Trial Delayed until at least January

[otto]

It's absurd but also surprising that the DA's office thinks the jury would fall for it.

At this point, I'm really wondering if the corruption was just within the crime lab.

JMO

If they produced the rock and claimed that there were 3 alleles that were consisent with Jason's DNA, then they were hoping that the jury was completely ignorant about DNA analysis. The alleles probably matched half the jury and one of the lawyers too.

 

[otto]

Ok, I'm mixed up. Was it a rock or a stick that he left in the door?

A rock was found propping open the door, Jason said that he used a stick to prop open the door when he smoked his cigar or got the charger from his car.

 

[NCEast]

He said he put a twig in the door to prop it open.

However, a rock was found propping open the door.

Thank you. That's why I was confused.

 

[otto]

How else would you have the state introduce that piece of evidence and lay the foundation before the DNA testing results are presented from that rock?

I suppose they could have said that they grabbed a bunch of rocks from the side entrance, tested them all for DNA and discovered that they matched several people in the courtroom. It's nonsense.

 

[Madeleine74]

Interesting to note that one of the items the last jury requested was a better picture of the shrubs outside that exit door--the one that was propped open. The state didn't have a better picture, but JTF happened to take pictures back then and he has at least one picture showing the distance of the nearest shrubs to that steel door. JY would have to contort himself to be able to get a 'twig' to prop that door, if he could have even reached one of the side shrubs.

Note that JLY wants nothing to do with any rock. Even though that's the closest item with which to prop a door, and is solid enough to hold the weight of the door, and was available and plentiful. Nope...he cannot be associated with a rock.

 

[MyBelle]

Okay ... so the jury can see what type of rock was left in the door at some point during the night. There's nothing to connect it to Jason, but at least they know the night audit guy is telling the truth about the type of rock he found.

Can we really expect that Jason would go outside in November, strip down and have a shower under the garden hose when he could have a shower in his home? His daughter was apparently cleaned up, so why wouldn't he clean up inside as well. It doesn't make much sense that he would shiver in the middle of the night under the garden hose when he didn't need to. I think what has happened is that the outside hose was left running and that doesn't make sense, so now we have to say that Jason took a shower in November outside with the garden hose instead of in the house. If he did that, then presumably he went back into the house and got dressed. It doesn't make sense to me.

Not only does it not make sense, there is no evidence of it. They checked the grass for blood and there was none just as none was found in the drains in the house. We know that CY was found with no blood so the giant question is where was she cleaned up? Blood would have soaked through her socks to her feet yet there were no footprints in the hallway outside that bedroom or bathroom.

JMO

 

[otto]

Interesting to note that one of the items the last jury requested was a better picture of the shrubs outside that exit door--the one that was propped open. The state didn't have a better picture, but JTF happened to take pictures back then and he has at least one picture showing the distance of the nearest shrubs to that steel door. JY would have to contort himself to be able to get a 'twig' to prop that door, if he could have even reached one of the side shrubs.

Note that JLY wants nothing to do with any rock. Even though that's the closest item with which to prop a door, and is solid enough to hold the weight of the door, and was available and plentiful. Nope...he cannot be associated with a rock.

If the prosecution theory is that he could contort himself to unplug a camera 10 feet off the floor, there's no reason to suddenly assume he couldn't contort himself to grab a stick from the bushes even if they were 6 feet away. Sounds like selective contortions to me.

 

[otto]

Not only does it not make sense, there is no evidence of it. They checked the grass for blood and there was none just as none was found in the drains in the house. We know that CY was found with no blood so the giant question is where was she cleaned up? Blood would have soaked through her socks to her feet yet there were no footprints in the hallway outside that bedroom or bathroom.

JMO

I don't know ... maybe she took off her socks in the bedroom, wiped her feet dry, carried them to the bathroom, then used a washcloth to clean up her feet. We know that she was talking about using a wash cloth to clean up her mom. Children usually take off their socks right away when they're uncomfortable ... no reason to assume she kept them on until she got to the bathroom.

 

[MyBelle]

How else would you have the state introduce that piece of evidence and lay the foundation before the DNA testing results are presented from that rock?

If they really want to win the case and don't have a corrupt crime lab available to help misrepresent the evidence, it's usually best for the prosecution to introduce real evidence. Random rocks are only evidence that they had no real evidence.

JMO:floorlaugh:

 

[otto]

<modsnip>

What's the actual distance between the door and the nearest stick and what was the situation on Nov 2, 2006? Were the bushes trimmed at any time?

 

[tarheel8600]

Where did you read that the camera was unplugged at 11:20?

It's in the testimony.

 

[Madeleine74]

You've mentioned "real evidence" before.

Please give a definition of what you mean by "real evidence."

There's only two kinds of evidence: direct and circumstantial.

Most murders don't have direct evidence, which consists of either an eyewitness to the murder, a video of the murder, or a confession by the murderer. Everything else is, by definition, circumstantial evidence.

