TURKEY - George Smith, 26, missing from cruise ship, July 2005

[angelmom]

This is not the first "missing passenger" that has happened on a cruise ship. There have been several others, and they tend to happen on just 2 or 3 of the cruise lines. IMO if they compared those passenger/staff lists they would find that someone happened to be on most of those ships when a person went missing.

Holy cow. What a way for a professional hit man to operate. If he was sometimes an employee and sometimes a passenger (and maybe even sometimes a guest of a passenger) would the police ever make the connection? Different cruise lines, international waters, only one job every couple of years...

Unlikely, but it would be a great story starter. Hmmm...

 

[mysteriew]

Holy cow. What a way for a professional hit man to operate. If he was sometimes an employee and sometimes a passenger (and maybe even sometimes a guest of a passenger) would the police ever make the connection? Different cruise lines, international waters, only one job every couple of years...

Unlikely, but it would be a great story starter. Hmmm...

I am thinking more serial killer than hit man. Maybe they didn't tip enough, or maybe they blew him off, or rebuffed his advances. Who knows the reasoning. Put cruise ships in the search box on WS and you will find info on several of the other victims. (Single women various ages, a couple of men, a Vietnamese couple- victims were different, jurisdiction was different, but usually the crime was the same. They came up missing (with no trace) and were never heard from again. The only things that were in common in these crimes were that the cruise ships did most of the "investigation", they occurred on a cruise ship, and nothing ever came of any "investigation", and the crime was presumed to have occurred in international waters.
Maybe the suspect just miscalculated about the balcony, or forgot that that section had a balcony.

 

[KatherineQ]

Part of the weird thing about cruise ships, is they are virtually travelling sovreign nations. Literally.

I have a friend whose husband was a physician, and he died aboard a cruise ship. He was dying for about 4 days, he knew it, his wife knew it, he'd had a heart attack and he couldn't get anyone to help him and even though he swore he'd pay for a helicopter airlift, international rules for removing someone from a cruise ship made it impossible. He died on board a carnival cruise. ONLY his wife was let off at the next port, as well as his dead body, and his two children were not allowed to disembark, but were forced to continue back to the US. Alone. Unescorted, with their dead father's body going to some carribean island along with their grieving mother.

This is Carnival Cruise. Whoda thought?

They are travelling countries, literally, with their own sets of laws. That people fall off them or are pushed off them and there is no real way to determine what happened to those who fall of is no big surprise.

 

[mysteriew]

Sounds like a serial killers paradise doesn't it?

 

[dani]

I'm wondering if the new bride was found sleeping in a *public area* of the ship? The news didn't give that detail, unless I missed it somewhere. I find it hard to believe that the crew would leave a female passenger sleeping in a public area, so that makes me wonder if she was in someone else's (another guy's?) stateroom, which could explain why the new bride isn't talking. :waitasec:

dani

 

[KatherineQ]

No, mysteriew, I don't agree so much. I don't think these murders are the work of one or two people.

But, this is a completely closed community. I really don't believe that there is a serial killer aboard all these closed communities pushing people off.

I do think, that if you want to off someone, doing it aboard a tourist ship is the way to go. I think almost no one "falls" off. I do think people get the idea to murder someone and pitch them off, and are able to do it successfully because for some reason no one has jurisdiction over these ships.

I think though, when this happens, they document every single individual aboard and if there is any overlap it would be noticed.

 

[Misty-Waves]

I was watching MSNTV Fri.night and a passenger-- Chief of Police from Florida-(not immediate neighbor) related that his Cousin watched as the bloodstain was quickly cleaned up--by 2 uniformed Security guards. No photos taken of the scene by the officers--- plus wouldn't you think clean-up would be someone elses job discription? I keep hearing it's all about $$$---cover any & everything that might reflect poorly on the Cruise Line.

I didn't happen to notice anyone mentioning that the couple were arguring in the casino, even across the room from each other--both pretty drunk. The new Mrs., it's said, gave her Husband a knee where it hurts the most. I only wish that was the worst thing to happen to him that night.

