Trial Discussion Thread #30

[james83]

Oscar is howling and puking in that Court room for a myriad of reasons, all obvious, and mostly rational.. the end of his career, life as he knows it, embarrassment or as he put it in his bail statement 'the mortification' of it all, that everyone knows he is a liar, the bills, the bills , the bills, the end of the dream of being a gun collector, farewell to travel and fame and hello to imprisonment and notoriety, the indignity of being questioned , the iniquity of being the worlds stupidest gun owner, having to constrain his temper for endless hours and days , having to call Judge Masipa 'milady', putting up with dumb coppers day in and day out, being made to think and think instead of just being Oscar, forced to contemplate the consequences, the bills, the bills, loss of income, the bills , no calls from sponsors, . and on and on.

its enough to make any grown man cry. ....

Spot on.
It's embarrassing that some people probably changed there opinion on this whole case on the basis of him crying and howling, dear oh dear, GULLIBLE.

 

[steveml]

I am a big fan of behavioral sciences you will not find a single reputable source that will say that all people under a certain situation will respond in the same manner. Just think of the wide range of human personalities.

You will find statistics and norms but not an "always" humanity does not have a collective specific behavioral response to a fluid situation.

I agree.

The oft-quoted fight of flight response is a perfect example of this. If we were all conditioned the same this response action would operate the same for every person under the same situation.
In essence, nobody would refuse to do a bungee jump, nobody would be scared of flying, we would all react the same in stressful situations etc etc. Nothing could be further from the truth.

What makes it even more difficult is that we are forming an opinion not on something that we regularly experience, for which we could use previous patterns as an example, but on a situation that the majority of us will never experience in our lifetime.

 

[Trooper]

Spot on.
It's embarrassing that some people probably changed there opinion on this whole case on the basis of him crying and howling, dear oh dear, GULLIBLE.

he can turn it on and off like a tap... and apparently, it only happens in the court room.

He wasn't howling and hurling at his bail hearing.

He has it fine tuned.

 

[Carmelita]

I'm interested in your thoughts on how likely you think it is that M'lady will find the core of his story to be true. I'm inclined to think she will consider it, and then completely reject it. In addition to all her legal expertise I'm sure she also has a good dollop of common sense and a well-honed sense of when a 'version' is a lie and will bring that to her decision making.

I simply can't read the mind of the judge. Her political pressures one way or the other, her sympathies for Reeva and her family, her sympathies for Oscar and his family, her wisdom and expertise that she brings to the bench, all the evidence which she and her assessors will have to wade through, all the different possible charges she must consider, will make her decision difficult at best.

 

[Jake18]

BIB. Oh, alright. They are not a "great news source" but then you accept the part they reported as if they are when it can be twisted to your rather cumbersome hypothesis. :irony:

Here are a couple of others, hopefully one of them is a great news source:

Steenkamp Took Few Breaths After Head Wound

http://www.heraldlive.co.za/steenkamp-took-few-breaths-after-head-wound/

Reeva's final breaths

http://m.news24.com/news24/SouthAfrica/Oscar_Pistorius/Reevas-final-breaths-20140310

Oh! And this one!:

Pathologist Gert Saayman told the court that Steenkamp did not take more than a few breaths after suffering her head wound.

<snipped>

Saayman described the wound to her head as an incapacitating wound, and said there was physical damage to the brain because of a substantial fracture to the base of the skull.

http://www.timeslive.co.za/local/2014/03/10/the-oscar-pistorius-murder-trial-day-6

Have you even been reading my posts or just refuting them? That's EXACTLY what I've been saying. The head wound was lethal, incapacitating and she didn't breathe ! However that doesn't preclude some cardiac activity before she died. And Pof Saayman, according to the Alex Crawford text did not say that she died just after the head shots, he said she didn't breathe again. He very clearly would not commit to her dying at that specific time. He also said that her heart was pale which means that she bled out before she died.
I'm not going to discuss this further with you, we're at cross purposes here.

 

[BritsKate]

I'm interested in your thoughts on how likely you think it is that M'lady will find the core of his story to be true. I'm inclined to think she will consider it, and then completely reject it. In addition to all her legal expertise I'm sure she also has a good dollop of common sense and a well-honed sense of when a 'version' is a lie and will bring that to her decision making.

And sadly, well-accustomed to men killing their significant others, and pleading not guilty, as well.


Please pardon errors as posted via Tapatalk with a less than stellar user.

 

[TorisMom003]

An interesting article about Mi'lady. Some of her past verdicts and sentences show me that OP is definitely in for at least some prison time.

http://www.mediaclubsouthafrica.com/democracy/3735-judge-thokozile-masipa-reserved-and-astute

MOO

 

[Linda7NJ]

Spot on.

It's embarrassing that some people probably changed there opinion on this whole case on the basis of him crying and howling, dear oh dear, GULLIBLE.

It didn't even figure into my opinion.

I did however wish I had some popcorn for the show he put on.
It fell apart from the start for me. I find his version completely and utterly ridiculous.....Even before the trial started.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[BritsKate]

Just so ya'll know its actually fight, flight, freeze, or fawn. The 4F's...fight and flight aren't the only two 'typical' responces when one is faced with a traumatic event. (<- The joy of being married to a mental health nurse. )

Please pardon errors as posted via Tapatalk with a less than stellar user.

 

[TorisMom003]

I simply can't read the mind of the judge. Her political pressures one way or the other, her sympathies for Reeva and her family, her sympathies for Oscar and his family, her wisdom and expertise that she brings to the bench, all the evidence which she and her assessors will have to wade through, all the different possible charges she must consider, will make her decision difficult at best.

