Trial day 53: REBUTTAL; #162

[Chelly]

Thanks everyone for being here.
I'm going to check out the time line thread then put an ice pack on my neck.
Forgot to put in my dental guard. Been clenching. my bad.
Later!

 

[Tuba]

Willmott returned today to her characterisation of "when the gun went off". We know better from the defendant's own lips. Martinez: "And so, you fired the gun, you shot him in the head and you killed him, right?" Defendant answers, "Yes." She had just admitted that she pulled the trigger.

 

[forb8182]

Geffner

This is one guy with a horse in this race. His bias is obvious before he's even taken the stand! :floorlaugh: JM will highlight that bias, he'll have Geffner tell the jury that he's a friend and colleague of ALV, that he has edited at least one of ALV's books and that another trial court sanctioned him and found him to be nothing but a hired gun. No jury is going to find him credible.:

respectfully snipped

Does anyone know if Geffner plans to interview JA and form an opinion from this proven liar? I just don't understand what the defense is thinking and how coming into this trial cold is going to prove. IMO DeMarte does not have to be an expert in DV to diagnose BPD.

 

[Sydni]

A lot of the time, things aren't seen or heard. I expect that he couldn't really yell since his throat was cut. I also don't see JA as the screaming rage type. To me, she seems cold and calculated.

I'm thinking why she cut his throat ... to quiet him ... disgusting. Just sickens me. That poor man suffered a horrible death. Poor soul such a shame ... so many victims ... so much heart-break.

I got nothing .. no feeling .. for the defendant. Nope ... nothing !!

 

[FrayedKnot]

This has driven me crazy as well...the fact that Jodi tries to appear as though she spent the entire time that she was dating Travis clutching her pearls over the "depraved" acts that he requested of her makes me physically ill.

This wasn't her first rodeo (obviously) and the fact that the DT tried to make it seem as though she underwent a re-virginization as a result of converting to Mormon-hood and then was led into the wicked wicked ways of TA who (*gasp) wasn't a virgin (heaven help us!) makes me want to retch. Oh and then that somehow not being 100% observant to every religious tenant and not telling everyone that he met that he wasn't (because I told all my good Baptist church members what I got up to every weekend..riiggghhtt) makes him abusive?? It smacks of desperation and is just absurd in my opinion....

I stand by my assertion that you never know what crazy you might be getting into bed with for that booty call, but the subtle (and often not at all subtle) implication that he brought this on himself because he OMG liked having sex with someone who obviously liked having sex with him is vile.

(Rant over!!)

My take on this is that the DT watches a lot of TV. They take their cues not from the actual circumstances, but from the "can't bother to research" programs on MSM.

You know, "ideal Mormon couple who had a dark secret". Ugh

Clips of Travis joking about being a 30 year old virgin. Mmmkay.

Photos taken by JA that make it appear to have been a MUCH longer relationship than it was, like they were engaged or something. Ick.

I think the DT wanted to run with that image that TV had already erroneously set up because even the jurors may have seen some of that nonsense prior to be chosen and whether they realized it or not, it may have made a tiny niche in their minds.

What the DT failed to realize is that the brutality of the crime and the creepy behavior of the killer coupled with lie after lie after lie would wipe away any remnant of the "committed young Mormon couple" and the "maiden wronged".

One thing I do sort of understand is the media's fixation on the sexual angle of the story. People are just plain interested in sex, even those who pretend not to be. And the whole Mormon, 30 year old virgin thing was ripe for the picking as far as sensationalism.

What is just shocking, IMO, is that the DT put on a defense that was just as unsourced and sensationalized as the typical HLN program on TV today.

And that is not acceptable.

All MOO, of course.

BTW, I heart Deanna Reid.

 

[Dum-Dum Sucker]

Never saw anyone cry like Jodie Arias.... She just makes a face and bends her nose back and forth.:floorlaugh:

:floorlaugh: .....and bends her nose back and forth .......:floorlaugh:

 

[Quester]

Jodi Arias defense cost hits nearly $1.7 million
http://ktar.com/22/1629926/Jodi-Arias-defense-cost-hits-nearly-17M

 

[Sleuth5]

Jodi Arias defense cost hits nearly $1.7 million
http://ktar.com/22/1629926/Jodi-Arias-defense-cost-hits-nearly-17M

 

[BetsyB]

That Travis, like any homicide victim, didn't deserve to be murdered is a given. That he was "just a guy being a guy" is not. Some of us are not satisfied with the pass men are given to behave in ways that women would be condemned for.

respectfully snipped.