 

[borndem]

Okay ... so the jury can see what type of rock was left in the door at some point during the night. There's nothing to connect it to Jason, but at least they know the night audit guy is telling the truth about the type of rock he found.

Can we really expect that Jason would go outside in November, strip down and have a shower under the garden hose when he could have a shower in his home? His daughter was apparently cleaned up, so why wouldn't he clean up inside as well. It doesn't make much sense that he would shiver in the middle of the night under the garden hose when he didn't need to. I think what has happened is that the outside hose was left running and that doesn't make sense, so now we have to say that Jason took a shower in November outside with the garden hose instead of in the house. If he did that, then presumably he went back into the house and got dressed. It doesn't make sense to me.

Where would he take this shower? In the bathroom off the murder room? And risk getting blood on himself on the way out? He was smart enuff to know not to do that. Maybe wash his hands so he wouldn't contaminate his dress shirt, tie, pants for his meeting. Got to do that now -- or in his hotel room if he had time. Which, which? Anyway, grab some clean clothes and & socks from his closet, being careful not to contaminate them with blood. Further, they had no heat, so how much warmer would it be? Plus he didn't have time.

Look at himself -- did he need to wash his hair? His face? He wisely planned to change clothes, shoes, etc., after he had exited the house. Maybe if he'd had the time, he might have staged a break-in, but no time. All he needed to do was change clothes, shoes, maybe discard his socks if they were bloody, throw both pairs of shoes in a trash bag along with his gloves and clothes, check his arms for blood, wash what he had to, back in the car, remembering to watch his speed, and GTH outta Dodge. Or something close to that, IMO.

 

[tarheel8600]

Ok, I'm mixed up. Was it a rock or a stick that he left in the door?

The night clerk found a rock propping open the door. JY testified that he broke off a twig from a nearby bush to prop open the door.

Problem is that there wasn't a nearby bush. JY testified that he used a twig because he wanted to separate himself from the rock that had 3 of his DNA markers on it.

 

[otto]

<modsnip>

I've said it before and I'll say it again ... the day that a prosecutor has to rely on forum discussions in order to do his or her job is the day he or she should seek other, more suitable employment.

 

[MyBelle]

I don't know ... maybe she took off her socks in the bedroom, wiped her feet dry, carried them to the bathroom, then used a washcloth to clean up her feet. We know that she was talking about using a wash cloth to clean up her mom. Children usually take off their socks right away when they're uncomfortable ... no reason to assume she kept them on until she got to the bathroom.

The blood would have soaked through her socks and onto her feet. There is no way a toddler could wipe blood completely off her feet just using a cloth and if she removed the socks herself, she would have had blood on her hands as well. It is an oily residue that would have left something on the carpet between the two rooms. The absence of the blood is evidence she was carried from the master bedroom to the bath but also carried back to the master bedroom.

JMO

 

[Madeleine74]

Also, there was a blood stain found on the door knob leading towards the garage side door...and right to where the hose was outside.

 

[otto]

Where would he take this shower? In the bathroom off the murder room? And risk getting blood on himself on the way out? He was smart enuff to know not to do that. Maybe wash his hands so he wouldn't contaminate his dress shirt, tie, pants for his meeting. Got to do that now -- or in his hotel room if he had time. Which, which? Anyway, grab some clean clothes and & socks from his closet, being careful not to contaminate them with blood. Further, they had no heat, so how much warmer would it be? Plus he didn't have time.

Look at himself -- did he need to wash his hair? His face? He wisely planned to change clothes, shoes, etc., after he had exited the house. Maybe if he'd had the time, he might have staged a break-in, but no time. All he needed to do was change clothes, shoes, maybe discard his socks if they were bloody, throw both pairs of shoes in a trash bag along with his gloves and clothes, check his arms for blood, wash what he had to, back in the car, remembering to watch his speed, and GTH outta Dodge. Or something close to that, IMO.

What risk is there for a man to shower in his own bathroom ... he had two to choose from? A stranger might think that it was risky, but not the occupant of the home. Suggestions that someone showered under the garden hose in the middle of the night in November support a stranger murderer better than they support an occupant murderer.

 

[otto]

The blood would have soaked through her socks and onto her feet. There is no way a toddler could wipe blood completely off her feet just using a cloth and if she removed the socks herself, she would have had blood on her hands as well. It is an oily residue that would have left something on the carpet between the two rooms. The absence of the blood is evidence she was carried from the master bedroom to the bath but also carried back to the master bedroom.

JMO

I don't know ... we're supposed to accept that this 2 year old understood the concept of murder and boldly stated that daddy did it, but at the same time she couldn't take off her socks as soon as they were wet and sticky and subsequently clean her feet in the bathroom?

 

[otto]

Also, there was a blood stain found on the door knob leading towards the garage side door...and right to where the hose was outside.

It's rather obvious to me that whomever murdered Michelle entered through the people door in the garage. It certainly doesn't mean that Jason is the murderer.