TX - Hailey Dunn, 13, Colorado City, 27 Dec 2010 - #26

[yllek]

Ding Ding!!!!!!!!!!! Winner Winner Chicken Dinner!!!!!! :floorlaugh: Ok, I have to quit watching the poker shows. But really, LE is not going to lie on these affidavits. And all of these people that say anything against BD are not lying. It's like she wants you to believe that EVERYONE is lying besides her. FAIL.

I agree. I do think affidavits are brief and not all context is provided, so it gives some defendants confidence to say their words were twisted or they were misquoted. Having all interviews taped is great in court. I love it when a defendant tries to take back what they said and the prosecution says "roll the tape". (I watch too much ID Discovery, 48 Hours, Dateline)

 

[my_tee_mouse]

I'm so jaded, I wondered if she told him to TEXT so there would be "written proof"........lol.

Not so jaded!

 

[captdj]

If Hailey wasn't abducted by someone unknown, I think this is the major question that needs to be answered in order to find Hailey. Why the heck did SA make that strange and immediate departure from work on 12/27 a.m. - the official day HD went missing? It's way more suspicious than denials about drug transactions, horror fantasies, a New Year's Eve gathering/party... Some or all of those things may be related to why he left, but they are not that incriminating on their own (imo). That sudden departure from work however is incriminating on its own (even before we knew he pinged back in Colorado City, it was incriminating). Wonder what he told LE. Did he tell them that he had an altercation, like he apparently told Billie? Did he give them an alternate explanation before he clammed up? The 64,000 dollar question...

Dang it, where is Hailey?!!!

Ok If SA is innocent (where was him during his 2 hours black out period on his blackjack...He leaves hailey home area then no cell pinging for 2 hours...then repowers @ his moms

If innocent
Hailey either:
Ran away - Mom and family feels this didnt happen
Stranger abduction - (also the most unluckiest day in SA life)
Children harmed her - Not found yet but would be close to the neighborhood.

 

[bellyup]

If so, I stand corrected. I know they use drug-sniffing dogs everywhere, but never heard of them taking cadaver dogs inside a home, seems like a dead body or signs of a murder would be fairly easy to locate in that small a house. They have so many tools and equipment now to locate forensic evidence, why would they need the dogs?
Not being disagreeable, just dumb, I guess.

I think they use them almost as a "pre screening" to bringing in other forensics (ie; lights / luminol / etc). If they take the dogs in and get a positive hit, they are going to secure the house and start processing it pretty quickly.

I am pretty sure that HRD dogs were taken into the Baker home... ? ? I don't think we were ever told if they "hit" on anything inside the house though.
And if what is alleged is true in that case - a very heinous murder (or at least dismemberment) took place in that house and LE saw nothing at first to indicate such.

 

[Kamille]

If so, I stand corrected. I know they use drug-sniffing dogs everywhere, but never heard of them taking cadaver dogs inside a home, seems like a dead body or signs of a murder would be fairly easy to locate in that small a house. They have so many tools and equipment now to locate forensic evidence, why would they need the dogs?
Not being disagreeable, just dumb, I guess.

One case that demonstrates that well is the Madeleine McCann case. They used a pair of blood and HRD dogs who usually work together. The blood dogs find all signs of blood, even blood that has been cleaned up. The cadaver dogs determine if the blood is from a corpse. There could be many reasons why there is blood in a home.

MOO

 

[debirlfan]

Interview with Nana was just rerun on NG and she stated that Hailey did close her door, but due to the light (hall or bathroom) Hailey could see his feet while he was standing outside of her door.

So wait a minute here. I thought the deal was supposed to be that he was standing outside her door looking in at her? If the door is shut, then he can't see her. Maybe the reason he's standing there has nothing to do with Hailey. Maybe he's using the light from the hall/bathroom to do drugs without waking Billie. Maybe he's on the phone - supposedly Hailey usually made her calls from the back yard - could there have been "dead zones" and the phone only have worked in certain locations? (I live in a dead zone - depending on brand, some visitors have to go out and wander around the yard to get a reliable signal.)