The thing is, whose word do we have that Travis actually didanything for which he requires "a pass?" We have surreptitiously recorded phone conversations (IMO, with scenarios set up, then recorded to provide defense by a woman already planning a murder) of consensual dirty talk that, really, isn't all that shocking to many of us.

And we have an incensed text message in response to something so horrendous that TA declared it caused more pain than his father's death--something so horrendous that caused him to state he hated JA, thought she is a sociopath (spot on, sadly), and that she was the worst thing that ever happened to him (again, spot on).

But we don't have much else.

Is it really so inconceivable that this extremely unstable, mentally ill woman was the actual source of the problems in the relationship? We don't know what spurred his outraged message, but it didn't come from nowhere.

If people saw the texts I sent my husband when, after a couple of decades of marriage, I learned that he is a fraud----well, if he wound up dead, I'd be in some pretty big trouble. In fact, when you learn that someone you love is profoundly personality-disordered and has never been genuine for even a moment, it is absolutely decimating. And an outraged response is normal and natural. (If you want greater insight into the effects of various personality disorders on the people who love those affected by them, visit outofthefog.net. Yes, there's that fog again...)

TA's response is especially understandable if placed in the context that many now suspect: that Jodi Arias told him she was pregnant and aborted or miscarried---then rescinded, or some variation of this theme of terrible, terrible manipulation and deception.

Honestly, we have no reason to believe that Travis Alexander behaved in any way that requires us to "excuse" him. Talking dirty? Consensual sex? He had a willing partner. And by all accounts, including that presented by the DT (which really only has this lukewarm, lame "deviant sex" and "mean mean text message" angle), Travis Alexander didn't need to be given a pass, because he was a good guy.

You won't find all that many people who unreservedly say the same of Jodi Arias.

 

[garthmax]

I agree. I don't think the diagnosis is of much importance at this point. What's important is that they know "the fog" is a convenient way to avoid damning evidence and that there was no domestic violence. Demartes herself stated that JA had 7 out of 10 markers above the baseline. The new guy can pick whatever he wants. Whatever she has, she premeditated and murdered TA.

moo

Your right. And let us not forget the JM proved the JA lied to the jury of all people. Again, again, and again. She knows also if the jury bought that she shot TA first and this incapacitated him than he didn't suffer. I think it would be great if JM could bring in a dummy just like HLN did and place tape on every single wound he suffered. I hope he brings out first that she could not have shot him first because of the defensive wounds he suffered on his hands. I didn't realize that until it was pointed out on HLN. That show at least got something right.

 

[Angelina Frost]

I'm thinking why she cut his throat ... to quiet him ... disgusting. Just sickens me. That poor man suffered a horrible death. Poor soul such a shame ... so many victims ... so much heart-break.

I got nothing .. no feeling .. for the defendant. Nope ... nothing !!

ITA. Only two reasons for that to happen. 1) she did it to silence him and 2) she wanted to guarantee he was dead.

Even with nothing else, that inhumane act alone makes it murder. Cutting someone's throat is up close and personal, it has ZERO to do with self defense or even manslaughter.

Near decapitation = rage. If there is anyone sitting in the jury box that doesn't understand that, there truly is nothing JM could do to fix it.

 

[Bravo]

I am tired and very sick of talking about this and that and what if. This trial has taken over my life and I feel like I am almost getting sick because of it. I'm a 63-yr-old woman .... and I have invested my life 100% into this case for the last 4 months. Hubby is somewhat supportive ... actually .. very supportive as he knows how addicted I am. He is even starting to sit with me and listen to/discuss some of the stuff on HLN. Good guy. But I can tell he just wants to throw his hands up in the air and leave the room most times. But he has a lot of self-control.

I haven't posted much because I have nothing to add to all of you brilliant people. But I read a lot ... and give "thankyou's".

Carry on gang. I'm just kinda warn out and wanted to express that. I'm sure there may be many out there feeling the same kind of weariness. I think this break will be enough to get me (and some others) re-energized and back into the sur-rebuttal (blech). Oh well. I'm feeling kind of numb and have a bit of a sick feeling in my tummy. Not sure why. I think I'm a little bit paranoid about another miscarriage of justice. Please ... Nooooo!!

