't work. It might be just my browser, but if others have the same problem, here's one to the archives which might work better:

http://therothshow.com/show-archives/july-2011/