TX - Hailey Dunn, 13, Colorado City, 27 Dec 2010 - #26

[winterrose]

The way I understood the description was that Hailey's door was shut, but she could hear him and see the shadow of his feet, so she knew he was there. Not that her door was open and he was looking. I could be wrong, but I was pretty sure about the "shadow" thing.

Salem

She was 11 according to her grandmother.

 

[twilight829]

I agree, and I don't think it's anywhere close to being proof that he killed Hailey. It's going to take a lot more than that for them to arrest and charge him, not to mention that they have no proof right now that she is dead.

I'm more concerned with him being the last known person to see her alive, and where he went after he walked off the job that morning, and why his cell phone showed no activity for an hour and a half.

I don't think the masks alone would be that troubling, but add everything else in, especially the questions he asked on the MM site, plus being the last to see her, leaving job like he did, and no activity on cell.....for me, that is enough to go HMMMMMMM??

 

[yllek]

Do we know (or can a local find out) whether the place SA works/worked has a 3rd shift? If he went there to meet someone who worked 3rd and found out they weren't there, that would explain him turning around and leaving.

Do you mean that he went there intending to stay, as usual, but when the person who supplies him his on-the-job drugs wasn't there, he split?

 

[bellyup]

All I can say is ........wow. If this isn't shocking to some of you, I am really at a loss for the low standard so many seem to be setting for todays youth.

I was no angel as a teen and I will be the first to admit it. But I have NEVER known anyone that took a chainsaw to the corpse of a deer for fun. Held up the heart of a deer for a vile photo shoot while making death threats. . Driving around behaving like a serial sniper...unacceptable. The whole mask thing...sorry, it's just really creepy.

I'm not saying I agree with it ... but ... yes it's common. IME IMO. There is a grown adult on my street ( a man with several children and a respectable career) who drove around the neighborhood with a fresh hacked off deer head in the back of a golf cart showing off his "trophy" to the neighbors - including the children. Holding it up with blood dripping. I was REPULSED beyond belief, but the other neighbors didn't seem to think much of it. In fact the some of the guys were all out there admiring his kill. The teenagers are much the same way. I'm sure I could pull up 10-15 pics right now of teen boys on my DD's facebook page holding up animals in varying forms of dismemberment as they are "cleaning" their kills. And sadly, I'm sure some of them will have captions like "Don't mess with me ...." or similar.

And as far as "death threats" .... all one has to do is look at a few facebook pages of teenagers and you'll see them EVERYWHERE. Drives me crazy, but it's so true. Heck, the teenager "term" around these parts to tell someone off is "go kill yourself" or "go die in a corner". Not sure how many times I've seen things like "Mess with my girl and your going to find the end of my (insert gun type here) to your head" and similar.

Girls doing it too. "The next guy to break my heart is going to die a slow and painful death. I'm going to start by cutting off his (penis)".

I know of AT LEAST three kids my DD knows who have "scary" looking pictures of them with their paintball guns pointed at their dog, sister, bestfriend, mother, police cars, etc.

It's everywhere.
(and I'll say it again, but I live in an UPPER class rural area -when we do outreach in the cities ... whewww... the stuff we see)

ETA: Not sure if this is video talk or not ? If so, I'd be happy to move it

 

[jen&jonhart]

Do we know (or can a local find out) whether the place SA works/worked has a 3rd shift? If he went there to meet someone who worked 3rd and found out they weren't there, that would explain him turning around and leaving.

I wonder if it wasnt just the fact that he went to work and said to himself forget this I think I will just go back home and finish up them drug's we bought last night. Thinking along that line maybe when he gets back home he get's into an arguement with HD. He hits her she hits her head he panics and gets rid of her. That is all JMO of how it might have happened.God I hated typing that, I went to bed and this stuff was just running around in my head. Now maybe I can go to sleep. Praying so hard this little girl is just hiding out some where and comes home soon.