Yes decompress after this one. I hope you chime in as you may find posting really helps with the stress level. Oh and I force myself to go to work LOL and out to lunch. I went part time a few years back and I can arrange my schedule (for the most part) and do some work at home. The flex adds to getting addicted. I'm sure you have lots to add :seeya:

 

[ladonna]

Has anyone found the autopsy photos the ME showed in court today?

Not the ones Josie posted, those were available before.

The photos today were never released before today.

 

[Nancy_Drew]

Gun first or knife first?

Does not matter. Whichever weapon she used first, it did not kill him. So if she used the gun, there are still 29 stab wounds and a throat cut through to the spine. If she used the knife first, TA was dead or dying when she shot him in the head.

Geffner

This is one guy with a horse in this race. His bias is obvious before he's even taken the stand! :floorlaugh: JM will highlight that bias, he'll have Geffner tell the jury that he's a friend and colleague of ALV, that he has edited at least one of ALV's books and that another trial court sanctioned him and found him to be nothing but a hired gun. No jury is going to find him credible.

I still don't understand why the defense would get someone like Geffner. I guess they ran through the list of U.S. psychologists and he was the only one willing to help the DT? What does that say? :floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

Exactly! Nothing good could possibly come for the DT from having Geffner testify....As a colleague of ALV is he taking the stand to save ALV's career or to lie for the defense??!! ...either way, not good for the DT!

(If I didn't know any better, its almost as if the DT is trying to sabotage their own case!)

 

[garthmax]

Gun first or knife first?

Does not matter. Whichever weapon she used first, it did not kill him. So if she used the gun, there are still 29 stab wounds and a throat cut through to the spine. If she used the knife first, TA was dead or dying when she shot him in the head.

Geffner

This is one guy with a horse in this race. His bias is obvious before he's even taken the stand! :floorlaugh: JM will highlight that bias, he'll have Geffner tell the jury that he's a friend and colleague of ALV, that he has edited at least one of ALV's books and that another trial court sanctioned him and found him to be nothing but a hired gun. No jury is going to find him credible.

I still don't understand why the defense would get someone like Geffner. I guess they ran through the list of U.S. psychologists and he was the only one willing to help the DT? What does that say? :floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

I don't get hiring Geffner either. And for the jury to have to start early and stay until sur-rebuttal is finished. The jury will be Pi$$ed. Especially since we will have to hear JW voice right? again? right? Right? right? Right? right? wrong!!!!!

 

[kaydono]

There is a Dr by the name of Dr. Daniel Amen who has done extensive research on SPECT Imaging to compare blood flow in normal brains with those of people with personality disorders, etc..

On his website he has images of the brain of a mass murderer... I don't know if I can post a link to his website but if you google his name you will find his websites....

But I think it is ok to post a link to his Wikipedia page:

Daniel Amen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Can't you just see me, in the future, dragging any guy that I am somewhat interested in, to this doctor, to have his brain scanned, before I agree to go out with him? I am sure that will go over real well, huh? Thanks for the link. I appreciate it and will read it, more in depth, after my son, Donovan, goes to bed later on. Otherwise he, being my son, would assume I was reading up on brain scans to cure his misbehavior....:floorlaugh:

 

[tlcya]

just got home from work, limited opportunity to check on the case today because I trying to work out the best way to tackle a research problem.

So ANOTHER (3rd thus far) juror was dismissed today and no reason was given??

Makes me wonder - was it juror number 7 who we were speculating JA was calling her DT attention to the other day?

TIA to anyone who can bring me up to speed on this development.

 

[Coldpizza]

Have a Juanderful weekend all!

Mr Pizza and I now have to do rock, paper, scissors, to see if we watch the NFL Draft, American Idol or NG at 8:00 with an exclusive interview regarding the engagement ring that JA stole.

We can tape one. hmmmmmm

 

[deanna82437]

I only have one thing to say after following every single day and every single witness...the needle they use on her when they put her to death should be the size of a knitting needle.

AND rusty, so it hurts more going in!!

Welcome to WS .... :seeya:

 

[Sleuth5]

Have a Juanderful weekend all!

Mr Pizza and I now have to do rock, paper, scissors, to see if we watch the NFL Draft, American Idol or NG at 8:00 with an exclusive interview regarding the engagement ring that JA stole.

We can tape one. hmmmmmm

Rig the game and watch Nancy.