Trial Discussion Thread #37 - 14.05.12 Day 30

[soozieqtips]

On the Sky News round up this evening, they were talking about the fact that OP may have to wait weeks or even months for a bed .. and that he may even be assessed on an out patient basis

I was surprised when I watched it. If he has to wait months for a bed, does that mean he gets to carry on living at Uncle Arnold's house as if nothing has happened... just like he's been doing for the past 15 months?

 

[BritB]

I have to get an early night or I won't get up in time for the start of the trial tomorrow.
It certainly has been quite a day in court and I was starting to lose the plot after Woolie's evidence but today certainly woke me up.
Thanks for your welcome and goodnight everyone.

 

[lithgow1]

So presumably if they go the way of the assessment and it's done on an outpatient basis all the guns at his uncle's house will need to be locked away. Does anyone know what effect this all may have on his bail conditions as they currently stand? It's sure thrown up a lot of comment and conjecture.

 

[Magdalyn]

...of course, they're legal experts, so likely have no idea what they're talking about. (End sarcasm.)

Ahhh. Dullards who don't have the brights, the lot of them. :waiting:

 

[AlexUK]

Probably totally inappropriate words to use but I'm really looking forward to seeing what transpires tomorrow. Many thanks to all who share their insights and thoughts on here....it's a fascinating experience. Off for an early night now so's to be bright eyed and bushy tailed in the morning....

Nanight :seeya:

 

[jay-jay]

'Twas funny....just now Sky News here in the UK were doing their nightly Oscar Trial round up and they showed the expert talking about how he didn't like to be seen without his prosthetic legs......whilst at the same time showing film of him showing off his stumps, (and how quickly he can put on his prosthetics), to the worlds press!

Yes, I saw that too! :facepalm: .. load of old BS, innit ..

 

[soozieqtips]

So presumably if they go the way of the assessment and it's done on an outpatient basis all the guns at his uncle's house will need to be locked away. Does anyone know what effect this all may have on his bail conditions as they currently stand? It's sure thrown up a lot of comment and conjecture.

His bail conditions should be revoked as he's a flipping menace to society. And I imagine his anger and resentment is growing daily as he sees his plans to walk off scot free slipping further and further away. So do the public a service, and put him somewhere where innocent people can make noises at night without being murdered.

 

[Forensics]

Seriously, there's likely a greater chance of me becoming the first yankee Queen than there is Oscar being deemed incompetent or successful at proving an involuntary defense. It just ain't gonna happen.

JMO and FWIW

BIB......unless they mistake you for the other Kate

 

[AlwaysShocked]

"I put it to you that Nel is beside himself in the way a cat would be beside himself if he came upon a mouse, cuddled up with a piece of cheese, taking a nap in his food dish."
:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

Post of the Day!!

-----------------
"And she also said that Nel was a 'danger' when he was armed."

Katydid, while I'm sure the above may indeed be true, I think you meant to say "Oscar" was/is the danger when armed.

Seriously, folks, how comfortable do you think Uncle Arnold and company can be about now? Oscar "loved" Reeva. Uhh. Huhh. If I had any accessible guns in my house along with Oscar in my house, I would not sleep very soundly at night and would be calling out "It's me! It's me Uncle Arnold!" as I made my way to the bathroom to pee at 3:00AM.

 

[Carol70]

I love your dog! What kind is it?

Oh lol thanks so much, she is what we call a "brak"- she was rescued from the township..hehe, she is a very odd looking dog I must say

 

[Val1]

BIB 1. I could be reading it wrong, but according to what Barry Bateman reports today in the Daily Maverick it appears he may not have to be institutionalised:



BIB 2. Are you sure OP looses his right to silence, because over here in the UK the psychiatrists that studied Shrien Dewani were not asked a dicky bird about what he had said to them about the case so I would find it strange SA psychiatrists would be allowed to "tell all"?.

