TX - Austin Package Bombs #3

[Tippy Lynn]

Early on when MAC was first identified, a reporter contacted his old boss/owner of company. Owner said he was terminated because he chose to do things his own way, despite being warned several times. He set his own priorities on the job, instead of implementing co. priorities according to owner. I believe those comments have been deleted
lately. I saw several later comments from this company that seemed less critical.

Sounds like he had “ the rules don’t apply to me” mentality.

 

[HMSHood]

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/21/us/mark-anthony-conditt-austin-bomber.html

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2018/03/what-we-know-about-austin-bomber-mark-conditt.html

Was Mark on the autism spectrum? Is it okay if I speculate that? Mods, you can delete this post if it’s not okay.

I don’t think he was a psychopath. I think he had issues and didn’t receive adequate medical and social intervention. And was open to striving for a certain image that was socially acceptable by whoever influenced him, and then feeling rejected when he could not achieve that standard.

Kind of like Elliot Rodgers but on a much greater scale.

Elliot Rodger was pathological envious with an extreme entitlement mentality.

 

[HMSHood]

Since he didn't study abnormal psychology in college nor have a degree or expertise in diagnosing behavior disorders, I wouldn't consider his opinion to be expert. Probably just something he read online or heard in a movie. Maybe he though it was a cool thing to brag about himself, made him feel cool.

Virginia Tech student Natalie Keepers also referred to herself as a "sociopath in training" when she helped her "friend" David Eisenhauer murder and dispose of the body of 13 year old Nicole Lovell.

http://www.richmond.com/news/virgin...cle_6947b4d0-2dce-5de8-9395-fb907683e106.html

Eisenhauer and Keeper were also raised in cloistered or isolated conservative Christian families. Both attended private "Christian" schools growing up and only emerged into mainstream society later in high school. Both were in their freshman year at Virginia Tech and neither fit in with other students who had more conventional social and educational backgrounds.

Both decided they wanted to plan a "perfect murder" and chose a 13 yo girl that Eisenhauer had lured into an online relationship. Again, it was a case of "othering", thinking it was ok to have a sexual relationship, then kill a young girl because she wasn't like them.

There's something happening when these kids are growing up in these hyper-Christian education environments. Something they're learning, either overtly or indirectly, is convincing them they are superior to others. When the time comes to get out in the real world, some don't fit in. They're not prepared, haven't been helped with the transition. Their way of responding to social rejection from their real world peers is with violence.

It's a small subset of this group that's having problems with normal socialization, but JMO, we need to think about some research to find out how to prevent it. Do Amish or Mennonite young who leave the faith strike out and use violence against others? It would be interesting to know, but I don't know of any cases offhand. It may have to do with the individual interpretations of their religions - peace loving vs violent fire and brimstone. The Amish and Mennonites also have different views about the use of deadly weapons. It's definitely worth studying the young adults who've had isolated upbringings.

I saw Nicole Lovell on 48 Hours. Very disturbing story. I thought David Eisenhauer and Natalie Keepers are clear cut psychopaths in absence of any injustice collecting as far as I notice. More like Leopold and Loeb.

I did not know Eisenhauer and Keepers came from strict religious upbringing, which is isolating in nature. I know in the past there have been killers from that type of background like Osama bin Laden, Omar Mateen, John Wayne Gacy, Ed Gein, Muhammed Youssef Abdulazeez, Ron Haskell, Charles Whitman, Betty Broderick, Diane Downs, and David and Louise Turpin.

There have been many who come from permissive upbringings in which there are no rules and are often coddled. They have the same problem as someone who comes from a strict and isolating upbringing. Elliot Rodger, Adam Lanza, Michelle Carter, Howell Donaldson, Todd Kohlhepp, and probably Jerry Sandusky came from a permissive upbringing.

Some have a mix of both authoritarian and permissive like Casey Anthony and Jodi Arias.

6 Family Characteristics That Can Contribute to Bullying
http://subscribe.vision.org/FamilyM...aracteristics-That-Can-Contribute-to-Bullying

1.) "Cool-to-cold emotional environment" with lack of involvement from the primary caregiver;
2.) Permissive parenting style—few rules or limits for behavior, little family structure
3.) Isolation of family from the community, and active social life or social involvement of family is lacking;
4.) Conflict between parents, and disharmony within the family;
5.) Inappropriate use of discipline—parents fail to punish aggression or may even reinforce it; and fail to reward prosocial behavior or may even punish it;
6.) Authoritarian parenting with high use of controlling and punitive discipline—parents try to maintain order with rigid household standards and rules.

It should not be any surprise that bullies often come from authoritarian or permissive upbringing mixed social isolation.

The common denominators they have are social alienation and sexual repression/frustration issues.

 

[human]

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entr...bible-study-group_us_5ab8f3bbe4b0decad04c1412

Where is the article from the coworker who said that the parents homeschooled to keep the kids away from.... I forget what. And that they gave parenting advice.

