GUILTY TX - Alanna Gallagher, 6, Saginaw, 1 July 2013 - #8

[SCHMAE]

Question for everyone:

In the past 20 years, how many cases have there been where a child was abducted and murdered by a stranger in your metro area? Cases similar to what happened to Amber, Opal, Ashley, and (possibly) Alanna.

Well that is my area, so at least 4 !

 

[miimaa]

How long was this little girl out and about unsupervised that day? Seems real weird to me that someone grabbed and murdered this girl, tied her up, disposed of her body all before the family reported her gone. My 12yo grandson isn't out of my sight or gone anywhere unknown to me. Only one time was he at the park with other kids and I could not find him for 15 minutes. I tracked him down and he was told to never go off without letting me know where and who he would be with. OTH my neighbor's granddaughter is out unsupervised all day. I see her riding her bike blocks from house. She is 7yo.

 

[blue22]

Question for everyone:

In the past 20 years, how many cases have there been where a child was abducted and murdered by a stranger in your metro area? Cases similar to what happened to Amber, Opal, Ashley, and (possibly) Alanna.

I'll add to that, if you don't mind! What was the population of your area at the time of abduction?

 

[miimaa]

Question for everyone:

In the past 20 years, how many cases have there been where a child was abducted and murdered by a stranger in your metro area? Cases similar to what happened to Amber, Opal, Ashley, and (possibly) Alanna.

In my area is a series of five small towns - total 30,000 population - one girl disappeared. Never recovered. No proof she was taken. LE doesn't know if she wandered off or what happened to her.

 

[floridamomma]

Question for everyone:

In the past 20 years, how many cases have there been where a child was abducted and murdered by a stranger in your metro area? Cases similar to what happened to Amber, Opal, Ashley, and (possibly) Alanna.

320,000+. i can't think of a single child murder.

eta: i googled, just in case my feeble ol'brain is forgetting. nothing but parents killing their own.

 

[1southernmama]

Then call me crazy too. I spent a lot of time yesterday staring at those pictures that I wasn't sure if my eyes started seeing things. It was determined the purple was some photo lighting effect on the tree, there is similar on the other side of the tree in the leaves too.

But then this morning on first look I see the same things straight away again. driver with hands on wheel, white tshirt, someone in the back looking out and someone in purple riding on a bike.

I, too, think there is someone in purple behind the car in the 2nd pic. If you compare both pictures you can eliminate which items are leaves and digital blur. (what looks like someone on a bike in front of the car, is also there in the other pic, therefore, leaves. there are leaves in the first image behind where the rear qtr panel would be, but there is something else there as well & it's wearing purple.)

 

[JustJeannie]

Question for everyone:

In the past 20 years, how many cases have there been where a child was abducted and murdered by a stranger in your metro area? Cases similar to what happened to Amber, Opal, Ashley, and (possibly) Alanna.

Our metropolitan area has 560,000+ people. There is only one such case I can recall, and it happened more than 25 years ago, so it is outside of the scope of your question. Child murder occasionally happens but it is generally parents, acquaintances, and a couple of drive by gang related shootings. Stranger abduction and murder, no.

eta: The case I recall happened about 28 years ago. A 12 year old boy was riding his bike, grabbed by a 17 and an 18 year old he did not know, and taken into nearby woods. He was beaten, raped, and then set on fire and left to die. The killers were caught shortly afterward. The 17 year old got life in prison w/o the possibility of parole, the 18 year old was sentenced to death. The older of the two is still sitting on death row!

 

[Kat]

Yep.
Knowles is a very small two lane street with no lights, and only a couple of stop signs. For about half its length, it's bordered on the West by Willow Creek Park, and on the East by residential neighborhoods, and the speed limit is 30. A little North of McLeroy, it broadens a bit and is bordered on both sides by neighborhoods, including Alanna's. The speed limit changes to 20 about half a mile before it reaches Bailey Boswell, where it dead ends. I live in a neighborhood on the other side of Longhorn, and it's a great (and pretty) way to cut right through town to get to Walmart if you don't mind the slow speed limits.

Saginaw Main (US 287) and Old Decatur both have much higher speed limits and much heavier traffic. A kidnapper who knew the area would have to be out of his mind to take one of those streets with his victim, when Knowles is available as a much more isolated alternative.

The first time I took Knowles home from the store after Alanna was killed, I thought about how easy it is to hop on Knowles from her street, and end up at the dump site. Just a few turns and a mile or so of very sparse traffic. I'm almost certain that's the route the killer took with her, because it's the best option for getting her out of the neighborhood quickly without being seen. I still scan for anything that looks like discarded clothing every time I go that way.

Here's a map, for anyone who's interested:

If you follow that route in street view, there's a clump of trees at [approximately] 300 Woodcrest. Those trees are very thick, overgrown, and dark right now, and driving by them I couldn't help but wonder if that might be the kill spot. There's nothing around, and I doubt anyone would think twice about a car parked near them.