 

[scrap_hag]

Although BD used drugs, I do not believe she is a drug addict. I worked in a medical setting for a number of years and know that if she were using drugs heavily, her coworkers would have spotted it. Since she has worked at the same place for 7 years, I believe she must be a reliable employee. Especially if they knew she did not have a license, her coworkers would have watched her closely. Also from knowing a number of nurses who lost their licenses because of drug use, I think if she were a serious drug user she would have soon gotten into trouble with the temptation to steal drugs or forge perscriptions. For these reasons, I think her drug use is recreational.

oh boy...I hope I don't get a time out for this...I am a relative newby here....
but while I am a skeptic...I like to give people the benefit of the doubt, so in my searching, I found this document which is public record :twocents:

http://204.65.111.68/THP/reldhjv15xyayw55o1102m2i/613203.PDF

this discloses that the reason she is not currently practicing, is that she didn't maintain a current license

I hope I have inserted this correctly. It was obtained on the Texas Board of Nursing site

 

[Pondering Mind]

Not saying that it's the case here but many things are a sign of the times whether we like it or not..I come from the generation of peace signs...you know, the kind you see everywhere today? Well, back in the late '60's and early '70's there were times that I had to take them off when certain people were around because they were considered an 'upside cross'..:floorlaugh:...and my choices in music..like Black Sabbath..didn't go over well with many...just sayin..

..and let's face it people are strange! For me, while I don't like the masks, vids, etc..by themselves, I don't think much about them. They could come into play..but I just feel that many have strange hobbies that others don't understand and 99.9 % don't go onto commit a heinous crime. jmo..fwiw..:crazy:


eta~I reserve the right to change my mind as I have NOT seen the vids and the more I read..whoa..

 

[TxLady2]

I see what you mean.

What strikes me different about SA though is that he's not trying to hide his fascination with violence and murder. He's making videos, posting on a public website that he's thought about murdering someone, telling people he chainsaws deer.. I think most serial killers hide their "dark side" at all costs. SA seems to like showing his. If he did kill Hailey, perhaps he would brag to a confidant(s) who shares his interests, he seems to like attention. We can only hope. (If he is guilty of killing Hailey, I think maybe he never intended to be a serial killer, just a one time kill for thrill and notoriety). Just speculating..

You might be right. So if he's proud of what he did, and wants the notoriety, then why doesn't he just come out and tell LE he killed her?
Oh... you're saying he told one of his friends, but won't admit it to LE, right? So wouldn't he be afraid that person would turn him in? I mean, that's a little twisted, but what do I know??
Not arguing, btw... just dis-cussin'!

 

[captdj]

there is one thing I keep coming back to in my had ... and it's Billie's recounting of how she came to realize that Hailey was missing.... something just does not ring true to me at all.

Without a time line I can't be exact, but she basically has said that she called her son and told him to text /call MA and tell Hailey to come home. She then says he calls her back and says (paraphrased) Mom, Hailey didn't spend the night there.

Then what? She calls CD from my understand and he says he hasn't seen her.... so she proceeds directly to the police department with a coworker to report her missing.

Then we have report that DD was pounding on the door for 5 mins and SA wouldn't let him in at 4:00. What was the actual time she was reported missing ? I thought it was earlier than 4 pm ?

So confusing. I am just not getting the proceed to the police station immediately response. I think most of us would have rushed home, called MA's mother or called MA. Even gone to their house. Called SA and verified that Hailey said she was going to be with MA and not another child. SOMETHING. Even calling 911 would have made more sense. The logical "next step" there doesn't seem to be to go straight to the police station.

I can't shake the feeling that BD knew exactly where Hailey was at that point in time so there was no reason to call MA, check with SA , etc. AND I further think she went straight to the police department because she knew from her reading that 911 calls can be used against you.... but a face to face filing isn't likely to be recorded right off the bat.

Billie didnt go to the police on the same day as her son was beating on the door....

Monday her son came home at 4PM

Tuesday at lunch time she calls home and her son answers and she then tells him to text MB and tell Hailey to head home... and then I get fuzzy about events....maybe she called Clint and maybe Shawn and then a co-worker drives her home and then to the police department.... as more information has been reported I think Billie did some things to try and find Hailey before going straight to LE...

 

[my_tee_mouse]

I really hope all of these interviews were taped even if they were voluntary...

I do too.

Yannow, I've asked myself, "Why would a LEO perjure him/herself on a sworn affidavit in this case? Why would they risk a felony and possible loss of their career and reputation? What would they have to gain?" And my answers are: They wouldn't, they wouldn't, and nothing whatsoever.