 

[rsd1200]

It's interesting that Conditt considered himself a psychopath, though.

I wonder why he believed that. He obviously realized he was abnormal in some way. (In my opinion.) Maybe someday we'll hear the recorded manifesto.

It does remind me of Elliot Rodgers, too.

Maybe he'd been one of those kids whose parents knew something was wrong. His parents may have taken him to see someone and he'd been diagnosed with one or more of the diags, below.. If so, had he been seeing a therapist at any time, or just been self-aware, he might have just known. His parents do not appear to be wealthy people. Buying that home, kinda says to me that it was time for him to leave the nest, but they felt that he couldn't live on his own. (I could be wrong, they may be very wealthy and bought it as an investment.) Psychopaths know that they are different, as they learn to mimic what they don't have, emotions.



From link, below:
Usually forensic psychiatrists and psychologists are involved because individuals with psychopathic personality are involved in serious criminal behavior and implicated with the law. Most of the times the profiles of children who evolve in adult psychopaths have components from other disorders, especially conduct disorder.

Nevertheless, people with Psychopathic Personality at one point were children, without diagnosis of Psychopathic Personality, as such a diagnosis is not appropriate at early childhood or adolescence. Psychopathic or/and antisocial tendencies sometimes are recognized in children and early adolescent age. Such behaviors lead usually to the diagnosis of Conduct Disorder or Oppositional Defiant Disorder or Attention Deficit and Hyperactivity Disorder in early years of life and increase the possibility to have a diagnosis of Antisocial Personality Disorder and Psychopathic Personality as an adult. (1)

“It’s difficult to spot a psychopath; in fact, they can look actually like they’re more genuine than other people,” says Book. “Part of it is that most people don’t have to fake emotions all the time, so they don’t have any practice at it. But someone who doesn’t feel these emotions will have practice at faking them, so they will probably be better at it.” (2)

(1) From Conduct Disorder in Childhood to Psychopathy in Adulthood https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22796980
(2) Psychopaths Mimic Emotions: https://brocku.ca/brock-news/2015/03/psychopaths-mimic-emotions-very-accurately-brock-study/

 

[jjenny]

Well, we can speculate all day long, but family claims they were shocked and had no idea.
"We are devastated and broken at the news that our family could be involved in such an awful way. We had no idea of the darkness that Mark must have been in,” the family said. “Our family is a normal family in every way. We love, we pray, and we try to inspire and serve others. Right now our prayers are for those families that have lost loved ones, for those impacted in any way, and for the soul of our Mark.""
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...thony-conditt-austin-serial-bomber/444738002/

 

[x_files]

Well, FBI, ATF and others will hopefully be doing a full investigation into Conditt's background. If there's sketchy stuff going on at those paramilitary religious camps, they will find out.

and I hope they warn/inform the public of their findings.

 

[x_files]

Elliot Rodger was pathological envious with an extreme entitlement mentality.

and with the next Elliot Rogers what can a parent or community do to help him?

 

[x_files]

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/24/...&gwh=4ACC90868D5D0349D4F21C563FA96912&gwt=pay

 

[jjenny]

and with the next Elliot Rogers what can a parent or community do to help him?

Maybe community should be worried about protecting itself, rather then "helping him."

 

[x_files]

"Relatives of bombing victim Esperanza “Hope” Herrera say they’re praying for the soul of the bomber, Mark Conditt."

yet, nothing from Mark's family or his Church regarding the victims, nor asking anyone to help them. If so, it's not in the local news.

https://www.statesman.com/news/fami...rays-for-mark-conditt/PEACWnvFWc8F26lkNuwSTM/

 

[bluesneakers]

Maybe community should be worried about protecting itself, rather then "helping him."

Maybe it's both.

 

[rsd1200]

Since he didn't study abnormal psychology in college nor have a degree or expertise in diagnosing behavior disorders, I wouldn't consider his opinion to be expert. Probably just something he read online or heard in a movie. Maybe he though it was a cool thing to brag about himself, made him feel cool.

Virginia Tech student Natalie Keepers also referred to herself as a "sociopath in training" when she helped her "friend" David Eisenhauer murder and dispose of the body of 13 year old Nicole Lovell.

http://www.richmond.com/news/virgin...cle_6947b4d0-2dce-5de8-9395-fb907683e106.html

Eisenhauer and Keeper were also raised in cloistered or isolated conservative Christian families. Both attended private "Christian" schools growing up and only emerged into mainstream society later in high school. Both were in their freshman year at Virginia Tech and neither fit in with other students who had more conventional social and educational backgrounds.

Both decided they wanted to plan a "perfect murder" and chose a 13 yo girl that Eisenhauer had lured into an online relationship. Again, it was a case of "othering", thinking it was ok to have a sexual relationship, then kill a young girl because she wasn't like them.

There's something happening when these kids are growing up in these hyper-Christian education environments. Something they're learning, either overtly or indirectly, is convincing them they are superior to others. When the time comes to get out in the real world, some don't fit in. They're not prepared, haven't been helped with the transition. Their way of responding to social rejection from their real world peers is with violence.

