GUILTY Turkey - Sarai Sierra, 33, NY woman murdered, Istanbul, 21 Jan 2013 - #1

[Rolandred]

The most common adjective that I have seen in connection to this case is "naive."

When you hire someone for a job, you look at their employment history and references. If SS had arranged to meet up with people who had references, or stay in a place with references, she would have been much safer.

Why do women go solo to these non-Western countries? Because they LOVE the culture so much. What's the culture like? Women wear veils, travel with chaperones, and defer to their husband's judgment. So we have an intrinsic contradiction.

Why do they really go to these countries? They can't afford the Riviera or Cham.

Because they are bored of the superficial Riviera and Cham.? We are not talking about Arabia here...or Somalia...or...etc...I know women 75+ who go to places "off the beaten path" alone - safely and wonderfully. Usually the more sophisticated traveler will opt for something more interesting than the middle class destinations considered the norm - like the Rivieras of the world - places which by the way are crawling with all kinds of thievery and mafias and unsavory characters- one has way more chance of running into trouble.

 

[CMac2]

Good find! I hope Lavy's around - my chrome translation for that was insane.

Same here. The best I could do is figure out **I think** that her underwear was found around her knees, despite the fact that some sort of testing (rape kit, perhaps?) came back negative.

 

[ToutCa]

If it's saying what I think it's saying, it sounds like you were right all along, ToutCa.

You and I both were leaning toward Taylan on this whole thing. But the investigation is a long way from anywhere yet.

One thing I've learned so far is to take anything from the Turkish press with a huuuge grain of salt.

For the sake of SS and those who loved her, I just want to see the truth prevail, and it's definitely OK if my guesses are wrong along the way!!!

 

[bourne]

LAVY - There's a new article up in the Turkish press - if you could translate the very beginning, it would be great.

After all my misadventures with google translate, I don't want to post quotes from it here.

But it covers new alleged details of the condition in which the body was discovered, including (without being too specific) disposition of its clothing which suggested sexual assault even though it repeats that preliminary rape tests were negative.

Lavy, take a look if you can and post a more detailed translation:

LINK

Like others, the article also insists there was an attacker of some kind and she was murdered. FWIW

Yes, we already knew she wasn't sexually assaulted. She was physically assaulted and killed.

 

[ToutCa]

Yes, we already knew she wasn't sexually assaulted. She was physically assaulted and killed.

Yes, but hypothetically if there was some sort of attempted sexual assault, that's relevant in terms of both motive and identity of perp.

And we don't know she wasn't sexually assaulted, we just know that a preliminary rape test came out negative. More thorough tests might change that story (and might not).

 

[CMac2]

Yes, but hypothetically if there was some sort of attempted sexual assault, that's relevant in terms of both motive and identity of perp.

And we don't know she wasn't sexually assaulted, we just know that a preliminary rape test came out negative. More thorough tests might change that story (and might not).

Lavy can tell us for sure (probably off watching the super bowl- Go 49ers!!) but I think there's more from this article than the fact that the rape test came back negative. Equally important is the fact that her panties were found around her knees (at least I think they were- hopefully Google Translate didn't lead me astray).

Why do that if there's no sexual assault? Or rather, why do that if there was no intended sexual assault? For me, this speaks- at best- of a sexual undertone or motivation.

 

[ToutCa]

Equally important is the fact that her panties were found around her knees (at least I think they were- hopefully Google Translate didn't lead me astray).

Why do that if there's no sexual assault? Or rather, why do that if there was no intended sexual assault? For me, this speaks- at best- of a sexual undertone or motivation.

I'm just going to wait on Lavy (do Turks watch the Super Bowl?!).

It's a little unclear what the article is actually saying. Plus my level of trust in the Turkish press is 0 - half the time they are scooping new details, but half the time they appear to just be making wild stuff up.

 

[CMac2]

I'm just going to wait on Lavy (do Turks watch the Super Bowl?!).

Ha ha. There goes my small minded American brain again. I assumed the entire world was watching the Superbowl. Ray Lewis is about to retire, afterall. That's epic, right?

You're right though- seems like every time we think we've gotten our hands on something solid based on what we think we've read in Turkish media, we seem to be mistaken. I'll try to be patient.

 

[ami]

Lavy can tell us for sure (probably off watching the super bowl- Go 49ers!!) but I think there's more from this article than the fact that the rape test came back negative. Equally important is the fact that her panties were found around her knees (at least I think they were- hopefully Google Translate didn't lead me astray).

Why do that if there's no sexual assault? Or rather, why do that if there was no intended sexual assault? For me, this speaks- at best- of a sexual undertone or motivation.

Assuming this new story is accurate (and, well, who knows about that) maybe the scenario was attempted rape, a struggle, a blow to the head meant to subdue her but that killed her, the realization that the assault had turned into murder and then he fled the scene?

 

[CMac2]

Assuming this new story is accurate (and, well, who knows about that) maybe the scenario was attempted rape, a struggle, a blow to the head meant to subdue her but that killed her, the realization that the assault had turned into murder and then he fled the scene?

