GUILTY TX - Ethan Couch 'Affluenza Teen' DUI driver who killed four gets probation, 2013 #2

[JeannaT]

The video of isolation in the prison is disturbing to me. The guy giving the tour dances around "most prisoners consider this punishment". When in fact, that's how this is used - and prisoners who have behavior disorders and borderline mental illnesses will get them in check mighty fast if they think they'll be sent to "the hole" as it's referred to in some women's prisons.

I think in the future, we'll see isolation in prison, when used to "protect" a prisoner from other prisoners, will be seen as being as barbaric and inhuman as freezing baths or straight jackets in mental institutions.

Texas has a new movement in prisons, under the direction of Brad Livingston, to prevent sexual harrassment and rape of prisoners that has basically been a mainstay of prison life in the US, and moving toward isolating offenders who assault other prisoners rather than isolating the ones who are the victims of assault.

Putting someone in isolation with no stimulation whatsoever than those exercise videos, and with no human contact whatsoever, is counterproductive to anything except having something so awful to punish incarcerated people with that they will behave. It's no place to put someone who is not streetwise and can't protect himself from assault by other offenders.

 

[faw720]

Personally, I think Ethan could use some behavior modification. 4 of his victims are even more isolated............6 feet under the ground in a not so roomy casket.

 

[jkly]

Putting someone in isolation with no stimulation whatsoever than those exercise videos, and with no human contact whatsoever, is counterproductive to anything except having something so awful to punish incarcerated people with that they will behave. It's no place to put someone who is not streetwise and can't protect himself from assault by other offenders.

What are they supposed to do with him then?

I'm not sure they have enough isolation cells to lock up all the other offenders who probably want to assault him.

 

[faw720]

What are they supposed to do with him then?

I'm not sure they have enough isolation cells to lock up all the other offenders who probably want to assault him.

Good question.

JeannaT, I would actually like to know how you would run all the U.S. prisons if you were given the opportunity. What are we supposed to do, turn all the prisoners loose?:thinking:

 

[JeannaT]

What are they supposed to do with him then?

I'm not sure they have enough isolation cells to lock up all the other offenders who probably want to assault him.

I would think they could treat those in isolation due to their risk of being assaulted differently from those who are there for punishment. So, human contact bringing in meals, access to books or TV or whatever else media access prisoners in the mainstream prison have access to, and social time with others who are in isolation because they are at high risk for being victims - the same amount of social time other offenders in the mainstream jail get.

To put someone in "the hole" because staff can't properly supervise the other prisoners and keep them from being assaulted can be dealt with in a different way from others who are being put there because they have broken the rules.

I did see a documentary once, about social life in prison and how most are allowed to kind of fend for themselves, vs. those who would be mercilessly bullied due to . . . whatever the cause. Appearing like a victim, lack of street smarts, having been in law enforcement before, whatever would cause them to be bullied more than average. They were segregated into another group and socialized among themselves, in a separate wing.

That seems to be the way to go, IMHO, rather than treating someone who is at risk for bullying the same as you treat people who commit crimes while in prison.

 

[faw720]

It has occurred to me that officials are possibly trying to give Ethan an opportunity to 'wake up & smell the coffee'. So far as I know, he has never shown any remorse for any of his actions & he has never, ever been held accountable for any of his actions until now. Thanks to his time in juvenile lockup he now knows that not everyone looks upon him as some kind of folk hero & some of those would actually like to do him severe physical harm. Now he is getting to experience solitary confinement & he has plenty of time to think. Does he even begin to realize that the only way he's ever going to be able to live a normal life is to turn his life around & act like a decent responsible person? The decision is entirely his! If he is declared an adult & breaks probation again, he is looking at 40+ years in state prison. Does he really want to be thrown into general population or does he prefer solitary? Actually in state prison I'm not sure that there is solitary except for death row inmates. It seems to me that his only good option is to become a responsible person & abide by the law. I am not convinced he is able to grasp that concept. We shall see.

 

[KaaBoom]

The video of isolation in the prison is disturbing to me. The guy giving the tour dances around "most prisoners consider this punishment". When in fact, that's how this is used - and prisoners who have behavior disorders and borderline mental illnesses will get them in check mighty fast if they think they'll be sent to "the hole" as it's referred to in some women's prisons.

I think in the future, we'll see isolation in prison, when used to "protect" a prisoner from other prisoners, will be seen as being as barbaric and inhuman as freezing baths or straight jackets in mental institutions.