It's a small subset of this group that's having problems with normal socialization, but JMO, we need to think about some research to find out how to prevent it. Do Amish or Mennonite young who leave the faith strike out and use violence against others? It would be interesting to know, but I don't know of any cases offhand. It may have to do with the individual interpretations of their religions - peace loving vs violent fire and brimstone. The Amish and Mennonites also have different views about the use of deadly weapons. It's definitely worth studying the young adults who've had isolated upbringings.

BBM

I was thinking about the Amish, when you posted about "othering" on your last post. I've only known of one really horrific murder, by an Amish man, at least where I'm at, and there are lots of them here, in parts of Ky. Mostly in the foothills. That man turned himself in to LE a few years after he committed the murder.

However, the Amish are the poster children for "othering". One cannot be LGBTQ and be Amish, they use corporal punishment, have insulated themselves from the outside world-liness, divorce is highly frowned upon and can be grounds for excommunication, and females must wear head coverings to denote their marital status (I think beards, or lack of, denote males status). Although pleasant, and cordial, to us English, we are the "others" to the Amish. They do have their own internal issues, as life in their community is not just some bucolic dream world, but they solve most among themselves.

The Amish, may not have issues with violence, in the same way as the "English", because they also have no electricity to constantly power hours of television, computers, and video game entertainment, either. They don't spend significant amounts of time, in front of these devices. Instead, because of their "othering", they must rely on a strong sense of community. Neighbors will give freely of their time to help one another, and kids work in the family business, doing apprenticeships, to learn a trade.

I don't know how many times, in interviews, after some horrific act, that I've heard the neighbors say, "Seemed like a nice guy, but, we didn't really know him . I spoke to him/her occasionally at the mailbox.". I don't think that it's about any views about firearms that the Amish own. If an Amish kid wanted to commit suicide, with their family's firearm, they could attempt to, just as easily as an English kid could. I think it's about the Amish's strong sense of community, and caring for one another. They have to, if their community is to survive. They know one another in their community, they eat together, worship together, and work together.

 

[x_files]

Maybe community should be worried about protecting itself, rather then "helping him."

In other words, what's the solutions to protect society and to prevent future crazy shooters/bombers?
If parents cannot see the red flags and cannot get help. What's the next step?

 

[Spellbound]

I wish I could post the video that is included in this article. It is of Draylen Mason (and his participation at Interlochen Arts Academy in Michigan) performing with his bass — he is outstandingly talented.

http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2018/03/texas_bomb_victim_was_michigan.html

Since nobody is talking about this, I will. This fine young man, Draylen Mason, died yesterday when he opened a package delivered to his home that contained a bomb. He was 17, a student at Intelochen Academy of the Arts (which is one of the most prestigious arts camps in the US), he played with the Austin Youth Symphony and even got to play with members of the LA Philharmonic (which is considered one of the best orchestras in the country.) He was an honors student and was expected to study music at a college conservatory. He was a boy, an artist and a good citizen. May his memory be a blessing!
#DraylenMason

 

[jjenny]

In other words, what's the solutions to protect society and to prevent future crazy shooters/bombers?
If parents cannot see the red flags and cannot get help. What's the next step?

If nobody can see the red flags then what possibly could be done? In this particular case, the bomber seemed to have been quiet and didn't cause trouble. Unless somebody knew what he was planning to do, I don't see how anything could have been done.

 

[bluesneakers]

In other words, what's the solutions to protect society and to prevent future crazy shooters/bombers?
If parents cannot see the red flags and cannot get help. What's the next step?

How about making people more aware of the red flags they should be looking for, and what to do when they see them.

 

[bluesneakers]

If nobody can see the red flags then what possibly could be done? In this particular case, the bomber seemed to have been quiet and didn't cause trouble. Unless somebody knew what he was planning to do, I don't see how anything could have been done.

We don't know what his roommates, friends and family saw in him or heard him say.

 

[jjenny]

We don't know what his roommates, friends and family saw in him or heard him say.

Family is already on record claiming they were completely unaware.

 

[rsd1200]

In other words, what's the solutions to protect society and to prevent future crazy shooters/bombers?
If parents cannot see the red flags and cannot get help. What's the next step?

To his family, maybe he was a difficult child, and an obnoxious teen, was fairly bright, but not successful at anything much in the work world. They dealt with it with as best they knew how but never sought a physician's advice. Buying that home, to me anyway, just rings, We love you but it's time to move out, we want some peace. Yet, they knew he had trouble navigating the work world, and wanted him to have a roof over his head, at the very least (and it wasn't their roof). I don't think they thought he would ever be a murderer, as I don't think that any parent ever thinks that of their child, but I do think that they were likely okay with him moving out. He probably showed a different side, to them, as he got older, and wiser, too. Kinda like the wives who had no idea that their husbands were serial killers.