Thank you for the map. I don't know about the clump of trees being the scene of the murder. Why not just leave her there in the woods that are thick and overgrown? Why risk being seen with a deceased body? Just some thoughts.

Also, the route doesn't make sense. It seems illogical to take that route in order to dispose of her body. Why did the person take that route, I'm wondering. Why not just head out of either neighborhood onto Old Decatur Road? There has to be a reason she was taken into the neighborhood where she was found on the other side of W. McLeroy Blvd. Which makes me wonder if that is where the crimes against her ultimately happened? JMHO and I have nothing to support this speculation except using the walk feature on google maps---but I think she was taken from her neighborhood and didn't cross W. McLeroy on her own. Meaning I don't think she was abducted from the Cindy Ln neighborhood where she was found. I think she was transported there either alive or deceased. But if she were deceased already why?

So if she was taken from her neighborhood alive then why go into the other neighborhood? Why not head out into open territory so the crimes that were committed against her could be done in relative isolation and/or privacy? ETA: Did they want to take her to their own home?

JMHO but I think this is a local living in either of those neighborhoods at this point in time. It would be someone that none of the neighbors would ever suspect. They would probably say after an arrest "But they were the nicest person, never in a million years would I have suspected...".

Just where my thoughts are today. Again, thank you for the map.

 

[dandan08]

I, too, think there is someone in purple behind the car in the 2nd pic. If you compare both pictures you can eliminate which items are leaves and digital blur. (what looks like someone on a bike in front of the car, is also there in the other pic, therefore, leaves. there are leaves in the first image behind where the rear qtr panel would be, but there is something else there as well & it's wearing purple.)

I respectfully disagree. If you look at the full picture, you will see the leaves on the tree match up exactly. There are purple artefacts all over the image too. I have copied the section of leaves from the first image and placed them over the purple spots on the second image. Where the purple spot is on the second image, it matches up to being leaves on the first image.

Don't forget we don't know if these are screenshots that the camera has taken directly when detecting movement. Or they are screenshots from a video that was recorded by the camera and LE have screengrabbed images from the video. If they are taken from a moving video, LE would know there was someone walking before the car pulled up.

Here is the full picture:

 

[skibaboo]

I, too, think there is someone in purple behind the car in the 2nd pic. If you compare both pictures you can eliminate which items are leaves and digital blur. (what looks like someone on a bike in front of the car, is also there in the other pic, therefore, leaves. there are leaves in the first image behind where the rear qtr panel would be, but there is something else there as well & it's wearing purple.)

I highlighted the areas for clafrification.

http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/6646/buel.jpg

Click 'ctrl' and '+' four times (on windows) to zoom in. I am still torn on whether the purple is someone on a bike or the tree.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Look at it this way. Saginaw has a population of 20,000 people. From 1999-2006, there were two murders. I don't know how many from 2007-2013 but let's say there were again two murders in that time span. So that's four murders in 14 years. One case is Opal's, on case is Alanna's. So half of the murders in Saginaw in 14 years involve a child being abducted and murdered by a predator. That's really off.

 

[Confusion]

I've spent a lot of time off and on over

I highlighted the areas for clafrification.

http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/6646/buel.jpg

Click 'ctrl' and '+' four times (on windows) to zoom in. I am still torn on whether the purple is someone on a bike or the tree.

I don't see someone on a bike there, but I do see a bike lying on the side of the street in one and not in the other. I've spent a lot of time off and on over the years playing those dumb games where you try to spot the differences between 2 pictures, and that's one that stands out the most for me.

 

[Linda7NJ]

I respectfully disagree. If you look at the full picture, you will see the leaves on the tree match up exactly. There are purple artefacts all over the image too. I have copied the section of leaves from the first image and placed them over the purple spots on the second image. Where the purple spot is on the second image, it matches up to being leaves on the first image.

Don't forget we don't know if these are screenshots that the camera has taken directly when detecting movement. Or they are screenshots from a video that was recorded by the camera and LE have screengrabbed images from the video. If they are taken from a moving video, LE would know there was someone walking before the car pulled up.

Here is the full picture:

Quick question after looking at the originals. It appears to me the sun was directly overhead in both photos. Doesn't that happen at approx noon???

I'm not good with this sorta stuff, as my sundial has been replaced with electronic digital devices for time telling.

 

[skibaboo]

I've spent a lot of time off and on over

I don't see someone on a bike there, but I do see a bike lying on the side of the street in one and not in the other. I've spent a lot of time off and on over the years playing those dumb games where you try to spot the differences between 2 pictures, and that's one that stands out the most for me.

I think I'm trying to see more than is there. The more I look the more I don't think there is someone in purple, its just tree. I don't see a bike anywhere. It is bit like a spot the difference and you can stare and stare and not see something until someone else points it out. My mind is just desperate for there to be something that leaps out and be significant here. If it was taken from moving video I wish they would release that too and not just stills. Guess there may be reasons they can't.