I don't get it----not any of it! All possibilities are so frightening.
Misty
~~~~Interesting posts earlier as to why his parents are holding back on DNA samples. Anything is possible.

 

[lcookster]

Thanks everyone for keeping the rest of us updated on this case. I am appalled that the cruise lines would destroy evidence and engage in cover-up. And kyotodeb, welcome to WS. I found this place when searching for news on Laci Peterson when she first went 'missing'. Have been here ever since.

 

[kyotodeb]

Thanks for all the nice welcomes! I am really enjoying reading all the posts. I am amazed at all the different theories! I guess different cruise lines treat situations differently. I've never sailed on the line this couple was on. I usually go on Princess and haven't heard any horror stories about them! Carnival doesn't have the greatest reputation.

 

[mysteriew]

No, mysteriew, I don't agree so much. I don't think these murders are the work of one or two people.

But, this is a completely closed community. I really don't believe that there is a serial killer aboard all these closed communities pushing people off.

I do think, that if you want to off someone, doing it aboard a tourist ship is the way to go. I think almost no one "falls" off. I do think people get the idea to murder someone and pitch them off, and are able to do it successfully because for some reason no one has jurisdiction over these ships.

I think though, when this happens, they document every single individual aboard and if there is any overlap it would be noticed.

This would all be true. Except for the histories of the past victims. Some were women traveling alone, one was a Vietnamese couple, some were part of a family or group.
Who would compare the lists? The cruise line? They have had problems lately with other types of problems on the cruise ships. It hurt their business very badly. Their bottom line is money, so they would not want any hint of an investigation of a serial killer.

 

[OriginalJerseyGirl]

I'm wondering if the new bride was found sleeping in a *public area* of the ship? The news didn't give that detail, unless I missed it somewhere. I find it hard to believe that the crew would leave a female passenger sleeping in a public area, so that makes me wonder if she was in someone else's (another guy's?) stateroom, which could explain why the new bride isn't talking.

I only heard it stated once on a television show, (I don't even remember which show at this point), that the wife was found asleep in a lounge chair on a deck, and that they had to wake her to ask if she knew where her husband was. Whether or not she was there all night, or if she was in a location where someone would have even noticed her in that chair without actually seeking her out - I haven't heard.

 

[LinasK]

I've been following this story for a couple of days on A Current Affair but haven't been able to get on-line because I badly hurt my back. What I heard from their program was that the couple (early twenties) was buying drinks for 18 & 19-year-old guys. My theory is that at least one or more of these guys was pursueing the wife sexually(reason for going to their cabin) and stabbed George in the room then tossed him over the deck, but he landed 2 floors down, then they had to toss him in the ocean. I also heard the blood stain was cleaned up in a matter of hours, but that the young girl took the picture of the blood stain and that the police officer heard alot of argueing/loud noises, but that neither of them, nor the bride has been interviewed. I would be very suspicious that the bride may have been in cohouts with the young men to kill him...


How come this case doesn't have it's own forum yet???

 

[OriginalJerseyGirl]

Forgive me if I missed this somewhere but it was mentioned on a couple of news programs today that during the course of the arguments that evening between Mr. and Mrs. Smith, Mrs. Smith gave her new husband a knee to the groin. I'm not implying that this has anything to do with his disappearance. I just wanted to mention it because it struck me as a pretty intense argument for newlyweds to be having during their honeymoon.

 

[luvbeaches]

international rules for removing someone from a cruise ship made it impossible

I've been on a cruise where a sick passenger was airlifted off the ship. It happens a lot. In fact, that's part of the reason we purchase travel insurance because it covers being taken in a helicopter from a ship. I am not sure about any international rules, but I've seen an ill person being removed from the ship, and I have a lot of friends who cruise and they have also seen people airlifted off.

I know someone who's husband died while on a cruise, and the cruiseline did everything in it's power to help her (it was also Carnival). Her biggest problem, was he died at the hospital in a port, and her nightmare began when she needed a passport to get out of the country (and she didn't have one). At that time, all you needed was a birth certificate to cruise. It won't be long before everyone has to have a passport to cruise...or travel, which I think is a good thing.

I am sorry what your friend went through, but I did want to post that I've cruised a lot, and I have seen an airlift operation myself. I also know that ships will deviate from their itenerary to ports if medical treatment is needed (and can't be provided on the ship). Although I can't explain what happened to your friend (and it's awful), I just wanted to add that I have myself witnessed an airlift while at sea.

 

[concernedperson]

This whole case is odd. And the Family clamming up is even more odd. Something isn't right.

 

[luvbeaches]

Forgive me if I missed this somewhere but it was mentioned on a couple of news programs today that during the course of the arguments that evening between Mr. and Mrs. Smith, Mrs. Smith gave her new husband a knee to the groin. I'm not implying that this has anything to do with his disappearance. I just wanted to mention it because it struck me as a pretty intense argument for newlyweds to be having during their honeymoon.

I heard that too. I also heard that an old boyfriend of hers was on the ship. Who knows if this is true, but I think there's a lot more that went on...and eventually we will hear more about this.

 

[Sassygerl]

I've never been on a cruise, but looked into it before our trip to the Caymans.....I am thinking now NO CRUISE!!!! Scary stories......

 

[lilpony]

I've never been on a cruise, but looked into it before our trip to the Caymans.....I am thinking now NO CRUISE!!!! Scary stories......

Been on quite a few cruises, with other family members. And, we always have had a blast. Never have had any problems at all. There so much fun, especially when you go with other people. :woohoo:

 

[KatherineQ]

I've been on a cruise where a sick passenger was airlifted off the ship. It happens a lot. In fact, that's part of the reason we purchase travel insurance because it covers being taken in a helicopter from a ship. I am not sure about any international rules, but I've seen an ill person being removed from the ship, and I have a lot of friends who cruise and they have also seen people airlifted off.

I know someone who's husband died while on a cruise, and the cruiseline did everything in it's power to help her (it was also Carnival). Her biggest problem, was he died at the hospital in a port, and her nightmare began when she needed a passport to get out of the country (and she didn't have one). At that time, all you needed was a birth certificate to cruise. It won't be long before everyone has to have a passport to cruise...or travel, which I think is a good thing.

I am sorry what your friend went through, but I did want to post that I've cruised a lot, and I have seen an airlift operation myself. I also know that ships will deviate from their itenerary to ports if medical treatment is needed (and can't be provided on the ship). Although I can't explain what happened to your friend (and it's awful), I just wanted to add that I have myself witnessed an airlift while at sea.

luvbeaches - I know almost everyone has a postive experience, it's great fun on a cruise ship, I understand that.

I don't fully understand all the dymanics of what happened to him. They look like normal people, they are educated, the man died after days of begging for a helilift. Being a doctor it's unbelievable they didn't find his request credible. Their lawsuit against Carnival has ended in a massive fortune, his children who were stranded and forced to ride without their parents are now in a cush position.

The entire point here, is I don't ever want to be at the mercy of a limited number of people who decide my fate. I understand almost 100% of people have a good experience. Despite his knowledge and wealth, he died aboard a ship and no one would clear him for treatment.

 

[LaurenD]

Anything new on this? This case is facinating, probably because it was their honeymoon and what should have been a beginning appears to be an end... .