Texas has a new movement in prisons, under the direction of Brad Livingston, to prevent sexual harrassment and rape of prisoners that has basically been a mainstay of prison life in the US, and moving toward isolating offenders who assault other prisoners rather than isolating the ones who are the victims of assault.

Putting someone in isolation with no stimulation whatsoever than those exercise videos, and with no human contact whatsoever, is counterproductive to anything except having something so awful to punish incarcerated people with that they will behave. It's no place to put someone who is not streetwise and can't protect himself from assault by other offenders.

I don’t really see anything wrong with the conditions in that video. It looks to me like they are doing a good job of keeping the prisoners safe. I think isolation is a good idea, for 1. safety and 2. I don’t think it’s a good idea to let criminals socialize with other criminals in prison. I don’t like the idea of prisoners socializing unsupervised in their cells, while they plan out their next crime.

If I was in charge of that jail, I would probably make a few minor changes. I think the Richard Simmons work out video played over and over is ridicules. I think one educational TV channel would be appropriate. I could also see letting the prisoners out for a couple of hours a day for some sports activities. But that should be a privilege, and highly supervised. If the inmates cause any problems, they should just be kept in their cells 24/7. Other then that I think that jail is just fine.

 

[asac]

It has occurred to me that officials are possibly trying to give Ethan an opportunity to 'wake up & smell the coffee'. So far as I know, he has never shown any remorse for any of his actions & he has never, ever been held accountable for any of his actions until now. Thanks to his time in juvenile lockup he now knows that not everyone looks upon him as some kind of folk hero & some of those would actually like to do him severe physical harm. Now he is getting to experience solitary confinement & he has plenty of time to think. Does he even begin to realize that the only way he's ever going to be able to live a normal life is to turn his life around & act like a decent responsible person? The decision is entirely his! If he is declared an adult & breaks probation again, he is looking at 40+ years in state prison. Does he really want to be thrown into general population or does he prefer solitary? Actually in state prison I'm not sure that there is solitary except for death row inmates. It seems to me that his only good option is to become a responsible person & abide by the law. I am not convinced he is able to grasp that concept. We shall see.

bbm

Just to point out - no, the US is extremely well known for it's (at times prolonged) use of solitary with prisoners.

As a non-American, I find this entire case so strange. In my country the juvenile's name would not have been known outside the court (or at least, couldn't be printed/widely known), he wouldn't get some weird juvenile/adult split sentence which could result in him either being on probation until 19 or eventually put in prison for up to 40 years (heck, what a range), the juvenile system would have actually done some sort of 'programming' with him, we wouldn't have a massive media scrum every time he was mentioned, and we wouldn't now have news stories with an almost gloating feel/reception about life in jail and tours by people in charge.

I'm not trying to be offensive. I just find the US extremely interesting when it comes to "crime and punishment", with "media" slipped in there too.

 

[jkly]

bbm

Just to point out - no, the US is extremely well known for it's (at times prolonged) use of solitary with prisoners.

As a non-American, I find this entire case so strange. In my country the juvenile's name would not have been known outside the court (or at least, couldn't be printed/widely known), he wouldn't get some weird juvenile/adult split sentence which could result in him either being on probation until 19 or eventually put in prison for up to 40 years (heck, what a range), the juvenile system would have actually done some sort of 'programming' with him, we wouldn't have a massive media scrum every time he was mentioned, and we wouldn't now have news stories with an almost gloating feel/reception about life in jail and tours by people in charge.

I'm not trying to be offensive. I just find the US extremely interesting when it comes to "crime and punishment", with "media" slipped in there too.

I do agree with you about how he shouldn't have been constantly mentioned in the media. Personally, I feel he doesn't deserve the attention. He's a lot of benefits from it that he wouldn't have ordinarily gotten.

I do, however, think he should have been treated as an adult for this. Accident or not, he killed four people. That's no small matter.

You live in Canada, right? Like you with our justice system, I like some things about your justice system, but others I don't like. I remember hearing about Jasmine Richardson. She was a twelve year old who, together with her boyfriend, murdered her entire family, including her little brother. Because she was a juvenile, she received a maximum ten year sentence. That really disturbed me. I just don't see how being lenient on people who commit such heinous crimes does any good. I also don't feel she deserved any of the protections she received under the Youth Criminal Justice Act.

That is what happens there, right? Please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[LinasK]

http://www.wfaa.com/news/local/tarrant-co/the-incarcerated-world-of-ethan-couch/38630500

Pictures & article about Ethan's life in the big boy jail. His affluenza is taking a beating right about now. :happydance: At least he has ample time to consider the error of his ways.