BBM

After reading up on the Judge, I don't think she will give a hoot about any political pressures. This is a woman that worries about the law first and foremost, then the victim next. The lies that OP has told on the stand will not go unnoticed by her either. I feel sure that OP and his defense were crushed when they learned that she would be the one to hear the case.

MOO

 

[crasshopper]

kink in the hose---all you have to do is release pressure by unkinking the hose. The water doesn't have to be turned on, just present in the hose.

It needs a heartbeat otherwise no arterial spurts, otherwise it comes out like
water from a hose on low as all the vasomotor tone is gone and the blood volume largely pools in the now wide open/unconstricted vessels.

Unfolding a "kink" would absolutely not cause a spurt even a minute after the heart stops.

This speaks to cricket bat before shots.

 

[TorisMom003]

But I take it your husband has all two working legs, and is not "paranoid" about
a potential violent attack in his house, and as you said yourself, is not a trigger happy fool.

I'll share a story that my family and I went through. Little bit of back story first.

We live in a one story home in a neighborhood where the houses are pretty close together. The back of our lot, including our house, sits on a hill. The hill starts to slope down at the side windows in the front of our house. The back of our house is on such a slope that it is as if it is a two story house. Our back yard is completely fenced in, starting at the front sides of our house. We always have dogs and let them outside often even at night.

One evening when it was just me and the girls at home, hubby was working 3rd shift, along with our two dogs someone jumped our fence to get into our backyard. They took one of our plastic lawn chairs, pulled it to the side of our house where our (hubby and mine) bedroom window is. It was spring time so the window was open but the screen was in place. The person climbed onto the chair, slit the screen with a knife and attempted to get in. They were unable to do so. We didn't know that someone had been in the backyard, had moved the chair or slit the screen until the next day when I noticed the screen was slit. We called police to report it immediately. We were told that there had been several home break ins in our neighborhood and that one family (older man and his wife) had been beaten. The person/people responsible had not yet been caught.

Hubby and I talked about what we would do if someone did get into our home. We decided on the plan that I said in an above post. If he was at work, then I would be the one getting our daughters and myself in a room with a phone and me holding the gun pointed at the door.

Now, since OP was so "fearful" about home invasion, I find it highly doubtful that he had not come up with a plan on what to do in case someone did get into his home. And since OP was having Reeva/other people over for the night at his house then he should have told them of his plan as well so that they too could follow it. Since OP never did that, along with not checking to make sure his security was working properly, that his sliding doors were left open while he "slept", that a ladder was left outside under an open window without making sure that the ladder was properly put up before "going to sleep", then I have to conclude that OP once again lied. OP, IMO, lied about being concerned about security at his home.

MOO

Perhaps my other post on this was missed so I am reposting it.

And no, my hubby is not disabled. He is also not a young, athletic man that has tons of money that was spent on security for our home. He does however have the brains to know how to keep himself and his family safe even when there is crime in our neighborhood.

MOO

 

[fox1lady]

How interesting... have just read that the 2 assessors are able to overrule the judge's decision... didn't know that.

 

[james83]

It didn't even figure into my opinion.

I did however wish I had some popcorn for the show he put on.
It fell apart from the start for me. I find his version completely and utterly ridiculous.....Even before the trial started.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Totally agree, the whole thing is ridiculous, a clear case of a man trying to get away with murder, since the bail hearing last year i have not for a second thought his "version" might be true.
I just can't fathom how people believe it.
JMO.

 

[TorisMom003]

In South African prisons do they allow prisoners to get an education? Since OP's career will more than likely be over (running professionally) after the trial, can he study something while in prison for him to get a jump start so to speak on a new career for when he is released? Since he has said he has an interest in architecture then maybe he can try that once he has served his prison time.

 

[wb180]

How do you know this??

Because Oscar said so and we shouldnt question him because he has a presumption of innocence.

 

[wb180]

How interesting... have just read that the 2 assessors are able to overrule the judge's decision... didn't know that.

I doubt they will though given the facts of this case and how bad OP was on the stand.

 

[Irisha]

If the core of Oscar's story is true and he thought he had a better chance of staying alive by fighting rather than fleeing it is not murder.

If OP "knew" Reeva was in the bed, he had many other options to protect both of them. Why didn't he call 911/security before grabbing his gun, instead of telling Reeva to? If he talked softly, why did OP assume she heard him, or could find her phone in the dark? Wouldn't she say I heard it too and stop him from leaving with the gun and the safety of fleeing unharmed? Why didn't he think there were more than 1 intruder that could harm him and leave Reeva in more danger? But was more concerned about a rickochet bullet(sp?) hitting him. He's a :liar:

 

[Linda7NJ]

Totally agree, the whole thing is ridiculous, a clear case of a man trying to get away with murder, since the bail hearing last year i have not for a second thought his "version" might be true.

I just can't fathom how people believe it.

JMO.

Me either!
I don't even find this case particularly interesting, didn't even plan on following it.
IMO the only thing interesting about it ...it's fascinating, to me, the lengths some will go to, in order to suspend all logic and common sense and enter into Oscars bizarrow world of lies.


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[wb180]

Totally agree, the whole thing is ridiculous, a clear case of a man trying to get away with murder, since the bail hearing last year i have not for a second thought his "version" might be true.
I just can't fathom how people believe it.
JMO.

Those people believe it because they disregard all common sense and thinks presumption of innocent means if there is an implausible version, we should still give it to the defendant. It's just weird.