Mind you - I'm not saying SA is innocent of all wrongdoing - maybe he is, maybe he isn't - but if he is, I think that it's wise to consider other motives besides "sex crime" - like for example an argument that escalated and got way out of hand, especially if fueled by drugs or withdrawal.

 

[mmmagique]

I see what you mean.

What strikes me different about SA though is that he's not trying to hide his fascination with violence and murder. He's making videos, posting on a public website that he's thought about murdering someone, telling people he chainsaws deer.. I think most serial killers hide their "dark side" at all costs. SA seems to like showing his. If he did kill Hailey, perhaps he would brag to a confidant(s) who shares his interests, he seems to like attention. We can only hope. (If he is guilty of killing Hailey, I think maybe he never intended to be a serial killer, just a one time kill for thrill and notoriety). Just speculating..

On one of his video monikers, he lists himself as a serial killer.

 

[my_tee_mouse]

Ok If SA is innocent (where was him during his 2 hours black out period on his blackjack...He leaves hailey home area then no cell pinging for 2 hours...then repowers @ his moms

If innocent
Hailey either:
Ran away - Mom and family feels this didnt happen
Stranger abduction - (also the most unluckiest day in SA life)
Children harmed her - Not found yet but would be close to the neighborhood.

And I have every faith that if it were #3, someone would have squawked by now.

I think Sparky and company have a pretty good idea just what happened in this case and now it's more of a waiting game. For someone like SA who likes to play out his sick little scenarios, have his drugs and talk it up big on I/N sites, things must be getting mighty boring just sitting around grandma's house. And things are probably getting pretty tense for some other folks as well. Sooner or later someone's gonna screw up and do something that gives LE their swoop-in and swoop-up moment, I believe.

 

[marlame]

In our town about 15 year ago a group of young people like this was into dungeons and dragons... and pretend murders...they had machetes, fantasy plays etc and one night one of the boys made plans to kill her PG girlfriend who was in the process of breaking up with him and another boy was to follow behind in another car to a secret spot in which to kill her ...Well the accomplice chickened out but the one boy killed her with the machete . She had many defensive wounds and was hacked up so bad she was not recognizable

I think its possible if you are have a violent type personality you might gravitate to this type of pretend fantasy murder stuff....and enjoy it a wee bit too much and I think its possible for this type of person they could have a problem with fantasy and reality and its easier to escalate to a crime....

But of course not all people who fantasize are gonna go that next step but after that has happened to a teen I knew I so leary of all this murder stuff...

BBM--Thanks for posting this!!! It just reminded me of research I did for a class I took a few years ago on Violent Crime...

Sexual killers fall into two main categories:
--The rape or displaced anger murderer (Cohen et al., 1971)--Rapists who kill do so primarily to escape detection.
--The sadistic or lust murderer (Becker and Abel, 1978)--Sado-erotic materials at home are evidence of fantasy.

For the sadistic killer, aggression and sexuality become intertwined –whereby aggression becomes eroticized. The thinking of these killers is dominated by fantasies of power and control and often begins in childhood. Fantasy is the focus of their behavior and the killer is pushed to kill by their thought patterns. He is essentially incited to murder by an intrusive fantasy life. His early learning is that that violence against other humans is normal and "acceptable". Sadistic killers have an inherent sadistic nature with a fascination for violence, injury and torture. They enjoy fantasizing about doing sadistic things to fellow humans.

The sadistic killer, much like the chronic gambler and problem drinker, is addicted to the use of fantasy--a coping device.

Sexual predators, whether they kill or not, will escalate their activities over the course of their careers. Typically, they will start with violent sexual fantasies and progress to acting out their imagined scenes with both willing and unwilling partners.

 

[bellyup]

Ok If SA is innocent (where was him during his 2 hours black out period on his blackjack...He leaves hailey home area then no cell pinging for 2 hours...then repowers @ his moms

If innocent
Hailey either:
Ran away - Mom and family feels this didnt happen
Stranger abduction - (also the most unluckiest day in SA life)
Children harmed her - Not found yet but would be close to the neighborhood.