I'd take the Bluebell Ice cream away, that's too cushy for him!!

 

[asac]

I do agree with you about how he shouldn't have been constantly mentioned in the media. Personally, I feel he doesn't deserve the attention. He's a lot of benefits from it that he wouldn't have ordinarily gotten.

I do, however, think he should have been treated as an adult for this. Accident or not, he killed four people. That's no small matter.

You live in Canada, right? Like you with our justice system, I like some things about your justice system, but others I don't like. I remember hearing about Jasmine Richardson. She was a twelve year old who, together with her boyfriend, murdered her entire family, including her little brother. Because she was a juvenile, she received a maximum ten year sentence. That really disturbed me. I just don't see how being lenient on people who commit such heinous crimes does any good. I also don't feel she deserved any of the protections she received under the Youth Criminal Justice Act.

That is what happens there, right? Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Yes, the enormous media attention is strange - but I think that could also probably take us into big discussions about 24 hour news cycles/ratings etc

I'm pretty much certain he would have remained as a juvenile here, though there probably would have also been more intensive court action after the first incident.

No, I live at the other end of the world. I'm not entirely sure of how that situation would be handled here, I can't think of a time off the top of my head that a 12 year old killed their family, or has been involved in multiple murders, thankfully. I suspect they would remain in the youth system though.

 

[LillyP]

The video of isolation in the prison is disturbing to me. The guy giving the tour dances around "most prisoners consider this punishment". When in fact, that's how this is used - and prisoners who have behavior disorders and borderline mental illnesses will get them in check mighty fast if they think they'll be sent to "the hole" as it's referred to in some women's prisons.

I think in the future, we'll see isolation in prison, when used to "protect" a prisoner from other prisoners, will be seen as being as barbaric and inhuman as freezing baths or straight jackets in mental institutions.

Texas has a new movement in prisons, under the direction of Brad Livingston, to prevent sexual harrassment and rape of prisoners that has basically been a mainstay of prison life in the US, and moving toward isolating offenders who assault other prisoners rather than isolating the ones who are the victims of assault.

Putting someone in isolation with no stimulation whatsoever than those exercise videos, and with no human contact whatsoever, is counterproductive to anything except having something so awful to punish incarcerated people with that they will behave. It's no place to put someone who is not streetwise and can't protect himself from assault by other offenders.

The only cruel and unusual punishment I see is having no choice but to watch Richard Simmons exercise videos over and over again. Now that's punishment for anyone!

But to get real though - some people are targets and they don't deserve to be. But some people DO deserve to be targets in my opinion. I know that may sound horrible to some people but it's my own opinion after learning of some absolutley sickening crimes I honestly can not blame people for targeting them at all because I would probably do the same.

Does Ethan Couch deserve to be a target? Well that is a matter of opinion.
I have never been to jail thankfully, but I have tried to put myself in his shoes and think hmmm.... what would be worse? Getting tormented in Juvie with everyone after him or to be put in adult jail in a private cell all alone? If I was in his situation I would opt for the private cell all alone with ice cream. What would you do? Is it really a punishment to be put in a cell to be left by yourself versus being tormented all day and night by almost everyone else in the jail with you?

Which is more inhumane?? Being tormented all day and night or be left alone in a cell while eating ice cream?

 

[LillyP]

I remember hearing about Jasmine Richardson. She was a twelve year old who, together with her boyfriend, murdered her entire family, including her little brother. Because she was a juvenile, she received a maximum ten year sentence. That really disturbed me.

This is a very sickening case. She was 12 years old and had a boyfriend who was 23. She did not look 12. She looked easily 18. I know how old she looked doesn't really matter but I am just shocked that she was 12 because truly she looked way older. She was said to be the mastermind behind the whole thing as well so maybe her brain was much older than 12 also.
They both killed her parents and little brother.
He was put in jail for life. But because she was 12, she ended up serving around 5 years (even though she was considered the mastermind, planner, behind it all) Then after that the Canadian government went ahead and gave her a whole new identity. Legally changed her name, her appearance and released her and put her into a city college.
I wonder how she is now if she has changed or not. Nobody will ever know because her name was legally changed when she was released under a new identity.

 

[faw720]

bbm

Just to point out - no, the US is extremely well known for it's (at times prolonged) use of solitary with prisoners.