 

[Kamille]

The way I understood the description was that Hailey's door was shut, but she could hear him and see the shadow of his feet, so she knew he was there. Not that her door was open and he was looking. I could be wrong, but I was pretty sure about the "shadow" thing.

Salem

You are probably right about that Salem. Here's the NG transcript...

GRACE: Ms. Jones -- Ms. Jones, your theory that the live-in boyfriend sexually attacked the little girl and that he killed her when she threatened to tell -- what do you base that on?

JONES: Because Hailey had told me (INAUDIBLE) him been living there in the past that he would walk around at nighttime, and the hall light would be on, and she could see his shadow at her door, at the foot of the door. She could see his legs at the foot of the door, just at her door, just standing there. And it scared her. And I don`t know, things just don`t add up that Monday. Why would he leave his job? He didn`t quit, he just left his job.

GRACE: Well, hold on, Billie. Hold on, Billie Dunn. What was she afraid of? What specifically would she say, Ms. Jones?

JONES: That she was afraid of him walking around at night. She said that he`d go in the bathroom and he`d use Billie`s phone and talk to people and then come out and just stand by her door. She said he -- she was just afraid of him. At this time, she was only, like, 11.

GRACE: Did she tell you anything other than him standing by her bedroom door at night?

JONES: No. She said he never tried any advances toward her or anything and...

GRACE: Did you ask her?

JONES: Yes, ma`am. I asked her a lot if he ever tried anything to her. And I told her, I said, If he ever tries anything, you tell your mom and your dad. I said, Don`t -- I said, He can`t -- he`s not going to get away with it, Hailey, if he ever touches you in any way.

GRACE: And what would she say? When you would tell her that, what would she say?

JONES: She said that she would and everything. And the last couple of months, I hadn`t seen her very much because her dad moved over to Colorado City. And she usually spends the night, sometimes the weekend with me, and I hadn`t seen her that much. But she always called me, almost every day.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1101/13/ng.01.html



I must have missed the part about CD only moving to Colorado City in the last couple of months. Sounds like HD was spending a lot of time sleeping at grandma's before that move and then at CD's new place I suppose. Perhaps he was living with his Mom in Snyder before the move?

 

[tehcloser]

oh boy...I hope I don't get a time out for this...I am a relative newby here....
but while I am a skeptic...I like to give people the benefit of the doubt, so in my searching, I found this document which is public record :twocents:

http://204.65.111.68/THP/reldhjv15xyayw55o1102m2i/613203.PDF

this discloses that the reason she is not currently practicing, is that she didn't maintain a current license

I hope I have inserted this correctly. It was obtained on the Texas Board of Nursing site

OK that's it...you get a TO, I'm tellin a Mod!!!!! :great: NOT REALLY. You did it just right and WELCOME to WS. We've had a lot of discussion on that very thing. I don't think I buy the NFS check excuse though.

 

[peeples]

Do we know (or can a local find out) whether the place SA works/worked has a 3rd shift? If he went there to meet someone who worked 3rd and found out they weren't there, that would explain him turning around and leaving.

A local and someone who does business with SA's work place said there is just a first and second shift.

 

[yllek]

Has anyone made a timeline from articles where friends and relatives said Hailey stayed in the last year and before?So far DB has said she stayed with her the last two weeks of the last school year and CD had her for awhile and the grandmother had her for awhile.I believe there were others,but I can't remember.Just wonder if anyone had worked that up.I wondered if most of it has been in this last year,after he threatened to kill Hailey and after he moved in with BD.

I haven't seen one winterrose. It would be a great reference doc, but I don't think we have enough specific information to piece it together. I only recall hearing open-ended time spans, not specific dates. Like when she lived with DB; she went at the end of the school year for a couple of weeks and then a couple of weeks later she went back to Colorado. Then, she stayed with Clint for about a month. Not sure if she went to year round school with a longer break at the end of the calendar year, had summer breaks, or what. I got the impression that all of this was in 2010, but not even sure about that. I wish it was more defined so we could see a pattern or tie her departures from home to specific events...

 

[tehcloser]

I do too.