This is one thing that confuses me and makes me think it's still POSSIBLE that SA and BD were not involved. If when they reported her "missing" LE was going with the runaway theory ... they would not have proclaimed her an "UNLIKELY" runaway like they did. They would have went with the runaway theory and embellished it to cover their own tushes. It seems they had easy ways to support that theory (ie; she didn't like SA, she was upset about CD having a baby, she wanted to live with her dad, etc.)

 

[lynnb]

I'm so jaded, I wondered if she told him to TEXT so there would be "written proof"........lol.

I must be getting jaded too because when you all talk about the interview where BD says she checked on Hailey but didn't touch her, I'm starting to think she's saying that to cover her butt in case the time of death (yes I hate typing that) can be determined to be prior to that. all IMO.

 

[debirlfan]

Do you mean that he went there intending to stay, as usual, but when the person who supplies him his on-the-job drugs wasn't there, he split?

Yeah, maybe. Possibly someone who works 3rd shift (IS there a 3rd shift?) or normally gets in before he does.

Or - if he'd already done something with Hailey, he was looking for someone that he thought would help him get rid of the body.

 

[PMLsmom]

You all are WAY to prolific in posting (lol)...Can someone give me a brief on todays happenings? I am at least three threads behind...TIA

 

[yllek]

You might be right. So if he's proud of what he did, and wants the notoriety, then why doesn't he just come out and tell LE he killed her?
Oh... you're saying he told one of his friends, but won't admit it to LE, right? So wouldn't he be afraid that person would turn him in? I mean, that's a little twisted, but what do I know??
Not arguing, btw... just dis-cussin'!

I hear ya. I was just speculating that since he likes to show off and document his dark side, the need to share his "accomplishment' might inhibit him from being able to keep his trap shut. When he was on MM site, he acted like it was normal to want to kill someone and wanted to talk about it (he got shut down quick). I think notoriety among what he sees as his peers might be intoxicating to him. BTW, I'm smiling as I type - this is SO JUST speculation and probably has nuthin to do with nuthin. :crazy:

 

[noneareworthy]

She looks in at her at night when she's in the house with the family, but doesn't call to check on her when she's supposedly at someone else's house to stay the night and she hasn't talked to her since Sunday night. Right. It's just another lie. But why?

 

[my_tee_mouse]

I must be getting jaded too because when you all talk about the interview where BD says she checked on Hailey but didn't touch her, I'm starting to think she's saying that to cover her butt in case the time of death (yes I hate typing that) can be determined to be prior to that. all IMO.

Well, color us all green, then.

 

[Pondering Mind]

The way I understood the description was that Hailey's door was shut, but she could hear him and see the shadow of his feet, so she knew he was there. Not that her door was open and he was looking. I could be wrong, but I was pretty sure about the "shadow" thing.

Salem

and if I may add, this was told to Hailey's grandmother 2 years ago. SA supposedly just started living there 4 months ago...so he wasn't even living there at the time..which in my mind would be all the more unexplainable..

 

[tehcloser]

So, I have been re-reading today, and by the way, IMA you rock with that media thread!!! It's MOST interesting to ME that up until January 3, she was being reported as missing around 1pm when she was walking to a friend's house. And then on January 3, the story changes to 3:15 AND she was going to stop by her dad's first before going to the friends.

 

[winterrose]

http://www.reporternews.com/news/2011/jan/10/officials-teenager-likely-a-runaway/

Billie Jean said Hailey also stayed at her dad’s house for less than a month at a time but has always wanted to come back home and that her daughter had at one point moved to Snyder and enrolled in school there while staying with extended family.

“I let her try it out for a minute,” she said in reference to Hailey staying with family members. “I couldn’t let her stay longer than that and, really, she didn’t want to anyway.”

Huh,a minute?So why did she want to move in with family members in Snyder and enrolled in school there?Family members,DB on and off,two weeks at the last of the school year,CD less than a month at a time,okay how many times,and with the grandmother,I haven't looked up how long and when.It's so obvious,she wasn't happy at home,so why didn't anyone deal with the root of the problem,hello?

 

[epiphany]

I don't find the videos or the masks overly concerning. I agree with you that it seems like a bunch of young guys goofing off for attention.

Respectfully, I wouldn't leave a goldfish let alone my child, teen nor young adult with a one of them.