BIB 3. IDK, but from my readings SA courts do appear to recognise "temporary insanity" as per the legal analysis titled "Insanity and Diminished Capacity Before the Court". Scroll down for the flowchart which resuming the part I am talking about goes:

What was X’s mental state at the time of the offence?
⬇
Non-pathological condition?
⬇
Temporary emotional states
⬇
Not guilty
⬇
Free​

Not that I think any of this will happen. From how Masipa was pushing Nel to continue his cross and to allow Roux to re-direct after, it seemed she was not convinced about allowing the application under Section 78, and it seems she has a very adamant Roux on her side to boot.​

Didn't the Dr. state that OP's condition is/was pathological?

That would open up the middle branch from that chart, correct?

 

[supernovaNic]

And she also said that Nel was a 'danger' when he was armed. Given that he is out on bail, and could get his hands on a weapon again if he felt especially anxious, Nel had to make the referral.

I did not see Nel as 'flustered.' He appeared adamant and determined, not flustered, imo.

Now I understand. Thank you !!

 

[Interested Bystander]

What a great day for me to join in with this conversation here but so much is going on that I hardly know where to start. I am sorry if this has been raised already but what is everyone's view on Oscar's reaction today to the suggestion by Nel that he is likely to be sectioned under the mental health act and admitted to a psychiatric hospital for assessment?
I have been watching OP's body language throughout the trial and the change this afternoon was very interesting but I can't decide if he either was not aware of what Nel was saying to the judge about applying for the section 78 or if he was shocked?

He is in denial. In fact so in denial that he believes whatever he says is the truth, even though it has changed several times throughout the trial.

 

[jay-jay]

That cold fish, death stare thingy he was doing this afternoon was very creepy....praps the psych woman slipped him a couple of happy pills in the lunch break.....

Check this out at 2:42:01 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYBnyelinBI .. lucky the blonde girl is on his side ..

 

[sleuth-d-]

nel: what is the purpose of your report?
v: [slowly carefully, thinking here]: to bring psychiatric factors... to the court's attention... that may be of relevance... to the court... for... the purpose of... conviction, and... if required, of sentencing.


so she wasn't thinking of any possibility of acquittal?

 

[Gryffindor]

Oh lol thanks so much, she is what we call a "brak"- she was rescued from the township..hehe, she is a very odd looking dog I must say

That's brilliant you rescued her. She's beautiful. Love her ears :-D <3

 

[Val1]

Check this out at 2:42:01 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYBnyelinBI .. lucky the blonde girl is on his side ..

So was RS, look what that got her....

 

[Carol70]

Carol I don't know if you follow crime and trials very much or just this one, like me. But if you have knowledge of other accused criminals in SA going though this process, would you please share?

Mr. Nel distinctly said that he was going to ask Judge Masipa to Order that OP undergo a three (3) day observation. It has been noted that he could ask for one lasting as long as thirty (30) days. How long do these typically go on for? I can see a convicted murder being put through the longest term possible, but OP has not been convicted of anything yet so that would seem unfair to him. Please share your experience if you would. TIA

None that I know of currently except Dewani and that case looks set to drag. I've followed a few that have used the dolus eventualis stand (jub jub, Jacob Humphrey etc) and most cases where the accused accidently shot loved ones have generally not landed up going to the high court- nor ended in serious conviction.

This is all new to me so can't really be of much help I'm afraid.

 

[aoibhinn]

The PT ran the lasers from the bathroom to the WC.

It would have been interesting if they had done the same thing but in the reverse direction. In other words, setup the laser in the WC and see how they laser lights align in the bathroom

Really interesting observation. The point at which the laser beams converge could confirm a point of origin for the gunshots.

 

[jay-jay]

I was surprised when I watched it. If he has to wait months for a bed, does that mean he gets to carry on living at Uncle Arnold's house as if nothing has happened... just like he's been doing for the past 15 months?

Yep, and then it's going to be another 30 days assessment after that .. and then all back to court again .. this trial is just going to go on forever .. it's ridiculous.