 

[dandan08]

For those wondering if there's a person in purple behind the car. I have quickly and roughly placed the leaves from the tree from the first image over the purple part of the second image:

For reference the unedited second image is at the bottom. The leaves from the first image is at the top. As you can see, where the purple is in the bottom picture, it is in the same spot as the dark spot of the leaves in the top picture. Granted you have to take wind into consideration etc but all other leaves around the driveway match up too.

 

[SCHMAE]

Quick question after looking at the originals. It appears to me the sun was directly overhead in both photos. Doesn't that happen at approx noon???

I'm not good with this sorta stuff, as my sundial has been replaced with electronic digital devices for time telling.

Ohmyblobs ! Good eye. you're right. Those trees' shadows are from directly overhead. But I will say in Texas in the afternoon, that bad boy shines from straight above until about 2 pm ish. I'll try to remember today to keep a peak outside until it starts to move the trees' shadows and report back. Someone help me remember.

 

[blue22]

Look at it this way. Saginaw has a population of 20,000 people. From 1999-2006, there were two murders. I don't know how many from 2007-2013 but let's say there were again two murders in that time span. So that's four murders in 14 years. One case is Opal's, on case is Alanna's. So half of the murders in Saginaw in 14 years involve a child being abducted and murdered by a predator. That's really off.

OK, I know some of you live in Dallas and none of this is news to you, but it's something I was thinking about,
Every place is easily accessible in DFW. What I mean is, I don't think it's off considering the population surrounding here. A lot of people here are transplants from other states and cities. So, lots of visitors. Also, I know A LOT of people who pass by Saginaw on 820 and 35W going to work in Ft. Wort and North Richland Hills, and people passing by to get home to Keller. I guess I take into account not only Saginaw, but the surrounding populations. Saginaw isn't a rural area, it's a suburb of very large cities. Ft. Worth has over 758,000 people, Keller has 40,000 people, and North Richland Hills has 65, 000 people. Not to mention, that 35W is a heavily used road for truckers and people traveling through. We also have one of the busiest airports in the world, and one of the biggest hubs in the US for business. We get millions and millions of people traveling through for business every year. (Not just DFW, but also Love Field.) We also have more construction them most places in the US. Both on roads, and residential and business. So much construction surrounding Saginaw.

What I'm taking forever to say, is Saginaw is not an island. There is millions in the population directly surrounding. If it were rural or set apart, I would find it odd, but not where it sits now.

 

[skibaboo]

For those wondering if there's a person in purple behind the car. I have quickly and roughly placed the leaves from the tree from the first image over the purple part of the second image:

For reference the unedited second image is at the bottom. The leaves from the first image is at the top. As you can see, where the purple is in the bottom picture, it is in the same spot as the dark spot of the leaves in the top picture. Granted you have to take wind into consideration etc but all other leaves around the driveway match up too.

Excellent thank you! The monitor on my PC is broken or I would have been on there playing around with photoshop doing just this. (probably making myself more crazy tho) lol so thank you doubly!

 

[Confusion]

I think I'm trying to see more than is there. The more I look the more I don't think there is someone in purple, its just tree. I don't see a bike anywhere. It is bit like a spot the difference and you can stare and stare and not see something until someone else points it out. My mind is just desperate for there to be something that leaps out and be significant here. If it was taken from moving video I wish they would release that too and not just stills. Guess there may be reasons they can't.

Where I see a bike is by the mailboxes behind the tree on the left. In one of them it looks like a fender lying parallel to the curb and a pedal sticking up. There's nothing there in the other one except for a few shadows from the leaves.
moo

 

[SCHMAE]

OK, I know some of you live in Dallas and none of this is news to you, but it's something I was thinking about,
Every place is easily accessible in DFW. What I mean is, I don't think it's off considering the population surrounding here. A lot of people here are transplants from other states and cities. So, lots of visitors. Also, I know A LOT of people who pass by Saginaw on 820 and 35W going to work in Ft. Wort and North Richland Hills, and people passing by to get home to Keller. I guess I take into account not only Saginaw, but the surrounding populations. Saginaw isn't a rural area, it's a suburb of very large cities. Ft. Worth has over 758,000 people, Keller has 40,000 people, and North Richland Hills has 65, 000 people. Not to mention, that 35W is a heavily used road for truckers and people traveling through. We also have one of the busiest airports in the world, and one of the biggest hubs in the US for business. We get millions and millions of people traveling through for business every year. (Not just DFW, but also Love Field.) We also have more construction them most places in the US. Both on roads, and residential and business. So much construction surrounding Saginaw.

What I'm taking forever to say, is Saginaw is not an island. There is millions in the population directly surrounding. If it were rural or set apart, I would find it odd, but not where it sits now.

Yes ! It's a ' small town ' by comparison to big inner city places but it's right near this big population BOOM that is DFW . Saginaw border FT Worth which is a pretty big city, imho. I'm a country girl so FW seems BIG to me and Dallas seems like NY to me. If you cross 820 South from Saginaw, you are straight into FW and not the nicest part of FW either. Saginaw is also way bigger than it was a decade ago.