Definitely plausible. I do know that I no longer believe in even the slightest way that this was an accidental fall that doesn't involve foul play.

 

[bourne]

Yes, but hypothetically if there was some sort of attempted sexual assault, that's relevant in terms of both motive and identity of perp.


And we don't know she wasn't sexually assaulted, we just know that a preliminary rape test came out negative. More thorough tests might change that story (and might not).

According to current MSM articles, she wasn't sexually assaulted. So I'm not going to presume facts not in evidence.

 

[Snoopster]

IF her panties were down that certainly IS a different scenario and implies sexual assault or intended demeaning (same objective ) of the victim.

(go Ravens!)

 

[bourne]

IF her panties were down that certainly IS a different scenario and implies sexual assault or intended demeaning (same objective ) of the victim.

(go Ravens!)

Provide link that says her panties were down.

 

[belimom]

Okay, I have to say it. I've tried biting my tongue because I don't want to open another can of worms. I think the Turkish LE have done a wonderful job on this case. I'm sure the FBI is of immense assistance - the US is just a larger country with more money and resources at their disposal for investigations. But I also think that the Turkish LE have done very well and have seemed from Day One to take this case seriously. I am glad they are accepting the FBI's help, but I just don't want to see them portrayed as incompetent or unable to handle the case on their own. Okay, off my soap box.

 

[lavy]

LAVY - There's a new article up in the Turkish press - if you could translate the very beginning, it would be great.

After all my misadventures with google translate, I don't want to post quotes from it here.

But it covers new alleged details of the condition in which the body was discovered, including (without being too specific) disposition of its clothing which suggested sexual assault even though it repeats that preliminary rape tests were negative.

Lavy, take a look if you can and post a more detailed translation:

LINK

Like others, the article also insists there was an attacker of some kind and she was murdered. FWIW

Aw...this doesn't look good. Translation is below:

Investigation is hazy. It is been clear that reason for death is that she was hit to head by an object. According to preliminary investigation she had her jeans and underwear below her knees. There has been NO signs of rape but they are focusing on rape attempt or she was attached when urinating. Again the blanket and other items are tested in criminal labs.

2 earrings, 1 headphone

Police found 2 earrings and a headphone under the ground (burried?) during the detailed investigation. Police questioned 20 people who live nearby. Police thinks it is a very low possibility that she was killed by people who live nearby (i believe they mean people who live around the walls) as her jewelery were not taken. Police is trying to find the person who caused her to go to Sarayburnu. (wonder how do they know somebody took her there)

No signs of her being a secret agent or drug smuggler.

500 surveillance has been inspected and she was followed from home to Sirkeci. As they couldn't find her after sirkeci 200 police searched her there. Except Taylan who she had met twice in turkey she has been talking to 3 other people on internet. Turkish police headquarters contacted Gmail throught Interpol for the emails. (so was it lie that her husband knew her password?)

Rest is old news.


--Sorry for the delay. No, I am not watching the superbowl. I was out for grocery shopping. Don't think Turks do watch it. Also Europeans don't too, sorry guys

 

[CMac2]

Provide link that says her panties were down.

Here's the translation of the first part of the link below:

Sierra's body was found earlier in the day at the foot of the ramparts Sarayburnu based on research in Sarai his pants and underwear were lowered as much as the knee cap. The first symptoms are not a sign of rape or attempted rape rape of the U.S. women's exposure focuses on the killer.

BBM

http://www.aksam.com.tr/dehlizin-ucundan-tecavuz-gorundu--163669h.html

 

[tardislass]

From another forum, a Turkish member said police still are saying the same thing. No assault, clothed only missing her electronics and no marks except the headwound. Any other allegations by the Turkish press should be ruled out for now. Their press seems to want to run with the more salacious headlines before the facts.

 

[bourne]

Here's the translation of the first part of the link below:



BBM

http://www.aksam.com.tr/dehlizin-ucundan-tecavuz-gorundu--163669h.html

Are we sure that is the correct translation? I don't speak Turkish so IDK.

If that is true, I wonder why do none of the U.S. MSM articles give that information?

 

[CMac2]

Are we sure that is the correct translation? I don't speak Turkish so IDK.

If that is true, I wonder why do none of the U.S. MSM articles give that information?

It is the correct translation, as lavy has corroborated it. That said, however, as we all know from following this case, anything the Turkish press reports should be taken with a grain of salt. I'm not sure if they're all about the scoop or what, but between the language barriers and what appears to be a difference in journalistic standards, not everything they've reported has been deemed accurate.

 

[bourne]

It is the correct translation, as lavy has corroborated it. That said, however, as we all know from following this case, anything the Turkish press reports should be taken with a grain of salt. I'm not sure if they're all about the scoop or what, but between the language barriers and what appears to be a difference in journalistic standards, not everything they've reported has been deemed accurate.

Agreed. Bummer, I gotta go now -- just when it was getting more fascinating!

Gotta watch the Superbowl! :rocker: