Trial Discussion Thread #35 - 14.05.08 Day 28

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K.T said:
Actually the Myer’s incident is something to be wonder about Pistorius mental state and not Steenkamp’s friends.

Witnesses (Blomberg journalist and police officer Van Staden) said Pistorius leant over and appeared to say something near Steenkamp’s friend and State witness, Kim Myer.

I think just the act of leaning over to a State witness shows unbalanced behavior. Even his denial is weird.
  1. Lawyer David Dadic suggested, from the bail affidavit, that engaging with a State witness may contravene Pistorius bail orders.
  2. From Pistorius’ Bail Affidavit Statement: “Nonetheless, I undertake not to communicate with any witness, whoever he or she may be, and any other persons whose names may appear on a list of “State witnesses”, to be provided by the State.”
  3. “I respectfully submit that should I be released on bail, my release shall not disturb the public order or undermine the proper functioning of the criminal justice system.”
  4. For an accused it is beyond bizarre to lean over and discuss anything with a State witness for any reason. Especially in court, in front journalists.
  5. Pistorius defended himself by saying (terrible public relations comment) to SA journalist Ainslie Laing: "I haven't spoken to them for a year and a half. I walk past them in the corridors and hold doors open for them but they don't look me in the eye."
  6. Even his blanket denial is an odd statement, seemingly revealing an arrogant or delusional attitude. He infers his chivalry in court about opening doors (after confessing to killing a beloved friend) deserves eye contact… I cannot comprehend that amount of presumptive confidence or why he would say such a self-defeating comment.
  7. Pistorius could have helped himself by saying he talked to Steenkamp’s friend/s out of respect, perhaps he was trying to make a conciliatory gesture or statement, but it’s an oddly revealing denial.

Pistorius seems like his own worst enemy.
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Agree it's very odd. Your 1, 2 and 3 should result in some serious action, particularly in view of the witness' present to OP's comment.

Another one for Shane's file I think.
 
Morning, I started watching when Wollie came to give his credentials. I walked out and milked the cows, fed the chickens, took out the trash and he was still giving credentials.

Ok so I really don't have cows and chickens. He strikes me as in his upper 60's.
 
Re Wollie's long list of credentials, did anyone hear the words "sounds expert"?
 
Interested Bystander said:
I don't feel she is lying but I do feel that far too much has been made of it. It was unpleasant of OP but IMO she should have shrugged and said to herself that it was par for him and moved on. Maybe she would have done if one of Nel's detectives hadn't heard it and encouraged them to take it further. Once the press get their hands on it we find it blown out of all proportion. It definitely was not nice but not earth shattering IMO.
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My thoughts are this is a murder trial, and in some cases witness' can be at some risk of reprisals, not to mention their evidence compromised. The friend like members of OP's family, live in Jo Bg. I'm not saying OP is like the mafia exactly, but he is from a powerful family as seen in the 'brushing over' of his previous criminal behaviour. I think she and her family have some reason to be nervous.
 
did i understand correctly? he said he is hard of hearing? so how would he distinguish between the sound of a bat or gun shot? just saying to clear this one up before the cross examination begins. he may have a hearing aid as well.
 
DebinGA said:
Yes, but it was his competence exuding amusement at Roux's nonsensical "I put it to yous" that got me.
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I agree. And his expressions when Botha testified... Oldwage's patented witness stare is nothing compared to Mangena's .
 
I think there may be some exaggeration over just how good the defence is doing. ;)

Trying to be objective since I side with the state in this case, the first trial I followed was Jeffrey Dahmer in 1992 and I'm only in my 30's. I've seen a heckuva lot of murder trials. The defence hasn't refuted the State's case, there are still many holes in their timeline Nel will most definitely exploit in summation, and there's still a very real potential of the State reopening their case.

The defence isn't under obligation to prove anything but they still must establish putative private defence. Oscar being emotional after the killing, witnesses who obviously only heard part of the event, the defence experts unwilling or unable to refute the State's and the constant references to the killing being accidental by his own witnesses really do nothing to further his defence.

Please pardon errors as posted via Tapatalk with a less than stellar user.
 
patCee said:
I'm wondering what the additional comments from Wolmaran will be, especially as he agrees overall with Mangena, on 2 of points he has been retained for. Maybe whether OP was crouching, or fired from hip. Not likely as this would not be helpful to DT IMO.
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Last year Wollie spoke re a case where a bullet came through a woman's roof and hit her in the leg causing injury. He found the roof dissipated enough energy so that the bullet hadn't just been shot into the air and come down [like OP's shot through the sunroof] but had been shot from a height [like from a hill into the roof]. Hope Nel asks Wollie if OP's sunroof shot might have seriously injured someone outside at the time.
 
W: I will just explain the working of a firearm to Milady so you can understand...

He is asking permission to play about with a gun in court, after 'I have made it safe'.

Nel: We don't have any guns.

W: we'll use a photo then.

Judge: I'd prefer that.
 
patCee said:
Agree it's very odd. Your 1, 2 and 3 should result in some serious action, particularly in view of the witness' present to OP's comment.

Another one for Shane's file I think.
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It's Myers, not Myer. If it's possessive, it's Myers'. She also means implies his chivalry in court, not infers. And as far as "something to be wonder about Pistorius mental state," yeah, that one's right, even though it wasn't expressed correctly. But I don't think asking someone "How can you sleep at night?" is engaging them in conversation, nor do I think it's in any way sinister. j/s
 
W: What I mean if I say 9mm X 19mm is that 19 is the length and 9 is the diameter.
 
Carmelita said:
Just popping in as I haven’t had much time at all to devote to the Pistorius case but the little I have read, the witnesses for the defense certainly seems to have put the rest of the already precarious “scream “witness testimony in doubt.

I have to say I find it extremely “convenient” that Gina’s sister is claiming that Oscar whispered (or did he say it in a low tone) incendiary words to her just when it is looking good for his defense. I know at first she was the only one to have claimed to have heard and now I believe suddenly a reporter “may have heard it also”. I think that that some people close to this case are blinded by their love for Reeva and not capable viewing it dispassionately.

Busy week for me.
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Sorry to hear you haven't had much time to follow the case with due attention. That comes over very clearly. :)
Hope things quieten down soon for you.
 
Oscar lives in his own universe. Classic narcissist. Still don't think premeditation has been proven, although I do think he premeditated her murder, and only formed his plan in seconds. He was (is) a ticking time bomb. Any truth to what Diane Sawyer said here in the States that it will take the judge months to give her decision? Anyone know of a precedence? Gosh, I hope not.
 
W is talking about hammer/cocking/double cocking/*advertiser censored* and locking position.....

Good heavens.

Clear as mud.
 
:rolleyes:
patCee said:
My thoughts are this is a murder trial, and in some cases witness' can be at some risk of reprisals, not to mention their evidence compromised. The friend like members of OP's family, live in Jo Bg. I'm not saying OP is like the mafia exactly, but he is from a powerful family as seen in the 'brushing over' of his previous criminal behaviour. I think she and her family have some reason to be nervous.
Click to expand...

Not to mention what wacky #Pistorians could be capable of. :rolleyes:
 
DebinGA said:
Yes, but it was his competence exuding amusement at Roux's nonsensical "I put it to yous" that got me.
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I too was impressed. His knowledge was excellent and he probably found Roux rather comical at times.

I thought your "be still my heart" was paraphrased from the well known saying "be still my beating heart" which is usual defined as an expression of excitement when seeing the object of one's romantic affections.
 
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