Yannow, I've asked myself, "Why would a LEO perjure him/herself on a sworn affidavit in this case? Why would they risk a felony and possible loss of their career and reputation? What would they have to gain?" And my answers are: They wouldn't, they wouldn't, and nothing whatsoever.

Ding Ding!!!!!!!!!!! Winner Winner Chicken Dinner!!!!!! :floorlaugh: Ok, I have to quit watching the poker shows. But really, LE is not going to lie on these affidavits. And all of these people that say anything against BD are not lying. It's like she wants you to believe that EVERYONE is lying besides her. FAIL.


ETA: HEY! I passed 10,000 post at some point that I didn't notice, did I miss my ticker tape parade too?

 

[Zoe Bogart]

Billie stated that she told her son to text Hailey at her friend's house, but Hailey didn't have a cell phone, so how could he text her? Did he text the friend, or did he just call the friend's house?

I'm looking at an earlier time frame for Hailey's "disappearance" rather than on Monday during the day. Billie's claim of looking in on Hailey before work sounded fabricated to me when she said it on NG's show. Also, that "I was at work" alibi is getting mighty old. Why Shawn went to work and turned around to leave is beyond me. Driving all that way for nothing seems extreme. Maybe he got there and decided he needed to get lost because someone might suspect something, maybe he was feeling jumpy and thought someone would notice. Maybe the body still needed to be gotten rid of and he was getting antsy.

It's like with Haleigh Cummings, was it done at home or was it done elsewhere? LE didn't seem to find evidence in either case inside the home. So where?

The Haleigh and Hailey cases are so similar and they are driving me crazy.

SA did leave his job abruptly on Monday morning, right? He claimed Hailey was going to a sleepover Monday night. Billie finds out about the "missing" girl on Tuesday and then finds out SA no longer had a job on Wednesday, right? Is that the correct timeline? I think I need to go to bed, my head is beginning to spin...

 

[my_tee_mouse]

Billie stated that she told her son to text Hailey at her friend's house, but Hailey didn't have a cell phone, so how could he text her? Did he text the friend, or did he just call the friend's house?

I'm looking at an earlier time frame for Hailey's "disappearance" rather than on Monday during the day. Billie's claim of looking in on Hailey before work sounded fabricated to me when she said it on NG's show. Also, that "I was at work" alibi is getting mighty old. Why Shawn went to work and turned around to leave is beyond me. Driving all that way for nothing seems extreme. Maybe he got there and decided he needed to get lost because someone might suspect something, maybe he was feeling jumpy and thought someone would notice. Maybe the body still needed to be gotten rid of and he was getting antsy.

It's like with Haleigh Cummings, was it done at home or was it done elsewhere? LE didn't seem to find evidence in either case inside the home. So where?

The Haleigh and Hailey cases are so similar and they are driving me crazy.

That puzzled me as well at first. Then I realized that DD had the cell phone that HD normally used, so the friend's number would be stored in it. Easy enough to pull up the friend's name and text.

 

[TxLady2]

LE can use HRD dogs in a house I am almost 100% certain.... that's a question for one of our resident experts but IIRC I remember it being done in other cases.

If so, I stand corrected. I know they use drug-sniffing dogs everywhere, but never heard of them taking cadaver dogs inside a home, seems like a dead body or signs of a murder would be fairly easy to locate in that small a house. They have so many tools and equipment now to locate forensic evidence, why would they need the dogs?
Not being disagreeable, just dumb, I guess.

 

[tehcloser]

That puzzled me as well at first. Then I realized that DD had the cell phone that HD normally used, so the friend's number would be stored in it. Easy enough to pull up the friend's name and text.

I'm so jaded, I wondered if she told him to TEXT so there would be "written proof"........lol.

 

[Wise Old Owl]

If so, I stand corrected. I know they use drug-sniffing dogs everywhere, but never heard of them taking cadaver dogs inside a home, seems like a dead body or signs of a murder would be fairly easy to locate in that small a house. They have so many tools and equipment now to locate forensic evidence, why would they need the dogs?
Not being disagreeable, just dumb, I guess.

IIRC HRD dogs were taken in Zahra's house.


ETA: I remember the interview with the dog handler. They asked about "hits' in the yard and the handler said the dogs didn't alert but when asked about inside the house the handler deferred the answer by telling the reporter they would have to ask LE.