Sorry I didn't make my statement clear. I was referring to the state prisons in Texas only. I suppose each state can decide how they want to house their prisoners. Ethan is currently in the county jail awaiting a ruling. If he ever is sent to the state adult penitentiary it is my understanding that the Texas prison system only has solitary confinement for death row inmates. The US Federal system can pretty much do whatever they want especially when it comes to terrorists.

 

[faw720]

The only cruel and unusual punishment I see is having no choice but to watch Richard Simmons exercise videos over and over again. Now that's punishment for anyone!

But to get real though - some people are targets and they don't deserve to be. But some people DO deserve to be targets in my opinion. I know that may sound horrible to some people but it's my own opinion after learning of some absolutley sickening crimes I honestly can not blame people for targeting them at all because I would probably do the same.

Does Ethan Couch deserve to be a target? Well that is a matter of opinion.
I have never been to jail thankfully, but I have tried to put myself in his shoes and think hmmm.... what would be worse? Getting tormented in Juvie with everyone after him or to be put in adult jail in a private cell all alone? If I was in his situation I would opt for the private cell all alone with ice cream. What would you do? Is it really a punishment to be put in a cell to be left by yourself versus being tormented all day and night by almost everyone else in the jail with you?

Which is more inhumane?? Being tormented all day and night or be left alone in a cell while eating ice cream?

When you seriously think about it, this is the first time in 3 years that Ethan has suffered any major punishment for his actions. IMO, killing 4 people & making a vegetable of another deserves some punishment even though the wreck was unintentional. Probation was nothing more than a slap on the wrist & he couldn't even stick with the rules of probation. Counseling fell on deaf ears & he rejected that chance to help himself. This is seriously his last chance to turn his life around. If he doesn't he could wind up in the state penal system as an adult. Should that happen he will be begging for solitary. Previously I've mentioned that I have an alcoholic friend who went into the state lockup after she received her 3rd DUI within her 50 year lifetime. Prisoners suffer in appalling conditions 24 hours a day & every day is a struggle. What my friend suffered was enough to change her outlook. As an alcoholic she still drinks BUT she never does so while driving. Matter of fact her situation made me make changes in my life. I used to think nothing of going out to dinner & having 1 or 2 drinks & driving home.............no more. I'm taking no chances of driving under the influence & being sent to state prison. I'm not a big drinker but it only takes 3 DUIs in a lifetime to get you put away & I want no part of that horrid existence.

 

[Only4Justice]

I never said anything about "quickly." I would expect all of those actions to evolve over time. But I would expect to see horror and remorse IMMEDIATELY. That's not what was ever expressed, even at the scene.



And it has been 2 years and 8 months since it occurred. His behavior shows no hint of comprehension of his acts.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...tim-ethan-couch-crash-scene-article-1.2495385

[emoji122] [emoji122] [emoji122] [emoji122] [emoji122] thank you for this post. Peace

Sent from my XT1031 using Tapatalk

 

[faw720]

Oh boy, here we go with another twist in this ever evolving case. Ethan was supposed to have a hearing tomorrow, but now this change.

http://crimeblog.dallasnews.com/2016/02/ethan-couch-postpones-court-appearance-to-next-week-after-waiving-right-to-detention-hearing/html/

This link is not connecting as it should. However, if you scroll down just a bit you will be able to click on Ethan couch story & it will take you to the link. Basically, it just says that he has waived his right to another detention hearing that was scheduled for tomorrow 2/12/16. I assume this means that he is not unhappy (under the circumstances) with his current detention situation.

 

[Only4Justice]

At the rate this is going , this thread will probably continue until all 3 of the Couches die of old age. A lot of the rest of us older ones will probably be long gone before that happens.

Funny! I think you are right. Peace

Sent from my XT1031 using Tapatalk

 

[JeannaT]

Oh boy, here we go with another twist in this ever evolving case. Ethan was supposed to have a hearing tomorrow, but now this change.

http://crimeblog.dallasnews.com/2016/02/ethan-couch-postpones-court-appearance-to-next-week-after-waiving-right-to-detention-hearing/html/

This link is not connecting as it should. However, if you scroll down just a bit you will be able to click on Ethan couch story & it will take you to the link. Basically, it just says that he has waived his right to another detention hearing that was scheduled for tomorrow 2/12/16. I assume this means that he is not unhappy (under the circumstances) with his current detention situation.

Does this link work better?

http://crimeblog.dallasnews.com/201...fter-waiving-right-to-detention-hearing.html/

 

[faw720]

Does this link work better?

http://crimeblog.dallasnews.com/201...fter-waiving-right-to-detention-hearing.html/

Yes, thank you!!